Greek Government Press Briefing, 11-05-25

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Dieyqynsh Plhroforhshs

Tmhma Dhmosiografikwn Kalycewn

Tetarth, 25 Maioy 2011

Ariqmos Deltioy: 334113536

Ekdosh 1

BRIEFING(250511)

KYBERNHTIKOS EKPROSWPOS

Aqhna, 25 Maioy 2011

GIWRGO PETALWTH

Kalo meshmeri.

Jekinhsame prin apo ena xrono mia terastia prospaqeia palhs, me thn krish toy xreoys alla kai toy dikoy mas kakoy eaytoy, oson afora sta zhthmata ths xwras mas. Palh, me sysswreymena problhmata dekaetiwn, streblwseis kai adynamies toy kratoys, ths oikonomias kai toy paragwgikoy monteloy.

Shmera, ena xrono meta, kataferame na syzhtame gia to mellon ths xwras mas, stekomaste sta podia mas, synexizoyme na yparxoyme, kati poy mono aytonohto den htan perysi tetoia epoxh. Ayto, xarh sthn apofasistikothta ths kybernhshs gia allages, alla kai sthn epimonh kai tis qysies toy ellhnikoy laoy, oi opoies pianoyn topo.

Einai polloi aytoi poy eykola, laikistika kai mhdenistika qewroyn oti apotyxame. Einai aytoi poy elegan oti oi Ellhnes den qa ta kataferoyn. Einai oi idioi poy kai perysi mas eixan synolika jegrammenoys kai ependyan malista poly s' ayto.

Aytoys diaceydoyme kaqhmerina me th megalh eqnikh prospaqeia poy kanoyme. Aytoys qa synexisoyme na diaceydoyme kai sto mellon. Giati akribws oloi kataballoyme titania prospaqeia kai prepei na thn kataballoyme oloi, giati oi qysies twn politwn mas ajiopoioyntai, giati qeloyme na allajoyme kai allazoyme.

Osoi shmera miloyn gia apotyxia, einai aytoi poy foboyntai tis megales allages. Me ayto anametriomaste. Einai aytoi poy epi xronia trefontan apo thn katastash poy epikratoyse. Einai aytoi oi opoioi den eblepan ti ginotan sto parelqon.

Qelw na qymisw, epeidh bgainoyn polloi shmera kai lene gia ton dhmosio tomea, epi N.D., mono to 2009 apoxwrhsan 13.000 dhmosioi ypallhloi kai proselhfqhsan 29.000 dhmosioi ypallhloi. Ayth htan tote h logikh!

Aythn thn arrwsth katastash prospaqoyme na anatrecoyme kaqhmerina edw kai enamish xrono. Kai gi' ayto epimenoyme na zhtame th megalyterh eqnikh synennohsh, eidika se ayto to shmeio poy briskomaste, me ta kommata, tis politikes dynameis, tis ygieis dynameis ths koinwnias mas. Me tis paragwgikes dynameis, poy mexri twra htan egklwbismenes s' enan faylo kyklo anajiokratias kai syntexniwn, me toys idioys toys polites. Exoyme tonisei pws eimaste anoixtoi se realistikes kai kainotomes protaseis ap' opoy kai an proerxontai, poy mporoyn apodedeigmena na symbaloyn sthn poreia ths allaghs ths xwras mas.

Apodeiknyoyme etsi pws h synennohsh se stigmes krishs den einai gia mas pyrotexnhma. Einai pagia kai diarkhs prosklhsh poy epiballetai apo thn ejyphrethsh enos ypertatoy stoxoy toy kratoys, poy einai h idia h epibiwsh toy san kratos.

Qa oloklhrwsw thn eisagwgh moy, legontas kai pali ayta poy dhlwse o Prwqypoyrgos Giwrgos Papandreoy ejerxomenos apo to Proedriko Megaro:

Oti h Ellada mporei. Oi qysies toy ellhnikoy laoy exoyn piasei topo kai synexizoyn na pianoyn. Piasame dynatoys stoxoys, toys opoioys prepei na synexizoyme na pianoyme apo dw kai pera. Einai mia megalh prosklhsh, mia megalh proklhsh. O mhdenismos den odhgei poyqena. To antiqeto. H megalh prospaqeia poy epiballetai na kanoyme oloi mazi, einai ayth poy mas diasfalizei oti oi qysies toy ellhnikoy laoy poy exoyn piasei topo mexri shmera, qa synexisoyn apo dw kai pera na apodidoyn, etsi wste na bgoyme oristika pleon apo thn krish.

Parakalw tis erwthseis sas.

PAPPA: Kyrie Ekproswpe, meta tis xqesines dhmosies topoqethseis twn politikwn arxhgwn, meta th synanthsh me ton Prwqypoyrgo, qewreite oti yparxoyn periqwria synennohshs kai synaineshs;

