Greek Government Press Briefing, 10-05-12

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

Tmhma Dhmosiografikwn Kalycewn

Tetarth, 12 Maioy 2010

Ariqmos Deltioy: 266936388

Ekdosh 1

brf1205

KYBERNHTIKOS EKPROSWPOS

Aqhna, 12 Maioy 2010

GIWRGO PETALWTH

Kalo meshmeri.

H yparjh kai h leitoyrgia toy eyrwpaikoy mhxanismoy sthrijhs, gia ton opoio h kybernhsh agwnisthke sklhra, mas parexei to xrono kai thn asfaleia na proxwrhsoyme stis aparaithtes allages kai tomes poy exei anagkh h xwra kai h koinwnia mas, makria apo thn abebaiothta kai thn kerdoskopia twn agorwn.

Se ayta ta plaisia, paroysiasthke sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio ths perasmenhs Deyteras kai meta apo entonh, oysiastikh kai analytikh diaboyleysh me oloys toys koinwnikoys etairoys, to neo asfalistiko systhma. Ena neo, sygxrono nomoqetiko plaisio, to opoio kyriolektika swzei makroproqesma ta asfalistika tameia, diasfalizontas etsi, th biwsimothta enos systhmatos poy oloi gnwrizame oti xwris qarralees tomes, qa katerree syntoma. Epipleon, to neo asfalistiko airei makroxronies adikies, opws einai oi polydapanes eqeloysies ejodoi kai oi prowres syntajiodothseis ligwn poy epibarynan oloys toys ypoloipoys.

Parallhla, proxwrame ston agwna mas gia thn empedwsh ths diafaneias sto dhmosio bio, me to nomosxedio gia thn tropopoihsh twn diatajewn toy ``poqen esxes'' poy syzhteitai xqes kai shmera sthn Olomeleia ths Boylhs. Me tis tropopoihseis aytes eisagontai pleon sklhres diatajeis, poy perilambanoyn th dhmeysh perioysiwn politikwn proswpwn, ta opoia apodedeigmena ypoballoyn anakribeis dhlwseis ``poqen esxes'', enw parallhla ekpiptoyn apo to boyleytiko toys ajiwma osoi symmetexoyn se off shore etaireies.

Me ayto ton tropo kai me mia seira allwn prwtoboyliwn apokaqistoyme thn empistosynh twn politwn sto politiko systhma ths xwras, alla kai kaqistoyme ton kaqe politiko ypeyqyno gia tis prajeis kai tis paraleiceis toy, kata th diarkeia toy politikoy toy bioy.

Telos, opws gnwrizete, ayth thn wra brisketai se ejelijh to atypo Ypoyrgiko Symboylio, me qema thn antagwnistikothta, ton anaptyjiako nomo kai tis meiwseis twn timwn. H kybernhsh dinei idiaiterh shmasia ston tomea ths anaptyjhs kai ayto fainetai apo tis prwtoboylies poy hdh exoyme parei, opws o diplasiasmos ths aporrofhtikothtas twn koinotikwn kondyliwn mesa se eji mhnes kai h aplopoihsh twn diadikasiwn toy ESPA, alla kai apo prwtoboylies poy erxontai syntoma, opws einai o neos anaptyjiakos nomos, h adeiodothsh twn epixeirhsewn kai oi epafes mas me jenoys ependytes.

H Ellada einai mia xwra me makra dhmokratikh politikh paradosh kai me ychlo deikth politikopoihshs twn politwn, oi opoioi einai se qesh na diakrinoyn, poios ergazetai, xtizei kai dhmioyrgei to ayrio kai poios, me paraleiceis toy, to gkremizei.

Parakalw tis erwthseis sas.

POLYMEROS: Shmera, o Prwqypoyrgos episkefqhke paralies ths Attikhs kai ezhse apo konta mia katedafish enos ayqairetoy ktismatos, ths ``Fantasias'', th qymomaste oloi. H eyaisqhsia ths kybernhshs fqanei mexri thn katedafish enos ktirioy, etoimorropoy qa elega egw, h aplws htan mia kinhsh entypwsiasmoy; Skefteste na epekteinete aytes tis drasthriothtes, dhladh qa ftasoyme sto shmeio, kapoia stigmh, na doyme o Prwqypoyrgos na episkeptetai kai ayqaireta poy qa gkremizontai se dasikes perioxes oi opoies kahkan kai exoyn sthqei ekei kapoia ktismata;

