Greek Government Press Briefing, 98-05-13

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

YPOYRGEIO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

Aqhna, 13 Maioy 1998

H ENHMERWSH TWN POLITIKWN SYNTAKTWN KAI TWN ANTAPOKRITWN JENOY TYPOY APO TON YPOYRGO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS KAI KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO DHMHTRH REPPA

Geia sas. Akoyw tis erwthseis sas.

SOYGLERHS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, exete kapoies anakoinwseis na mas kanete, ean apofasisate kati sth synanthsh me ton k. Mantelh kai ton Prwqypoyrgo;

REPPAS: Den egine synanthsh me ton Prwqypoyrgo. O Prwqypoyrgos asxoleitai me polla qemata. Asfalws, kapoia stigmh qa asxolhqei kai me to sygkekrimeno. Emeis, oi synarmodioi Ypoyrgoi, exoyme syskeceis ...

SOYGLERHS: Milame gia thn chfiakh ...

REPPAS: Gi` ayto milame. Polla dhmosieymata, omws, blepoyn to fws ths dhmosiothtas kai prepei na sas pw oti yparxei mia sygxysh gyrw apo ayto to qema. Ta osa eipame sth synenteyjh poy dwsame me ton k. Mantelh, stis 3 Martioy, isxyoyn. Prepei na dieykrinisw oti eimaste xronika epikairoi, dioti kai sthn Eyrwph h syzhthsh gia to qema ayto einai se ejelijh. Einai se ekkremothta h telikh proseggish gia to pws antimetwpizetai h anaptyjh tetoiwn drasthriothtwn sto xwro ths paroxhs, mesw chfiakwn programmatwn, thleoptikwn kai allwn thlepikoinwniakwn yphresiwn. Sthn Ellada den prepei na epanalaboyme ta laqh toy parelqontos, otan oi idiwtikoi thleoptikoi staqmoi anaptyxqhkan xwris sxediasmo. Prepei na antimetwpisoyme to fainomeno ayto sth genesh toy, me tetoio tropo, wste kai diafaneia na yparxei kai na antimetwpizoyme ta qemata poy qa aforoyn th sygkentrwsh oikonomikhs kai politikhs dynamhs. Alla, bebaiws, prepei na egkaqidrysoyme kai ena plaisio proypoqesewn, otan kapoios endiaferetai na askhsei ayto to dikaiwma, na anaptyjei ayth th drasthriothta. Ola ayta einai qemata ta opoia mas apasxoloyn. Eimai kathgorhmatikos -to eipa allwste kai se palaioterh apanthsh moy- oti h qesh mas einai isxyrh kai sto plaisio ths E.E., giati tiqentai ekei tetoia qemata. Den exoyme opoiadhpote ypoxrewsh na epitrecoyme thn anaptyjh ayths ths drasthriothtas, mia sygkekrimenh xronikh stigmh, an kai bebaiws h stigmh ayth den qa prepei na anagetai sto apwtero mellon. Exoyme, opws kai alles xwres ths E.E., me ypeyqyno kai cyxraimo tropo proseggisei ayto to qema. Mas apasxolei. H epiqymia mas gia th dhmioyrgia isxyroy forea, sto plaisio mias eqnikhs chfiakhs platformas, paramenei. Enqarrynoyme ayth thn prospaqeia. Den qa einai o foreas aytos, efoson prokycei, o monadikos. Qa leitoyrgei me toys kanones toy antagwnismoy, oi opoioi isxyoyn sthn Koinothta. Ayto to opoio prepei na einai safes einai oti h prospaqeia poy kanei h Kybernhsh apoblepei sth diasfalish twn meizonwn koinwnikwn agaqwn kai sthn prosfora yphresiwn sthn patrida kai ton polith-katanalwth. O poliths, ws poliths kai ws katanalwths, einai aytos poy prepei na mas deixnei to dromo gia oles tis epiloges mas. Kai oxi, bebaiws, to kerdos, to opoio kapoioi epidiwkoyn na apokomisoyn mesa apo tetoies drasthriothtes. To kerdos einai qemito. Den mporei, omws, na einai to stoixeio ekeino to opoio qa kalyptei oloys toys alloys paragontes kai tis parametroys poy prepei sobara na laboyme ypoch mas prin proxwrhsoyme stis telikes epiloges mas.

