Greek Government Press Briefing, 99-10-18

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

YPOYRGEIO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

Aqhna, 18 Noembrioy 1999

H ENHMERWSH TWN POLITIKWN SYNTAKTWN KAI TWN ANTAPOKRITWN JENOY TYPOY APO TON YPOYRGO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS KAI KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO DHMHTRH REPPA

Geia sas kai kalh ebdomada.

Apoxairethsame, shmera, to Giannh Xorn, o opoios kosmhse, oxi mono th dhmosiografia, giati h stash zwhs toy htan ypodeigma eyqynhs kai qarroys se dyskoles stigmes. O Giannhs Xorn ekleise ton kyklo ths zwhs toy, afhnontas to ergo toy ws parakataqhkh stoys dhmosiografoys twn neoterwn geniwn, alla kai se oloys toys polites.

* O Prwqypoyrgos episkefqhke, shmera, ton Proedro ths Dhmokratias, sto plaisio twn taktikwn synanthsewn toys, kai ton enhmerwse gia qemata ths epikairothtas, meta kai to Ektakto Eyrwpaiko Symboylio sth Filandia.

Argotera, stis 3 m. m., qa synergastei me synarmodioys ypoyrgoys gia qemata poy exoyn sxesh me to misqologio twn ajiwmatikwn, diaforwn oplwn kai kladwn. Sth syskech ayth qa laboyn meros, ektos toy k. Papantwnioy, toy k. Xristodoylakh kai toy k. Giannitsh, oi ypoyrgoi Akhs Tsoxatzopoylos, Mixalhs Xrysoxoidhs kai Stayros Soymakhs.

To apogeyma, stis 7.30, qa parabreqei sta egkainia ths ekqeshs pros timhn toy EL GRECO, sthn Eqnikh Pinakoqhkh.

* Ayrio to prwi, qa synergastei me ton k. Papantwnioy kai ton k. Anwmerith. Antikeimeno ayths ths synergasias einai qemata poy aforoyn to gewrgiko tomea. Argotera, stis 11.30, qa dexqei ton prwqypoyrgo ths Roymanias k. Basile, o opoios episkeptetai epishma thn Ellada.

* Thn Tetarth, stis 10 to prwi, qa dexqei antiproswpeia ths PASEGES kai sth 1 to meshmeri, toys ekproswpoys ths Ieras Koinothtas toy Agioy Oroys poy briskontai sthn Aqhna. To apogeyma, qa labei meros sthn kaloymenh "Wra toy Prwqypoyrgoy".

* Thn Pempth, qa periodeysei sth Mytilhnh. H anaxwrhsh qa ginei apo to Ellhniko Aerodromio stis 9 to prwi kai parakalw osoys endiaferontai na symmetasxoyn sthn apostolh na to dhlwsoyn egkairws.

* Thn Paraskeyh to prwi, qa synedriasei h Kybernhtikh Epitroph. Qa asxolhqei me qemata ejwterikhs politikhs kai qemata poy sxetizontai me thn politistikh Olympiada. Gia to logo ayto, h K. E. qa exei dieyrymenh synqesh, afoy qa laboyn meros kai ypoyrgoi poy den einai melh ths.

* Sas lew apo twra gia thn erxomenh ebdomada, oti thn Trith -hmera toy Agioy Dhmhtrioy- qa synedriasei kai pali, stis 10 to prwi, h K. E. Qa ginei mia ektimhsh twn problhmatwn poy antimetwpizoyme, sto plaisio ths politikhs mas, meta to seismo. Thn hmera ekeinh, episkeptetai thn Aqhna o prwqypoyrgos ths Italias Masno Ntalema, o opoios bebaiws qa exei synanthsh kai synergasia me ton Prwqypoyrgo. O k. Ntalema qa anaxwrhsei thn epomenh.

* Qa moy epitrecete na kanw mia politikh dhlwsh me aformh ena qema ths epikairothtas poy afora to Binteolotto:

H Nea Dhmokratia den diaqetei programma, exei omws para polla problhmata. H N. D. einai komma xwris politikh pyjida, alla aneyqynologei kai skandalologei, kata tropo, o opoios einai proklhtikos kai epizhmios. H N. D. htthqhke se politiko kai programmatiko epipedo kai anazhtei enagwniws -ayto einai to nohma ths prospaqeias ths, ayth einai h epidiwjh ths- ena xwro ston opoio, sto plaisio enos politikoy aponenohmenoy diabhmatos ths, qa epixeirhsei na kerdoskophsei politika, na plhjei thn kybernhsh, adiaforwntas an ayth h aneyqynh stash ths exei dysmeneis synepeies gia th dhmosia zwh ths xwras. Mila me tropo aneyqyno, xwris stoixeia, xwris tekmhriwsh. Epixeirei na syskotisei kai oxi na fwtisei to qema to opoio epeleje na anadeijei. Dhlhthriazei thn atmosfaira sth dhmosia zwh. H N. D. kai pali qa apotyxei, giati, bebaiws, einai gnwsth h rhsh toy Hrakleitoy oti "den mporeis dyo fores na mpeis ston idio potamo". Ayto epixeirei na kanei h N. D. Omws, exoyn perasei deka xronia kai poly nero exei kylhsei se ayto to potami toy dhmosioy bioy kai ths politikhs.