PETALWTHS: H kinhsh ayth toy Prwqypoyrgoy na brisketai shmera sto gkremisma enos ayqairetoy ktismatos sthn paralia, exei amesh sxesh me th logikh ths kybernhshs gia anoiktes paralies. Ayto to dikaiwma poy parexetai apo to Syntagma, kat` epektash, gia eleyqerh prosbash twn politwn stis paralies, einai dikaiwma poy eidika stis paralies ths Attikhs energopoieitai poly periorismena. Hdh, to diasfalizoyme emeis ws kybernhsh kai shmera gkremisthkan ola ekeina ta empodia poy periorizan thn prosbash toy polith ths Attikhs se mia paralia gyrw kai poly konta sto spiti toy. Ayto fysika einai mono h arxh. H ypoyrgos Periballontos k. Mpirmpilh exei analabei mia seira prwtoboyliwn kai ayth htan h arxh mias prwtoboylias, opoy qa apeleyqerwqoyn aktes mhkoys peripoy 2 xiliometrwn. Kai ayto qa ginei amesa. Entassetai de, sth logikh ``amesh prosbash'' sthn perioxh, h opoia apodidetai ston polith, sthn oikogeneia, stoys neoys. Apo ekei kai pera, to qema poy qesate einai synoliko. Opws gnwrizoyme, exei chfistei apo thn kybernhsh mas o nomos 3218/2010 gia thn prostasia twn daswn kai twn dasikwn ektasewn ths Attikhs, gia tis legomenes ``kamenes perioxes'', me thn opoia problepetai, pera apo thn anastolh twn oikodomikwn ergasiwn, kai h systash eidikoy organoy poy qa einai armodio gia tis katedafiseis, to opoio hdh exei systaqei, exei stelexwqei kai energopoieitai me to skopo ths systashs toy, dhladh na elegxei kai na syntonizei ta gkremismata twn ayqairetwn sthn perioxh.

MAKRYGIANNHS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, mias kai to efere h koybenta, orismenoi polites profanws den perimenan na ylopoihqei to programma ``anoiktes paralies'' apo thn kybernhsh, alla ekanan pisines sta spitia toys. Paranomes. Mhpws yparxei kapoio eidiko sxedio, mhpws yparxei h politikh boylhsh na antimetwpistei ayto to pragma, to opoio mas exei kanei kai dieqnws rezili, me pisines oi opoies kalyptontai sta boreia proastia me diaforoys tropoys kai me anqrwpoys poy forodiafeygoyn h paranomoyn en pash periptwsei; Yparxei h politikh boylhsh kai pws qa thn ekfrasei h kybernhsh pros ayth thn kateyqynsh h qa ejantlhsei mono thn politikh boylhsh, thn apofasistikothta, stoys xamhloys syntajioyxoys;

PETALWTHS: Prwta ap` ola, to anoigma twn paraliwn stoys polites exei na kanei kyriws me toys polites oi opoioi den exoyn thn oikonomikh dynatothta, na plhrwnoyn peripoy 40 eyrw, ana oikogeneia, gia na exoyn prosbash stis paralies, opws qa eprepe na exoyn. Ara, to metro ayto exei na kanei me thn prostasia twn dikaiwmatwn, idiaitera toy adynamoy polith, fysika kai olwn twn politwn.

Ws pros tis pisines, gnwrizoyme oloi oti h kybernhsh exei analabei prwtoboylia gia ton entopismo twn kataskeyasmatwn aytwn kai me th xrhsh doryforoy, etsi wste na entopizontai oi pisines poy yparxoyn kai den einai dhlwmenes, gia na exoyn oi idiokthtes toys, th deoysa antimetwpish apo thn Politeia, poy exei na kanei kai me thn apokrych forologikwn stoixeiwn kai eisodhmatwn. Gnwrizoyme poly kala oti oi pisines einai pleon tekmhria diabiwshs poy synypologizontai sto na apokalyfqoyn ekeina ta eisodhmata, ta opoia apokryptontai kata tis forologikes dhlwseis.

STRATAKHS: Mias kai briskomaste para qin' alos, ti ennoeite otan lete oti qa yparxei eleyqerh prosbash stis paralies; Ti akribws ennoeite; Giati h eleyqerh, para deigmatos xarh, prosbash einai kai sth Barkiza, alla gia na mpeis mesa qelei 13 eyrw kai prepei na plhrwseis meta kai gia thn japlwstra h thn karekla poy qa kaqiseis. Ean de epilejeis xwro na kaqiseis, den yparxei. Qa parei kapoia metra pros ayth thn pleyra h kybernhsh;

PETALWTHS: Den th gnwrizw thn periptwsh poy anafereste...

STRATAKHS: Oles oi paralies etsi einai.

PETALWTHS: Opoy yparxei, omws, misqwmenh paralia kai yparxei idiwtikh ekmetalleysh, h opoia plhrwnetai fysika pros to kratos, einai ena diaforetiko kaqestws. Ayto poy den mporoyme na anexqoyme pleon, einai na kleinei thn paralia kaqe magazi, kaqe kentro, kaqe jenodoxeio, ayqaireta kai na apokleiei thn prosbash twn politwn se aytes tis paralies. Oi organwmenes plaz, exoyn ena idiaitero nomiko kaqestws kai fysika, o,ti kineitai sta plaisia ths nomimothtas, to antimetwpizoyme me ton tropo ayto.

