Greek Government Press Briefing, 06-04-04

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

Aqhna, 4 Aprilioy 2006

TYPOY APO TON YPOYRGO EPIKRATEIAS KAI KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO

QEODWRO ROYSOPOYLO

Xairete.

Oloklhrwqhke h synedriash ths Kybernhtikhs Epitrophs sthn opoia, ektos apo to qema syzhthshs poy aforoyse nomosxedio toy ypoyrgeioy Dhmosias Tajhs gia ton eksygxronismo kai thn anabaqmish toy Pyrosbestikoy Swmatos, o ypoyrgos Eqnikhs Amynas k. B. Meimarakhs enhmerwse gia th nea organwtikh domh toy ypoyrgeioy Eqnikhs Amynas. O k. Meimarakhs, ejerxomenos toy Megaroy Majimoy, proebh se sxetikes dhlwseis.

O Prwqypoyrgos, ayrio stis 09.30, sto Megaro Majimoy, qa synanthqei me ton Grammatea ths Kentrikhs Epitrophs k. L. Zagorith kai ton boyleyth, prwhn ypoyrgo kai nyn ypochfio dhmarxo Aqhnaiwn k. N. Kaklamanh. Stis 10.30, qa exei synergasia me thn ypoyrgo Toyristikhs Anaptyjhs k. F. Petralia.

Se o,ti afora ena peristatiko poy synebh prin apo ligh wra panw apo to Aigaio, sthn perioxh twn Sporadwn, metajy aeroskafoys ths Olympiakhs Aeroporias kai polemikwn aeroskafwn, qa hqela na sas anaferw oti entos oligoy qa ekdoqoyn leptomereis anakoinwseis, toso apo thn Yphresia Politikhs Aeroporias, oso kai apo to Geniko Epiteleio Aeroporias.

Qa hqela na kanw ena sxolio gia th nea syllogikh symbash ergasias poy ypografhke xqes: H kybernhsh xairetizei th symfwnia sthn opoia katelhjan oi koinwnikoi etairoi, kaqws ayth diasfalizei, afenos men thn ergasiakh eirhnh poy syndramei thn prospaqeia gia thn enisxysh ths ellhnikhs oikonomias, afeteroy de beltiwnei to pragmatiko eisodhma twn ergazomenwn.

Telos, sto erwthma poy exei ypobalei o k. B. Papadopoylos sxetika me thn eyrwpaikh organwsh mikrwn kai mesaiwn epixeirhsewn, einai alhqes oti ayth h organwsh -poy idryqhke to Dekembrio toy 1999 me edra tis Bryjelles kai exei pararthmata grafeiwn sto Monaxo- exei hdh aponeimei eqnika kai dieqnh brabeia se prwqypoyrgoys kai proedroys, metajy twn opoiwn ston prwhn Proedro twn HPA k. Mpil Klinton kai ton prwhn Prwqypoyrgo ths Kinas. Apo to 2005 exei egkrinei th systash eyrwpaikoy brabeioy. Ayth h eyrwpaikh organwsh apofasise, omofwna, to prwto ayto brabeio na to aponeimei ston Ellhna Prwqypoyrgo, dioti, opws anaferetai sto skeptiko ths apofashs ths, akoloyqei me synepeia to stoxo toy sthn epanidrysh toy kratoys, xwris na ypologizei to politiko kostos. Epideiknyei dynamikothta kai apofasistikothta ergoy. Proxwrei me qarros tis metarryqmiseis. Prokeitai gia ena qema poy xeirizetai to ypoyrgeio Anaptyjhs. Exei ftasei sto grafeio toy Prwqypoyrgoy kai menoyn oi leptomereies gia to pote qa ginei h teleth sthn opoia qa aponemhqei ayto to brabeio.

Parakalw tis erwthseis sas.

SIDERHS: Qa mporoysate na mas peite poia einai h kybernhtikh qesh gia to kaqestws toy Kossyfopedioy;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Ti ennoeite; Exoyn ginei anakoinwseis, kata kairoys. O Prwqypoyrgos eixe episkefqei prin apo poly kairo thn perioxh. Epishs, exei symmetasxei se dieqneis diaskeceis opoy exei zhthqei to qema. H xwra mas exei labei dhmosia qesh. Den exw na pw kati epipleon, shmera.

SIDERHS: Qa qelate na thn ypenqymisete;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Oxi. O rolos moy edw den einai na ypenqymizw, genikws, tis qeseis. Mporw na sas aposteilw ta eggrafa sta opoia periexontai oi dhlwseis toy Prwqypoyrgoy gia na exete kai eseis gnwsh, afoy den exete hdh labei gnwsh.

