Greek Government Press Briefing, 07-11-26

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

Tmhma Dhmosiografikwn Kalycewn

Deytera, 26 Noembrioy 2007

Ariqmos Deltioy: 107920661

Ekdosh 1

brf2611

YPOYRGOS EPIKRATEIAS

Aqhna, 26 Noembrioy 2007

Xairete kai kalh ebdomada.

" O Prwqypoyrgos k. Kwstas Karamanlhs, ayrio stis 12.00, qa synanthqei, sto Megaro Majimoy, me ton Proedro ths Kypriakhs Dhmokratias k. Tasso Papadopoylo. Meta apo th synanthsh, qa akoloyqhsei epishmo geyma.

" Ypografetai shmera apo ton Ypoyrgo Oikonomias kai Oikonomikwn k. Alogoskoyfh, thn Epitropo Perifereiakhs Politikhs ths Eyrwpaikhs Enwshs k. Ntanoyta Xoympner kai ton Epitropo Apasxolhshs Koinwnikwn Ypoqesewn kai Isothtas twn Eykairiwn k. Blantimir Spintla, h epishmh enarjh ths ylopoihshs twn Epixeirhsiakwn Programmatwn toy Eqnikoy Strathgikoy Plaisioy Anaforas 2007-2013, gnwstoteroy ws ESPA. Ta programmata ayta, dhladh ta 8 tomeaka kai ta 5 perifereiaka Epixeirhsiaka Programmata, egkriqhkan apo thn Eyrwpaikh Enwsh sto synolo toys. Taytoxronws, me thn egkrish ayth jekinaei kai h energopoihsh ths diadikasias gia thn ektamieysh ths prokatabolhs ths koinotikhs syndromhs, h opoia einai ths tajhs twn 400 ekatommyriwn eyrw. Ta ellhnika Epixeirhsiaka Programmata ypoblhqhkan epishmws sthn Eyrwpaikh Epitroph, hdh apo ton Ioylio toy 2007, meta apo prokatarktikh diapragmateysh me tis yphresies ths Eyrwpaikhs Epitrophs. To gegonos ayto exei ws apotelesma thn epispeysh twn diadikasiwn egkrishs toys. To ESPA ths Elladas poy eixe egkriqei apo thn Epitroph ton Martio toy 2007, htan to prwto metajy twn xwrwn ths Eyrwpaikhs Enwshs twn 15 kai to deytero metajy twn xwrwn ths Eyrwpaikhs Enwshs twn 27. H epityxia ayth den einai tyxaia. Hrqe meta apo sklhrh, epimonh, meqodikh kai kala organwmenh doyleia triwn etwn kai ws synexeia ths sklhrhs maxhs poy doqhke apo thn kybernhsh kai proswpika apo ton Prwqypoyrgo, to Dekembrio toy 2005, otan ejasfalisthkan oi polytimoi poroi ths D' Programmatikhs Periodoy 2007-2013, synolikoy ycoys 24,3 disekatommyriwn eyrw. Gia thn programmatikh periodo 2000-2006 parelhfqh mia katastash me shmantikes adynamies oson afora sto plaisio gia thn ylopoihsh toy G' Koinotikoy Plaisioy Sthrijhs. Me to ESPA 2007-2013, stoxos einai, na mhn yparxoyn ta problhmata ayta. Kai gia to logo ayto epidiwketai to systhma sxediasmoy diaxeirishs-ylopoihshs toy elegxoy na diasfalizei thn apotelesmatikh leitoyrgia toy.

Parakalw tis erwthseis sas.

PALAIOLOGOS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, gia to Asfalistiko poy einai kai epikairo, epeidh grafontai polla, anaparagontai polla, ti ginetai me to qema ths 37etias; Katargeitai kai paei sta 39 xronia h sta 40 gia thn plhrh syntajiodothsh;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Oi protaseis ths kybernhshs, opws gnwrizete, katatiqentai sthn armodia Epitroph ths Boylhs, thn prosexh Tetarth. Sthn armodia Epitroph ths Boylhs o k. Magginas qa anaferei tis protaseis ths kybernhshs gia osa qemata den exoyn doqei mexri stigmhs.

PALAIOLOGOS: Moy epitrepete, omws, epeidh edwse xqes mia synenteyjh, kaq` ola endiaferoysa sthn ``KAQHMERINH'', o k. Magginas, wstoso den fanhke na anoigei ta xartia toy, pera apo th gnwsth desmeysh, toylaxiston se rhtoriko epipedo, twn triwn ``den'': Den qa yparjei ayjhsh twn eisforwn, den qa yparjei ayjhsh toy orioy hlikias kai den qa yparjei meiwsh ths syntajhs. Wstoso, omws, sthn prajh blepoyme, ean toylaxiston ylopoihqoyn oi ejaggellomenes proqeseis, tis lew egw, ths kybernhshs, mallon qa pame se ayjhsh toy orioy hlikias h toylaxiston se ayjhsh kai twn eisforwn. Telika, den blepw na yparxei ena jekaqarisma toy topioy ws pros tis proqeseis ths kybernhshs.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Isxyei h prohgoymenh apanthsh.