STRATAKHS: Na pw kai kati, mias kai briskomaste sto ypoyrgeio Periballontos. Exei jeshkwqei megalos qorybos kai yparxoyn antidraseis hdh arketes, giati se mia epoxh poy perikoptontai epidomata dhmosiwn ypallhlwn, se mia epoxh poy yparxei h qesh ths kybernhshs oti pagwnoyn oi logariasmoi, epiballetai ena epipleon xaratsi stoys logariasmoys ths DEH poy afora mia sygkekrimenh kathgoria ergazomenwn. Dhladh, pali exoyme kathgories pronomioyxwn dhmosiwn ypallhlwn, poy me to diko toys tropo epitygxanoyn thn epixeirhmatikh politikh, thn opoia fainetai oti synexizei h kybernhsh. 'H qa poyme kai edw, opws kai sta telh kykloforias, mea culpa;

PETALWTHS: Prwta ap` ola, antilambanomai oti anafereste se ayto to telos toy DETE, poy einai stoys logariasmoys ths DEH. Hdh, exei ekdoqei kai apo to ypoyrgeio Oikonomikwn - giati einai armodiothta toy ypoyrgeioy Oikonomikwn- mia anakoinwsh, h opoia jekaqarizei ta pragmata. Symfwna me thn anakoinwsh ayth, prokeitai gia esoda toy taktikoy proypologismoy. Polla apo ta dhmosieymata, ta opoia anaferqhkan sto sygkekrimeno qema einai anakribh. Aplws, gia thn istoria, sas enhmerwnw oti to telos ayto, to epidoma ayto, etsi opws xorhgeitai, prosdioristhke to 2007 me nomo ths prohgoymenhs kybernhshs, otan htan yfypoyrgos Oikonomias kai Oikonomikwn o k. Mpezas kai ayto poy kaname emeis einai na to meiwsoyme, prwton kata 20% synolika fetos kai deyteron, na exoyme thn aytotelh forologhsh toy epidomatos aytoy sto plaisio ths forologikhs politikhs poy akoloyqoyme, etsi wste na yparxei koinwnikh dikaiosynh kai se ayto ton tomea.

Apo kei kai pera, ayto einai ena prwto bhma. Meletatai h oristikh epilysh toy zhthmatos aytoy, giati ontws den mporoyme na anexqoyme na epibarynontai oi sympolites mas me telh kai epidomata, ta opoia den toys aforoyn.

GIANNISHS: Me dedomenes kai tis ejaggelies toy k. Kastanidh kai to nomosxedio to opoio syzhteitai shmera sth Boylh kai bebaiws me aytonohto to oti h Boylh einai ekeinh h opoia apofasizei se o,ti afora th systash proanakritikhs Epitrophs ws aporroia twn eyrhmatwn mias Ejetastikhs Epitrophs, h politikh boylhsh ths kybernhshs einai na proxwrhsei se proanakritikh; Dedomenoy toy gegonotos oti h kybernhsh exei kai thn pleiochfia twn 160 boyleytwn, ara an lhfqei mia tetoia apofash qa lhfqei me thn kybernhtikh pleiochfia sth Boylh. Yparxei politikh boylhsh gia proanakritikes Epitropes; Kai deyteron, yparxei kapoios tropos anadromikothtas se o,ti afora paragegrammena adikhmata;

PETALWTHS: Na jekaqarisw oti h politikh boylhsh mas einai na diereynhsoyme kai na diereynhsei kai h Dikaiosynh apo ena shmeio kai pera, opoy einai armodia, opoiodhpote stoixeio poinikhs parabatikothtas prokycei apo tis Ejetastikes Epitropes. Den qa xaristoyme se kanenan. Ayth einai h entolh poy exoyme labei apo thn koinwnia, apo toys polites. Ayth einai h nomimh ypoxrewsh kai kaqhkon ths kybernhshs kai olwn twn boyleytwn fysika. Ara, den prokeitai na kanoyme pisw, otidhpote kai an synanthsoyme mprosta mas kai gia opoiodhpote politiko h mh proswpo.

Ws pros thn anadromikothta, epeidh yparxoyn, fysika, desmeyeis ths nomikhs episthmhs gia th mh anadromikothta twn nomwn kai epeidh antilambanomai ti ennoeite, yparxei h skech na diereynhqoyn ta adikhmata ayta se ena allo epipedo, etsi wste kai adikhmata poy ferontai apo kapoioys oti exoyn paragrafei, na ejantlhqei kaqe dynatothta, etsi wste na mporesoyme na ta dwsoyme sth Dikaiosynh gia na diereynhqoyn etsi opws prepei.

GIANNISHS: Dieykrinistika: Ayto to ``allo epipedo diereynhshs'' poio qa einai; Mporeite na mas to perigracete eseis;

PETALWTHS: Einai safes: oti qa ejantlhsoyme kaqe nomikh dynatothta, etsi wste na mh fainontai paragegrammena adikhmata, ta opoia oysiastika den einai.

MAKRYGIANNHS: Epeidh eiste kai dikhgoros, nomikos, mporeite na mas peite poia arqra, poioys nomoys qa kanete xrhsh; Giati o nomos peri eyqynhs ypoyrgwn einai sygkekrimenos k. Ypoyrge.

PETALWTHS: Ta adikhmata, omws, exoyn diafores morfes teleshs -den einai dikh moy armodiothta twra na ta anaferw- poy shmainei oti oi nomikoi, oi boyleytes poy symmetexoyn se Epitropes, osoi apofasisoyn kai stis Ejetastikes kai se endexomenes proanakritikes, qa kanoyn plhrh diereynhsh olwn twn nomikwn ptyxwn aytwn twn adikhmatwn. An ontws exoyn paragrafei h oxi.