KIAOS: Qetete ws Kybernhsh kapoio xroniko orio, pote dhladh qa teleiwsei ayth h diadikasia;

REPPAS: Den einai eykolo na prosdiorisw sygkekrimena thn hmeromhnia sthn opoia qa eimaste etoimoi na proxwrhsoyme sthn anaptyjh ayths ths drasthriothtas. Pisteyw oti den qa einai makrys o xronos. Pisteyw, omws, oti apaiteitai na oloklhrwqei aytos o sxediasmos, prokeimenoy ta apotelesmata na einai pros ofelos ths patridas mas, twn katanalwtwn kai bebaiws, kai twn epixeirhmatiwn, poy me nomimo kai qemito tropo qa drasthriopoihqoyn ston tomea ayto.

KIAOS: Exete erqei se synennohseis me foreis poy emplekontai kai epaggelmatika sta qemata ths thleorasews, p.x. ESHEA, POESY, apo to xwro to diko mas, to dhmosiografiko ennow h me toys idiokthtes h alloys foreis; An phrate th gnwmh toys, an syzhthsate, an eginan ayta ta pragmata;

REPPAS: H Kybernhsh, mesw toy k. Mantelh kai emoy, proxwrhse se sygkekrimenes anakoinwseis stis arxes Martioy. H Kybernhsh den exei opoiadhpote allh emplokh kai symmetoxh se syzhthseis h oionei diapragmateyseis gia to sygkekrimeno qema. Oi endiaferomenoi foreis, exontas ayto to dhmosio kalesma ths Kybernhshs, antapokrinomenoi, epeidh akribws endiaferontai na symmetasxoyn se mia tetoia drasthriothta, exoyn epafh me thn hgesia toy OTE -poy einai enas Organismos, me metoxo to Dhmosio, alla metexei sto Xrhmatisthrio kai leitoyrgei me idiwtikooikonomika krithria- o opoios exei endiaferon na anaptyjei drasthriothta s' ayto ton tomea. Exoyn ginei kapoies syzhthseis, prokeimenoy na diereynhqei h diaqesh ths agoras, etsi wste kai oi telikes epiloges poy qa kanoyme, afoy enhmerwqoyme gia to apotelesma olwn aytwn twn syzhthsewn, na exoyn mia antistoixia me thn pragmatikothta kai na mhn einai qewrhtikes kataskeyes, oi opoies den exoyn mia stereh bash. Aytos einai o logos olwn aytwn twn syzhthsewn. Oson afora ta qemata, sta opoia epi troxadhn anaferqhka prin, prokeimenoy na oloklhrwsoyme ayto to plaisio, einai bebaio oti ws Kybernhsh qa syzhthsoyme me toys armodioys foreis ths koinwnias mas, prokeimenoy na laboyme ypoch tis qeseis toys, wste to teliko keimeno poy qa diatypwsoyme gia olo ayto to qema, na exei, metajy twn allwn, synektimhsei kai tis dikes toys apoceis.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: An qymamai kala sth synenteyjh me ton k. Mantelh eixate pei oti ayth h eniaia chfiakh platforma qa einai kai o monadikos foreas ...

REPPAS: Den eipa oti qa einai o monadikos foreas. Tetoia lejh den yparxei.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: Kalws h kakws to eixame katalabei tote etsi ...

REPPAS: Den yparxei kati tetoio.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: To idio epanalabate kai prin apo tesseris hmeres, otan egw sas rwthsa kai eipate oti mesw aytoy toy forea ths eqnikhs chfiakhs platformas qa pernoyn oi opoioi endiaferomenoi na parasxoyn tis chfiakes yphresies. Ayto isxyei shmera;

