Greek Government Press Briefing, 01-04-24

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

YPOYRGEIO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

Aqhna, 24 Aprilioy 2001

JENOY TYPOY APO TON YPOYRGO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

KAI KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO DHMHTRH REPPA

Geia sas.

Akoyw tis erwthseis sas.

MPOTWNHS: O boyleyths k. Tsoykatos kateqese kapoies protaseis. Qa syzhthqoyn kai aytes;

REPPAS: O dialogos, oson afora ta stelexh twn kommatwn ginetai kai sto eswteriko twn kommatwn. Kai, bebaiws, oi boyleytes -opws kai oloi oi politikoi paragontes- exoyn endiaferon kai dikaiwma na enhmerwnoyn toys polites ths xwras. Kata ta alla, o koinwnikos dialogos ginetai me tropo organwmeno kai syntetagmeno, prokeimenoy na antimetwpisoyme ayto to qema. Oi foreis poy symmetexoyn, oi koinwnikoi etairoi, ta syndikata qa prepei na antapokriqoyn se ayto to kalesma, syneisferontas tis dikes toys apoceis, tis dikes toys protaseis, prokeimenoy na sygkentrwqei to xrhsimo ekeino yliko, poy qa apotelesei kai th bash, gia thn enarjh aytoy toy dialogoy. Emeis exoyme kataqesei to plaisio twn dikwn mas protasewn. Anamenoyme na kanoyn to idio kai oi alloi endiaferomenoi, oi amesws h emmesws emplekomenoi foreis.

MPOTWNHS: Dhladh, o k. Tsoykatos den einai sto plaisio aytwn twn syntetagmenwn;

REPPAS: Se aytes tis diadikasies, opws sas eipa, den symmetexoyn oi boyleytes. Oi boyleytes symmetexoyn stis diadikasies toy Koinoboylioy. Opws, epishs, analoga me thn kommatikh entajh enos ekastoy stis diadikasies toy kommatos toy. Kai, bebaiws, apeyqynontai sthn koinh gnwmh. Den exei problefqei, mexri twra toylaxiston, se kamia xwra -kai kata to montelo poy exei epikrathsei sthn Ellada- na symmetexoyn ws monades, ws memonwmena atoma diaforoi paragontes toy dhmosioy bioy se enan tetoio koinwniko dialogo, o opoios, epanalambanw, einai organwmenos, einai syntetagmenos. Symmetexoyn sygkekrimenoi koinwnikoi foreis.

XONDROS: Shmera to prwi o k. Farmakhs se synenteyjh toy se radiofwnikh ekpomph eipe oti h hgesia toy ypoyrgeioy Ergasias aisqanetai monh kai oti oloi prepei na bgoyn na sthrijoyn thn prospaqeia poy kanei h kybernhsh kai afhse aixmes gia th stash twn boyleytwn-stelexwn, oi opoioi eipe oti an sthrizoyn olh ayth thn prospaqeia na bgoyn na to poyn.

REPPAS: Prwta ap` ola, to plaisio sto opoio katelhjan sthn koinh synedriash toys h Kybernhtikh Epitroph kai to Ektelestiko Grafeio, apofasisthke apo ola ta stelexh poy exoyme synhqisei na apokaloyme stelexh prwths grammhs. Gnwrizete poly kala, oti exoyn logo kai rolo ayta ta stelexh. Symmetexoyn stis syzhthseis poy ginontai gia th diamorfwsh ayths ths politikhs kai bebaiws, opws pantote kai twra, briskontai sthn prwth grammh, prokeimenoy na oloklhrwsoyme thn ergasia poy prepei na kanoyme, wste mesa apo to dialogo na katalhjoyme sthn epiqymhth kai apotelesmatikh lysh. Oi paragontes toy kommatos kai ths kybernhshs asfalws einai parontes. Exoyn to diko toys rolo.