ROYBINETHS: H Enwsh Dhmosiografwn Ellhnismoy kai Perifereiakwn MME, opws sas exoyme enhmerwsei, kanei ena diktyo me ton Ellhnismo kai syllegei thn antapokrish poy exoyn gia ta diafora metra. Yparxoyn metra poy exoyn shmeiwsei epityxia, opws to fragma twn syntexniwn poy espase to ypoyrgeio Dhmosiwn Ergwn me ton Reppa, o Astakos poy einai mia poly shmantikh ependysh kai syzhthqhke epishs ayth h apanthsh toy k. Papakwnstantinoy gia thn ayjhsh twn esodwn. Omws, yparxei kai ena parapono - kai nomizw oti xreiazetai edw prwtoboylia toy Prwqypoyrgoy kai mia systrateysh pragmatikh, opws ennoei- gia ta anaptyjiaka metra. Ta metra ths Katselh menoyn pisw kai epikeitai, opws lene, megalo ``tsoynami'' se epixeirhseis kai se diafora. Ayto, omws, qa mporoyse na akyrwsei ta mexri twra spoydaia pragmata poy exoyn epiteyxqei, opws - legetai- ston tomea twn daneiwn poy phrame.

PETALWTHS: Na sas ypenqymisw oti kai sto eishghtiko moy shmeiwma, etsi opws to anefera, ejeqesa me arketh leptomereia oti shmera eidika to atypo Ypoyrgiko Symboylio, to opoio einai en ejelijei kai synedriazei, syzhta akribws tetoioy eidoys apofaseis. Qemata anaptyjhs, qemata poy qa perilambanontai sto neo anaptyjiako nomo, ena nomo prwtoporiako kai kainotomo poy einai aparaithtos. Enas nomos o opoios bazei fragh se oles ekeines tis periptwseis poy ta daneia ta opoia lambanan oi ependytes polles fores xrhsimopoioyntan me tropo teleiws anarmosto gia dhmosio xrhma. Yparxei antikeimenikopoihsh, yparxoyn kinhtra sthn anaptyjh, eidika ths perifereias kai qa einai enas nomos, o opoios pragmatika qa dhmioyrghsei megales anatropes sthn ependytikh apnoia poy diakatexei th xwra mas.

Epishs shmera sto atypo Ypoyrgiko Symboylio, syzhteitai to qema toy pws parembainei h Politeia sthn agora, ws pros tis times. Yparxoyn sygkekrimenes parembaseis kai sygkekrimenes stoxeyseis, etsi wste, afenos men oi times na elegxontai, sto plaisio fysika ths agoras, afeteroy na yparxei prostasia toy katanalwth kai ws pros tis times kai ws pros thn poiothta twn proiontwn ta opoia agorazei. Kai genikws, to qema ths antagwnistikothtas einai ena zhthma poy mas afora. Ekeino, omws, to opoio qa prepei na pw einai oti den qa prepei na adikoyme thn anaptyjiakh politikh ths kybernhshs, h opoia hdh exei dwsei deigmata. Hdh exoyme nomoqethsei thn adeiodothsh, thn aplopoihsh toy ESPA, thn aplopoihsh ths idryshs epixeirhsewn kaqws kai th leitoyrgia toys. Spame th grafeiokratia kai nomoqetika, kati poy mporei na fainetai aploiko se mas, alla sas enhmerwnw oti se kaqe epafh poy kanoyme me jenoys ependytes, to prwto zhthma poy bazoyn einai h aforhth grafeiokratia poy yparxei sth xwra mas kai einai to megalytero empodio sthn anaptyjh ths antagwnistikothtas ths Elladas enanti allwn xwrwn. Hdh, exoyme kanei polles kinhseis, ap` edw kai pera, omws, trexoyme akomh perissotero.

Kai fysika ena allo zhthma poy exei na kanei me thn anaptyjh ths xwras mas einai ayto to perifhmo D' K.P.S, opws exoyme synhqisei na to leme, to ESPA dhladh, me aporrofhtikothta molis 3% ola ayta ta xronia, fetos prosdokoyme na fqasei h aporrofhtikothta toy sto 15%, etsi wste na mporesoyme na kerdisoyme to xameno xrono, twn prohgoymenwn xronwn, gia na yparxoyn ependyseis oi opoies, fysika, fernoyn kai qeseis ergasias.

GARGALAKOS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, paroti h kybernhsh qa eprepe na trexei kai paroti eipate eseis oti me to Asfalistiko kanete tomes kai etsi katafernete na ginei to systhma biwsimo, exoyme thn ejhs katastash: Shmera, sto megalytero asfalistiko Tameio ths xwras den yparxei dioikhths. Kai apo o,ti akoysame apo ton k. Loberdo, aytos tis protaseis tis exei kanei. H kybernhsh, to kentro ejoysias toy Majimoy, bradyporei apo o,ti fainetai. Kai kati akomh: Ean kapws ta dhmosionomika strwsoyn, qa apokatasthsete eisodhmatika toys syntajioyxoys poy toys exete plhjei me ayta ta metra;

PETALWTHS: Prwta ap` ola, na sas pw oti h kybernhsh dra syllogika. Den einai qema enos ypoyrgoy o orismos h mh twn dioikhtwn. Einai qema ths kybernhshs syllogika. Kai fysika, qa yparxei se syntomo xroniko diasthma dioikhths sto IKA.