Thn wra poy to PASOK epixeirei kai prospaqei na lysei ta problhmata ths xwras kai toy ellhnikoy laoy, h N. D. prospaqei na lysei ta dika ths problhmata, prowqwntas ena skhniko akraias paraloghs kai eqnika kai koinwnika epizhmias polwshs. Prospaqei na syspeirwsei to stelexiko dynamiko ths. Prospaqei na apoprosanatolisei thn koinh gnwmh apo ta pragmatika problhmata gia ta opoia h N. D. adynatei na ekferei qetiko logo. Opws, epishs, epixeirei na kalycei tis adynamies ths, oi opoies hrqan me entono tropo sthn epifaneia thn teleytaia periodo, me ayth th meqodo ths skandalologias.

Einai prwtotypo, einai prwtofanes ena komma na mila me ayto ton tropo kai na kathgorei thn kybernhsh oti yphretei kapoia symferonta, thn wra poy h kybernhsh, mesw twn armodiwn yphresiwn, exei proxwrhsei se anoixto diagwnismo me diakhryjh, h opoia apotelei tekmhrio diafaneias kai antikeimenikothtas. Einai prwtofanes na qewrei h N. D. oti tetoies diafaneis, anoixtes kai antikeimenikes diadikasies yphretoyn symferonta. Isa-isa, h N. D. prepei na mas pei poia symferonta prospaqei na ejyphrethsei -peran twn dikwn ths idiotelwn mikrokommatikwn politikwn symferontwn- xrhsimopoiwntas kat` ayton ton atekmhriwto tropo stoixeia, ta opoia den exoyn chgmata alhqeias.

Oi stoixeiwdeis ariqmhtikoi ypologismoi apodeiknyoyn oti ola ayta poy epikaloyntai o k. Karamanlhs kai stelexh ths N. D. den exoyn kamia sxesh me thn pragmatikothta. H agwniwdhs prospaqeia toy k. Karamanlh kai ths N. D. na epanelqoyn sthn kentrikh politikh skhnh apo thn "pisw porta", omws, ths politikhs, apodeiknyei, gia mia akomh fora, ayto poy kat` epanalhch exoyme pei, oti h N. D. den exei programma, tipota qetiko den exei na proteinei gia to paron kai to mellon ayths ths xwras. Apodeiknyei kai pali oti einai dynamh opisqofylakhs, alla ayth h "retro" politikh ths, thn odhgei se adiejodo. As lysei ta problhmata ths. Epiqymoyme na ta lysei. Arkei ayto na mh ginei se baros ths xwras kai twn symferontwn toy ellhnikoy laoy. Giati ayto den qa to epitrecoyme. Thn wra poy dinoyme krisimh maxh gia na antimetwpisoyme kai na lysoyme megala qemata, qewroyme oti einai toylaxiston katwteros twn peristasewn, ekeinos -politikos arxhgos h kommatiko stelexos- poy me ayto ton tropo diaboykolhshs ths koinhs gnwmhs epixeirei na apoprosanatolisei toys polites apo ta qemata poy apasxoloyn th xwra kai toys idioys kai apo ta opoia qa kriqei to mellon ths Elladas, mono kai mono epeidh etsi pisteyei pws mporei na kerdisei sto mikrokommatiko xrhmatisthrio kapoioys pontoys. Alla, oyte ayto qa to epityxei, giati pantote h alhqeia einai ayth poy telikws epikratei. Ayto exei apodeixqei istorika. Idoy mia akomh stigmh sthn politikh istoria toy topoy, poy ayto qa fanei oti apotelei, gia men th N. D. apotyxhmenh syntagh, gia de thn kybernhsh kai tis dynameis poy prowqoyn me diafaneia kai antikeimenikothta ta symferonta toy topoy, syntagh epityxias kai qetikhs antimetwpishs twn proklhsewn.

Mporw na anaferw seira stoixeiwn, apantwntas se dikes sas erwthseis. Arkoymai mono na pw ta ejhs:

H diakhryjh ayth poy anakoinwqhke kai basei ths opoias ejelissetai o diagwnismos, exei labei ypoch ths th dieqnh empeiria, sth de katartish ths exoyn labei meros, oxi mono epitroph ychlobaqmwn stelexwn toy OPAP, alla kai kaqhghtes toy Eqnikoy Metsobeioy Polytexneioy kai toy Panepisthmioy Aigaioy, etairia symboylwn poy epelegh gi` ayto to skopo, kaqws kai nomikh epitroph apoteloymenh apo ton Antiproedro toy Nomikoy Symboylioy toy Kratoys, to nomiko symboylo toy ypoyrgeioy Politismoy kai th Nomikh Yphresia toy OPAP. H dhmosieysh ayths ths diakhryjhs oyden sxolio prokalese, giati htan profanes oti apotelei -epanalambanw- tekmhrio antikeimenikothtas kai diafaneias gia to diagwnismo ayto.