REPPAS: Prwta ap` ola, den einai dynaton, epeidh ayto epiballei o antagwnismos, na mh dinetai h dynatothta ths anaptyjhs, mesw ths dhmioyrgias pollwn forewn, ayths ths drasthriothtas. Ayto to opoio eipame tote kai epanalambanw einai toyto kai einai safes: Eynooyme kaqe prospaqeia gia th dhmioyrgia enos isxyroy forea, sto plaisio mias eqnikhs chfiakhs platformas, me th synenwsh twn dynamewn olwn, an einai dynaton, twn endiaferomenwn, xwris apokleismoys, wste na exoyme ws xwra, ws koinwnia, mia isxyrh dieqnh paroysia ston chfiako xwro. An ayto den einai dynaton, bebaiws den qa ofeiletai se dikes mas adynamies h epiloges. Einai kati poy to enqarrynoyme kai apotelei gia mas mia epilogh yper ths opoias prepei na prospaqhsoyme. Ajizei na dwsoyme ayth th maxh, enw parallhla -kai ayto einai to nohma ths eqnikhs chfiakhs platformas- prepei na aposafhnisoyme to plaisio, to periballon, entos toy opoioy qa anaptyxqei ayth h drasthriothta se polloys tomeis. Oson afora th sygkentrwsh, epanalambanw, oikonomikhs kai politikhs dynamhs. Oson afora th diafaneia, oson afora ta protypa stis texnologies efarmoghs. Gia to an dhladh, o apokwdikopoihths poy qa xrhsimopoieitai se ena systhma qa einai symbatos, wste o katanalwths na mporei na xrhsimopoiei ton apokwdikopoihth, efoson kapoia stigmh apofasisei na entaxqei se ena allo systhma. Prepei, dhladh, na yparxoyn sygkekrimenes prodiagrafes. Deite kati analogo me ayto poy ginetai sthn kinhth thlefwnia, opoy mporeite na xrhsimopoihsete thn idia syskeyh gia diaforetika systhmata. Ola ayta prepei na ta problecoyme me enan tetoio tropo, wste na eimaste etoimoi na antimetwpisoyme ayto to fainomeno, poy qa parei ekrhktikh diastash kai qa htan oleqrio, shmera, me enan tropo epipolaio, na to antimetwpisoyme, wste ayrio na breqoyme apenanti se tetelesmena kai mesw ths dhmioyrgias elegktikwn mhxanismwn kai ek twn ysterwn na epixeiroyme na ryqmisoyme qemata. Kati poy se megalo baqmo egine kai ginetai me ta thleoptika kai radiofwnika programmata, ta opoia ekpempontai sthn patrida mas. Ayta ola mas exoyn didajei. H empeiria prepei na ajiopoihqei. Den qelw na mpoyme se ena dhmosio dialogo, o opoios pairnei mia diastash poy den antapokrinetai sth sobarothta toy qematos, giati dinontai para polles ermhneies. Yparxei mia filologia, h opoia -qa moy epitrecete na pw- deixnei mikro endiaferon gia thn antimetwpish aytoy toy problhmatos kai megalo endiaferon gia th dhmioyrgia entypwsewn. O chfiakos kosmos, h chfiakh texnologia einai ena poly shmantiko kefalaio gia thn patrida mas, enocei toy 21oy aiwna. Exoyme eyqynh oloi -h Kybernhsh aisqanetai ayth thn eyqynh- na kanoyme to kalytero dynato. Ayto prospaqoyme. Ayth einai h safhs prospaqeia mas.

DHMOSIOGRAFOS: Epeidh den ta katalabainoyme kai poly ...

REPPAS: Einai eidika qemata. Egw milhsa me ayto ton tropo, me ton opoio milhsa, gia na sas katasthsw koinwnoys enos problhmatismoy poy yparxei kai na sas dwsw to metro ths eyqynhs poy niwqoyme, otan xeirizomaste ayta ta qemata. Den einai qemata sta opoia eykola ekdideis mia apofash gia na anaqeseis se kapoion na anaptyjei mia epixeirhmatikh drasthriothta giati den prokeitai mono gia mia epixeirhmatikh drasthriothta. Prokeitai gia enan para poly neyralgiko tomea, ston opoio epiqymoyme h Ellada na eiselqei me ajiwseis, wste na exei mia isxyrh qesh.

SOYGLERHS: Qa hqela na rwthsw h ERT qa exei proteraiothta mia kai exei to apokleistiko dikaiwma ths doryforikhs chfiakhs ekpomphs;

REPPAS: To apokleistiko dikaiwma ths ERT einai isxyro, oson afora ta kalwdiaka h syndromhtika diktya, apo thn apoch toy optikoakoystikoy periexomenoy toys. H men agora twn thlepikoinwniwn exei apeleyqerwqei, einai omws allo pragma h ypodomh, oi texnikes egkatastaseis kai h texnologia kai allo pragma to periexomeno me to opoio trofodoteitai to texniko diktyo. Ws pros to periexomeno, loipon, h ERT diathrei ayto to apokleistiko dikaiwma, to opoio mporei kai h idia na to ajiopoihsei h bebaiws mporei na to ekmetalleytei proxwrwntas se symfwnies, synetairismoys h synach symbasewn me alloys endiaferomenoys idiwtikoys foreis.