PALAIOLOGOS: Oti qa jekaqaristei sth Boylh;

KWNSTANTINIDHS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, sto Asfalistiko tis teleytaies hmeres empleketai entona, qa elega, to qema ths syntajiodothshs twn boyleytwn, anaforika me to ycos twn paroxwn. Ti ginetai me ayth thn ypoqesh; Qa kopoyn oi syntajeis; Den qa syntajiodothqoyn oi boyleytes; Prepei na dwsete mia apanthsh, giati h eikona ayth kaqe hmera sthn thleorash exei emplakei kai den mporei na bgei kai akrh.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Opws eixa pei prin apo liges hmeres se ayth thn aiqoysa, yparxoyn zhthmata ta opoia qa apasxolhsoyn th syzhthsh sth Boylh, meta apo protaseis poy kanei h kybernhsh. Kai bebaiws, oxi mono sth Boylh, alla kai metajy twn armodiwn syndikalistikwn forewn poy endiaferontai na metexoyn sto dialogo. Metajy twn qematwn, einai kai to qema twn boyleytwn. Qa perimenete ws thn Tetarth, na ginei h syzhthsh sth Boylh.

ROYMELIWTHS: H kybernhsh qewrei oti einai oratos o kindynos, kapoioi apo toys boyleytes ths poy eite diaforopoioyntai, h kratoyn apostaseis apo tis protaseis ths kybernhshs gia to Asfalistiko, na mhn tis chfisoyn sth Boylh;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Opws gnwrizete, pote den kanw eikasies se ayth thn aiqoysa.

PASISHS: Kyrie Ekproswpe, aytes oi protaseis poy molis proanaferate, poy basizontai, se poia analogistikh meleth basizontai; Yparxei tetoia meleth kat` arxhn;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Yparxoyn analogistikes meletes. Exei ginei syzhthsh gi` aytes, sthn arxh ths syzhthshs gia to Asfalistiko. Sas qymizw oti kapoia apo aytes  den qymamai akribws- toy Kentroy Ergasias, exei hdh dhmosiopoihqei.

KAKALHS: Apo tis mexri twra topoqethseis twn armodiwn ypoyrgwn, exei aposafhnistei oti h kybernhsh den qa qijei ta katwtata oria twn syntajewn, dhladh den qa qijei ta 460 eyrw gia to IKA, ayth einai h katwterh toy IKA, kai ta 386 gia ton Organismo Asfalishs Eleyqerwn Epaggelmatiwn. Epishs, den qa qijei ta genika oria hlikias syntajiodothshs, dhladh ta 65. Ola ta ypoloipa dhladh, h kybernhsh ta syzhtaei; Mia ejomoiwsh pros ta katw twn syntajewn kai mia ayjhsh ths hlikias; Ola ayta, einai mesa se ayta poy syzhtaei h kybernhsh;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Otan syzhthsame ayto to qema, prin apo liges hmeres, sas eixa pei xarakthristika oti den noeitai na bgainei kapoios sth syntajh se hlikia 40 h 42 etwn. Einai jekaqarh h qesh.

KAKALHS: Einai akraies, eixame pei kai tote. Exoyn proelqei apo kybernhtikh ryqmish. Den yparxei kati diaforetiko.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Akraies, symfwnoyme. Isxyoyn omws.

KAKALHS: Me kybernhtikh ryqmish exoyn erqei. Epishs, opws yparxoyn kai ta alla oti katargeitai h 35etia mexri ta 58 kai qa toys pane sta 65. Ayto isxyei;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Qewrw oti exw dwsei apanthsh gi` ayto.

SARANTAKOS: Ta tria ``den'' poy eipe o Prwqypoyrgos proeklogika, isxyoyn gia oloys toys asfalismenoys kai ergazomenoys kata synepeia h gia toys exontes wrima syntajiodotika dikaiwmata, opws eipe o k. Mhtsotakhs se prosfath thleoptikh toy synenteyjh sto ALTER;

ROYSOPOYLOS: O,ti exei pei o Prwqypoyrgos, isxyei. O,ti exei pei proeklogika, isxyei kai twra.

SARANTAKOS: Gia to synolo;

ROYSOPOYLOS: O,ti akribws exei pei o Prwqypoyrgos.