ANTYPAS: Qa hqela na epanelqw sto qema toy k. Tsoykatoy. Epeidh lete oti exete zhthsei apo ta stelexh na bgoyn kai na sthrijoyn thn politikh@

REPPAS: Poios to eipe ayto;

ANTYPAS: Den exete zhthsei;

REPPAS: Eipate sthn erwthsh sas, "epeidh lete". Eipa egw tetoio pragma;

ANTYPAS: H kybernhsh. Den qelete ta stelexh na yposthrijoyn thn politikh;

REPPAS: Ta stelexh poy elaban thn apofash einai dynato na apostasiopoioyntai apo mia apofash poy exoyn labei oi idioi;

ANTYPAS: Eiste ikanopoihmenoi;

REPPAS: Apolytws, me thn ennoia oti eseis exete mia allh antilhch gia to pws prepei na ginetai ayth h paroysia. Sas diafeygei oti ayth thn wra poy syzhtoyme, den exei apeyqynqei epishmws akomh prosklhsh sta syndikata, stoys koinwnikoys etairoys, prokeimenoy na laboyn meros se ayto to dialogo. Eipa oti o ypoyrgos Ergasias qa to kanei ayth thn periodo, dhladh tis epomenes hmeres. Eseis qewreite oti h syzhthsh h opoia ginetai sth dhmosia sfaira mesa apo ta MME, prepei na ginetai me ton tropo poy eseis qewreite oti einai orqos. Egw pisteyw oti ayth h syzhthsh poy ginetai einai xrhsimh gia na enhmerwqoyn oi polites ths xwras kai epikrotoyme tetoioy eidoys diadikasies epikoinwnias kai enhmerwshs, alla den einai mono ayto, to opoio synista to dialogo. O dialogos einai organwmenos, syntetagmenos kai se ayton qa paroyn meros oi foreis kai oi etairoi.

ANTYPAS: Gi` ayto rwtaw, epeidh den exei jekinhsei akomh. En tw metajy, synadelfoi apeyqynontai stoys ypoyrgoys, oi opoioi den bgainoyn.

REPPAS: Kai poios sas eipe oti kaqe ypoyrgos prepei na antapokrinetai etsi opws ena MME qewrei, proskalwntas ton ypoyrgo, pws prepei na antapokriqei;

ANTYPAS: Gia na mhn aisqanetai monos@

REPPAS: Kaneis den aisqanetai monos kai gnwrizete poly kala oti h apofash ayth elhfqh sto anwtato dynato epipedo me th symmetoxh dyo koryfaiwn organwn, enos kybernhtikoy kai enos kommatikoy. Einai dynato, loipon, eseis na qewreite oti ta stelexh poy symmetexoyn se ayta ta dyo koryfaia organa den exoyn sxesh me thn apofash poy elhfqh sth synedriash aytwn twn organwn;

ANTYPAS: H apofash ths Kybernhtikhs Epitrophs kai toy Ektelestikoy Grafeioy einai ta shmeia poy exei steilei to ypoyrgeio Ergasias h h dhlwsh toy Prwqypoyrgoy;

REPPAS: Giati qetete se antidiastolh th dhlwsh toy Prwqypoyrgoy apo thn eishghsh toy ypoyrgoy Ergasias; H eishghsh toy ypoyrgoy Ergasias, etsi opws syzhthqhke sth synexeia, kata thn ejelijh ths synedriashs, edwse ena apotelesma. Dhmioyrghse ena plaisio. Epi toy plaisioy aytoy milhse o Prwqypoyrgos sth dhlwsh poy ekane amesws meta thn koinh synedriash twn dyo organwn. Ayto einai poy apotelei th qesh ths kybernhshs ayth thn wra. Eimaste sth fash enarjhs toy dialogoy. Qa apeyqynqei, epishmws, h prosklhsh stoys endiaferomenoys foreis. Emeis qewroyme oti exoyme dwsei to enaysma kai kaloyme na antapokriqoyn kai oi alles pleyres se ayth thn prosklhsh, prokeimenoy na parei ypostash o dialogos. Ayth einai h dikh mas epidiwjh.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Meta apo ayta poy eipate oti oi boyleytes exoyn dikaiwma, alla mono sth Boylh, dhladh twra o k. Tsoykatos prokeitai na parapemfqei se kapoio organo; Ypepese se paraptwma;