PETALWTHS: Pantote yparxoyn periqwria. Einai epibeblhmeno na yparxei eqnikh synennohsh. Emeis epimenoyme s' ayto. Kai malista, milame gia mia synennohsh, oxi genikws kai aoristws, alla o idios o Prwqypoyrgos xqes sthn omilia toy ston SEB eqese kai sygkekrimena zhthmata, opoy mporei na yparxoyn koinoi ajones - kai hdh apo mia aplh syzhthsh poy egine xqes me toys politikoys arxhgoys, mporoyme na metrhsoyme arketoys- etsi wste se sygkekrimena qemata na yparxoyn eqnikes synaineseis, etsi wste na yparxei eqnikh synennohsh gia na mporesoyme na jeperasoyme oristika thn krish. Ayto qa prepei na to katanohsoyme oloi. Anejarthta apo to ti leme pros ta ejw, ekeino poy einai sigoyro einai oti periqwria yparxoyn, alla den yparxei kanena periqwrio toy na mhn katanohsoyme epiteloys se poso krisimh katastash einai h xwra kai poso krisimos einai o rolos twn politikwn dynamewn. Ekei pragmatika den yparxei kanena periqwrio. Elpizoyme oti ayth h katanohsh yparxei. Kai elpizoyme oti ayth h prosklhsh poy apeyqynei h kybernhsh olo ayto to diasthma, alla idiaiterws ayth thn epoxh pros tis politikes dynameis, qa ginei dekth, etsi wste oloi na synaisqanqoyn ton rolo poy exei kaqenas kai thn terastia eyqynh poy exoyme apenanti se mia xwra, apenanti se enan lao, ston ellhniko lao, o opoios brisketai antimetwpos me to fasma mias prwtofanoys krishs, olo to teleytaio diasthma.

MPEKA: Giati o Prwqypoyrgos, twra poy fqasame sto adiejodo, zhta synainesh kai den zhtoyse perysi th synennohsh me toys politikoys arxhgoys, prin ypogracei to mnhmonio, opws egine prosfata kai me toys Portogaloys;

PETALWTHS: Prwta ap' ola, oi Portogaloi, briskontai se mia proeklogikh katastash. Yparxei mia metabatikh kybernhsh kai makari thn eyqynh kai thn ypeyqynothta poy deixnoyn oi politikes toys dynameis na thn deixname ki emeis, gia na katanohsoyme kai to poy briskomaste kai poso ypeyqynoi eimaste apenanti ston ellhniko lao. Emeis, thn prosklhsh gia synainesh thn apeyqyname apo thn prwth stigmh poy analabame thn kybernhsh ths xwras, otan den eixe jediplwqei to megeqos ths krishs poy exoyme na antimetwpisoyme kai otan yphrxe kai mia meteklogikh eyforia poy qa mporoysame na deijoyme mia symperifora, h opoia kaqe allo para symperifora synaineshs qa mporoyse na htan. Par' ola ayta, emeis, apo thn prwth stigmh apeyqynoyme ekklhsh gia synainesh. Giati akribws ayth einai h antilhch toy PASOK, ayth einai h proswpikh antilhch toy Prwqypoyrgoy, toy Giwrgoy Papandreoy. Alla an kapote htan aplws mia qewrhtikh antilhch, twra, to teleytaio diasthma, einai entonotata apaitoymeno na yparxei eqnikh synennohsh. Gia na dwsoyme mia eikona, oxi mono stoys etairoys mas, alla kai stoys polites, toys opoioys kaloyme na epwmisqoyn sygkekrimenes qysies, oti oi politikes dynameis sysswmes, antilambanontai to poy briskomaste. Osoi apodeiknyoyn me tis prajeis toys oti antilambanontai, ayto einai qetiko gia oloys mas. Osoi omws apodeiknyoyn oti den antilambanontai thn poly megalh eyqynh poy exoyme oloi mas, me ton rolo poy exei kaqenas apenanti ston ellhniko lao, e, tote qa prepei na apologhqoyn apenanti ston ellhniko lao me ton tropo poy oi idioi pisteyoyn oti prepei na to kanoyn. Emeis, omws, thn eqnikh synennohsh thn qewroyme ws epibeblhmenh, akomh kai shmera. Kai malista, otan dinoyme kai toys ajones oti pragmatika yparxoyn poly megala pedia eqnikhs synennohshs, poly-poly sygkekrimena.

MPEKA: To kanete mono gia thn eikona sas ayto h to kanete giati blepete oti ayth th stigmh den sas bgainei to sxedio drashs;

PETALWTHS: Oxi. Emeis dhlwnoyme oti polloi apo toys stoxoys mas einai petyxhmenoi. Ayto einai jekaqaro. Den mas endiaferei h eikona mas. Mas endiaferei na antilhfqoyn oloi to megeqos ths eyqynhs toys. Kai otan to antilhfqoyn, tote pragmatika qa diasfalizoyme kai to mellon ths xwras mas. Mas endiaferei h sigoyria toy Ellhna polith kai ayto gia mas einai to megalo zhtoymeno.

GIANNITSHS: Einai stis skeceis ths kybernhshs na qesei to mesoproqesmo sthn krish toy ellhnikoy laoy, me th morfh dhmochfismatos;

PETALWTHS: To mesoproqesmo akoloyqei th diadikasia ths koinoboyleytikhs chfishs kai se ena megalo meros toy kai s' ena poly sygkekrimeno plaisio, exei hdh yparjei syzhthsh sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio. Emeis akoloyqoyme tis koinoboyleytikes diadikasies, me o,ti synepagetai ayto kai qa chfistei etsi opws orizetai apo to Syntagma kai toys Nomoys.

Alla, oson afora sto dhmochfisma, epeidh ginetai kai pollh koybenta aytes tis meres, na ypenqymisw oti einai pagia kai gnwsth apo palia h qesh toy Prwqypoyrgoy, toy Giwrgoy Papandreoy, gia ta dhmochfismata kai teleytaia fora ayth ekfrasqhke kai sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio. Ayto einai jekaqaro. Den shmainei omws, oti yparxei sygkekrimenh skech kai sygkekrimenos sxediasmos gia kapoio dhmochfisma. Emas, epanalambanw, kyrio melhma mas einai h oloklhrwsh twn diergasiwn gia to mesoproqesmo sxedio, poy einai to ameso bhma to opoio kanoyme pros thn ejodo apo thn krish, h ejasfalish toy mellontos ths xwras mas mesa sthn eyrwzwnh kai kyriws h asfaleia toy Ellhna polith, thn opoia exoyme ypoxrewsh oloi mas na diafylajoyme ws korh ofqalmoy.