SIDERHS: Exete pei ``kaqestws poy qa diasfalizei thn eirhnikh synyparjh kai biwsimothta toy Kossyfopedioy''. Ayto ti shmainei; Anejarthsia, merikh anejarthsia, aytonomia, ws exei to kaqestws; Ayto rwtw. Ayta ta diazeytika na mas lysete.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Se kaqe periptwsh, mporw na sas promhqeysw me tis qeseis ths ellhnikhs kybernhshs, opws exoyn diatypwqei apo ton Prwqypoyrgo, thn ypoyrgo Ejwterikwn h kai ton prwhn ypoyrgo Ejwterikwn. Mia einai h qesh, koinh kai eniaia.

SPYRAKH: Yparxei mia egkyklios pros tis dioikhseis twn problhmatikwn DEKO poy afora stis ayjhseis poy qa doqoyn kai anaferontai sto 3%, sto orio ths eisodhmatikhs politikhs toy Dhmosioy. Qelw na rwthsw, ean qewreite oti ayth h kateyqynsh paramenei en isxy, meta th symfwnia GSEE-ergodotwn sthn opoia oi ayjhseis ston idiwtiko tomea einai kata poly megalyteres apo tis proteinomenes pros tis DEKO.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Sthn oysia toy erwthmatos sas qa hqela na sas qymisw oti oi periorismoi sthn oikonomikh diaxeirish aforoyn tis zhmiogones DEKO. Gnwrizete oti sto Dhmosio leitoyrgoyn epixeirhseis poy epi seira etwn exoyn sysswreysei elleimmata, ta opoia barynoyn mesw toy proypologismoy toys Ellhnes forologoymenoys, ton kaqe Ellhna forologoymeno xwrista. H metarryqmistikh politikh stis DEKO exei akribws ws stoxo ths na termatisei ayth thn problhmatikh katastash. Ws ek toytoy, bebaiws kai qa parameinei ayto poy exoyme pei.

SPYRAKH: Dedomenoy twn plhroforiwn poy yparxoyn gia th diaqesh ths eyrwpaikhs Epitrophs, katopin eishghshs toy armodioy Epitropoy, na epistrecei h Olympiakh th xarakthrizomenh ws kratikh bohqeia ths periodoy mexri to 2000 poy ypologizetai peripoy sta 160 ekat. eyrw, h kybernhsh protiqetai na kanei alloys xeirismoys, prokeimenoy na parataqei to xroniko diasthma mexri thn parapomph ths ypoqeshs sto dikasthrio twn Eyrwpaikwn Koinothtwn;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Orqws eipate, sto kleisimo ths erwthsh sas, oti einai parapomph ths ypoqeshs sto Eyrwpaiko Dikasthrio. Den einai apofash h epibolh prostimoy. Einai parapomph. Emeis qa perimenoyme thn apofash toy Kollegioy twn Epitropwn.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Phrate thn apanthsh apo to Nomiko Symboylio toy Kratoys gia thn AGB;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Oxi.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Twra, h diafhmistikh pita pws moirazetai; Me tis metrhseis ths AGB sta kanalia;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Ean apeyqyneste se idiwtes epixeirhmaties eimai o pleon akatallhlos na sas apanthsw. Ekproswpw thn kybernhsh, ara den exw na sas pw kati.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Thn kratikh diafhmish ennow.