MIXAHL: Ola ayta poy mas eipate twra prokeitai na syzhthqoyn se ligh wra, sth syskech poy qa ginei ypo ton Prwqypoyrgo, ton k. Mantelh, ton k. Xristodoylakh kai esas h den qa ginei ayth h synanthsh;

REPPAS: H syskech poy qa ginei se ligh wra me ton Prwqypoyrgo, einai sto plaisio twn syskecewn poy exei o Prwqypoyrgos me synergates toy kai qa ginei mia eyryterh syzhthsh. Qa afora, dhladh, to synolo twn qematwn poy exoyn sxesh me thn anaptyjh aytwn twn newn texnologiwn.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: Oi idiwtes oi opoioi endiaferontai na parasxoyn chfiakes yphresies qa mporoyn na to kanoyn xronika, anejarthta apo to an o dhmosios tomeas, mesw toy OTE h ths ERT, qa mporei kai aytos na mpei se ayton to xwro;

REPPAS: Apo th stigmh poy exoyme aposafhnisei to plaisio entos toy opoioy qa anaptyxqei ayth h drasthriothta kai khryssoyme ypo mia ennoia thn enarjh drasthriothtas, antilambaneste pws h drasthriothta ayth einai eleyqerh gia oloys ekeinoys poy throyn orismenes proypoqeseis kai antapokrinontai stoys oroys poy sto metajy exoyme me sygkekrimeno tropo orisei, wste na yparxei o antagwnismos pros ofelos toy katanalwth, opws problepetai se oles tis xwres ths E.E. Prepei na pw, omws, oti se polles xwres ths E.E. den exei anaptyxqei ayth h Yphresia kai oti yparxei se oles tis xwres, akomh kai ekei poy exei anaptyxqei, ploysiotatos dialogos, megalos problhmatismos gia to pws prepei oi Kybernhseis, oi armodioi foreis na xeiristoyn ayta ta toso eidika alla poly krisima qemata.

KIAOS: Hqela na rwthsw pws qa antimetwpisete eseis ws Kybernhsh thn prosfygh poy exei ginei se eyrwpaiko epipedo;

REPPAS: Ej oswn gnwrizw den exei ginei kamia prosfygh se eyrwpaiko epipedo. Den exoyme enhmerwqei gi ayto. Oi plhrofories poy exw apo ena diktyo to opoio yparxei sthn E.E. opoy antallassontai apoceis, moy dinoyn th dynatothta na pw shmera, sxedon me bebaiothta, oti den yparxei prosfygh. Yparxei apla mia epistolh h diamartyria, h opoia bebaiws meletatai h anagignwsketai apo toys paralhptes ths. Den yparxei prosfygh me th nomikh ennoia ths. An yparjei prosfygh exoyme ta epixeirhmata mas ta opoia qa anaptyjoyme. Prepei na sas pw oti h qesh mas kai politika kai nomika einai isxyrotath.

KIAOS: Lete oti perimenete thn prosfygh;

REPPAS: Den perimenw prosfygh, giati den pisteyw oti exei prooptikh mia prosfygh, doqentos oti den exoyme parabei kapoia ypoxrewsh, enanti ths opoias na egkaloymeqa. Me thn eykairia ayth, qelw na pw oti ayta ta qemata, ta opoia einai poly shmantika qemata, oloi prepei na ta syzhtoyme cyxraima kai na ta afhsoyme makria apo opoiasdhpote morfhs antidikia. Emeis to kanoyme, sto baqmo poy einai anqrwpinws dynaton. Qelw kai eseis na dexqeite oti ajizei na melethsoyme ayta ta qemata, wste na eimaste apolytws etoimoi thn wra ekeinh poy qa anaptyxqoyn aytes oi nees yphresies.

SOYGLERHS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, epeidh einai poly sobaro qema, opws mas to dinete shmera, qa zhthsete tis protaseis twn politikwn kommatwn;

REPPAS: Otan h Kybernhsh katalhjei pleon se ena orismeno plaisio, poy qa apotelei th dikh ths protash, asfalws qa mpei se ena dialogo me tis politikes kai koinwnikes dynameis. To eipa prin apantwntas se sxetikh erwthsh toy k. Kiaoy, oti oi koinwnikes omades qa mporoyn na poyn tis apoceis toys. To idio bebaiws kai poly perissotero qa exoyn th dynatothta na poyn thn apoch toys oi politikoi foreis.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, eipate oti h Kybernhsh, toylaxiston, epiqymoyse mexri twra oloi na synenwnoyn tis dynameis toys...