PALAIOLOGOS: Sas egine mia erwthsh gia to qema twn boyleytwn. Eipate oti ayto to qema qa syzhthqei sth Boylh. Ekeino poy den jeroyme, omws, einai poies einai oi proqeseis ths kybernhshs, giati diabazoyme kai anaparagontai diafora. As poyme, yparxoyn boyleytes, opws o k. Manwlhs, o opoios exei zhthsei thn plhrh katarghsh ths boyleytikhs apozhmiwshs kai to mono poy zhtaei einai mono mia prosayjhsh sthn epaggelmatikh syntajh, kata 3%. Thn idia stigmh, blepoyme na diarreoyn plhrofories poy milane gia ayjhsh toy xronoy twn boyleytikwn qhteiwn, dhladh, apo ta 4 na pane se treis qhteies, sta 12. Oi proqeseis ths kybernhshs, poy akribws kymainontai;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Qa anakoinwqoyn sth Boylh. Sas eipa oti yparxei ena programma to opoio akoloyqei pista h kybernhsh, enas dialogos poy ginetai sto plaisio ths armodias Epitrophs ths Boylhs.

MELIGKWNHS: Gia thn chfish toy nomosxedioy gia to Asfalistiko, otan ayto erqei sth Boylh, meta th syzhthsh, qa teqei qema kommatikhs peiqarxias;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den gnwrizw kati tetoio kai den jerw an einai stis proqeseis ths kybernhshs, kati tetoio. Pisteyw oti se o,ti afora toys boyleytes ths Neas Dhmokratias, qa akoloyqhsoyn ayto to opoio, oysiastika, o Prwqypoyrgos prodiegrace stis Programmatikes Dhlwseis. Einai gnwsto oti h kybernhsh eprokeito na proxwrhsei se allagh twn ryqmisewn gia to Eqniko Systhma Koinwnikhs Asfalishs, h opoia allagh exei hdh -opws eipwqhke kai nwritera- eipwqei apo thn proeklogikh periodo.

KAKALHS: Eiste se qesh shmera na prosdiorisete poia ennoeite ``wrima asfalistika dikaiwmata''; Einai ayta poy qa exoyn osoi bgoyn sth syntajh meta apo pente xronia, gia paradeigma;

ROYSOPOYLOS: O,ti eixa na pw gia to Asfalistiko, mexri stigmhs, to exw pei. Qa perimenoyme thn Tetarth, opoy qa ginei h epomenh synedriash ths Boylhs kai qa eimaste pali edw, sth diaqesh sas.

PALAIOLOGOS: Sth synexeia ths prohgoymenhs erwthshs. Mallon fanhke kat` eme, na steilate ena jekaqaro mhnyma ws kybernhsh pros toys boyleytes. Isxyei to idio; Prokeitai h epispeysh ths eisodoy toy eklogikoy nomoy sth Boylh, synista ena epishs safestato mhnyma pros toys boyleytes se periptwsh poy katachfisoyn;

ROYSOPOYLOS; Sas qymizw oti rwthqhka -tis prwtes hmeres meta tis ekloges- kai meta thn chfo empistosynhs sthn kybernhsh- edw sthn kaqhmerinh enhmerwsh kai eixa pei tote oti se syntomo xroniko diasthma, to opoio den eixa prodiagracei nwritera apo dyo mhnes, qa erqei o nomos sth Boylh. Ara, den exei allajei tipota se sxesh me to xrono kataqeshs toy nomosxedioy gia thn allagh ston eklogiko nomo, poy shmainei dhladh oti den symfwnoyme gia th frash poy xrhsimopoihsate peri epispeysews.

ROYMELIWTHS: Xqes, sas akoysame na lete sto radiofwno oti se orismenes xwres ths Eyrwpaikhs Enwshs oxi mono dhmosieyontai fwtografies kai onomata anqrwpwn poy aforoyn ypoqeseis paiderastias, alla enhmerwnetai h koinh gnwmh akoma kai gia to pote qa bgoyn apo th fylakh. Aytes htan proswpikes sas apoceis h endexomenws na yparjei kai mia protash pros ton k. Xatzhgakh;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den eipa apoceis. Eipa ti symbainei se alles xwres. Ara, ayto den einai apoch. Metefera plhroforia gia to ti symbainei se kapoies alles xwres.

ROYMELIWTHS: Nai. Kai taxqhkate yper.

ROYSOPOYLOS: To oti taxqhka yper aytoy, bebaiws einai proswpikh moy apoch.

ROYMELIWTHS: To eixate janapei ayto.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Nai.

PALAIOLOGOS: Se sxesh panta me to qema gia ton eklogiko nomo. Epeidh phrame dhmosiografikes plhrofories oti o eklogikos nomos qa erxotan stis arxes toy xronoy. Blepoyme, omws, oti eisagetai sth Boylh taytoxrona me ena kayto qema, to Asfalistiko. Anarwtiemai mhpws h symptwsh ayth ths xronikhs taytishs den einai tyxaia.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Opws gnwrizete, h Boylh exei polles Epitropes, oi opoies synedriazoyn parallhlws kai chfizei nomosxedia h askei ton koinoboyleytiko elegxo. Ara, loipon, den qa ekana sxoliasmo h den qa edina kapoia idiaiterh ajia sto oti yparxei to ena qema mazi me to allo. Yparxoyn kai alla qemata sth Boylh, ayth thn periodo.