Oson afora th seira twn pragmatwn, o diagwnismos aytos einai apotelesma ths epiloghs poy egine gia thn analhch ths diorganwshs ths Olympiadas toy 2004 apo thn Aqhna, apo th xwra mas, synepws. Se oles tis analoges periptwseis qespizetai ena laxeio apo to opoio epidiwkontai analoga esoda gia thn yposthrijh twn Agwnwn. Allwste, laxeio problepotan kai sto fakelo poy eixe kataqesei, epi ths dikhs ths periodoy, h N. D. ws kybernhsh ths xwras. To Olympiako ayto laxeio elabe thn telikh morfh kai onomasia -kai etsi symperilambanetai- ws Olympiako Binteolotto kai sto Proedriko Diatagma, to opoio ejedoqh pros toyto, meta apo synennohseis me to Symboylio Epikrateias.

Prepei na sas pw oti sto sxetiko Proedriko Diatagma, sto arqro 4, problepetai to pososto kerdoys poy apodidetai stoys polites paixtes, na apodeiknyetai oti anerxetai kat` elaxisto sto 80% kai kata megisto sto 95% twn stoixhmatizomenwn poswn. Apo to synolo, dhladh, twn xrhmatwn poy diakinoyntai h dapanwntai sto plaisio aytwn twn paigniwn -kai einai ena stoixeio, basei toy opoioy metajy twn allwn krithriwn kai ayto qa lhfqei ypoch gia na epilegoyn oi anadoxoi, me bash dhladh to poios einai aytos poy dinei ta megalytera kerdh h to megalytero pososto stoys paiktes- to syntriptika megalo apo ta stoixhmatizomena posa pososto, to 80-95%, epistrefei stoys idioys toys paixtes. To agnooyn ayto h kanoyn kapoioi oti to agnooyn kai proxwroyn se aytoys toys aparadektoys ariqmhtikoys ypologismoys.

Oi ependyseis aytes exoyn ychlo kostos leitoyrgias. Einai ependyseis neas texnologias. Ypologizetai oti kaqe endiaferomenos gia diekdikhsh mias tetoias adeias qa prepei na probei se ependyseis me synoliko kostos, toylaxiston 40 dis. draxmes.

Me thn ypoyrgikh apofash 20295/1.9. 99 me thn opoia kaqoristhkan qemata poy exoyn sxesh me tis leptomereies diejagwghs aytoy toy paixnidioy, problepetai oti den epitrepetai h diejagwgh toy Olympiakoy Binteolotto, opws onomasthke, mesw hlektromhxanikwn mhxanwn typoy Slot Machine, "koyloxerhdes" kata thn ellhnikh orologia poy exei epikrathsei. Ara, loipon, oydeis logos dikaiologei ayth thn prospaqeia ths N. D. na dwsei thn entypwsh oti eisagetai ena "kaqestws koyloxerhdwn", opws h idia to "baptise", me ayto to diagwnismo.

Prepei na pw akomh, pws to oti elabe ayto to binteopaixnidi ayth thn telikh morfh, antapokrinetai sta symferonta kai toy Dhmosioy kai toy OPAP, poy kanei enan programmatismo se baqos xronoy, epeidh akribws ayto to fainomeno parathreitai dieqnws. Einai ptwtikh h poreia twn allwn, paradosiakoy typoy, laxeiwn. H leitoyrgia aytoy toy neoy diagwnismoy qa apaithsei ena ikano xroniko diasthma, giati prepei na dhmioyrghqei analogh ypodomh.

Ta mhxanologika kai mhxanika ejarthmata apajiwnontai entos ligwn xronwn. Ara, qa prepei na yparxei ananewsh toy ejoplismoy apo toys anadoxoys sth diarkeia ths adeias thn opoia qa exoyn labei. Kai ayto einai ena epiprosqeto kostos, to opoio prepei na lhfqei ypoch.

To systhma ayto -epanalambanw- antapokrinetai sta symferonta toy OPAP kai toy Dhmosioy, afoy dinei th dynatothta -antiqeta me oti kapoioi prospaqoyn na paroysiasoyn oti symbainei- ana pasa stigmh na elegxei, mesw enos kentrikoy systhmatos, ON LINE, o Organismos, o opoios paramenei diaxeirisths toy Olympiakoy Binteolotto, an olo to systhma, to kaqe mhxanhma leitoyrgei me bash tis arxikes prodiagrafes. Den epitrepetai, dhladh, den einai eykolh h opoiadhpote parembash tritoy -idiwth, epixeirhmatia h alloy- sto logismiko toy kaqe mhxanhmatos, pragma to opoio se kapoies periptwseis symbainei se mhxanhmata alloy typoy, ta opoia leitoyrgoyn kai leitoyrgoyn telikws paranomws, afoy ginetai ayth h epembash. Ara, ana pasa stigmh, einai dynatos o elegxos gia to an throyntai oi prodiagrafes kai oi oroi toy diagwnismoy ths diakhryjhs, basei ths opoias kapoios elabe thn adeia.

Telos -kai menw, ston prwto gyro, mono se ayta- otan syzhthqhke o nomos aytos, to prohgoymeno kalokairi, opoy sto arqro 134 o nomos 2725/99 proeblepe thn eisagwgh aytoy toy typoy paixnidioy, tipota apo osa shmera isxyrizetai h epikaleitai h N. D. den diatypwqhke sto plaisio ths syzhthshs sth Boylh. Gi` ayto, akribws, mporei kallista na odhghqei kapoios sto symperasma, oti h N. D. gia alloys logoys poy den exoyn kamia sxesh me th diafaneia h thn antikeimenikothta twn diagwnistikwn diadikasiwn, epanerxetai sto qema ayto, to opoio anakalyce kai ycwse ws "shmaia eykairias", mono kai mono gia toys logoys poy proanefera kai oxi, epeidh se ayto to idio to qema exei epixeirhmata kai logoys na epanelqei, khdomenh dhqen ths diafaneias h opoia prepei na diepei aytes tis diagwnistikes diadikasies.