SIDERHS: O kyrios Prwqypoyrgos einai yper ths diaboyleyshs kai twn dhmochfismatwn. Profanws, einai gia qemata deytereyoyshs shmasias, enw gia qemata sta opoia zhtei th synainesh twn politwn, den toys dinei th dynatothta na ekfrastoyn mesw enos dhmochfismatos.

PETALWTHS: Gia poia ennoeite oti den dinei th dynatothta; Egw sas eipa prohgoymenws kai epanalambanw oti yparxei mia pagia qesh toy Prwqypoyrgoy kai fysika den yparxei sxediasmos gia dhmochfisma. Eseis, den katalaba, ti ennoeite;

SIDERHS: Ennow oti einai meizon qema. Kai s' ayto den qa eprepe na kanei dhmochfisma o Prwqypoyrgos;

PETALWTHS: Se poio;

SIDERHS: Gia to mnhmonio, gia th synexish toy mnhmonioy.

PETALWTHS: To mnhmonio einai mia daneiakh symbash poy egine ypo ektaktes synqhkes. Fysika eixame thn ypoxrewsh na diafylajoyme mia diadikasia stenh, grhgorh kai thn pio asfalh ws pros thn apotelesmatikothta ths, me mia diapragmateysh poy ejantlhse ola ta oria poy eixame ws xwra na to kanoyme. Kai fysika, ayto epanalambanw kai ayth th stigmh, epeidh legetai poly eykola oti to mnhmonio apetyxe: Ma, to oti briskomaste shmera edw, na milame gia th synexish ayths ths prospaqeias, me oloys toys kindynoys h opoia enexei, ean den htan to mnhmonio, epanalambanw, den qa briskomastan edw na milame gia th synexish mias poly megalhs prospaqeias poy kanoyme. Kai yparxei mia sxetikh asfaleia, to oti ftasame mexri edw.

SIDERHS: Se mia ypoqesh ergasias, ean pame se allo mnhmonio, epeidh qa zhthqoyn prosqeta metra, den qa htan epibeblhmeno na ginei ena dhmochfisma, wste na apofasisei o laos ean qelei na ta ypostei h na exei mia diaforetikh ekfrash kai poreia;

PETALWTHS: Politika, briskomaste se ena poly krisimo stadio. Kai fysika den mporoyme na milame me ypoqeseis ergasias. Emeis kanoyme prajeis. Kai epanalambanw, to kyrio melhma mas einai na proxwrhsei ayto to mesoproqesmo strathgiko sxedio, na diasfalisoyme to mellon ths xwras mesa sthn eyrwzwnh kai th sigoyria toy Ellhna polith. Ayth einai h proklhsh mas kai ayto einai to megalo kaqhkon mas shmera.

MPELEGRHS: ...gia ta dhmochfismata;

PETALWTHS: Oson afora ta dhmochfismata, o Prwqypoyrgos exei topoqethqei pagia, sto plaisio mias megalhs diaboyleyshs, oti opoy xreiazontai eyryteres kai pio ameses synaineseis apo ton ellhniko lao, tote mporoyme na prosfeygoyme se dhmochfismata. Einai alhqeia oti den yparxei koyltoyra dhmochfismatwn sthn ellhnikh koinwnia kai thn politikh skhnh. Ayto, omws, den shmainei oti den mporoyme na exoyme mia apoch. Epanalambanw, omws, oti ayto den shmainei - ennoeitai - oti yparxei sxedio, skech kai apofash gia kapoio dhmochfisma.

MIXAHL: Edw yparxei mia antifash kai qa sas parakaloysa, an exete thn kalosynh, dieykriniste to, gia na mhn yparxoyn parermhneies. Apo th mia mas lete oti den yparxei kamia skech na kanoyme dhmochfisma. Apo thn allh mas lete oti einai gnwstes oi apoceis toy Prwqypoyrgoy peri dhmochfismatos. Opws antilambaneste ayto dhmioyrgei mia sygxysh, dioti an den yparxei tetoia skech, poios o logos na mas ypomnhsete th qesh toy Prwqypoyrgoy. Ean qelete na mas ypomnhsete th qesh toy Prwqypoyrgoy peri dhmochfismatos, tote pws den yparxei skech; Den ejhgoyntai logika.

PETALWTHS: Den yparxei sygkekrimenh skech gia sygkekrimeno dhmochfisma kai fysika den yparxei kai apofash. Oi qeseis toy Prwqypoyrgoy paramenoyn, einai pagies, alla to na milhsoyme gia ena sygkekrimeno dhmochfisma xreiazetai polles diadikasies, xreiazetai epejergasia. Fysika, den einai kati to opoio mporei na einai ameso kai poly eykola apofasismeno. Den yparxei kamia antifash.

MIXAHL: Me ton Proedro ths Dhmokratias, epeidh empleketai kai aytos sth diadikasia toy dhmochfismatos, egine sxetikh syzhthsh;

PETALWTHS: Oi dhlwseis kai toy Proedroy ths Dhmokratias kai toy Prwqypoyrgoy htan dhmosies. Ayto, omws, den shmainei -epeidh jerw pws qa ermhneyqei- oti lew pws egine kati tetoio.

MIXAHL: Apo xqes, meta th synanthsh me toys politikoys arxhgoys kai me dedomenes tis qeseis poy ejefrasan oi politikoi arxhgoi, exei enisxyqei ena senario to opoio trofodoteitai kai apo to ejwteriko kai apo to eswteriko, oti o k. Papandreoy prokeitai na prosfygei sth laikh etymhgoria, koinws na kanei ekloges...