Apo kei kai pera, einai safes oti emeis exoyme balei ws prwto stoxo, sthn poly asxhmh oikonomikh katastash poy biwnoyme kai gia thn opoia gnwrizoyn oi pantes, th beltiwsh twn dhmosionomikwn zhthmatwn ths xwras mas, etsi wste na mporesoyme na beltiwsoyme kai to eisodhmatiko epipedo twn aplwn politwn.

Ws pros toys syntajioyxoys poy eipate, omws, nomizw oti adikei to na isopedwnoyme toys pantes. Nomizw -to exw pei kai allh fora sthn enhmerwsh- yparxoyn peripoy 2,5 ekat. syntajeis, oxi syntajioyxoi, syntajeis. Dystyxws, yparxoyn syntajioyxoi poy pairnoyn diples, triples kai tetraples syntajeis, ek twn opoiwn 2,5 ekat., oi 850.000 einai syntajeis toy OGA. Aytes den exoyn aggixqei kaqoloy. Ws pros toys ypoloipoys syntajioyxoys yparxei mia klimakwsh. Kai fysika kaname ekeines tis parembaseis, oi opoies qa htan oi ligotero aixmhres kai ligotero epipones gia toys syntajioyxoys kai eidika gia toys xamhlosyntajioyxoys. Einai safes oti einai melhma mas na orqopodhsei h xwra, giati ayto einai poy ,roexei, kai apo kei kai pera na frontisoyme gia thn anaplhrwsh toy xamenoy eisodhmatos twn politwn.

MAKRYGIANNHS: Otan lete, qa frontisete gia thn anaplhrwsh toy xamenoy eisodhmatos, symfwna me to sxedio toy D.N.T. kai ths troikas, en pash periptwsei, to xreos ths xwras, ean den kanw laqos to 2013-2014 qa einai 149% epi toy AEP, pote blepete eseis, ws xroniko orizonta dhladh, thn apokatastash twn plhgentwn apo ayth thn politikh;

PETALWTHS: Qa htan parakindyneymeno na apanthsw xronika. Gnwrizoyme, omws, genika oti ayto to programma einai trietes, oti yparxei safes plaisio xronoy, to opoio exei teqei gia thn katanomh kai gia thn ejelijh twn dhmosionomikwn megeqwn. Einai, dhladh, ypologismeno poso qa einai to elleimma toy xronoy, poso qa einai to elleimma sth meqepomenh xronia kai poso qa einai to xreos. Melhma diko mas, ayth th stigmh einai na mporesoyme na ylopoihsoyme ayto to programma to opoio qa mas bgalei apo ayth thn terastia krish, thn opoia biwnoyme ws xwra.

MAKRYGIANNHS: Akoysa ton k. Loberdo na leei oti endexomenws apo ta Xristoygenna, mporei na apokatastaqoyn eisodhmata twn xamhlosyntajioyxwn poy eplhghsan. Kai epeidh, loipon, leme gia to xroniko orizonta, to 2019, symfwna pali me to programma toy DNT h poreia toy xreoys qa einai sto 120%. Dhladh, parapanw apo o,ti einai shmera, poy einai 115%. Ara, den einai ypokrisia kai koroidia na leei enas ypoyrgos kai na leei kai h kybernhsh, na afhnei na ennohqei oti mporei na apokatasthsei se toso mikro xroniko diasthma, apwleies esodwn, eisodhmatos apo tews adynames omades;

PETALWTHS: Sas anefera oti den mporw na kanw tetoioy eidoys ypologismo, oti einai parakindyneymeno na anaferw ayth th stigmh xrono apokatastashs twn eisodhmatwn. O k. Loberdos, fysika, einai armodios ypoyrgos epi toy Asfalistikoy, poy shmainei oti mporei na kanei toys ypologismoys kalytera apo emena. Sas lew oti ayto poy bazoyme emeis mprosta einai h ylopoihsh toy programmatos, poy exoyme ekponhsei. Apo ekei kai pera, mporei na lete eseis gia to 2019. Na sas anaferw omws, oti an apomonwnoyme ena dhmosionomiko stoixeio, ayto den leei tipote. Kai ta elleimmata yparxoyn kai den einai kako na yparxoyn. Kai to xreos exei ena pososto sto opoio kineitai. To qema einai na bgoyme apo thn yfesh kai na xrhsimopoihsoyme ayta ta xrhmata, etsi wste na mporoyme na exoyme anaptyjh. Basei aytoy toy programmatos poy exoyme ekponhsei kai exoyme dhmosiopoihsei, efoson yparjei anaptyjh, einai safestato oti qa anaplhrwqoyn ta xamena eisodhmata olwn twn politwn.