REPPAS: Kai to epiqymoyme.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: Kai to epiqymeite akoma. H Kybernhsh exei proxwrhsei, exei zhthsei apo toys endiaferomenoys idiwtes, oi opoioi qeloyn na drasthriopoihqoyn se ayton ton tomea, exei syzhthsei mazi toys to qema; Kai an nai, poia apanthsh eisepraje;

REPPAS: Eipa, k. Mpogiopoyle, oti h Kybernhsh, me th synenteyjh poy paraxwrhsame oi dyo Ypoyrgoi, aphyqyne mia dhmosia prosklhsh. H Kybernhsh ektote, den exei opoiadhpote emplokh se ayth th diadikasia.

FILHS: Ena synafes qema. Epeidh to programma ths doryforikhs metadoshs syndyazetai se kapoio baqmo kai me to qema toy podosfairoy kai ths emporikhs ekmetalleyshs toy aqlhtikoy qeamatos kai epeidh prin apo kapoio diasthma yparxei mia symfwnia poy exei epikriqei apo orismenes pleyres, metajy toy enos twn endiaferomenwn gia thn chfiakh thleorash kai ths EPAE. Ekei yparxei qema antagwnismoy; Qa parembei h Kybernhsh;

REPPAS: Den dikaioymai na krinw epi ths oysias kapoies symbaseis oi opoies exoyn ginei. Bebaiws, oi antagwnistes exoyn th dikh toys apoch. Emeis eimaste ametoxoi se ayth th sygkroysh oikonomikwn symferontwn. Ayto, omws, to opoio prepei na pw me aformh thn erwthsh sas einai toyto: Yparxei Koinotikh Odhgia h opoia problepei oti shmantikes aqlhtikes ekdhlwseis poy prokaloyn to pallaiko endiaferon, qa prepei na metadidontai mesw anoiktwn programmatwn. Menei, loipon, na prosdioristoyn poies einai aytes oi megales ekdhlwseis. Einai ena qema to opoio mas apasxolei. To Ypoyrgeio Politismoy exei ton prwto logo. Exoyme kanei proodo kai nomizw oti kai sto qema ayto, syntomotata, qa yparjei telikh ryqmish.

FILHS: Synepws, yparxei qema diathrhshs ths symfwnias ayths.

REPPAS: H symfwnia isxyei. Aplws, oi aqlhtikes ekdhlwseis poy paroysiazoyn megalo endiaferon prepei na metadidontai mesw eleyqerwn diktywn kai oxi mesa apo syndromhtika diktya. Menei, loipon, h kaqe xwra -kai oles tis xwres shmera tis apasxolei ayto to qema- na orisei poies einai aytes oi ejairetikhs shmasias aqlhtikes ekdhlwseis. Antilambaneste oti einai qemata polyploka.

FILHS: Kostizoyn, bebaiws.

REPPAS: Se xrono.

FILHS: H erwthsh einai, poia einai h nomikh diadikasia poy qa chfistei h platforma. Dhladh, nomos, Proedriko Diatagma; Ti akribws qa ginei;

REPPAS: Synhqws, to Koinotiko Dikaio pros to opoio enarmonizetai to diko mas, mesw ths chfishs nomikwn diatajewn, ginetai kai Dikaio ths xwras.

FILHS: H eqnikh platforma, ennow, pws qa chfistei; Apo th Boylh;

REPPAS: O nomos o opoios isxyei, sto prwto toy arqro kiolas, perilambanei sygkekrimenes diatajeis poy problepoyn qemata gi` ayth thn yphresia, gi` ayth th drasthriothta. Efoson krinoyme oti xreiazetai symplhrwsh h tropopoihsh, prokeimenoy na antimetwpisoyme qemata san ayta sta opoia sthn arxh anaferqhka, asfalws mesw diatajhs nomoy qa proxwrhsoyme sthn analogh prosqhkh.

T. MPERMPERAKHS: Qelw na kanw mia erwthsh, den jerw an einai kai toy Press Room, alla tis teleytaies hmeres parakoloyqoyme diafhmiseis kai endiamesa aytwn kapoioys agwnes. Epeidh, omws, oi diafhmiseis katalambanoyn poly megalo xrono kai blepoyme aytes para toys agwnes...

REPPAS: Yparxoyn Kwdikes Deontologias...