PETALWTHS: Gia allh mia fora. Egw ayto to senario to akoyw pente fores thn hmera perissotero apo ena xrono toylaxiston.

MIXAHL: Egw, loipon, lew, se ayth thn krisimh sygkyria, me ayto to programma poy antimetwpizei kai koinwnikh antidrash kai thn elleich symfwnias apo tis koinwnikes dynameis. Einai stoys sxediasmoys sas h prosfygh stis kalpes;

PETALWTHS: Ennoeitai oti den yparxei tetoia skech. Pera apo to eykolo mikropolitiko paixnidi poy paizoyn kapoioi, mas endiaferei kai eimaste epifortismenoi me to barytato kaqhkon na diasfalisoyme to mellon ths xwras. Ara, ta ``paixnidia'' kai ta ``paixnidakia'' aforoyn alloys. Epanalambanw oti diabazoyme kai akoyme ayto to senario para polles fores thn hmera, apo egxwrioys kai jenoys ``parathrhtes'', nomizw oti aytos o oros qa prepei na xrhsimopoieitai. Einai ena senario poy to aporriptoyme. Ws kybernhsh exoyme maqei edw kai 18 mhnes na politeyomaste me poly dyskoles kai sklhres synqhkes. Ennoeitai oti den qa akoloyqhsoyme th syntagh ths N.D., na lipotakthsoyme otan to mellon ths xwras epiballei na meinoyme staqeroi kai proshlwmenoi stoys stoxoys mas.

PIKOYLAS: Ap`ola ta ranteboy xqes me ton Prwqypoyrgo, oloi oi politikoi arxhgoi htan kata twn forologikwn metrwn. Akoma kai shmera, o Proedros ths Dhmokratias yponohse oti den prepei oi xamhlomisqoi kai oi xamhlosyntajioyxoi na ypostoyn kai alla barh apo ta forologika metra. Yparxei kapoia skech na ta parete pisw; Kai telika, den einai sth skech sas to dhmochfisma, epeidh ta politika kommata ekfrazoyn olh thn koinwnia kai o Proedros ths Dhmokratias, mhpws aisqaneste oti mesa apo ena dhmochfisma qa yparjei rapisma ths politikhs sas;

PETALWTHS: Den yparxoyn tetoies skeceis. Ayto poy mas endiaferei, einai na mporesoyme na epibiwsoyme ws xwra, na meiwsoyme to terastio xreos kai ta elleimmata poy exoyme. Kai gi` ayto, akribws, lambanoyme oles aytes tis apofaseis, etsi opws paroysiasthkan sto mesoproqesmo kai sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio, poy bebaia pros ta ejw polles ap` aytes diogkwnontai. Shmera, gia paradeigma, opws kai xqes, parolo oti yphrje anakoinwsh apo to ypoyrgeio Oikonomikwn, eblepa ypologismoys apo sygkekrimena kanalia gia to poso qa epibarynqei to kalaqi ths noikokyras, otan to idio to ypoyrgeio Oikonomikwn exei ekdwsei anakoinwsh, oti ola ayta poy legontai kai grafontai einai senaria. Fysika, mexri stigmhs exoyn yparjei oi genikes kateyqynseis, alla to na leme oti ola qa pane ston ychlo syntelesth FPA 23%, einai kai parakindyneymeno kai den prokeitai na ginei kati tetoio. Synepws, as meinoyme mexri to shmeio poy milaei h kybernhsh kai milaei tekmhriwmena. Fysika, to oti den prepei na yparjei forologikh epibarynsh einai ena zhthma poly geniko, poly qewrhtiko kai polles fores eyxaristo na akoygetai. O idios o Prwqypoyrgos exei pei oti gi` ayto akribws emeis frontizoyme kai parallhla zhtame enallaktikes protaseis isodynamwn metrwn poy ta kommata ths antipoliteyshs apo to na katakrinoyn aplws ta forologika metra, qa prepei na staqoyn ypeyqyna kai na proteinoyn sygkekrimenes enallaktikes kai isodynames protaseis, kati poy mexri stigmhs den exoyme dei ws pros ta forologika. Omws emeis synexizoyme na tis perimenoyme. Kai fysika, ws pros toys adynamoys polites poy poly swsta o Proedros ths Dhmokratias eqese ayto to zhthma, o Prwqypoyrgos dhlwse kai to janaqymizw oti apo to fasma ths xreokopias poy qa mporoyse na epelqei ean akribws den hmastan toso apofasistikoi, oi prwtoi poy qa plhttontan einai akribws oi adynamoi sympolites mas. Kai ayto, nomizw, einai katanohto, giati ean kati den paei kala sth xwra mas, oi exontes megala eisodhmata, sigoyra, einai aytoi poy qa plhgoyn ligotero, enw oi adynamoi polites einai aytoi poy qa plhgoyn apo kati tetoio. Kai to fasma ths xreokopias to fernei pio konta h adraneia kai h adynamia protasewn, opws ekanan palaiotera alles kybernhseis. Oso mporoyme kai eimaste apofasistikoi, tolmhroi kai tekmhriwmenoi ws pros tis protaseis mas. Kai to metro ths koinwnikhs dikaiosynhs to metrame para poly, parolo poy polles apofaseis, polles fores einai epwdynes- tote oi idioi oi adynamoi sympolites mas den kindyneyoyn apo kati tetoio.