Hmoyn poly safhs. Gia to qema ayto oi armodioi ypoyrgoi qa milhsoyn stoys synadelfoys sas me leptomereies. Ta stoixeia einai para polla kai apodeiknyoyn me ton pio apokalyptiko tropo, oti gia mia akomh fora -epeidh den einai h prwth- h hgesia ths N. D. diepraje mia politikh gkafa olkhs. H ceydologia kai h skandalologia den einai dynato na meinoyn anapanthtes apo toys endiaferomenoys foreis kai apo thn kybernhsh. Ta stoixeia ta opoia einai sth diaqesh pantos endiaferomenoy, dinoyn apostomwtikes apanthseis stoys isxyrismoys ths N. D. Kai se teleytaia analysh, opoioi probainoyn se tetoies kataggelies, exoyn thn eyqynh na tis tekmhriwnoyn kai, giati oxi, na apeyqynontai kai stis armodies dikastikes arxes.

Einai prwtofanes o kataggelwn na fobatai th Dikaiosynh h na thn parakamptei. Einai prwtofanes o politika kataggelwn na mhn tekmhriwnei tis kataggelies kai na arkeitai sthn ekstomish kapoiwn kathgoriwn gia th dhmioyrgia entypwsewn kai monon. Poly perissotero, otan h xwra kai h kybernhsh exoyn epidoqei se mia poly shmantikh prospaqeia poy afora ta problhmata toy parontos, alla kai toy kontinoy mellontos, opws, metajy twn allwn, einai h artia diorganwsh ths Olympiadas toy 2004.

Sas akoyw epi toy qematos aytoy. Na to lysoyme ayto to qema, giati prepei na teleiwnei ayth h istoria. Akoyw opoia erwthsh yparxei gi` ayto to qema kai pame meta sta alla qemata.

Kalws. Afoy den yparxoyn erwthseis, pame se alla qemata.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Meta to Eyrwpaiko Koinoboylio kai thn Commission, hrqe kai to Symboylio Koryfhs, gia na anacei to "prasino" fws gia thn entajh ths Toyrkias sthn E. E. H Kybernhsh ti kanei;

REPPAS: H kybernhsh kanei oti prepei gia na prowqhsei thn politikh ths kai na diasfalisei to eqniko symferon. Pisteyoyme oti h apofash poy qa lhfqei to Dekembrio sto Elsinki, qa antapokrinetai sta symferonta ths E. E. Qa einai wfelimh apofash -ej aytoy toy logoy- kai gia thn Ellada. Elpizoyme na einai wfelimh kai gia thn Toyrkia. Den yparxei prasino fws, ayth thn wra poy syzhtoyme. Yparxoyn skeceis, oi opoies exoyn diatypwqei, apo oles tis xwres, kai apo th dikh mas. Aytes oi skeceis ekfrazoyn mia qetikh diaqesh gia thn eyrw-toyrkikh proseggish, alla syndyazoyn ayth thn proseggish me thn apokthsh ek meroys ths Toyrkias ths idiothtas ths ypochfias pros entajh xwras, me sygkekrimenes enarmoniseis pros to koinotiko kekthmeno, stis opoies prepei na proxwrhsei h Toyrkia. Ara, loipon, qa kyriolekthsw an pw oti ayto to qema brisketai sta xeria ths Toyrkias. Den arkei h qetikh diaqesh apo thn pleyra ths E. E. Xreiazetai praktikh antidrash ths Toyrkias poy na apodeiknyei oti ayto poy epiqymei, mporei na to pragmatopoihsei sebomenh tis arxes kai toys kanones poy diepoyn to koinotiko kekthmeno.

STAMATOPOYLOS: H Ellada, rwthsa, ti kanei;

REPPAS: Hmoyn safhs. Eipa oti h Ellada sto plaisio ths E. E., exei mia politikh, h opoia ekfrazetai me qetikh proseggish, oson afora mia tetoia endexomenh ejelijh. Alla, bebaiws, gia na ginei pragmatikothta ayth h ejelijh, ejartatai se megalo, se kaqoristiko baqmo, apo thn idia thn Toyrkia. Ayto, allwste, einai qesh poy exoyn ekfrasei kai alles xwres, oi perissoteres ths E. E. Kai me ayth th qesh eimaste apolytws symfwnoi.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Poia alla kyriarxika dikaiwmata qa paraxwrhsei h kybernhsh Shmith;