T. MPERMPERAKHS: Anaferomai se agwnes mpasket.

REPPAS: Yparxoyn Kwdikes Deontologias, oi opoioi prepei na throyntai, oson afora to xrono poy katalambanoyn oi diafhmiseis se opoiodhpote programma. To Symboylio Radiothleorashs elegxei ayth th diadikasia kai prepei na sas pw oti einai poly aysthro.

GKOGKAS: Yparxei kapoio sxolio ths Kybernhshs gia tis xqesines kataggelies toy k. Gewrgakopoyloy, alla kai toy k. Ebert, gia "mizes" poy dinontai, prokeimenoy na egkriqoyn kapoia anaptyjiaka programmata;

REPPAS: Yparxoyn kapoia stoixeia; An yparxoyn kapoia stoixeia, ajizei na asxolhqoyme emeis kai poly perissotero prepei, kai den ajizei apla, na asxolhqei h Dikaiosynh. Alla, einai dynaton sto plaisio ths antallaghs kapoiwn apocewn -polles fores oi apoceis aytes gnwrizete oti diatypwnontai kai gia politikoys logoys- emeis na kanoyme mia syzhthsh edw shmera, me enan tetoio tropo, o opoios qa moy eititrecete na pw, den einai kai o pleon endedeigmenos, an qeloyme na antimetwpisoyme ta problhmata. An qeloyme na antimetwpisoyme problhmata poy pisteyoyme oti yparxoyn, syllegoyme stoixeia, drasthriopoioymeqa entonws kai epimelws kai proteinoyme lyseis. Aytes oi genikes kathgories, prepei na pw oti den einai idio mias sobarhs kai ypeyqynhs politikhs proseggishs sta problhmata ths xwras. Kai kalo einai na apofeygontai.

MOYRTZHS: Dhladh, mas lete oti o k. Gewrgakopoylos einai asobaros; Giati diatypwse aytos tis kataggelies.

REPPAS: Polles fores eseis bgazete symperasmata ta opoia den einai dika moy. Ayto to opoio apotelei kanona einai o,ti eipa prohgoymenws. Kai ayto to opoio eipa prohgoymenws, den einai para to aytonohto. Pisteyw, loipon, oti otan me sobaro, ypeyqyno tropo, me syllogh stoixeiwn kai me sygkekrimenh anafora se stoixeia, kapoios anaferetai se problhma, tote apodeiknyei oti exei endiaferon na antimetwpistei to problhma. Otan den ginetai me ayto ton tropo h anafora se problhmata, tote to endiaferon -qa moy epitrecete na pw- se megalo baqmo, den einai pragmatiko. Kai ayto to epishmainw. O topos exei anagkh apo lyseis sta problhmata. Diagnwseis, eykola mporei na kanoyn. Oi diagnwseis aytes, omws, otan den periexoyn th gnwsh gia to ti akribws symbainei, syxnotata einai lanqasmenes kai odhgoyn se laqos qerapeia. Kalo, loipon, einai na gnwrizoyme ti symbainei kai me sygkekrimenes qerapeytikes syntages na antimetwpizoyme ta problhmata ekei poy yparxoyn. Den qelw twra na metablhqoyme se filologoys ths politikhs. Qelw na eimaste rizospastes politikoi poy lynoyme problhmata.

KANELLAKHS: Pws sxoliazete thn apopeira dolofonias apo parakratikoys sthn Toyrkia toy Proedroy ths Epitrophs Anqrwpinwn Dikaiwmatwn;

REPPAS: H apopeira ayth deixnei oti sthn Toyrkia yparxoyn mhxanismoi poy thn kratoyn desmia ths aneleyqerias kai toy aytarxismoy. H apopeira enantion toy hgeth yper twn Anqrwpinwn Dikaiwmatwn, den einai plhgma monon gia ton idion, einai plhgma gia th dhmokratia kai ta anqrwpina dikaiwmata poy -opws fainetai- sthn Toyrkia einai ennoies kenes periexomenoy. Tetoia gegonota apoteloyn stigma gia thn epoxh mas.