REPPAS: Den einai mono megalh h fantasia sas, einai megalh -qa moy epitrecete na pw- kai h apostash poy dianyete, prokeimenoy na fqasete sthn ejagwgh symperasmatwn poy den exoyn kamia sxesh me ayta ta opoia lew egw. Ston koinwniko dialogo, gnwrizete poly kala oti symmetexoyn sygkekrimenoi foreis kai pantws den symmetexoyn boyleytes.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Den einai sthn koinwnia o k. Tsoykatos; Poy anhkei, dhladh;

REPPAS: Gi` ayto akribws anaptyssei tis apoceis toy -kai poly kala kanei- opws oloi oi alloi boyleytes, opws ola ta stelexh.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Enw den exei to dikaiwma, opws lete, na symmetexei. Apo th mia lete "den exei to dikaiwma", apo thn allh ...

REPPAS: Antiqetws. To teleiws diaforetiko eipa: Oti isa-isa exoyn dikaiwma kai ypoxrewsh na apeyqynontai sthn koinh gnwmh kai na enhmerwnoyn toys polites gia tis apoceis toys. Teleiws antiqeto apo ayto poy eseis katalabate. Qa to diapistwsete, an diabasete ayta poy eipa. Giati den me parakoloyqeite kai ayto den moy kanei entypwsh.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Se allo qema. Kai eseis eipate kai o Prwqypoyrgos elege oti den qa mpoyn alloi foroi. Giati ayjanete ta tsigara kata 45%; Den einai foros aytos;

REPPAS: Epeidh moy exete kanei kai allote thn idia erwthsh, sas exw dwsei apanthseis.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Twra ta ayjanete ta tsigara. Pali. Gi` ayto sas janarwtw.

REPPAS: Prepei na sas pw oti ayto den exei sxesh me th forologia. Exei sxesh me thn ayjhsh ths timhs enos proiontos, opws se diafora proionta exoyme mia sxetikh anatimhsh. Den exei sxesh me thn epibolh mias forologias.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Ta ergostasia ayjanoyn thn timh...;

REPPAS: Nai, bebaiws, kai ayto isxyei me tis kapnobiomhxanies.

STAMATOPOYLOS: ...h o foros; Na milhsoyme jekaqara twra: Exete anebasei to foro nai h oxi;

REPPAS: Oxi. Sas eipa oti oi times twn diaforwn proiontwn diamorfwnontai mesa se orismeno plaisio kai, bebaiws, parakoloyqeitai apo tis armodies yphresies pws ejelissontai oi times aytes.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Tis 152.000 pote qa tis dwsete, epiteloys;

REPPAS: Sas exw pei, kat` epanalhch, oti megales omades toy plhqysmoy poy dikaioyntai ayth th syntajh, exoyn labei ta sxetika posa.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Den exei parei kanenas.

REPPAS: Kanete laqos.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Mporeite na mas peite enan ariqmo, enan anqrwpo poy to phre;

REPPAS: Ariqmo den mporw na sas pw, oydeis mporei na sas pei to sygkekrimeno ariqmo. Asfalws, omws, mporw na sas pw oti to poso ayto twn 152.038 drx. to exoyn labei arketoi sympolites mas. Einai to akribes poso, ths legomenhs katwtaths syntajhs, poy afora asfalismenoys sto IKA. Kai bebaiws, qa paroyn anadromika to poso ayto apo thn 1.1.2001 osoi dikaioyntai ayth th syntajh. Oydeis qa xasei, estw kai mia draxmh.

KARAKWSTAS: Shmera, eixame ton k. Farmakh. Liges ebdomades prin eixame ton k. Papantwnioy na aisqanetai monos kai ton Prwqypoyrgo. Blepoyme oti se krisimes epiloges, h kybernhsh aisqanetai monh kai...