REPPAS: Eimaste poly makria apo thn epoxh poy kapoioi epiqewroysan ton ellhniko strato san na htan dikos toys. Oi enoples dynameis einai se tetoio epipedo, wste na mporoyn na diasfalisoyn thn akeraiothta ths xwras mas. H ellhnikh koinwnia, h oikonomia exoyn kerdisei ena ajiozhleyto epipedo, wste kai di aytoy toy tropoy na qwrakisoyme thn Ellada, apenanti se klydwnismoys, oi opoioi mporei na proelqoyn apo ejwterikh epiboylh. Oxi mono den yparxei paraxwrhsh kyriarxikwn dikaiwmatwn -me thn ennoia poy eseis to qetete, isws kai kapoioi synadelfoi sas- giati panta ta kyriarxika dikaiwmata ta syndeete me thn edafikh akeraiothta, alla antiqetws, yparxei enisxysh twn dikaiwmatwn poy dieqnws anagnwrizontai gia thn Ellada, apo thn wra poy einai melos ths E. E. kai allwn megalwn dieqnwn organismwn. Giati o logos ths Elladas, h qesh ths, h chfos ths ephreazei tis ejelijeis se ena epipedo eyrytero, apo to eqniko xwriko pedio. Apo kei kai pera, to oti eimaste melos aytwn twn megalwn enwsewn, opws einai h E. E., asfalws, opws symbainei gia oles tis xwres kai se oles tis periptwseis, synepagetai ypoxrewseis kai gia th dikh mas xwra, tis opoies sebomaste apolytws. Yparxoyn apofaseis dieqnwn dikasthriwn, poy epiballoyn kapoies poines, p. x. sto ellhniko Dhmosio, gia thn epistrofh xrhmatwn se kapoioys polites poy exoyn prosfygei sta dikasthria. Etsi ki emeis prepei na symmorfwqoyme me aytes tis apofaseis. Shmainei oti exoyme paraxwrhsei kyriarxika dikaiwmata mas; To oti symmetexoyme me alles xwres se dieqnh sxhmata synergasias gia thn patajh ths egklhmatikothtas, shmainei oti ekxwroyme kyriarxika dikaiwmata mas; Shmainei oti sto plaisio ayths ths synergasias diatypwnoyme protaseis -opws kai ta alla melh- kai apo koinoy lambanoyme apofaseis, prokeimenoy na proxwrhsoyme se sygkekrimenh drash. Ayto den shmainei meiwsh ths askoymenhs kyriarxias, apo th dikh mas pleyra. Mporw na anaferw seira paradeigmatwn. H kakopisth ayth ermhneia nomizw oti den qa eprepe na doqei apo thn pleyra ths N. D., h opoia eirhsqw en parodw, zhthse, bebaiws, thn paraithsh toy ypoyrgoy Ejwterikwn. Den einai h prwth fora poy to kanei kai den to kanei mono gia ton epikefalhs toy ypoyrgeioy Ejwterikwn. Kai malista, to zhthse th stigmh poy o ypoyrgos Ejwterikwn symmeteixe sto Symboylio Koryfhs kai edine maxh, prowqwntas tis ellhnikes qeseis gia krisima qemata, ta opoia htan antikeimeno ths syzhthshs, se aytes tis diaskeceis. Nomizw oti -an qeloyme pragmatika na bohqhsoyme ton topo kai to lao mas, na jeperasei ta sobara problhmata poy yparxoyn, kai den einai liga- ayto poy exoyme na kanoyme einai na ergastoyme me sobarothta kai synepeia, legontas thn alhqeia. Aytoy toy eidoys oi antiparaqeseis ginontai mono kai mono gia na prokaleitai qorybos. Omws, to na pyroboleis, oxi gia na petyxeis to stoxo, alla gia na exeis thn ikanopoihsh na akoyseis to qorybo apo ton pyrobolismo, den mas afora. Ek toy mh ontos dhmioyrghqhke ena qema, gia sygkekrimenoys logoys, poy den exoyn sxesh, oyte me to eqniko symferon, oyte me thn politikh ths kybernhshs. Exoyn sxesh me thn agwniwdh prospaqeia ths N. D. na pei kati gia na dhlwsei thn paroysia ths. As milhsei me qetiko logo kai qa akoystei. Den einai anagkh di aytoy toy tropoy na epixeirei na epanelqei, ws ajiwmatikh antipoliteysh, sthn kentrikh politikh skhnh. Zhmiwnetai kai h idia.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Den htan mono ena komma, htan ola ta kommata. Kai efoson milate gia kakopisth ermhneia, giati o Prwqypoyrgos ayth th frash thn ebgale apo to keimeno toy k. Papandreoy;

REPPAS: Poios sas eipe oti thn ebgale o Prwqypoyrgos;

STAMATOPOYLOS: Giati den yparxei;

REPPAS: Epeidh den yparxei, eseis bgalate to symperasma oti thn ebgale o Prwqypoyrgos. H erwthsh sas, einai h kalyterh apodeijh ths kakopistias, h opoia fainetai sas diakrinei. Otan exete bgalei to symperasma oti ayto to ekane o Prwqypoyrgos, moy dinete to dikaiwma...

STAMATOPOYLOS:...me entolh toy Prwqypoyrgoy egine ayto.