PIKOYLAS: Hqela na rwthsw kai kati allo: O ypoyrgos Oikonomikwn, se prosfath thleoptikh synenteyjh toy, eipe oti an den paroyme thn pempth dosh, qa yparjei xreokopia kai qa katebasoyme rola. Enw palaiotera akoygame dhlwseis oti apofygame th xreokopia perysi me thn ypografh toy mnhmonioy, twra janaerxetai sto proskhnio to xarti ths xreokopias, ws meso foboy twn politwn, kata th dikh moy aisqhsh. Ti akribws symbainei; Giati jana arxizoyme kai milame gia xreokopia;

PETALWTHS: Prwta ap` ola, kaneis den eixe pei oti perasame thn krish. Oses dhlwseis kai an ginontan, akomh kai pio aisiodojes ap` o,ti isws qa epetrepan oi synqhkes, kaneis den eipe oti jeperasame thn krish. Alla, ayto poy legame synexeia, einai oti briskomastan mesopelaga, oti exoyme akomh poly xrono mprosta mas kai poly megales apofaseis na paroyme, etsi wste h xwra na bgei apo thn krish. Ejalloy kai mesa sto mnhmonio, dhladh to programma to opoio efarmozoyme, o xronos poy arxizei na perna h krish einai to 2012. Fysika, apo ekei kai pera, epanalambanw gia mia akomh fora: As qymhqoyme oti yparxei ena eyrwpaiko kai dieqnes reysto oikonomiko kai politiko pedio, den yparxei asfaleia kai sigoyria se tipota. H monh asfaleia kai sigoyria einai na prospaqoyme kaqe mera na ginomaste olo kai pio apofasistikoi kai na efarmozoyme tis apofaseis mas. Ayth einai h monh syntagh gia na jeperasoyme, pragmatika, thn krish. H krish, safws kai den exei perasei. To na leme oti eimaste antimetwpoi me to fasma ths xreokopias, den einai kindynologia. Aplws, o ypoyrgos Oikonomikwn aneptyje mia pragmatikothta, oti ean den paroyme sygkekrimenes apofaseis, ean den sxediazame kai den ylopoihsoyme ayto to mesoproqesmo, tote pragmatika qa odhgoymastan sth xreokopia. Epeidh, omws, emeis kai parembaseis kai megales diarqrwtikes allages sxediazoyme, kai thn pempth dosh toy daneioy exoyme epixeirhmata kai prospaqoyme kai eimaste aisiodojoi oti qa thn paroyme, giati akribws exoyme na deijoyme mia poly sygkekrimenh doyleia, tote oso ta kanoyme ayta, toso apomakrynetai to fasma ths xreokopias, mias kai zoyme se mia poly reysth periodo. Omws, ayto den shmainei me tipota - kai fysika den eipe kati tetoio o ypoyrgos Oikonomikwn - oti exei apotyxei ayto to mnhmonio kai ayto to programma sto opoio proxwrame. Kai opws eipa sthn eisagwgh moy, epeidh polloi areskontai na lene pws ``apetyxe to mnhmonio'' kai ``einai mia apotyxhmenh politikh'', oloi aytoi jexnoyn ti qa ginotan ean den yphrxe to mnhmonio. Qa stamatoysame, perysi to Maio, na exoyme misqoys kai syntajeis. Ayto den einai tromokrathsh kai fysika, den einai kindynologia. Einai mia pragmatikothta. H krish einai akoma mprosta mas. Oi proklhseis kai h adhrith anagkh na pairnoyme tolmhres kai gennaies apofaseis kai na tis ylopoioyme, einai akoma mprosta mas, yparxei mellon. Omws, den qa prepei na apogohteyomaste. Qa prepei na eimaste realistes. Kai pragmati thn krish me ola ayta, qa thn jeperasoyme. Fysika, proypoqesh einai na kanoyme ola osa prepei na kanoyme. Ayto eipe kai o ypoyrgos Oikonomikwn.

GARGALAKOS: Kyrie ypoyrge, akoyme, qa elege kaneis, mia akatasxeth metrologia, sxetika me diafora xaratsia poy qa pesoyn panw stis plates toy ellhnikoy laoy. Kai enqymoymai oti eixate pei pws den qa yparjoyn metra poy qa plhjoyn misqwtoys kai syntajioyxoys. Omws, ola ayta poy diabazoyme kai akoyme gyrw apo ta nea forologika metra, plhttoyn, ek twn pragmatwn, misqwtoys kai syntajioyxoys. Ti ginetai akribws; Telika, poia isxyoyn kai poia oxi;