ROYSOPOYLOS: H kratikh diafhmish dianemetai apo tis antistoixes kratikes yphresies, toys kratikoys foreis k.t.l., me bash ta osa problepoyn oi nomoi. O nomos -kai edw einai h dikh moy armodiothta kai kala kanete kai rwtate, giati moy dinete thn eykairia na to dhlwsw gia allh mia fora dhmosiws- orizei na dinetai to 30% ths diafhmistikhs dapanhs sta perifereiaka MME. Ayth thn armodiothta askw kai thn askw ews ekei poy moy to epitrepei o nomos. Se o,ti afora ta loipa, eimai bebaios oti oi dioikhseis twn organismwn synypologizoyn stis apofaseis toys th dynatothta poy prepei na exei mia epixeirhsh na diafhmizetai sthn eyryterh dynath gkama proswpwn, stoxeyontas sto ejeidikeymeno koino poy prepei na stoxeysei h kaqe diafhmish.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Den dinetai h diafhmish analoga me thn akroamatikothta kai thn thleqeash poy exoyn; Mexri twra, etsi den dinontan;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Ean milame gia thn kratikh diafhmish, qelw na sas pw oti h parembash poy exei ginei me prwtoboylia dikh moy kai sthn opoia eixe symfwnhsei h Kybernhtikh Epitroph perysi to kalokairi, htan -katopin syzhthsewn peripoy oktw mhnwn me thn Enwsh Idiokthtwn Hmerhsiwn Efhmeridwn Aqhnwn- mia egkyklios poy ryqmize th dianomh isoy ariqmoy diafhmisewn, diafhmistikwn kataxwrhsewn me diaforetiko timologio analoga me thn kykloforia ths kaqe efhmeridas. Prokeitai gia egkyklio poy isxyei akomh dokimastika, opws exw pei, prokeimenoy na doyme ta apotelesmata ths kai kata poso ayta ta apotelesmata qa mas dwsoyn qetiko shma gia na proxwrhsoyme sthn idia diadikasia. Opws gnwrizete, yparxoyn pantote problhmata otan kati kainoyrgio paei na gennhqei.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Den rwtw gia efhmerides. Gia tis efhmerides jerw oti einai h kykloforia kai hjera mexri twra kai apo o,ti fainetai synexizetai me thn thleqeash h thn akroamatikothta dinontan oi kratikes diafhmiseis. Synexizetai na ginetai ayto;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Sas epanalambanw oti ta krithria poy akoloyqoyntai einai krithria poy kaqe dioikhsh organismoy ofeilei na synypologisei. Einai, loipon, ta krithria ayta poy anefera prohgoymenws, na mhn sas ta epanalabw. Den ginetai kentrika katanomh twn diafhmisewn, opws isws orismenoi nomizoyn h opws kapoioi dhmioyrgoyn entypwseis. H diafhmistikh dapanh poy barynei kaqe organismo ginetai jexwrista apo ton kaqe organismo. H monh armodiothta poy exei o nyn ypoyrgos Epikrateias, prwhn ypoyrgos Typoy, einai na elegxei ean apo th diafhmistikh dapanh twn dhmosiwn epixeirhsewn to 30%, opws problepetai apo nomo poy chfise h ellhnikh Boylh, dianemetai stis efhmerides ths perifereias.

SARANTAKOS: Qa hqela na rwthsw, ean ayth th stigmh einai se qesh h kybernhsh mesw hmwn na diabebaiwsei toys Ellhnes kai toys jenoys poy qeloyn na tajidecoyn sthn Ellada to kalokairi, oti h Olympiakh qa synexisei na peta kai to kalokairi, meta thn parodo aytoy toy dimhnoy poy xreiazetai mexri thn parapomph ths Elladas sto Eyrwpaiko Dikasthrio.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Nai.

KORAH: Qa hqela ena sxolio ths kybernhshs gia to deal ths Eqnikhs Trapezas me thn toyrkikh kai an thn tromazei to megeqos kai toys kindynoys poy emperiexei.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Gnwrizete oti h Eqnikh Trapeza einai mia idiwtikh epixeirhsh. To mono sxolio poy qa hqela na kanw einai oti h kybernhsh enqarrynei tis prospaqeies twn epixeirhmatikwn kyklwn na enisxysoyn th dynamikh toys paroysia sth Notioanatolikh Eyrwph.

KORAH: Dhmosieymata toy Typoy sas feroyn na exete paijei ena rolo ``koymparoy'' anamesa ston epixeirhmatia k. Alafoyzo kai ton allo epixeirhmatia k. Patatoydh gia thn ejagora toy SEVEN. Ti exete na apanthsete;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Exw na apanthsw oti einai pantelws anakribh. Se kaqe periptwsh, profanws, ean yparxei tetoio dhmosieyma den exei ypopesei sthn antilhch moy.

KORAH: Xqes htan sth ``XWRA'' kai nomizw kai sthn ``TRAFFIC''.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Ean yparxei, loipon, tetoio dhmosieyma qa hqela na epishmanw oti oi diadikasies, opws problepontai apo toys nomoys, gia tis metabibaseis twn epixeirhsewn aytoy toy typoy, ginontai mono mesw toy ESR. Den yparxei, dhladh, kanenos eidoys sxesh toy prwhn ypoyrgeioy Typoy me toys neoys nomoys stis metabibaseis kefalaiwn apo epixeirhsh se epixeirhsh, opws ayth poy anaferate prohgoymenws.

BLAXOS: Mporw na lysw mia aporia moy, protoy kanw thn erwthsh;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Fantazomai oti kai h erwthsh aporia qa emperiexei.

BLAXOS: Epeidh sas akoysa na lete oti den to diabasate ayto to dhmosieyma poy eipe h synadelfos@

ROYSOPOYLOS: Eipa oti den exei ypopesei sthn antilhch moy.

BLAXOS: Den diabazete th ``XWRA'' epeidh sas askei kritikh; Ayto mas lete;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Kaqhmerina diabazw oles tis efhmerides.