REPPAS: To jerete ayto; Epeidh ki egw eida tis ermhneies poy doqhkan, prepei na sas pw oti enoxlhqhka gia enan logo. To stigmiotypo ekeino poy me deixnei na exw skycei kai na milw sto ayti toy k. Papandreoy, ermhneyqhke apo polloys, ws dikh moy parembash pros ton k. Papandreoy. Aplws, enhmerwsa ton k. Papandreoy se sxesh me erwthsh poy eixe diatypwsei synadelfos sas, molis prin, gia mia ekdosh toy ypoyrgeioy Typoy toy 1999. Kamia sxesh me thn alhqeia h ermhneia poy doqhke gia to periexomeno ayths ths syzhthshs poy kaname ekeinh th stigmh. Ola ayta nomizw oti exoyn kanei ton kyklo toys. Den prepei na mas apasxoloyn allo. Exoyme sobara qemata na antimetwpisoyme. Epeidh polla problhmata yparxoyn mprosta mas kai prepei na ta antimetwpisoyme kai na ta lysoyme, as anadeijei h N. D. thn protash ths kai as epixeirhsei di aytoy toy tropoy na ejasfalisei paroysia kai probolh, gia na prosferei eqnikh yphresia.

SOYRMELH: Qa hqela ligo perissotero na anaptyjete ayto to "den yparxei prasino fws". Eipate, bebaia, oti yparxoyn skeceis poy ekfrazoyn diaqesh. Qa hqela omws ligo perissotera gia to "prasino fws".

REPPAS: H apofash gia to qema ayto qa lhfqei sto Elsinki. Ara, loipon, den mporei na pei kaneis oti ayto to qema exei lhjei. Den exei lhfqei sxetikh apofash.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Emena, pantws, den moy apanthsate, poios apaleice th frash... Efoson den einai o Prwqypoyrgos...

REPPAS: Ayto to qema to apanthsame. En pash periptwsei kai o Prwqypoyrgos apanthse epi ths oysias se sxetikh erwthsh, thn idia hmera kai egw sas apantw, anaferontas kapoia paradeigmata epi ths oysias, prokeimenoy na mhn yparxei h paramikrh yponoia oti syntelesqhke ekxwrhsh kyriarxikwn dikaiwmatwn, opws kapoioi, atyxws isxyristhkan, metajy twn opoiwn isws kai eseis, me ton tropo poy qetete tis erwthseis sas. Mporw na to ektimhsw ayto. Htan poly safh kai ayta poy eipe o Prwqypoyrgos kai ayta ta opoia eipa egw. Kai mh syndeete, sas parakalw, ta kyriarxika dikaiwmata pantote me ton eqniko xwro, giati ayth th sygxysh prospaqhsan kapoioi na prokalesoyn stoys polites, gia na ejaxqei to symperasma oti exoyme dhqen ekxwrhsei eqniko xwro. Eimaste se dieqneis synergasies, exoyme sygkekrimena dikaiwmata, enisxymena se sxesh me to parelqon poy den symmeteixame se ayta ta dieqnh sxhmata, alla exoyme kai sygkekrimenes ypoxrewseis, stis opoies prepei na antapokriqoyme. Ayta ola ginontai sto plaisio diadikasiwn poy einai dhmokratikes kai sto plaisio aytwn twn diadikasiwn, h Ellada exei isxyrh fwnh kai paroysia, prokeimenoy na proaspizei ta symferonta ths. Perissotero para pote exoyme petyxei na exoyme ayth thn isxyrh, dieqnws, qesh poy odhgei sthn yperaspish twn eqnikwn symferontwn.

SOYRMELH: Mporeite na apariqmhsete twra, meta to Tampere, orismena apo ta bhmata poy prepei na kanei h Toyrkia, sygkekrimena, gia na proxwrhsei pros ta eyrwpaika kekthmena;

REPPAS: Den qa htan fronimo ayth thn wra na syzhthsoyme, me leptomereies, gia to pws prepei ayto to dimhno poy mesolabei mexri th Synodo Koryfhs sto Elsinki, na ergastoyn oles oi kybernhseis gia na ftasoyn sto gnwsto stoxo ton opoio epidiwkoyn, ton opoio epiqymoyn. Gnwrizete poies einai oi qeseis poy exoyme anaptyjei kata kairoys. Sas parapempw se aytes tis qeseis. Den exw na prosqesw tipota. Sas lew omws oti ayto to dimhno, pragmatika einai enas xronos poy prepei na ajiopoihqei, giati polla pragmata prepei akomh na ginoyn. Hmoyn safhs otan eipa oti rolo kaqoristiko se mia tetoia ejelijh exei h idia h Toyrkia.

BITALHS: Qa hqela dyo dieykriniseis. Prospaqw na katalabw poia einai h sygkekrimenh stash ths ellhnikhs kybernhshs sto qema ths "xartas diadromhs" poy leme, anaforika me thn Toyrkia. Emeis yioqetoyme thn apoch oti ayth qa prepei na synadei, mallon na phgainei parallhla me thn anakoinwsh ypochfiothtas ths Toyrkias h qa exoyme mia allh diadikasia, afoy anakoinwqei h Toyrkia, an anakoinwqei ypochfia gia th "xarta diadromhs". To prwto erwthma einai ayto.