REPPAS: Exw apanthsei sto qema ayto. Sas parapempw stis apanthseis poy exw dwsei sto parelqon. Sas eipa oti h kybernhsh ayth einai laoproblhth, exei anadeixqei apo thn pleiochfia twn Ellhnwn politwn stis prosfates ekloges, exei thn empistosynh ths pleiochfias twn politwn na synexisei kai na oloklhrwsei to ergo ths. Giati, to ergo ths kybernhshs exei gnwmona to eqniko kai dhmosio symferon, antapokrinetai stis proklhseis twn kairwn. Ayth einai h dikh mas ypoxrewsh. Ayto einai poy mas endiaferei. Oxi na dhmioyrgoyme entypwseis poy exoyn, en pollois, efhmero xarakthra, alla na ktizoyme meqodika thn isxyrh xwra, thn isxyrh oikonomia, thn isxyrh koinwnia, giati ayto antapokrinetai sto symferon olwn mas. Ayto einai poy exei shmasia.

MIXAHL: Eseis epimenete kai lete edw, opws kai o k. Prwtopapas oti oles oi protaseis anejairetws mporoyn na mpoyn sto trapezi toy dialogoy. To kako einai oti ta syndikata den sas qewroyn fereggyoys kai eilikrineis kai fernw san paradeigma th stash ths kybernhshs sto ergasiako. Ti protiqeste na kanete, loipon, wste na toys peisete oti eiste ontws eilikrineis kai oti qa qelate pragmatika oxi mono na syzhthsete, alla an peisteite na dexqeite kai tis protaseis toys;

REPPAS: Prwton, prepei na gnwrizete oti oi ekloges sto poly shmantiko syndikato, sth GSEE, einai prosfates kai gnwrizete, epishs, poly kala poia einai ta pososta ta opoia kategracan oi diafores paratajeis se aytes tis ekloges. Deyteron, asfalws, oi ekproswpoi twn ergazomenwn diatypwnoyn tis qeseis toys me ton tropo poy pisteyoyn oti prepei na to kanoyn gia na yperaspistoyn ta symferonta twn politwn, toys opoioys ekproswpoyn. Ayto einai oxi mono qemito, alla kai epibeblhmeno. Emeis me megalo endiaferon kai eyaisqhsia syzhtoyme ola ayta ta qemata kai apeyqynomenoi stoys ekproswpoys twn ergazomenwn toys zhtoyme na proselqoyn sto trapezi toy dialogoy kai ayta ta opoia dhmosiws isxyrizontai h diatypwnoyn ws protaseis na ta kataqesoyn ws yliko se ayto to trapezi twn syzhthsewn. Pisteyw oti qa antapokriqoyn se ayto to kaqhkon toys, giati exoyn ypoxrewsh apenanti stoys ergazomenoys, na toys ekproswphsoyn me sygkekrimenes protaseis. Den nomizw oti einai arketo me synqhmata, me ypekfyges na exei paroysia se ena toso shmantiko qema mia syndikalistikh hgesia. Qa prepei na exei paroysia me ypeyqynes protaseis, tis opoies prepei na kataqesei sto trapezi toy dialogoy. Otan kapoios exei ayth th dynatothta, giati na thn apempolhsei; Den yparxei allh diadikasia peran toy dialogoy gia na fqasoyme sto pio wfelimo apotelesma.

MIXAHL: H apanthsh sto rhtoriko erwthma poy qesate einai, oti se ayth thn periptwsh qa toys katasthsete synypeyqynoys gia kati poy den dexontai. Gi` ayto lene ``parte pisw oles tis protaseis kai elate na koybentiasoyme, xwris na yparxei...''.

REPPAS: Gnwrizw oti opoios exei empistosynh stis qeseis toy kai sta epixeirhmata toy, syzhta, syndialegetai me kapoia allh pleyra kai agwnizetai, prokeimenoy na anadeijei to basimo kai to orqo twn epixeirhmatwn toy. Ayto prepei na kanoyme oloi kai sth sygkekrimenh periptwsh, eite kommata, eite koinwnikoi h syndikalistikoi foreis.