BLAXOS: Ara, qa prepei na to eixate dei.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Diabazei kapoios tis efhmerides analoga me to xrono poy diaqetei se mia poly fortwmenh hmera. Sebomai omws kai timw oles tis efhmerides, toys dhmosiografoys, toys anqrwpoys poy ergazontai sta MME, toys anqrwpoys poy dinoyn doyleia se dhmosiografoys kai ennow toys epixeirhmaties poy einai idiokthtes MME.

BLAXOS: Ean loipon sebosastan toys dhmosiografoys -kai ayth einai h erwthsh moy- giati den kanate to kaqhkon sas na elegjete epi dyo xronia thn antikeimenikothta ths AGB;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Qa hqela na moy peite apo poy aryetai ayth h ypoxrewsh kai to kaqhkon poy lete, dioti antilambanomai oti profanws anafereste se kapoio nomiko plaisio, se kapoio nomo poy me ypoxrewnei gia kati tetoio, opws ayto poy eseis epishmanate.

BLAXOS: To epishmainei kai h eisaggeleas sto porisma ths gia thn AGB, oti h elleich elegxoy apo to ypoyrgeio Typoy kai to ESR eixe afhsei ayth thn katastash na pagiwnetai. Malista prepei na sas pw oti h eisaggeleas mila enypografws gia qema diaplokhs. Dhladh, leei oti osoi emplekontai se ayto to systhma, oysiastika apoteloyn systhma diaplokhs. Kai to grafei kiolas.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den exw to porisma sto opoio anafereste, giati bebaiws h eisaggeleas den einai ypoxrewmenh na steilei to porisma se kapoion. Kata synepeia, den mporw na gnwrizw kata poso ayta poy moy metaferete se ayth thn aiqoysa einai alhqh. Wstoso, an kapoia stigmh exw sth diaqesh moy to keimeno toy porismatos, efoson eilikrinws den gnwrizw ean ta porismata dinontai epishmws sth dhmosiothta, qa qymhqw tote na to diabasw kai qa janakanoyme ayth th syzhthsh. Dioti, qewrw adianohto me komco tropo na moy apeyqynete mia kathgoria san ayth poy anaferate, sthrizomenos se porisma eisaggelea. An den einai etsi, qa parakalesw na to qymomaste kai oi dyo mas tote kai na to janasyzhthsoyme sthn aiqoysa.

BLAXOS: Pantws, prepei na qymaste san kybernhtikos ekproswpos kai san ypeyqynos Typoy ths N.D. oti san antipoliteysh eixate kanei mega qema sth Boylh gia tis metrhseis ths AGB Dhladh, eixate kataqesei erwthseis, eixe ginei salos me ton k. Kefalogiannh ton k. Ebert. Ki omws, eseis otan analabate thn diakybernhsh anti na jekinhsete thn kaqarsh se ayton ton tomea, epi dyo xronia to afhnate etsi.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Exoyme diaforetikh proseggish sto poia qemata exoyn kai poia proteraiothta. Gia paradeigma, ayth h kybernhsh pisteye apo thn prwth stigmh oti exei proteraiothta na oloklhrwsei mia seira apo metarryqmiseis, oti exei proteraiothta na proxwrhsei stis ryqmiseis gia ton basiko metoxo, opws kai ekane. Dioti, opws gnwrizete, akoma kai to qema poy lete, basizetai panw se aytes tis ryqmiseis, peri diafaneias, me kapoion emmeso, plhn safh tropo. Ara, loipon, ean cegete thn kybernhsh giati den jekinhse me to yp` ariqmo ena -kat` esas- qema, dhladh twn metrhsewn thleqeashs, alla jekinhse me ton basiko metoxo kai sth synexeia eqese kai mia seira allwn qematwn, opws einai o eparxiakos kai perifereiakos Typos, h idrysh toy Eqnikoy Optikoakoystikoy Arxeioy, h chfiakh thleorash, poy apeyqynetai se ekatontades xiliades Ellhnes polites, eidika to tmhma ths poy anaferetai se ena prwtoporiako, gia ta eyrwpaika dedomena, kanali kai apeyqynetai sto ena ekatommyrio sympatriwtes mas, ta atoma me anaphria. Ean loipon eseis exete thn apoch oti prepei na jekinhsei apo kapoy alloy h kybernhsh egw qa sebastw thn apoch sas. Se kaqe periptwsh, omws, qelw na sas qymisw oti einai h kybernhsh poy jekinhse prwth, edw kai polloys mhnes, na anaferei thn anagkh allaghs aytoy toy nomikoy plaisioy. Einai h N.D. ws antipoliteysh -opws orqa eipate- poy epishmane thn anagkh allaghs toy plaisioy. Kai einai h kybernhsh ths N.D. poy meta apo polles syzhthseis me oloys toys foreis, me ta ypoloipa kommata ths Boylhs, proxwra sto neo nomoqetiko plaisio. Ean to zhthma sas einai giati den egine ton prwto mhna diakybernhshs ths xwras, alla ginetai ston deytero xrono, exete kaqe dikaiwma na kanete kritikh. Qa eixate sigoyra peistikotera epixeirhmata ean, gia paradeigma, to jexnoyse h kybernhsh kai den to eixe arxisei, poly prin ginei prwto qema sta kanalia.