REPPAS: Qa epanalabw ena meros ths apanthshs poy edwsa sthn k. Soyrmelh. Ayth thn periodo ginontai syzhthseis metajy twn kybernhsewn, antallassontai apoceis. Oi syzhthseis aytes exoyn kai ena xarakthra diapragmateyshs. Den einai swsto kai mhn perimenete na to kanei h kybernhsh mas, na syzhtoyme dhmosiws kai di aytoy toy tropoy gia ena toso sobaro qema. Exoyme diatypwsei qeseis. Einai se sas gnwsto to plaisio. Tis qeseis aytes epanalabame, dia toy Prwqypoyrgoy, sth Synodo Koryfhs, proxqes. Den yparxei tipota allo, to opoio na exei sto metajy ekdhlwqei.

SOYRMELH: O k. Papandreoy jekina mia toyrne shmera...

REPPAS: Bebaiws, gia na enhmerwsei kai se dimeres epipedo, kai me perissoteres leptomereies gia tis qeseis mas tis kybernhseis twn allwn kratwn-melwn ths E. E. Den qa kanei tipote allo, para na epanalabei tis qeseis mas.

BITALHS: Qetei h Aqhna, h kybernhsh kai o Prwqypoyrgos kai sto Tampere, ena zhthma, dhladh mia desmeysh ek meroys twn "15" gia thn entajiakh poreia ths Kyproy. To erwthma moy einai: Qewrei h Aqhna oti einai katoxyrwmenh apo dyo apofaseis Symboyliwn Koryfhs h entajh ths Kyproy, h diadikasia entajhs ths Kyproy, asxeta me to politiko problhma; To qewreite dedomeno ayto;

REPPAS: Na eiste apolyta sigoyros oti oi opoies desmeyseis epiqymoyme na analhfqoyn, sto plaisio ths E. E., apo thn Toyrkia, prokeimenoy na proxwrhsei se kaqestws ypochfiothtas h xwra ayth, qa analhfqoyn gia na yparxei ayth h ejelijh. Ean den analhfqoyn, asfalws den qa yparjei ayth h ejelijh. Ti allo pio safes prepei na eipwqei oson afora ayto to sygkekrimeno qema; Kai h E. E. sto sygkekrimeno ayto tomea exei to diko ths rolo. Den prokeitai na syzhthsoyme perissoteres leptomereies ayto to dimhno gia to sygkekrimeno qema. Den antilambaneste oti ayto einai epizhmio; Ayth thn wra einai se ejelijh oi syzhthseis ths ellhnikhs kybernhshs me kybernhseis twn allwn xwrwn ths E. E. To perigramma twn qesewn mas to gnwrizete. Den prokeitai na syzhthsoyme thn wra poy diejagontai aytes oi diapragmateyseis dhmosiws kai me leptomereies.

BITALHS: Egw den amfisbhtw oti ginontai diapragmateyseis. Egw rwtw ena poly aytonohto pragma: Apo th stigmh poy qewreitai dedomeno, me apofaseis Symboyliwn Koryfhs, giati janadiapragmateyomaste to idio qema;

REPPAS: Kanete laqos, ean qewreite oti diapragmateyomaste. To qema ths entajhs ths Kyproy, asfalws kai exei apofasistei. H entajh ths Kyproy den mporei na yponomeyqei apo kanenan. Poio einai to qema; Gnwrizete poly kala oti yparxoyn xwres poy kata kairoys exoyn diatypwsei mia allh proseggish. Den mporeis na epibaleis se opoiadhpote kybernhsh na mhn exei th dikh ths qesh. Emeis epixeiroyme, ektos ean proteinete na apoxwrhsoyme apo thn E. E....

BITALHS: Den proteinw ayto, k. Ypoyrge. Yparxoyn apofaseis Symboyliwn Koryfhs...

REPPAS: Asfalws yparxoyn kai parapempoyn sto koinotiko plaisio poy exei apofasistei se Synodoys Koryfhs.

BITALHS: Kai giati to diapragmateyomaste;

REPPAS: Poios sas eipe oti ayto to qema einai dynaton na einai ejw apo th dikh mas optikh; Eite to qema ths epilyshs toy kypriakoy problhmatos, eite to qema ths aproskopths entajhs ths Kyproy sthn E. E. mporei na meinei ejw apo th dikh mas optikh, sto plaisio twn prospaqeiwn poy kanoyme, thn wra poy h E. E. syzhta gia th dieyrynsh ths; Mhn exete kamia aporia. Gia ena poly aplo logo, eseis pairnete sa dedomeno oti ena qema to syzhtoyme me ton tropo poy eseis to qetete, enw sas lew oti ola ayta einai qemata ta opoia syzhtoyme, etsi wste na diasfalisoyme ta symferonta ths xwras mas kai ths Kyproy. Kai taytoxrona den qa exoyme kamia antirrhsh, bebaiws, h Toyrkia na xristei ypochfia xwra ths E. E., an ayto ginei katw apo tis sygkekrimenes arxes. Loipon, mh qelete na syzhthsoyme perissotero ayth thn wra, giati -epanalambanw- den exei prokycei tipota diaforetiko apo ayta ta opoia exoyme pei kai ta opoia gnwrizete. Tipota diaforetiko.