PALAIOLOGOS: O eklogikos nomos, omws, shmainei kati allo. Dhladh, shmainei, an chfistei enas eklogikos nomos, tote lynontai eykola ta xeria ths kybernhshs  ayto einai katanohto, qa legame, se prwth anagnwsh- oytws wste se periptwsh poy yparjei, o mh genoito gia thn kybernhsh, kati sto Asfalistiko, as poyme katachfistei apo dyo boyleytes h den chfistei apo toys 152, na pame se mia epispeysh twn eklogwn.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Twra katalaba, sthn trith erwthsh sas, oti me rwtate emmesws, alla den qelete na to peite eyqews giati perasan molis dyo mhnes apo tis ekloges, ean prokeitai na pame stis ekloges syntoma.

PALAIOLOGOS: Oxi, den sas rwthsa, an pame, alla ean dinetai h dynatothta na pate grhgora me ton eklogiko nomo kai me aformh mia katachfish toy Asfalistikoy sth Boylh.

ROYSOPOYLOS: O eklogikos nomos, opws orizei to Syntagma, chfizetai kai isxyei gia tis meqepomenes ekloges h mh monon ean chfistei me perissoteres apo 200 chfoys. An dhladh synainesei, en prokeimenw, to meizon komma ths ajiwmatikhs antipoliteyshs h kapoia mikrotera kommata kai boyleytes toy meizonos kommatos. Omws ayto einai senario. Den yparxei kanena tetoio senario sth skech ths kybernhshs.

SARANTAKOS: H kybernhsh synypologizei hdh, stis opoies apofaseis gia to Asfalistiko, ayth thn koinwnikh antidrash poy yparxei; Mpainoyme se mia ebdomada entonwn apergiakwn kinhtopoihsewn.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Oti yparxoyn sigoyra apoceis poy antitiqentai stis apoceis aytes poy ekfrazei h kybernhsh, einai safes. To gnwrizete kalytera apo emena. To metaferete ws dhmosiografoi, to diabazoyme, to akoyme, to blepoyme. Exoyn katateqei kai antiqetes apoceis apo syndikalistikes organwseis kai oxi mono apo mia, alla perissoteres apo mia. Oysiwdes gia thn kybernhsh einai oti to Eqniko Systhma Koinwnikhs Asfalishs den einai ena systhma to opoio allazei h kybernhsh gia kapoioys logoys aoristoys h adioratoys. Prospaqei na to beltiwsei, prospaqei na dhmioyrghsei synqhkes tetoies, etsi wste na bohqhsei na zhsei perissotero, dhladh na dwsei thn pnoh poy xreiazetai. Dioti yparxoyn Tameia ta opoia exoyn para poly megala problhmata kai Tameia ta opoia, me ta problhmata poy exoyn, ean den ginei kapoia allagh, den exoyn para liga xronia zwhs. Eimai bebaios, loipon, oti akoloyqoyme mia politikh, h opoia ofeilei na akoloyqhqei apo kaqe sobarh kybernhsh -kai exei ginei kai se alles xwres ths Eyrwpaikhs Enwshs- otan diapistwnetai oti eimaste se krisimo stayrodromi, wste gia na enisxyqei to asfalistiko systhma.

SARANTAKOS: Mia dieykrinistikh: Gia ton tropo twn allagwn an qa synypologisei h kybernhsh, an akoloyqhsei alloys dromoys gia tis allages aytes qa synypologisei tis koinwnikes antidraseis apo tis koinwnikes omades.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Ean ennoeite ean lambanoyme ypoch mas tis qeseis, tis topoqethseis, tis apoceis, ayto einai alhqes oti ginetai. To exw pei, allwste, apo thn prwth stigmh. Opws qymaste, kalesame kai th GSEE kai thn ADEDY kai alles syndikalistikes Organwseis kai Omospondies k.t.l. na metexoyn sto dialogo, poy shmainei oti emeis qeloyme to dialogo. Den jekinhsame legontas oti qa ginei a' kai teleiwse mexri to a' h oti qa ginoyn ayta ta pente kai teleiwsan ta pente. Jekinhsame legontas poies einai oi apoceis ths kybernhshs kai siga-siga anaptyssontai kai se orismena qemata poy den exoyn anaptyxqei akoma plhrws. Kai perimenoyme tis apoceis kai twn syndikalistikwn forewn, opws perimenoyme tis apoceis twn kommatwn.