BLAXOS: To gegonos oti epishmainw kati poy den kanate eseis ws Ypoyrgos, einai qema ths kybernhshs; Giati xrhsimopoieite thn frash ``cegete thn kybernhsh''. Dhladh, opoios kanei kritikh se esas, einai san na kanei kritikh se oloklhrh thn kybernhsh; Enas ypoyrgos melos ths kybernhshs eiste.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den jerw ean exete thn entypwsh oti enas ypoyrgos aytonomeitai. Einai melos ths kybernhshs kai paramenei melos ths kybernhshs, ara yparxei h eyqynh ws meloys ths kybernhshs.

BLAXOS: Nai, alla den einai syllogikh h eyqynh@

ROYSOPOYLOS: Sas anefera, epi ths oysias, poies einai oi kybernhtikes proteraiothtes kai aytes tis askhsame kai tis askoyme. Sas anefera, epishs kai to epanalambanw, oti ean molis proxqes egine prwto qema se kapoia deltia eidhsewn me aformh to porisma toy eisaggelea to qema ths AGB, to prwhn ypoyrgeioy Typoy, nyn Grammateies edw kai kairo, syneiseferan ta opoia stoixeia eixan sthn ereyna toy eisaggelea. Poly kairo nwritera eixame dhlwsei dhmosia thn anagkh enisxyshs toy qesmikoy plaisioy blepontas to keno poy yparxei se ayto to sygkekrimeno qema. Ara, loipon, giati cegete thn kybernhsh; Dioti dieblece; Dioti eipe oti yparxei problhma; Dioti dhmosiws to eqese se ola ta kommata, to eqese se 35 foreis se olh thn Ellada; Dioti to entassei se ena nomosxedio, poly prin ginei olh ayth h dhmosia syzhthsh sthn opoia anafereste;

KAKALHS: Xairethsate thn xqesinh symbash GSEE-ergodotwn, alla prin apo esas thn xairetise to PASOK h armodia Tomearxhs k. Basw Papandreoy. Ektimate thn symbolh toy PASOK se ayth thn epibolh ths litothtas se baros twn ergazomenwn;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Milhsa kai milw panta gia koinwnikoys etairoys. Den anaferomai se kommata se o,ti afora ayta ta qemata.

KAKALHS: Yparxei symptwsh ap` o,ti diapistwnoyme oloi, kaqoti ki eseis kai to PASOK xairetizete ayth thn symfwnia.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den blepw na yparxei kati kako se ayto poy lete. Mallon ws qetiko to ektimw gia ta politika pragmata ths xwras.

KAKALHS: Oxi, alla tosa xronia kataggellate to PASOK oti epebale th litothta kai synexizete thn idia politikh. Anejarthta apo ayto, qewreite oti beltiwnei to pragmatiko eisodhma twn ergazomenwn, opws eipate, ta 0,77 eyrw ayjhsh toy katwteroy merokamatoy kai 17 eyrw sto misqo, sto prwto ejamhno toy 2006;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Qa meinw sto arxiko sxolio moy, den xreiazetai na pw tipota perissotero.

KORAH: Sxetika me to qema ths AGB Mia kritikh poy ginetai sthn kybernhsh einai oti anoigei twra to qema kai ayto to anoigma sympiptei me thn eisodo toy sygkrothmatos Alafoyzoy ston thleoptiko tomea. Dhladh, oti epixeirei ena emmeso plhgma sthn AGB, wste mellontika na anoijei ton dromo se enan kratiko parembatismo, poy qa mporesei na moirasei kai diaforetika thn trapoyla twn thleqeasewn kai ths diafhmistikhs pitas. Poia einai h apanthsh sas;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den gnwrizw apo poioys ginetai kai ean ginetai ayth h kritikh kai den exei kamia shmasia. Shmasia exei ti exei kanei h kybernhsh kai ti exei kanei h dikaiosynh. Se o,ti afora thn kybernhsh, jekinhse, edw kai polloys mhnes, enan dialogo epishmainontas ta problhmata. Opws eipe synadelfos sas, apo tote poy htan antipoliteysh h N.D. eixe epishmanei ayto to zhthma. Kai deyteron, sas qymizw, oti h dikaiosynh eixe hdh jekinhsei ayth thn ereyna, nomizw apo to Dekembrio toy 2004, dhladh poly prin symboyn ola ayta ta opoia anaferate sto prwto skelos toy erwthmatos sas.