PETALWTHS: Prwta ap` ola, eixame pei oti den qa yparjoyn orizonties meiwseis se misqoys kai syntajeis. Kai ayto pragmatika to kanoyme. Ayth einai h pragmatikothta. Ayto qa efarmosoyme me to mesoproqesmo. Apo ekei kai pera, sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio, egkriqhke kai apofasisthke ena Mesoproqesmo Strathgiko Sxedio se ena sygkekrimeno plaisio, to opoio kai doqhke sth dhmosiothta. H ejeidikeysh twn forologikwn metrwn poy emperiexontai s` ayto qa ginei. Den exoyn apofasisqei ola ayta ta opoia akoyme kai diabazoyme oles aytes tis meres. Qa prepei na perimenoyme thn oloklhrwsh aytoy toy programmatos gia na bgaloyme kai ta symperasmata mas. Alla, kalo qa einai, mexri tote, na stamathsoyme pragmatika na bombardizoyme ton kosmo me lejeis opws ``forokataigida'', ``forosok'', ``sok kai deos'' kai ola ta synafh. Kai an pragmatika o ellhnikos laos yfistatai qysies kai epwdynes, polles fores, apofaseis - kai ayth einai mia pragmatikothta poy oyte krybetai, oyte mporoyme na thn krycoyme, giati emeis eimaste realistes kai apotypwnoyme thn alhqeia - qa prepei ola osa leme na bgainoyn pragmatika se prwto plano kai oxi mono oi ``foroi'', oi ``meiwseis'' klp, polla apo ta opoia, polles fores, einai anypostata. Kaneis, gia paradeigma, den bghke na pei ti shmainei h efarmogh enos gennaioy programmatos apokratikopoihsewn, enos gennaioy programmatos ajiopoihshs ths dhmosias perioysias, poy pera apo ta poly megala esoda poy qa apoferei, apo th mia qa symbalei oysiastika sth meiwsh toy xreoys kai apo thn allh qa apobei mia megalh anaptyjiakh prospaqeia me thn proselkysh idiwtikwn kefalaiwn, me qeseis ergasias, me qetiko proshmo anaptyjhs stis arxes toy 2012, me tis ejagwges mas na ayjanontai, me ton toyrismo na exei prwtofanh, gia ta teleytaia xronia, stoixeia beltiwshs. Ola ayta qa prepei na ta bgazoyme pros ta ejw, na mhn ta apokryptoyme eskemmena kai na stamathsoyme na bombardizoyme ton kosmo me mia aperanth tromokratia, xwris fysika na isxyrizomaste oti polles apo tis apofaseis poy pairnoyme den einai epwdynes h den einai pragmatika kostobores gia ton Ellhna polith. Epomenws, ta osa legontai kai grafontai, sthn pleionothta toys, den antapokrinontai sthn alhqeia, opws paroysiazontai. Kai en pash periptwsei, as perimenoyme na doyme ejeidikeymena ta metra gia tis apofaseis kai as krinoyme tote, opws eimaste ypoxrewmenoi na krinoyme, ti pragmatika qa ypostei kai ti qa kerdisei o Ellhnas poliths.

MIXAHL: Ep` aytoy: Osa dhmosieyoyn efhmerides kai osa lene thleoptikoi staqmoi, qewreite oti einai prosxhma gia kritikh enantion ths kybernhshs;

PETALWTHS: H synwmosiologia den einai xarakthristiko mas, giati exoyme na antimetwpisoyme pragmatika kai realistika problhmata. Milhsa gia tis yperboles poy bgainoyn pros ta ejw polles fores kai oi opoies adikoyn, oxi mono thn prospaqeia ths kybernhshs, alla kai th megalh prospaqeia poy kanei o ellhnikos laos.

ZAFEIRIADOY: Kyrie Ekproswpe, hqela na sas rwthsw, ean yparxei apo opoiadhpote pleyra, entos h ektos ths xwras, an tiqetai ws epilogh h ejodos ths xwras apo to eyrw, anejarthta apo to poios qa parei thn apofash, an qa einai mia kybernhsh, polla kommata h o laos.

PETALWTHS: Gia ejodo apo to eyrw kai thn eyrwzwnh; Ayto qa htan poly megalo xtyphma gia to mellon ths xwras mas. Emeis leme oti dinoyme ton agwna mas, akribws gi` ayto: Gia na mhn kindyneysei h xwra mas, gia na mhn kyriarxhsoyn alla senaria, ta opoia einai senaria ypobaqmishs ths zwhs toy Ellhna polith. Kai senaria, ta opoia qa parameinoyn senaria, giati akribws - kai ekei eyelpistoyme - yparxei mia kybernhsh poy pairnei apofaseis kai enas ellhnikos laos poy einai poly wrimos kai mporei pragmatika na kanei tis epiloges toy se tetoio shmeio kai se tetoio baqmo, wste na diasfalizetai h asfaleia toy kai to mellon toy.

ZAFEIRIADOY: Sygnwmh, alla ayto akribws rwthsa, ean yparxei periptwsh na klhqei o laos na epilejei ean qelei na meinei sto eyrw h oxi, paroti einai wrimos gia na apofasisei to swsto, an oloi symfwnoyme edw mesa, poio einai to swsto.

PETALWTHS: Apo mas den yparxei tetoia skech kai tetoia piqanothta.

KEXAGIA: Qa hqela na epanelqw sth synanthsh toy Prwqypoyrgoy me ton Proedro ths Dhmokratias kai na sas rwthsw kai pali, ean o Prwqypoyrgos eqese to zhthma dienergeias dhmochfismatos, estw kai qewrhtika, enwpion toy Proedroy ths Dhmokratias. Kai kata th gnwmh sas, pws na ermhneysoyme th dhlwsh toy k. Prwqypoyrgoy oti tis apofaseis poy qelei na ylopoihsei h kybernhsh, qelei na tis ejasfalisei me th synainesh kai bebaiws toy ellhnikoy laoy.

PETALWTHS: O Prwqypoyrgos, proserxomenos ston Proedro ths Dhmokratias ejefrase dhmosiws tis qeseis toy poy sas einai gnwstes kai sygxronws ton enhmerwse gia ta apotelesmata twn synanthsewn poy eixe me toys politikoys arxhgoys. Ayto einai to periexomeno ths synanthshs toy Prwqypoyrgoy me ton Proedro ths Dhmokratias.

PAPPA: Qema dhmochfismatos yparxei gia thn kybernhsh; Giati oi plhrofories lene oti o Prwqypoyrgos eixe anaferei kati gia dhmochfisma sto teleytaio Ypoyrgiko Symboylio.