STRATAKHS: Hqela na rwthsw kyrie Ypoyrge, gia thn episkech toy k. Erntogan sthn Aqhna. H Nea Dhmokratia exei shkwsei to qema, legontas oti einai antiqetos o k. Samaras sth xronikh periodo poy ginetai h episkech kai malista exoyme ena sxolio toy symboyloy toy k. Samara, k. Lazaridh, o opoios milaei gia mia oqwmanikh kai aytokratorikh episkech Erntogan. Pws sxoliazete ayto;

PETALWTHS: Prwta ap` ola, qa hqela na maqw kai egw ean ayth h rhsh toy symboyloy toy k. Samara einai kai ypeyqynh apoch kai politikh ths Neas Dhmokratias. Den gnwrizw dhladh, kata poso ekfrazei th Nea Dhmokratia, mia tetoia apoch. Ekeino, omws, to opoio qa hqela na jekaqarisw edw, einai oti h ejwterikh politikh askeitai me perissh sobarothta, me poly megalh plhrothta ws pros tis stoxeyseis kai tis politikes mas. Emeis den kanoyme koymparies gia na kanoyme ejwterikh politikh mesw koympariwn. Emeis bazoyme to qema ths ejwterikhs politikhs ekei poy prepei, xwris fobies, me jekaqares qeseis kai h antallagh episkecewn ginetai opote prepei na ginetai. Exoyme qesei ena sygkekrimeno plaisio se ayth thn episkech, me sygkekrimenes apofaseis poy qa lhfqoyn, me sygkekrimenes ypografes synergasiwn kai den yparxei kanena qema parermhneias ths qeshs mas, oyte stis ellhnotoyrkikes sxeseis, oyte se kamia allh ptyxh twn dieqnwn mas sxesewn.

STRATAKHS: Den symmerizeste thn apoch poy ekfrazetai apo stelexh ths Neas Dhmokratias, endexomenws kai apo thn hgesia oti briskomaste se mia periodo adynamias, logw twn oikonomikwn problhmatwn kai ths oikonomikhs krishs kai den einai o,ti kalytero na proxwrame se syzhthseis epi eqnikwn qematwn, ayto to diasthma;

PETALWTHS: Ayth einai mia fobikh apoch. To na krybomaste shmera, epeidh exoyme oikonomika problhmata poy ta gnwrizei, dystyxws, olh h anqrwpothta, qa einai sfalma kai blabh gia ta eqnika symferonta. Emeis diekdikoyme ta dikia mas se ola ta epipeda kai se ola ta fora. Oi ejwterikes mas sxeseis me toys geitones mas den mporoyn na diataraxqoyn, oyte mporoyme na fobomaste, parolh thn oikonomikh katastash poy briskomaste. Ean krybomaste, akribws ayto yphretoyme. To na ginomaste epirrepeis kai na mas ypologizoyn olo kai ligotero.

SPANOY: Qa ginei kapoia syzhthsh gia to endexomeno synekmetalleyshs petrelaikwn koitasmatwn, poy kapoioi pisteyoyn oti yparxoyn sto notio Aigaio;

PETALWTHS: Oi syzhthseis qa dhmosiopoihqoyn. Qa dhmosiopoihqei to plaisio kaqws kai oi ypografes symfwniwn poy qa ginoyn.

MAKRYGIANNHS: Epeidh legetai oti mporei na yparjei kapoia qeamatikh protash apo ton k. Erntogan se o,ti afora tis ejoplistikes dapanes twn dyo xwrwn, h ellhnikh kybernhsh einai anoixth se mia tetoia syzhthsh kai an o Prwqypoyrgos k. Papandreoy, apo th dikh toy pleyra, einai etoimos na paei kai ena bhma mprosta, prin kan isws to kanei o k. Erntogan apo monos toy;

PETALWTHS: H meiwsh twn ejoplismwn, qewrhtika einai ena ejairetika qetiko dogma kai gia tis dyo pleyres kai gia thn ellhnikh kai gia thn toyrkikh. Einai aytonohto oti to na dapanoyntai tosa xrhmata gia ejoplismoys, otan exoyme shmantika oikonomika problhmata kai emeis kai h Toyrkia einai ena problhma. Ekeino, omws, to opoio exei pei h ellhnikh kybernhsh kai to epanalambanw kai egw shmera, einai oti me logia, den meiwnontai oi ejoplismoi. Xreiazontai erga, xreiazontai prajeis, etsi wste na mporoyme na milame kapote gia meiwsh ejoplismwn. Kai aytes oi prajeis prepei na ginoyn, fysika, apo thn Toyrkia giati gnwrizoyme kai th symperifora ths.

MAKRYGIANNHS: Allh mia erwthsh gia thn episkech. Einai eikona sobarhs, pantws, xwras k. Ekproswpe, na zhteitai apo ton Toyrko prwqypoyrgo na mhn katalysei se sygkekrimeno jenodoxeio sthn plateia Syntagmatos, opoy synhqws ginontai diadhlwseis, alla na paei ligo parapera;

PETALWTHS: Poy parapera, dhladh;

MAKRYGIANNHS: Jerw egw; Sto Hilton, as poyme.

PETALWTHS: To Hilton einai ena apo ta kentrika shmeia, oytws h allws, ths Aqhnas kai to gnwrizoyme...