KANELLAKHS: Sas eixa rwthsei kai prosfata sxetika me thn egkatastash pyrhnikwn antidrasthrwn sthn Toyrkia. Prosfata h Gkrhn-Pis dhmosieyse mia ekqesh gia thn epikindynothta aytwn twn antidrasthrwn. Poia einai h qesh ths Kybernhshs;

REPPAS: Milhsa gia to qema ayto. Gnwrizw tis diamartyries oi opoies diatypwqhkan kai anaferontai sth dynatothta h to endexomeno na dhmioyrghqei ena tetoio ergostasio, me tis opoies synepeies mporei na prokycoyn apo th leitoyrgia toy. Eipa poies energeies exei kanei h Kybernhsh. Parakoloyqoyme ayto to qema. Den exei prokycei kati newtero se sxesh me ta osa eipame thn hmera poy syzhthsame to qema. Me thn eykairia, omws, ths erwthshs sas, prepei na ekfrasw kai pali th qesh ths Kybernhshs mas, oson afora tis dokimes poy eginan sthn India, kai na pw oti prepei na threitai h synqhkh toy Organismoy Hnwmenwn Eqnwn poy problepei thn apagoreysh kai ton periorismo twn pyrhnikwn oplwn, giati h xrhsh toys einai eykolo na dhmioyrghsei terastia problhmata gia thn anqrwpothta. Qa prepei, me ypeyqyno tropo, na antimetwpisoyme kai ayto to qema. H Ellada s' ayta ta qemata exei epideijei idiaiterh eyaisqhsia. Ekfrazoyme th diafwnia mas s' aytes tis prwtoboylies.

MIXAHL: Sas problhmatizei to gegonos oti sthn prospaqeia idiwtikopoihsewn poy exete ejaggeilei, yparxoyn sobares antidraseis apo toys ergazomenoys stoys tomeis poy kaleiste na efarmosete thn idiwtikopoihsh; Einai oi synexomenes apergies stis trapezes, oi diadoxikes apergies argotera, opws ejaggelletai kai oi kinhtopoihseis se alloys kladoys h tomeis poy prokeitai na idiwtikopoihqoyn;

REPPAS: Mas problhmatizei kai mas dysarestei. Giati, oxi mono dyskoleyei thn prospaqeia -ayto, bebaiws, einai kati, alla einai to ligotero- alla kai kyriws giati apodeiknyetai pws kapoioi den exoyn antilhfqei pws einai kai pros to diko toys symferon na symbaloyn s' ayth thn prospaqeia poy kanei h Kybernhsh, afoy h prospaqeia ayth ws kyrio stoixeio ths, metajy twn allwn, periexei th diasfalish ths ergasias twn ergazomenwn. Sto paradeigma ths Ionikhs mporei kapoios na pei oti h antidrash twn ergazomenwn, oxi mono den mas briskei symfwnoys, alla den einai apo th dikh mas pleyra kai eykola ejhghsimh. Epilejame mia lysh, prokeimenoy na diasfalisoyme tis qeseis ergasias twn ypallhlwn ths Ionikhs, enw yphrxe allh protash na proxwrhsoyme se sygxwneysh Emporikhs kai Ionikhs Trapezas, me proypoqesh, omws, thn apolysh 3.500 ypallhlwn. Prokeimenoy na diathrhsoyme aytes tis qeseis ergasias -pragma poy apotelei gia mas ws koinwniko megeqos, ena krithrio to opoio den eprepe na agnohsoyme- epilejame thn pwlhsh ths Ionikhs Trapezas. Ki omws, kapoioi ergazomenoi, oi opoioi exoyn dikaiwma, bebaia, na apergoyn, entos twn nomimwn plaisiwn, efqasan sto shmeio na katalaboyn to Tmhma Mhxanografhshs, ton "egkefalo" ths Trapezas me synepeia na paralysei h Trapeza. Strefontai etsi se baros twn synallassomenwn me thn Trapeza kai oysiastikws epitygxanoyn na meiwsoyn thn ajiopistia ths Trapezas sthn opoia ergazontai. Dhmioyrgoyn ena problhma to opoio telikws einai problhma gia toys idioys, se megalo baqmo. Den einai problhma gia thn Kybernhsh. Ayth h antimetwpish, pragmatika, einai mia dysaresth ejelijh. To epishmainw ayto. Emeis qa proxwrhsoyme sto programma poy exoyme ejaggeilei, giati pisteyoyme oti einai pros to symferon, oxi aplws ths eqnikhs oikonomias, alla kai twn idiwn twn ergazomenwn stoys diaforoys tomeis. Kai prepei to programma ayto, na oloklhrwqei sto problepto mellon, symfwna me to xronodiagramma poy exoyme qesei, giati ayto apaitei to dhmosio symferon.