PETALWTHS: Ontws. Ayto poy exw pei gia to dhmochfisma, einai oti yparxei mia pagia kai diarkhs qesh apo palia ekfrasmenh apo ton Prwqypoyrgo gia ta dhmochfismata. Mia qesh, h opoia, fysika, paramenei ws qesh kai me pio prosfath thn anafora poy ekane sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio. Omws, ayto den shmainei pws yparxei sygkekrimenh skech kai sygkekrimenh apofash gia kapoio dhmochfisma. Epanalambanw oti diko mas kyrio kai monadiko, ayth th stigmh, melhma einai na proxwrhsei h xwra sthn chfish toy Mesoproqesmoy Strathgikoy Sxedioy, to opoio dinei polles diejodoys s` ayth thn poly dyskolh katastash poy biwnoyme, na synexistei h diasfalish toy mellontos ths xwras mesa sthn eyrwzwnh kai na yparxei asfaleia ston Ellhna polith, poy einai to poly megalo kai to teliko zhtoymeno gia oloys mas.

MPEKA: Pws krinete thn protash poy egine xqes apo ton k. Daskalopoylo ston SEB, sxetika me to dhmochfisma;

PETALWTHS: O k. Daskalopoylos ejefrase mia apoch. Egw sas eipa thn apoch toy Prwqypoyrgoy, h opoia einai pagia kai ekfrasmenh. Oi apoceis poy ekfrazontai apo paragwgikoys foreis, einai poly endiaferoyses, tis syzhtame kai tis entassoyme sto programma mas otan prepei. Pisteyoyme oti einai konta kai me th filosofia mas, alla kai me thn telikh mas stoxeysh. Apo thn pleyra toy Prwqypoyrgoy den yphrxe kapoia aporriptikh skech se ayto poy proteine o k. Daskalopoylos. H apoch mas, omws, einai aytotelhs kai ekfrasmenh.

PIKOYLAS: Xqes, o k. Karatzaferhs eipe oti o Prwqypoyrgos den aperrice thn protash toy gia syneyqynh. Ayto na mas proideazei oti yparxei skech sthn kybernhsh kai gia kybernhsh synergasias me ton k. Karatzaferh, alla kai me thn allh proqymh thn ka Mpakogiannh;

PETALWTHS: H kyria Mpakogiannh to eipe ayto;

PIKOYLAS: Oxi, o k. Karatzaferhs. Alla kai h kyria Mpakogiannh den fainetai na mhn einai proqymh...

PETALWTHS: Meta apo enan gyro sobarwn syzhthsewn, den qa mporoysa na sxoliasw tis dhlwseis twn politikwn arxhgwn. Emeis eimaste jekaqaroi. Milame gia eqnikh synennohsh kai fysika oxi gia kybernhseis synergasias. Yparxei isxyrh kybernhsh, me isxyres boylhseis, poy apodeiknyei kaqhmerina. Boylhsh mas einai na bgaloyme th xwra mas apo thn krish. To qema ths synaineshs kai ths synennohshs to exoyme ejhghsei para polles fores. Safws kai den milame gia kybernhtikh synergasia. Ayto einai jekaqaro. Alla oyte kan ejantloyme se mia chfoforia thn synainesh kai th synennohsh. Den milame gia synainesh se mia chfoforia sth Boylh. H synainesh kai h synennohsh qa prepei na ekfrazontai kaqhmerina me sygkekrimenes prajeis. Ean oi politikes dynameis ennooyn ayth thn ypeyqynh stash ths synennohshs, mporoyn apo mones toys na broyn tropo na to deixnoyn kai na to apodeiknyoyn kaqhmerina.

GIANNISHS: Qa moy epitrecete na epanelqw sto qema toy dhmochfismatos. Apo thn teleytaia sas apanthsh se sxesh me thn protash toy k. Daskalopoyloy, ayto poy endexomenws qa mporoysame na ermhneysoyme einai oti ypo alles synqhkes, ean htan wrimes, o Prwqypoyrgos qa proekrine th dienergeia dhmochfismatos, alla aplws ayth th stigmh einai tetoia h sygkyria, poy to kaqistoyn apagoreytiko;

PETALWTHS: Epanalambanw ayto poy eipa prohgoymenws: Den yparxei prohgoymeno. Sthn mexri twra politikh mas zwh, den exoyme koyltoyra dhmochfismatwn. Einai kati poly shmantiko, qelei poly megalh epejergasia kai skech kai fysika ayth th stigmh den yparxei tetoia skech. Ayto einai aytoteles kai den exei sxesh me ton k. Daskalopoylo. To lew ayto giati o k. Daskalopoylos exei mia sygkekrimenh protash. Egw epanelaba oti den thn aporricame, dioti akribws yparxei mia protash, yparxei mia pagia qesh toy Prwqypoyrgoy ws pros ta dhmochfismata kai fysika ejartatai apo to pws ennoei kaqenas to dhmochfisma, me ti erwthmata, me poio stoxo. Einai para poly shmantiko. Yparxei mia seira parametrwn poy qa mporoysan na prosdiorisoyn kati tetoio. Omws, ayth th stigmh den yparxei logos gia mia tetoia syzhthsh.