MAKRYGIANNHS: Den ginontai diadhlwseis ap ejw, apo oso gnwrizw...

PETALWTHS: ... kai omws ginontai. H amerikanikh Presbeia einai para poly konta kai pernoyn polles diadhlwseis apo to Hilton. Sxedon oles oi diadhlwseis. Apo kei kai pera...

MAKRYGIANNHS: Zhthqhke na paei alloy;

PETALWTHS: ... einai zhthmata asfaleias. Einai zhthmata poy adikoyn thn oysia kai nomizw oti qa prepei na meinoyme ekei. Pantws, to jenodoxeio opoy qa katalysei o Toyrkos prwqypoyrgos, opoy qa ginoyn oles oi ergasies twn ellhnotoyrkikwn synanthsewn, einai to kentrikotero shmeio ths Aqhnas.

GIANNISHS: Mia erwthsh gia na epistrecoyme sta qemata diafaneias kai kakodiaxeirishs toy dhmosioy xrhmatos. Tis teleytaies hmeres blepoyme oti yparxoyn anafores ston Typo gia dapanes ypoyrgwn ths prohgoymenhs kybernhshs ths Neas Dhmokratias, bebaiws, me ypoyrgikes apofaseis. Ypoqetw oti ayto den einai mempto, efoson h diadikasia exei thrhqei. Wstoso, ta posa ta opoia anaferontai apoteloyn gia thn kybernhsh zhthma diereynhshs h estw, zhthma kolasmoy;

PETALWTHS: Gia thn kybernhsh apotelei zhthma diereynhshs kaqe yponoia, kaqe kataggelia, kaqe endeijh poy yparxei gia kataspatalhsh kai diaspaqish toy dhmosioy xrhmatos, akomh kai enos eyrw. Den prokeitai na xaristoyme se kanenan, eite einai politiko eite einai mh politiko proswpo, eite einai aplos dhmosios ypallhlos, opoy diafainetai oti yparxei diaspaqish toy dhmosioy xrhmatos. Ayth einai h arxh mas kai akoloyqoyme oles ekeines tis diadikasies, etsi wste na yparxei epanorqwsh ths ajiopistias toy Dhmosioy kai fysika perifroyrhsh toy dhmosioy xrhmatos.

STRATAKHS: Mia teleytaia erwthsh. Eipate shmera sto atypo Ypoyrgiko Symboylio pws qa parembainei h Politeia stis agores. Ayth thn Epitroph Antagwnismoy qa thn energopoihsete;

PETALWTHS: H Epitroph Antagwnismoy yparxei. Gnwrizoyme para poly kala pws leitoyrgei. Ean yponoeite kai ennoeite, mallon, oti den leitoyrgei opws qa eprepe, gnwrizoyme tis paqogeneies toy systhmatos elegxoy ths agoras. Gnwrizoyme periptwseis poy exoyn paei sthn Epitroph Antagwnismoy kata diasthmata kai ti troph eixan. Gnwrizoyme oti melh ths Epitrophs Antagwnismoy, oi opoioi tygxanan na einai koymparoi politikwn ths Neas Dhmokratias, hdh exoyn perasei sth Dikaiosynh, hdh exoyn profylakistei. Gnwrizoyme ti antimetwpish eixan aytoi kai ti asylia se alles epoxes. Emeis, exoyme mia arxh, oti qa prepei h agora na elegxetai, etsi opws prepei na elegxetai.

STRATAKHS: Panw se ayto, qa elegxetai, ma opws elegxetai epiballontai kapoia prostima poy den ...

PETALWTHS: Opws qa prepei na elegxetai...

STRATAKHS: Opws qa prepei na elegxetai.. Dhladh qa epimeinei h kybernhsh stis symfwnies kyriwn poy htan kai ena antikeimeno antiparaqeshs to prohgoymeno diasthma h qa proxwrhsei se aysthres kyrwseis stoys parabates, stoys kerdoskopoys. Giati p.x. na sas anaferw ena paradeigma, gia na ginei apolyta katanohto. Ena prostimo isodynamei me mia wra doyleias se ena super market.

PETALWTHS: Symfwnw. Gi` ayto akribws to ypoyrgeio Oikonomikwn kai to ypoyrgeio Oikonomias ergazontai pros ayth thn kateyqynsh. Hdh to ypoyrgeio Oikonomikwn exei syllejei enan ariqmo parabasewn kai qa dhmosiopoihsei ola ta apotelesmata, synolika, ths poreias poy phran aytes oi parabaseis. To de ypoyrgeio Oikonomias ergazetai akribws pros ayth thn kateyqynsh kai paroysiazetai sto atypo Ypoyrgiko h ergasia poy exei kanei ws pros ton elegxo ths agoras, pros ofelos toy katanalwth kai toy polith.

MAKRYGIANNHS: Eipate gia to Asfalistiko k. Ypoyrge oti diasfalizei th biwsimothta kai paei legontas. Wstoso aytes tis prosdokies, tis qeseis, en pash periptwsei, den tis symmerizetai oyte h GSEE oyte h ADEDY, oi opoies kaitoi elegxontai apo to PASOK, syndikalistika ennow, katebainoyn se apergies, se diadhlwseis klp.