PAPAGIANNHS: Eseis eixate synanthsh me ton dioikhth ths Agrotikhs Trapezas k. Mhliako, ston opoio ypotiqetai oti anhke o staqmos @Seven-x@. Syzhthsate ayto to qema;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Oxi. Den exw syzhthsei ayto to qema. Teleytaia fora poy epikoinwnhsa me ton k. Mhliako -den qa to elega giati den synhqizw na apantw se tetoies leptomereies- htan prin apo peripoy dyo mhnes, otan syzhthsame to qema ths Enwshs Antapokritwn Jenoy Typoy kai toy ktirioy poy stegazei thn Enwsh kai brisketai sthn odo Akadhmias.

PAPAGIANNHS: Ean katalaba kala sto ayriano programma toy Prwqypoyrgoy, sth synanthsh poy qa ginei me ton k. Kaklamanh, qa einai parwn kai o k. Zagoriths;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Nai qa einai kai oi dyo parontes.

PAPAGIANNHS: Mhpws allaje kati ston epikoinwniako sxediasmo ths N.D., h ths kybernhshs, ws pros tis dhmotikes ekloges, dedomenoy oti blepoyme mia syntonismenh epiqesh apo gnwsta kentra MME se sxesh me th diafwnia poy exei prokycei metajy toy k. Kaklamanh kai toy k. Abramopoyloy;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Oxi. Den exei allajei tipota. Ginetai mia synanthsh toy Prwqypoyrgoy me ton Grammatea ths Kentrikhs Epitrophs kai toy ypochfioy Dhmarxoy Aqhnaiwn gia ta profanh.

BLAXOS: Poios th zhthse;

ROYSOPOYLOS: O Prwqypoyrgos kalei sto grafeio toy.

SARANTAKOS: Sthn paroysiash poy ekane shmera o k. Meimarakhs sthn Kybernhtikh Epitroph gia to neo organogramma toy ypoyrgeioy Eqnikhs Amynas, sas enhmerwse mhpws gia thn proqesh toy na topoqethsei ton k. Karaxalio sthn eyaisqhth qesh ths Oikonomikhs Dieyqynshs toy ypoyrgeioy;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den qymamai na eipwqhke kati tetoio. H enhmerwsh htan epi toy qesmikoy plaisioy kai twn allagwn. Den anaferqhke se proswpa o k. Meimarakhs.

SARANTAKOS: Qa enhmerwsei sto mellon gia ta proswpa h einai apokleistikh armodiothta toy ypoyrgoy Eqnikhs Amynas;

ROYSOPOYLOS: O ypoyrgos Eqnikhs Amynas, opws kaqe ypoyrgos, epilegei toys synergates toy.

SARANTAKOS: Akoma ki an prokeitai gia kommatika stelexh na topoqetoyntai se eyaisqhtes qeseis, opws einai ayth poy anefera gia ta oikonomika toy Pentagwnoy;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Otan to komma poy kerdizei tis ekloges sxhmatizei kybernhsh, synhqws epilegei ta stelexh poy qa stelexwsoyn tis kybernhtikes qeseis.

SIDERHS: Gia na mhn fygoyme me thn aporia. Anaferate mia seira draseis poy kanate sto qema toy Typoy. Metajy aytwn anaferate kai ton basiko metoxo. Giati ejakoloyqeite na ton anaferete, afoy apotelese to ``Baterlw'' sas;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Oi apoceis poikilloyn, diaferoyn. Ephreazomenos, ki eseis profanws, apo merida dhmosieymatwn, moy qetete thn erwthsh apo ayth thn optikh gwnia. Qa moy epitrecete na sas pw oti qa prepei oloi na qymoyntai thn istoria, den exei shmasia ean einai mikroi h megaloi, qa prepei na th qymoyntai.

SIDERHS: Kai to pososto toy basikoy metoxoy.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Qa moy epitrecete na sas qymisw oti ayth h diadikasia jekinhse apo thn prohgoymenh kybernhsh me aithma ths Eyrwpaikhs Epitrophs na allajei to arqro 14 par. 9 toy Syntagmatos. Kai fqasame sthn apolyta symfwnh gnwmh ths Commission se enan nomo epi toy arqroy 14/9 dinontas mia maxh, thn opoia eixe apofygei h prohgoymenh kybernhsh na dwsei. Ean, loipon, gi` esas to na jekinhsei h Commission me aithma ``katarghste to arqro toy Syntagmatos sas'' kai na katalhjei se symfwnia gia enan nomo epi aytoy toy arqroy einai Baterlw, exoyme teleiws diaforetikh entypwsh peri toy ti shmainei Baterlw.

SIDERHS: Pali yperaspisthkame to Syntagma, dhladh, me ayton ton nomo;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Sas anefera ta gegonota.