MIXAHL: Poio einai to epomeno bhma ths kybernhshs me dedomenh th stash twn syndikatwn;

REPPAS: H kybernhsh apeyqynei prosklhsh dialogoy kai paramenei se ayth th qesh.

MIXAHL: Arnoyntai.

REPPAS: Gnwrizete oti den exei doqei akomh h prosklhsh kai den exoyme thn epishmh ``aporriptikh'', kata th dikh sas ektimhsh, qesh twn syndikatwn.

MIXAHL: Oi idioi to lene, den to lew egw.

REPPAS: Qa anamenete, loipon, na perasoyn kapoies hmeres, prokeimenoy na pame sthn epishmh prosklhsh kai tote qa anamenoyme thn epishmh, pleon, qesh twn endiaferomenwn poy kaloyntai se ayto to dialogo. Mia tetoia prosklhsh oydeis dikaioytai na thn arnhqei.

STAQOPOYLOS: Prin apo ligo, o Proedros toy kinhmatos Eleyqerwn Politwn k. Abramopoylos, edwse sth dhmosiothta protaseis gia to asfalistiko. Zhta, loipon, amesh paysh kaqe energeias, dialogo apo mhdenikh bash, tonizei epishs oti to asfalistiko sthn Ellada, oxi mono nosei, alla brisketai sta proqyra xreokopias kai telos, epishmainei oti se epta xronia oi Ellhnes syntajioyxoi den mporoyn na einai sigoyroi oti qa toys katablhqoyn oi syntajeis toys. Qa hqela to sxolio sas.

REPPAS: Einai h symbolh toy kommatos, ypo ton k. Abramopoylo, sto qema poy syzhtoyme.

KARGOYDH: Apo tis apoceis poy exoyn antallagei kai tis qeseis, metajy kybernhshs kai syndikatwn, aytes tis hmeres, exw antilhfqei oti ta syndikata qetoyn treis proypoqeseis gia na proselqoyn sto dialogo: Prwton, einai oti den qa qigei to orio hlikias gia syntajiodothsh, deyteron, oi katwtates syntajeis kai triton, oi neoi poroi. Qa hqela na rwthsw an problhmatizetai h kybernhsh na diasfalisei aytes tis treis proypoqeseis, san endeijh kalhs proqeshs.

REPPAS: Apo thn prwth stigmh eipame oti aytos o dialogos prepei na ginei xwris proapaitoymena. Kai an yparxei mia proypoqesh, ayth einai h thrhsh kapoiwn basikwn arxwn, kapoiwn basikwn kanonwn, opws einai ayth ths allhleggyhs twn genewn h ths koinwnikhs dikaiosynhs h ths bebaiothtas poy prepei na exei kaqe asfalismenos, gia to pote kai ti syntajh qa parei. Ayth einai h proypoqesh. Ola ta alla qa prepei na apotelesoyn antikeimeno syzhthshs. Emeis diatypwsame mia desmh protasewn, orisame ena plaisio. Zhtoyme kai apo tis alles pleyres na employtisoyn ayto to plaisio, wste na jekinhsei o dialogos, gia na katalhjoyme mesa apo th synqesh twn apocewn sthn epiqymhth, sthn wfelimh gia oloys lysh.

KARGOYDH: Me sygxwreite, alla eseis milate gia genikes arxes. Ta syndikata diatypwnoyn sygkekrimenes...

REPPAS: Emeis den exoyme diatypwsei sygkekrimenes protaseis;

MPOTWNHS: Symfwna me shmerina dhmosieymata, feretai na apeilei me paraithsh o k. Giannitshs, an den sthrixqei h politikh toy. Yparxei...

REPPAS: Kamia sxesh me thn pragmatikothta. Oydepote diatypwqhke kapoia tetoia epiqymia, estw kai emmesws.

Sas eyxaristw.

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