MPELEGRHS: Epeidh aporriptete thn apotyxia toy mnhmonioy, tiqetai kai ena allo zhthma. Mhpws apetyxe h efarmogh toy mnhmonioy; Dhladh qelw na pw oti otan ypegrafh prin ena xrono to mnhmonio den problepontan ek neoy metra opws qa perilambanei, opws diabazoyme toylaxiston, to mesoproqesmo oyte qa etiqeto an qa paroyme thn 5h dosh. Dhladh o k. Papakwnstantinoy to na bgainei na leei oti h xwra kindyneyei na katebasei rola, shmainei oti tiqetai qema an qa paroyme thn 5h dosh h oxi. Giati tiqetai ayto to qema, an ola exoyn paei kala;

PETALWTHS: Kaneis den eipe oti ola exoyn paei kala. Exw pei oti einai poly reysto to periballon poy politeyomaste. Oi oikonomikes epiteyjeis twn stoxwn den exoyn na kanoyn mono me to ti kanoyme emeis, alla genikws me to ti periballon yparxei sthn Eyrwph kai pagkosmiws. O k. Papakwnstantinoy exei ejhghsei giati kapoioi stoxoi den phgan kala kai yparxei apoklish. Anefere sygkekrimena oti logw ths yfeshs h opoia den htan h anamenomenh, kapoia oikonomika stoixeia den leitoyrghsan opws perimename na leitoyrghsoyn. Apo ekei kai pera omws, einai gnwsto oti kaqe fora prin thn katabolh ths doshs pername enan elegxo apo toys daneistes mas, apo thn troika, oi opoioi elegxoyn thn mexri twra poreia mas. Ep' eykairia toy elegxoy antimetwpizoyme kaqe fora kai thn dikh mas krish apenanti ston eayto mas, gia to poso petyxainoyn oi stoxoi poy qesame kai ean kapoioi stoxoi exoyn apoklinei eite poly, eite ligo, ayto den shmainei oti apetyxe synolika to mnhmonio. As mhn jexname oti ews twra exoyme parei 4 megales doseis apo to daneio poy synacame pragma poy shmainei oti h troika ajiologhse qetika tis mexri twra prospaqeies mas kai synexizoyme na efarmozoyme tis apofaseis mas. Kai an twra ginetai ayth h prospaqeia gia na paroyme thn 5h dosh, to idio qa ginetai kai gia thn 6h kai gia tis ypoloipes doseis. To oti yparxei mia megalyterh kinhtikothta ayth thn fora kai mia amfibolia gia thn katabolh ths 5hs doshs, ayto den shmainei oti exei apotyxei to mnhmonio. Einai megeqh poy prospaqoyme na petyxoyme. Gnwrizoyme para poly kala oti h xwra mas brisketai se poly dyskolo shmeio kai ayth h maxh ginetai kaqe fora poy ajiologoymaste kaqe fora poy erxomaste na paroyme apofaseis. Alla to symplhrwma twn apofasewn qewrhqhke epibeblhmeno gia na mporesoyme na bgoyme apo thn krish. Den leme oti den yphrxan astoxies kai paraleiceis, alla den mporoyme na poyme oti to periballon htan staqero kai ara kati den kaname kala emeis.

MPELEGRHS: Gia tis paraleiceis kai tis astoxies, qa anazhthqoyn kapoies eyqynes. Dhladh, ap' o,ti jeroyme sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio teqhke qema kai aytokritikhs apo sygkekrimena melh toy. Qa kanei kati tetoio h kybernhsh; Qa apodwsei kapoies eyqynes;

PETALWTHS: Thn aytokritikh thn kanoyme oytws h allws, alla dexomaste kai thn krish twn Ellhnwn politwn kaqe mera, etsi wste na blepoyme ki emeis thn poreia mas kai ton dromo poy exoyme parei. To na apodoqoyn eyqynes gia kapoies astoxies h kapoies kaqysterhseis, einai poly megalh koybenta. Giati qa prepei kaneis na analogistei oti oloi aytoi oi ypoyrgoi poy exoyn kyriws to baros kai thn eyqynh toy na ``trexoyn'' ta programmata eite einai oikonomika eite anaptyjiaka - kai den einai qema enos monon ypoyrgeioy, giati h anaptyjh ginetai se polla ypoyrgeia - qa prepei na analogistei kaneis ti exoyn kanei olo ayto to diasthma, ypo poly sklhres synqhkes kai prwtofaneis gia th xwra mas kai gia thn Eyrwph. Ara, to na eimaste monodiastatoi kai na milame monon gia eyqynes, sigoyra adikei thn prospaqeia olwn osoi doyleyoyn ayto to diasthma gia na mporoyme shmera na milame me asfaleia gia to pws exoyme fqasei mexri edw, alla kai na mporoyme na milame gia to mellon ths xwras mas.

KEXAGIA: Pali qa epanelqw se kati poy hdh exei eipwqei, alla mhpws qa prepei na mas tromazei ayto poy epanalambanei tis teleytaies hmeres h kybernhsh oti qa prepei na diasfalisoyme thn paramonh mas ston steno pyrhna ths eyrwzwnhs; Exei anoijei tetoia syzhthsh;

PETALWTHS: Oxi. Den yparxei tetoia syzhthsh, den exei anoijei kai alimono ean anoige. Emeis, blepoyme to mellon ths xwras mas mesa sthn eyrwzwnh. O ellhnikos laos ekane qysies gia na mpoyme sthn ONE. Kaname qysies gia na meinoyme sthn ONE, otan mas eytelizan, logw ths terastias anajiopistias poy zhsame ej aitias ths kybernhshs ths N.D. To mellon mas, fysika, brisketai ekei. Alla epeidh zoyme se mia epoxh poy ta panta einai reysta kai ypo krish kai kyriws h asfaleia toy Ellhna polith, profanws anoigoyn diafores syzhthseis, poy den exoyn kamia sxesh omws me thn kybernhsh. H kybernhsh exei jekaqarh qesh: Den mporoyme na skeftoyme to mellon ths xwras mas ejw apo thn eyrwzwnh. Ayto einai jekaqaro.

Sas eyxaristw.

Kalo apogeyma. --1427249692-654525682-1306352318=:19196--

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