GALIATSATOS: Ean katalaba kala mas eipate oti o Grammateas Politikoy Sxediasmoy kai Programmatos ths N.D. proorizetai na paei sthn Oikonomikh Dieyqynsh toy ypoyrgeioy Eqnikhs Amynas.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den sas eipa kati tetoio. Sas eipa oti o ypoyrgos Eqnikhs Amynas, opws kai kaqe ypoyrgos, epilegei toys synergates toy. Kai sth deyterh parathrhsh synadelfoy sas, ean qymamai kala, se sxesh me to an ta kommatika stelexh lambanoyn qesh, eipa oti kaqe komma poy ginetai kybernhsh epilegei stelexh toy kommatos gia tis kybernhtikes qeseis.

GALIATSATOS: Yparxei tetoia proqesh, pantws;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den to gnwrizw.

KORAH: Pantws, mas lete oti den einai apagoreytiko;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Ta stelexh enos kommatos, otan ginetai kybernhsh, na lambanoyn kybernhtikes qeseis;

KORAH: Oxi, se stelexh@

ROYSOPOYLOS: Ayto apotelei basikh arxh ths Dhmokratias. Einai allo na katalyei kaneis to kratos, opws eidate na symbainei sto prosfato parelqon, kai allo ta kommatika stelexh na lambanoyn kybernhtikes qeseis, prokeimenoy na efarmosoyn to programma toy kommatos, to opoio h pleiochfia toy ellhnikoy laoy chfise na ginei kybernhsh.

BLAXOS: H eisodos toy k. Nikhta Kaklamanh, kommatikoy ypochfioy gia to Dhmo ths Aqhnas, sto Megaro Majimoy mazi me ton k. Zagorith, epishs kommatikoy stelexoys ths Neas Dhmokratias, aposkopei sto na doqei kalych toy ypochfioy apo ton Prwqypoyrgo kai na stamathsoyn oi boles poy dexetai apo ypoyrgoys;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den exei anagkh apo kalych o k. Kaklamanhs. O k. Kaklamanhs exei mia diaygh poreia. Exei mia poreia me ergo, exei mia poreia me politikh shmasia. Opws qymaste, ws ekproswpos toy Prwqypoyrgoy, anakoinwsa thn ypochfiothta toy thn hmera poy anakoinwqhke to neo sxhma ths kybernhshs. H synanthsh den exei para to periexomeno poy eqesa prohgoymenws. Tipote perissotero.

BLAXOS: Me ayth thn epistolh poy steilate sto nomiko symboylo toy kratoys@

ROYSOPOYLOS: ``Erwthma'' legetai.

BLAXOS: Erwthma, nai, gia thn AGB, exete balei xroniko periqwrio pote qa sas apanthsei;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Sto nomiko symboylo toy kratoys h sto Nomiko Symboylio toy Kratoys, ypoyrgos -h kratikos leitoyrgos- ypobalei erwthma kai apanta to Nomiko Symboylio toy Kratoys, sto xrono ekeino poy ekeino krinei oti einai oloklhrwmenh h apanthsh toy. Den mporw na gnwrizw@.

BLAXOS: Ma me sygxwreite kyrie Ekproswpe, dyo lepta, giati qa xasoyme thn aplh koinh logikh mas.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Mhpws den gnwrizete pws leitoyrgei to ellhniko kratos, gi` ayto;

BLAXOS: Oxi, me sygxwreite, alla qelw, sas parakalw para poly, na moy apanthsete se ayto to erwthma: Ayth th stigmh kapoioi dinoyn kapoia lefta. To Nomiko Symboylio toy Kratoys kaleitai loipon kai to rwtate an swsta aytoi oi anqrwpoi h ERT sthn prokeimenh periptwsh opws eseis lete, dinei swsta ta lefta. Kai den exete balei xroniko periqwrio gia na doyme an swsta dinei ta xrhmata h ERT h oxi; Ayto den einai diaspaqish xrhmatos;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Ean den to gnwrizete, maqete oti to Nomiko Symboylio toy Kratoys den exei thn ennoia toy ypallhloy poy dexetai entoles. Leitoyrgei me nomikh anejarthsia, katoxyrwmenh apo to Syntagma. Kai to Nomiko Symboylio toy Kratoys apofasizei epi th basei toy Syntagmatos kai twn nomwn. Apanta loipon katoxyrwmena. Den einai dhladh o ypallhlos o opoios qa labei entolh ``kane ayto kai kane to ayrio''. Dioti alliws den qa eixe kai nohma.