KWNSTANTINIDHS: Se liges hmeres erxetai sthn Aqhna gia epishmh episkech o ypoyrgos Ejwterikwn ths Toyrkias. Dierwtwmai, ektos apo ta dimerh zhthmata, an qa teqei to Kypriako kai an qa eipwqei gia mia akomh fora sthn Toyrkia oti prokeimenoy na proxwrhsei h entajiakh ths poreia, qa prepei na thrhsei tis ypoxrewseis sas kai anaferomai kyriws sto Prwtokollo ths Agkyras.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Ennoeite ti qa diameifqei sth syzhthsh poy qa exei me thn ypoyrgo Ejwterikwn ths Elladas; Ta qemata poy yparxoyn sthn atzenta metajy twn dyo xwrwn einai gnwsta. Kai ayta ta qemata h xwra mas ta epanaferei se kaqe eykairia.

KAKALHS: Eipate prohgoymenws oti stoxos twn allagwn poy prowqei h kybernhsh sto Asfalistiko einai na zhsei perissotero to asfalistiko systhma. Wstoso, oi idies oi analogistikes meletes poy exete kataqesei den blepoyn kanena problhma mexri to 2025 kai sthn periptwsh poy to kratos antapokriqei stis ypoxrewseis toy, h makrohmereysh toy systhmatos einai akomh megalyterh. Ayto einai to deytero. Kai to trito, poia einai ta metra; H kybernhsh, dhladh, qa antapokriqei etsi opws ofeilei gia tis ypoxrewseis poy exei apenanti sto nomo gia ta Tameia poy den to exei kanei mexri twra. Oyte ston Proypologismo to ekane. O k. Alogoskoyfhs eixe pei gia 1,5 dis kai telika ston Proypologismo einai 1,2, an den kanw laqos. Epishs, me thn eisforodiafygh den exete kanei tipota.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Balate polla qemata sthn erwthsh sas. Se o,ti afora tis ypoxrewseis, ayto to opoio exei eipwqei apo thn pleyra toy ypoyrgeioy Oikonomias kai Oikonomikwn ginetai prajh ston Proypologismo toy 2008. Gia thn eisforodiafygh ginetai kai ekei prospaqeia. Einai ena problhma poy isxyei, dystyxws, polla xronia sth xwra mas. Opws gnwrizete, h kalyterh organwsh, oi texnologikes ejelijeis, bohqoyn se ayto, etsi wste na pataxqei h eisforodiafygh, oxi sto 100%, alla se ena megalytero pososto apo o,ti sto parelqon. Genikotera to qema ths eisforodiafyghs einai meizwn logos  exete dikio se ayto- problhmatwn poy anafyontai sto Asfalistiko, opws kai se alla zhthmata, oxi monon ekei. Se o,ti afora tis analogistikes meletes poy yparxoyn gia kaqe Tameio, dinoyn apanthsh sta problhmata poy exei to kaqe Tameio, kanoyn jekaqarh thn eikona. Einai safes oti mia kybernhsh den jekina na lysei problhmata sto systhma ths koinwnikhs asfalishs etsi. Alla, yparxoyn problhmata. Ofeilei na ta antimetwpisei. Opws einai safes  kai nomizw oti to exw janapei se ayth thn aiqoysa- oti to Asfalistiko einai ena zhthma poy mono ayto poy qa legame ``politiko ofelos'' den fernei sthn opoiadhpote kybernhsh. Wstoso, ofeilei mia kybernhsh, poy sebetai to mellon ths neas genias, na asxolhqei, na to enisxyei, na to beltiwsei. H antidrash den einai mia antidrash apenanti sthn kybernhsh. H antidrash einai mia antidrash apenanti sto mellon poy diekdikoyn ta paidia mas ayrio. To Asfalistiko den to proseggizei h kybernhsh na to lysei gia kapoioys dikoys ths logoys. Den exei proswpikoys logoys. To proseggizei na to lysei, etsi wste na mporesei na bohqhsei tis nees genies poy mpainoyn twra sthn paragwgh, na zhsoyn ayrio kala kai kalytera, ean einai dynaton. Na exoyn asfalistiko systhma poy qa einai ygies.

KAKALHS: Ta problhmata poy anamfibola yparxoyn sto asfalistiko systhma, ena einai sigoyro, oti den qa exoyn dhmioyrghsei oi ergazomenoi. Den eyqynontai aytoi gi` ayta, omws aytoi plhrwnoyn gi` ayta. Ayto einai to ena zhthma. Kai to deytero einai gia to mellon twn paidiwn. Milate gia to mellon twn paidiwn eseis poy dhmioyrgeite qeseis ergasias merikhs kai anasfalisths apasxolhshs;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Gnwrizete oti exoyn allajei para polles parametroi kai oso beltiwnetai h kaqhmerinothta, oso beltiwnetai h idia h zwh, oi parametroi poy exoyn na kanoyn kai me to Asfalistiko, allazoyn. To Asfalistiko, opws eixa thn eykairia na epanalabw se ayth thn aiqoysa, einai ena zwntano qema. Den einai ena qema to opoio lynetai to 1935 kai menei esaei. Einai ena qema to opoio blepete kai se alles xwres -antimetwpizetai alloy ana 15etia, 20etia, 25etia, alloy se makrytero xroniko diasthma, analoga me to pws eixan asxolhqei sto parelqon oi kybernhseis- prin apo orismenes dekaeties. Einai ena problhma, omws. Nomizw oti ayto to anagnwrizei kaqenas. Kai pisteyw oti anagnwrizei o kaqenas oti mia kybernhsh den exei kanenos eidoys politiko ofelos na asxolhqei me to Asfalistiko. O monos logos, to mono kinhtro, einai oti ofeileis, exontas synaisqhsh eyqynhs, na asxolhqeis me to qema ayto gia tis epomenes genees.