KIAOS: Poia h logikh ths Kybernhshs otan leei oti me th sygxwneysh Eqnikhs kai Kthmatikhs den apolyontai ypallhloi kai poia h logikh otan leei oti me th sygxwneysh Emporikhs - Ionikhs, apolyontai;

REPPAS: Giati kaqe fora yparxoyn sygkekrimena dedomena ta opoia oi symboyloi ektimoyn. Einai allh dynamh, allos o ogkos kai allh h kefalaiakh bash poy exei to kaqe trapeziko idryma. Den einai ola to idio kai den einai apolytws sygkrisima. Sth mia periptwsh dhmioyrghqhke enas kolossos, o opoios exei th dynatothta na parameinei isxyros kai ston antagwnismo poy einai pro twn pylwn. Sthn allh periptwsh, kriqhke oti den yparxoyn oi eparkeis proypoqeseis, wste to neo sxhma na exei mia isxyrh paroysia sto antagwnistiko periballon kai eprepe na doylecei me allo tropo.

KIAOS: Poia einai ayta ta stoixeia;

REPPAS: Anaferontai me leptomereies sth meleth poy exoyn kanei oi eidikoi symboyloi. Kai einai o ariqmos apasxoloymenwn se kaqe trapeza. Prepei na deite posoys apasxolei h Eqnikh, posoys apasxolei h Kthmatikh, se sxesh me ton kyklo twn ergasiwn toys. Posoys apasxolei h Emporikh, posoys apasxolei h Ionikh se sxesh me ton "tziro" poy kanoyn, sto plaisio twn yphresiwn poy prosferoyn. Prepei na deite, mesa apo tis synergasies aytes, me diaforoys syndyasmoys, an einai biwsima ta sxhmata poy prokyptoyn. Ola ayta ejetazontai me poly prosektiko kai episthmoniko tropo, prokeimenoy na ejaxqoyn symperasmata.

MOYRTHS: Eipate oti epilegontai kapoies lyseis. Yparxei h antistoixh lysh gia thn trapeza Makedonias-Qrakhs kai yparxoyn kataggelies oti den threitai h symfwnia gia th mh apolysh twn ergazomenwn. To gnwrizei h Kybernhsh;

REPPAS: Asfalws. Qa prepei oi desmeyseis poy exoyn analhfqei na throyntai. An exoyn diatypwqei sygkekrimenes kataggelies me stoixeia gia to oti den throyntai oi oroi ths symbashs poy exei syntaxqei, ta armodia organa amesws -an den exoyn kiolas epilhfqei- qa epilhfqoyn gia na antimetwpisoyn ayta ta fainomena. Asfalws einai aparadekto na mhn threitai mia symfwnia, h opoia ypegrafh apo oles tis pleyres, epeidh oles oi pleyres qewrhsan oti wfeloyntai apo ayth th symfwnia.

PETOYRH: Qelw na epanelqw sto qema ths dolofonikhs apopeiras toy Proedroy ths Epitrophs twn Anqrwpinwn Dikaiwmatwn sthn Toyrkia kai na sas rwthsw, an problhmatizei thn ellhnikh Kybernhsh ypo thn ennoia oti ephreazei thn eyrwpaikh proseggish ths Toyrkias kaqws kai to politiko klima sth geitona xwra.

REPPAS: Eipa kai sthn prwth apanthsh oti yparxoyn mhxanismoi sthn Toyrkia poy thn kratoyn prosdemenh se ena plaisio aneleyqerias kai aytarxismoy. Yparxoyn aytoi oi mhxanismoi. Einai mia gkriza dhmokratia h toyrkikh dhmokratia. Kai oi mhxanismoi aytoi nomizw oti spernoyn ton oleqro h tromokratoyn toys polites ths Toyrkias, poy exoyn proodeytikes apoceis h diekdikoyn to dikaiwma na leei kaqenas eleyqera thn opoia apoch toy. Taytoxronws, omws, katorqwnoyn ej antikeimenoy na blaptoyn kai thn Toyrkia. Giati to proswpo ths Toyrkias apexei para poly apo to na einai ena proswpo mias sygxronhs xwras, h opoia filodojei na entaxqei sthn eyrwpaikh oikogeneia. Gi' ayto, loipon, gia to symferon ths idias ths Toyrkias, qa prepei na antimetwpizontai apotelesmatika tetoioi mhxanismoi, tetoies kinhseis oi opoies, epanalambanw, apoteloyn stigma gia thn epoxh mas.

Sas eyxaristw.

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