PETALWTHS: Ayto einai pros timhn toys.

MAKRYGIANNHS: Mporei kai to piqanotero. H kybernhsh pws den mporei...

PETALWTHS: Pros timhn toy PASOK, fysika, poy den epibalei gnwmes.

MAKRYGIANNHS: An mporoyse, isws, mporei na eixame alla. Alla, en pash periptwsei, pws kai den mporeite na peisete tis syndikalistikes organwseis oti ayto to sxedio einai ontws to kalytero;

PETALWTHS: Emeis, prwta ap ola, mesa apo ayto to dialogo poy anoijame, enan eyrytato koinwniko dialogo kai me toys etairoys kai me ta politika kommata, eixame zhthsei, anejarthta an den antapokriqhkan oloi, na yparxei mia syllogikh kai synolikh protash, h opoia, fysika, na einai efarmosimh, etsi wste to asfalistiko mellon twn politwn mas na einai kalymmeno kai prostateymeno. Thn eyqynh ths askhshs politikhs thn exei anaqesei o laos, symfwna me to Syntagma, sthn kybernhsh. H kybernhsh askei ypeyqynh, apofasistikh politikh me poly megala, omws, periqwria syzhthshs me thn koinwnia. Apo kei kai pera, oi syndikalistikoi foreis kanoyn th doyleia toys, etsi opws nomizoyn oti prepei na thn kanoyn. Prokeitai gia dyo diaforetika zhthmata. H kybernhsh kanei allo ergo kai oi syndikalistikoi foreis exoyn to diko toys. Emas, mas endiaferei na antilhfqei o Ellhnas poliths oti ean den kanoyme tomes sto asfalistiko systhma se syntomo xroniko diasthma den qa eixe asfalish oyte ygeias, oyte syntajhs. Kai epeidh einai ypoxrewsh dikh mas na ta diasfalisoyme ayta, gia ayto, akribws, fernoyme ena asfalistiko systhma, to opoio qa einai biwsimo kai den qa einai aplws ena ``mpalwma'', opws ekane h prohgoymenh kybernhsh. Ena asfalistiko systhma, to opoio sygkentrwnei thn panspermia tameiwn se tria mono, etsi wste na yparxei tajh sto asfalistiko systhma ths xwras. Ena asfalistiko systhma, to opoio qa eggyatai thn periqalch kai th syntajiodothsh toy aploy Ellhna polith.

MAKRYGIANNHS: O anasxhmatismos pote qa ginei;

PETALWTHS: Me rwthsate kai xqes;

MAKRYGIANNHS: Oxi egw. Kapoios synadelfos. Syzhteitai.

PETALWTHS: Den tiqetai qema anasxhmatismoy.

STRATAKHS: Pws sxoliazete th mhnysh poy kateqese shmera o k. Manos kai to komma toy ``H DRASH'' enantion twn syndikalistwn toy PAME gia thn katalhch ths eisodoy toy jenodoxeioy ``Megalh Bretania'' kai ths katalhchs toy limanioy gia na mhn apobibastoyn h na mhn epibibastoyn toyristes.

PETALWTHS: Ennoeitai oti th mhnysh toy k. Manoy den qa th sxoliasw. Ekeino, omws, poy pragmatika mporw na sxoliasw, epeidh xqes, opws gnwrizete, eixa mia synergasia me thn k. Gkerekoy thn armodia yfypoyrgo gia ton Toyrismo kai mas exei dystyxws dhlwqei oti polles xiliades krathsewn, gi` ayto to xroniko diasthma apo xwres toy ejwterikoy, exoyn akyrwqei. Kai exoyn akyrwqei, giati qewroyn oti den mporoyn na erxontai epibates kroyazieroploiwn, toyristes kai na toys apagoreyetai h eisodos h h ejodos sto limani toy Peiraia. Den mporei na apagoreyetai se kentrika jenodoxeia ths Aqhnas h eisodos twn politwn jenwn xwrwn, poy shmainei oti oloi qa prepei kapote na analaboyme tis eyqynes mas. Kai epeidh oles aytes oi draseis toy PAME ginontai en onomati mias ceydepigrafhs prostasias twn ergazomenwn, sas enhmerwnw oti fernei akribws ta antiqeta apotelesmata. Giati h meiwsh ths toyristikhs kinhshs, isws, enos apo ta ygiestera proionta poy exoyme na epideijoyme ws xwra, den shmainei mono meiwsh twn kratikwn esodwn kai eisodhmatwn h twn epixeirhmatikwn, shmainei kai meiwsh qesewn ergasias, kati poy qa prepei na antilhfqoyme oloi mas kai na ginoyme para poly aysthroi otan exoyme na kanoyme me tetoioy eidoys zhthmata.

ROYBINETHS: Mhpws qa prepei na zhthqei apo tis syndikalistikes organwseis na paroyn qesh se ena toso kyrio shmeio.

PETALWTHS: Nomizw oti h ypeyqynothta poy epiballoyn oi kairoi kai oi prajeis, mporei na ginei antilhpth apo oloys.

Sas eyxaristw.

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