TSIOYFOS: Efoson h kybernhsh -kai swsta lete- qelei na epilysei problhmata se kapoia Tameia poy exoyn sobara problhmata, giati asxoleitai kai me ta alla poy den exoyn problhmata kai sta opoia, ean proxwrhsei se kapoies enopoihseis, as poyme, opws aytes poy proteinete, piqanon na dhmioyrghqoyn problhmata kai sta hdh ygih Tameia. Giati den afhnete ayta kai na asxolhqeite mono me ta alla poy exoyn problhmata.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Ena apo ta meizona problhmata toy Eqnikoy Systhmatos Koinwnikhs Asfalishs sthn Ellada einai akribws ayth h polydiaspash, otan exoyme 155, endexomenws kai parapanw, Tameia. Se alles xwres o ariqmos einai para poly mikroteros. Yparxoyn xwres opoy yfistatai mono ena Tameio kai einai oloi asfalismenoi ekei. Den pame se ayto, sto ena Tameio. Den jerw ti qa ginei meta apo 30 xronia. H tote kybernhsh, isws apofasisei na paei se ena Tameio. Alla sigoyra, an den pame sto epomeno bhma, dhladh se ekeino to bhma poy qa ``symmazecei'' arketa ta pragmata. Qa bohqhsei kai na pataxqei mia grafeiokratia kai na dhmioyrgoyntai kalyteres synqhkes gia ta hdh yparxonta apoqematika, sta opoia gnwrizete oti den mpainei kanenos eidoys xeri -gia na xrhsimopoihsw mia laikh ekfrash- alla paramenoyn ws exoyn sto kaqe Tameio, akomh kai entos toy megalyteroy Organismoy. Kai milw gia ola ta Tameia. Den isxyei mono gia ena h gia dyo Tameia. Antilambanetai kapoios oti ofeilei na akoloyqhsei meqodoys, oi opoies einai monternes kai isxyoyn se alles xwres kai apodeiknyoyn megalyterh antoxh sto systhma.

TSIOYFOS: Den diafwnoyme se ayto. Egw, omws, lew oti efoson kapoia Tameia exoyn kataferei me piqanon swstoys tropoys na ejasfalisoyn mia biwsimothta gia arketa xronia sto mellon, giati se ayta ta Tameia na prospaqeite na kanete kati;(Den akoygetai).

ROYSOPOYLOS: Katalaba to erwthma sas. H prwth allagh poy ginetai se ayta ta Tameia einai oysiastika h enopoihsh toys se enan organismo. Kai nomizw oti gnwrizoyme oloi gia poia Tameia milame. H deyterh allagh poy einai oysiwdhs se o,ti afora ta mikrotera Tameia kai ta ftwxotera, einai to 10% twn porwn poy qa phgainei pia se ena allo logariasmo gia na enisxyontai ta ftwxa Tameia. Ayth einai h oysiwdhs allagh se o,ti afora ta oikonomika toys. Den qigontai ta apoqematika, den allazei tipote apo thn kinhth kai akinhth perioysia toys. H ependysh qa epistrefei eis oloklhron kai pali sto Tameio. Kai malista qa epistrefei megalyterh ependysh apo oti otan ependyei kapoios mikrotera posa. Fantasteite ton eayto sas na exete 1000 eyrw na ependysete kai na exete 10.000 eyrw na ependysete. Einai sigoyra megalytero to prosodo poy qa exete sth deyterh periptwsh. Einai mikra ta posa poy anaferw gia Tameia, alla antilambanetai kapoios poso megala qa einai ta esoda poy qa exoyn, otan qa exoyn na kanoyn me kapoies ekatontades ekatommyria se ena Tameio  milaw gia apoqematika- kai kapoia disekatommyria otan enwqoyn ayta ta Tameia. Oi allages, loipon, poy aforoyn ayta ta Tameia einai dyo: H mia afora sthn enopoihsh kai h deyterh sto 10% apo toys apo edw kai pera poroys, to opoio 10% qa phgainei sta ftwxotera Tameia.