BITALHS: Einai dedomenes oi apofaseis toy Symboylioy Koryfhs;

REPPAS: Giati den tis sebontai alles xwres ths E. E. otan me dhmosies dhlwseis paragontwn toys diatypwnoyn mia arnhtikh qesh; Ti shmainei ayto kata th dikh sas apoch;

BITALHS: Den qa ekfrasw th dikh moy apoch, alla qa rwthsw jana: Einai isxyres oi apofaseis toy Symboylioy Koryfhs;

REPPAS: Einai isxyres kai prepei na ginontai sebastes. Alla gnwrizete kai eseis kai oloi sas poly kala, poio einai to pedio entos toy opoioy anaptyssoyme thn politikh mas. Den eimaste monoi mas. Kai parakalw otan enhmerwnete thn koinh gnwmh, ayto na dinete ston kosmo na to katalabei, giati para polloi qewroyn oti apo th stigmh poy emeis exoyme mia qesh, ayth h qesh prepei na einai qesh olwn twn allwn kratwn. Den symbainei ayto. Kai blepete oti polles fores ta idia ta krath, mesw twn kybernhsewn toys, pairnoyn mia diaforetikh qesh, kanoyn mia diaforetikh proseggish gia to idio qema. Den einai kainoyrgio fainomeno ayto.

EYSTAQIOY: Prwton, ean emeis stis syzhthseis, tonizoyme kai epishmainoyme oti yparxoyn oi apofaseis kai deyteron, o Prwqypoyrgos kata thn episkech toy sthn Praga eixe erwthqei kai eixe apanthsei oti se periptwsh poy "kanoyn pisw" oi etairoi sto qema ths Kyproy, emeis qa qesoyme beto gia to qema ths Toyrkias. Paramenei staqerh ayth h qesh ths kybernhshs;

REPPAS: Osa exoyme pei isxyoyn apolytws. Asfalws isxyoyn. Den allazei tipota ws pros ayto to qema.

KARGOYDH: Gia to FALCON hqela na rwthsw. Apo thn prohgoymenh Paraskeyh exei ekdoqei ena prwto porisma apo tis roymanikes arxes. Ektos toy prwtotypoy, poy exei paroysiastei ston ellhniko Typo, h kybernhsh ti exei ypoch ths.

REPPAS: H kybernhsh den exei labei opoiodhpote porisma.

TAKHS: H qesh ths kybernhshs sthn protash ths N. D. gia systash Ejetastikhs Epitrophs, oson afora to FALCON, poia qa einai;

REPPAS: H qesh poy diatypwsame apo thn prwth stigmh. Otan den exoyme sth diaqesh mas to teliko porisma gia na gnwrizoyme tis synqhkes katw apo tis opoies egine ayto to tragiko symban, antilambaneste pws einai, toylaxiston, epipolaio na syzhtoyme gia systash Ejetastikhs Epitrophs. Kapoioi qa to hqelan ayto mono kai mono gia mikropolitikoys logoys.

TAKHS: Se poies diplwmatikes energeies qa probei h kybernhsh sxetika me to tragiko gegonos poy synebh sthn Imbro; Sthn pyrpolhsh enos spitioy, opoy kahke ena ejaxrono paidi.

REPPAS: Yparxei epikoinwnia twn armodiwn paragontwn. Prepei na sas pw oti apo tis prwtes plhrofories poy exoyme, prokyptei oti ayto to qema afora perissotero to astynomiko deltio. Einai ena tragiko gegonos. Lypoymaste gi ayto. Alla, ayth einai h alhqeia.

EYSTAQIOY: Shmera, symplhrwnontai 18 xronia, apo tote poy to PASOK breqhke sthn ejoysia. Qa hqela na sas rwthsw, ean eiste ikanopoihmenoi, 18 xronia meta, me bash ta osa apo tote eixate ejaggeilei, apo thn poreia toy sosialistikoy kaqestwtos sthn Ellada;

REPPAS: Prwta ap` ola, antilambanomai ayto poy eipate ws "lepto xioymor". Den milhse kaneis gia sosialistiko kaqestws. To kanete eseis, epeidh, profanws, enw to gnwrizete pws den yfistatai, qelete na dhmioyrghsete kapoia entypwsh. To oti to PASOK kyberna ta perissotera xronia apo to 1974 ews shmera, apodeiknyei me ton kalytero tropo pws dikaiwnei toys logoys gia toys opoioys o Andreas Papandreoy kai oi synergates toy proxwrhsan sthn idrysh toy Kinhmatos. Exei allajei o xarths ths Elladas. H qesh ths Elladas sth dieqnh skhnh einai poly pio isxyrh shmera, para pote. Sthn ellhnikh koinwnia h synoxh, h dynatothta stoys adynamoys kai perifronhmenoys toy 1981 na zoyn se ajioprepeis synqhkes, einai kai ayto ena agaqo apotelesma ths politikhs poy askhsan oi kybernhseis toy PASOK. Kai, bebaia, to megalo qema ths eqnikhs symfiliwshs, pisteyw oti apotelei mia istorikh stigmh, apo tis pio shmantikes sto synolo ths ellhnikhs istorias. Kai ayto einai ergo toy PASOK. Mporoyme na milame polles wres. Alla, den fantazomai na anamenate oti epeidh eimaste sto PASOK kai epeidh meta apo tosa xronia, me thn chfo toy ellhnikoy laoy, kybername kai janakybername, qa prepei na eimaste kai dysaresthmenoi! Asfalws ekfrazoyme megalh ikanopoihsh.

Sas eyxaristw.

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