KAKALHS: Ep` aytoy. O Prwqypoyrgos exei dhlwsei, polles fores, oti h bash toy systhmatos Koinwnikhs Asfalishs einai h trimerhs xrhmatodothsh. Einai dhladh to kratos, o ergodoths kai oi ergazomenoi. Sto TSPEAQ, sto Tameio twn dhmosiografwn poia einai h symmetoxh toy kratoys; Kai parolo poy den yparxei symmetoxh toy kratoys, qelete na afaireqei kai to 10% twn porwn;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Nomizw oti exoyme analysei poly to qema toy sygkekrimenoy Tameioy. Den exw na prosqesw kati perissotero.

MELIGKWNHS: Symfwna me plhrofories, h Ekqesh ths Ellhnikhs Astynomias gia tis ereynes poy ginontai sto Mylopotamo kai ta Zwniana, leei pws yparxoyn, telos pantwn, Mylopotamites oi opoioi epidiwkoyn ychles gnwrimies, milaei gia politikes diasyndeseis me dynatothta epirrohs kai gia yposthrijh apo politika proswpa kai ntopioys arxontes. H kybernhsh synexizei na apokleiei to na breqoyn politikes eyqynes sthn olh ypoqesh;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den gnwrizw thn ekqesh sthn opoia anafereste, alla profanws me rwtate gia th dhlwsh poy eixa kanei sto press room pro oligoy kairoy. Qa hqela na sas parakalesw na thn janadiabasete. Isxyei ayto poy eixa pei tote.

MELIGKWNHS: Ara h dhlwsh sas, tote, htan apo qesh arxhs, etsi; Oti den dianoeiste na yparxoyn politikes eyqynes.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Akribws. Ayto eixa pei tote, ayto lew kai twra.

PALAIOLOGOS: Qa sas kanw mia erwthsh diaforetikh apo ayth poy eixa sto myalo moy, me aformh to Mylopotamo. Thn exw krathsei hdh. Epibebaiwnete thn plhroforia poy dhmosieythke prosfatws, oti o Prwqypoyrgos eixe synanthsh me ton tews boyleyth Reqymnoy ton k. Kefalogiannh; Kai an eixe ginei mia tetoia synanthsh, anarwtiemai gia poio logo den doqhke sth dhmosiothta, dhladh den anakoinwqhke epishmws, dedomenoy oti...

ROYSOPOYLOS: O k. Kefalogiannhs, opws gnwrizete, einai symboylos toy Prwqypoyrgoy. Den anakoinwnetai pote epishmws kamia synanthsh toy Prwqypoyrgoy me toys symboyloys toy.

PALAIOLOGOS: Einai akomh symboylos;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Nai.

PALAIOLOGOS: H deyterh erwthsh exei na kanei me to an yparxoyn sthn kybernhsh alazones ypoyrgoi h ypoyrgoi poy me akrites dhlwseis kanoyn zhmia sthn eikona ths kybernhshs.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Ektimw pws oxi.

PALAIOLOGOS: Ara, den einai ``ragismeno gyali'' h kybernhsh.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Poy qelete na to pate;

PALAIOLOGOS: Egw ekana mia erwthsh.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Arkei h apanthsh poy sas edwsa.

KAKALHS: Mporeite na mas peite poio einai to antikeimeno ths synanthshs toy Prwqypoyrgoy to apogeyma me ton Proedro toy LAOS kai poios th zhthse;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Qemata ejwterikhs politikhs. Th zhthse o k. Karatzaferhs.

PARTALIDHS: Exw asxolhqei xronia me to Asfalistiko kai blepw mia oxi anataraxh, alla mia agwnia ston kosmo. Giati akribws den jerei. Jerei tis kales proqeseis alla den mporei na tis dei pws qa pragmatopoihqoyn xwris na qigontai ta gnwsta dikaiwmata twn asfalismenwn kai twn ergazomenwn. Mhpws h kybernhsh biazetai enw milaei gia hpia prosarmogh h me ryqmo swsto kai den exei enhmerwsei arkoyntws thn koinh gnwmh; Giati eipate oti yparxoyn logistikes meletes. Nomizw oti den exoyn problhqei oi epimeroys adynamies twn Tameiwn. Dioti, kales men oi kateyqynseis na ginoyn oi enopoihseis opws exoyn sxhmatistei sta pente-eji kyria Tameia, alla mhpws qa eprepe prin apo thn ypagwgh opoioydhpote apo ta Tameia ayta, gia thn katastash na exei enhmerwqei h koinh gnwmh poly eparkws, wste mh fqasoyme se mia katastash toy 2001 kai qa einai poly krima gia tis kales proqeseis ths kybernhshs.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Ginetai prospaqeia kai mesa apo thn Epitroph ths Boylhs kai opoy alloy kai apo ton armodio Ypoyrgo -kai merikes fores apo emena se ayth thn aiqoysa na enhmerwqei o kosmos oso kalytera ginetai. Sigoyra yparxoyn polla shmeia ta opoia xreiazontai akomh perissoterh dieykrinish. To katalabainw. Hdh eipa, se dyo-treis erwthseis sthn arxh toy briefing, oti apanthseis qa doqoyn thn prosexh Tetarth, sth synanthsh poy kanei o ypoyrgos me thn armodia Epitroph ths Boylhs. Ekeino poy prepei na shmeiwsoyme einai oti h syzhthsh exei arxisei, tiqentai sto trapezi ta stoixeia. Stoixeia gia ta Tameia, stoixeia gia thn enopoihsh, stoixeia ayrio-meqayrio gia ta barea kai anqygieina k.o.k. Kai o kosmos siga-siga qa einai se qesh na gnwrizei, oso kalytera ginetai, poy egkeitai to zhthma.

PARTALIDHS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, an moy epitrepete na synexisw. Mhpws omws exei dwsei to antiqeto me ayto poy endexomenws na epidiwkei, mia biasynh; Mhpws dhladh ekei exei deijei oti biazetai na kleisei to Asfalistiko, enw jeroyme oti einai ena qema to opoio den teleiwnei oyte me ena nomo, oyte me mia apofash. Gi` ayto exoyme apo to 1990 kai to 1992 kai to 1993 kai synexeia me ta epomena xronia, me thn epomenh kybernhsh, synexeis nomoys oi opoioi den lynoyn makroproqesma to Asfalistiko.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Qa htan paratairo na sas parapemcw se syzhthseis poy eixame kanei pro 2, 3 h 4 etwn se ayth thn aiqoysa h sthn antistoixh ths odoy Zalokwsta. Giati tote qymamai oti oi erwthseis parepempan sto oti ``h kybernhsh den asxoleitai me to Asfalistiko'' kai ``giati den asxoleitai twra'' kai ``giati to parapempei sthn OKE''. Qymaste oti eixe jekinhsei mia syzhthsh apo thn OKE. Oi apanthseis htan oti prepei na jekinhsei mia syzhthsh mesa sthn OKE. Etsi jekinhse, h syzhthsh dihrkese gia 2 xronia peripoy, apo to 2005 ews to 2006 kai fetos to 2007 kai akoysthkan polles protaseis. Kai eixame pei jekaqara oti apo ayth th Boylh qa mpei mprosta to qema gia to neo nomosxedio, to neo nomo. H enhmerwsh se baqos xreiazetai poly dromo akomh.

TSIOYFOS: Peste mas kati. Poia einai h epishmh politikh sxesh metajy toy Prwqypoyrgoy kai toy k. Loylh;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Ennoeite an...

TSIOYFOS: An yparxei epishmh politikh sxesh metajy toy Prwqypoyrgoy...

ROYSOPOYLOS: Legontas ``politikh sxesh'' ti ennoeite; An chfizei o k. Loylhs th Nea Dhmokratia;

TSIOYFOS: Oxi den ennow ayto. Ennow politikh sxesh. An exei kapoio rolo o k. Loylhs; Einai symboylos toy Prwqypoyrgoy; Den einai;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Oxi den yparxei kapoia sxesh symboyloy.

TSIOYFOS: Ayto ennow.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Typika, den einai symboylos toy Prwqypoyrgoy. Allwste oi symboyloi toy Prwqypoyrgoy, opws gnwrizete, dhmosieyontai sto Fyllo ths Efhmeridas ths Kybernhshs. Twra ean yparxoyn proswpikes sxeseis, ayto einai ena allo zhthma. Fantazomai oti den me rwtate gia ayto.

FANIDHS: Prin apo ligo eipate oti se 20- 30 xronia, mia epomenh kybernhsh isws xreiastei na allajei to Asfalistiko. Ayto shmainei oti symfwna me toys ypologismoys poy exete kanei, meta thn enopoihsh twn Tameiwn, to neo Asfalistiko systhma qa antejei tosa polla xronia;

ROYSOPOYLOS: To Asfalistiko toy 1992, symfwna me toys Bretanoys analogistes, oi opoioi eklhqhsan apo ton tote Ypoyrgo toy PASOK k. Giannitsh kai hrqan sthn Aqhna gia na kanoyn tis analogistikes meletes toys, eixe zwh peripoy 20 etwn, dhladh ews to 2012. Qelw na pisteyw oti oi allages poy qa ginoyn, qa dwsoyn minimoym diarkeia zwhs 20 etwn. Einai ena ikanopoihtiko xroniko diasthma, ta 20 ews 30 xronia, shmantiko omws. Kai ayth einai h prospaqeia poy kanoyme. Giati to Asfalistiko den einai gia na allazei kaqe 5 xronia. Einai gia na dinei kai mia staqerothta ston polith na gnwrizei ti akribws symbainei kai ti qa symbei sto mellon ths zwhs toy.

Sas eyxaristw.

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