BLAXOS: Na to qesw alliws loipon. An to Nomiko Symboylio toy Kratoys, bgei kai pei oti den einai nomimh h diadikasia kai oti kakws dinontoysan ayta ta lefta apo toys kratikoys foreis.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Qa kinhqoyn oles ekeines oi diadikasies poy einai nomimes.

BLAXOS: Qa zhthqoyn pisw ta xrhmata;

ROYSOPOYLOS: O,ti problepetai apo ton antistoixo kwdika kai toys nomoys qa ginei mexri keraias, sas diabebaiw.

BLAXOS: Kai eyqynes politikes den yparxoyn gia thn kaqysterhsh ypobolhs toy erwthmatos;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Mporeite na kanete opoia krish qelete.

BLAXOS: Oxi, lew an eseis aisqaneste oti exete politikes eyqynes. Eseis kai profanws kai o k. Prwtopapas prin apo esas.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Exw pei ti exei kanei h politeia, ti exei kanei h kybernhsh, jekaqara. Apo ekei kai pera krinontai oi pantes. Poly perissotero krinontai oi politikoi.

BLAXOS: Estw kai an yparxei toso megalh kaqysterhsh kyrie ypoyrge;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Sas apanthsa. Den exw na pw tipote perissotero.

KAKALHS: Enqarrynate, eipate, thn ejagora ths toyrkikhs trapezas apo thn Eqnikh. Wstoso h kybernhsh exei synypologisei to legomeno gewpolitiko risko; Me dedomeno oti h toyrkikh kybernhsh diathrei thn apeilh polemoy se baros ths xwras mas, synexizei thn amfisbhthsh twn kyriarxikwn dikaiwmatwn, enw den anagnwrizei thn Kypriakh Dhmokratia. Qelw na pw dhladh, ti qa ginoyn ta lefta twn tameiwn kai twn ellhnikwn noikokyriwn, an paei kati straba;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Yparxoyn dieqneis kanones, poy diepoyn aytes tis sxeseis kai h Toyrkia einai apo tis xwres h opoia ypakoyei s` aytoys toys dieqneis kanones. Kai ofeilei na ypakoysei. Se kaqe periptwsh, epanalambanw oti h etaireia, poy legetai ``Eqnikh Trapeza ths Ellados'', h idiwtikh ayth epixeirhsh, exei kanei mia poly megalh ependysh se perioxes poy krinei oti qa apodwsoyn oikonomika. Mia apo aytes einai h ependysh, poy ypegrafh molis xqes. H kybernhsh -epanalambanw gia deyterh fora- enqarrynei tis prwtoboylies epixeirhmatikwn drasthriothtwn sth notioanatolikh Eyrwph. Ean qa mporoysa na kanw kai ena deytero sxolio politikhs yfhs, ayto einai oti se orismena qemata opws, gia paradeigma, h diplwmatia twn seismwn -thn paradexthkame oloi sto parelqon- h peraiterw endynamwsh twn oikonomikwn sxesewn, mporei na feroyn toys dyo laoys, tis dyo xwres pio konta.

KAKALHS: Kai ena deytero, synafes erwthma, pws ejhgeite to gegonos oti o asygkrita megalyteros trapezikos omilos, h Citi- group, poy diekdikoyse ws antipalos ths Eqnikhs thn toyrkikh trapeza, teleytaia stigmh ypanaxwrhse kai paraxwrhse th qesh ths yper ths Eqnikhs; Den hjere ta symferonta ths, qelw na pw, den eixe megalyteres dynatothtes na thn agorasei;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den mporw na to gnwrizw ayto. Moy zhtate na ejhghsw mia epixeirhmatikh drasthriothta, pws skeftetai enas dieqnhs omilos. Akomh kai ellhnikos omilos na htan den qa mporoysa na gnwrizw pws skeftetai epixeirhmatika kai apofasizei.

KAKALHS: Afoy omws einai ypertimhmenh h ejagora, ayto qelw na pw, apo thn Eqnikh.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Sas apanthsa.

PAPADOPOYLOS: San proektash toy erwthmatos toy synadelfoy, mhpws gnwrizete ean o k. Arapogloy prohgoymenws htan ypallhlos ths Citi-group;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Nomizw eixe ergastei kai s` ayton ton omilo. To biografiko toy eixe doqei sth dhmosiothta, otan anelabe. Fantazomai qa to perilambanei.

BLAXOS: Mhpws mporeite na mas enhmerwsete, gia poio logo oi ypoyrgoi ejafanisthkan apo thn proeklogikh ekstrateia ths DAP, sth foithtikh proeklogikh periodo kai mono o k. Boylgarakhs, tolmhse na bgei sto amfiqeatro; Yparxei kanenas logos poy oi ypoyrgoi den pane na sthrijoyn thn DAP-NDFK h kati allo;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Giati ypotimate ton k. Boylgarakh, o opoios einai ypoyrgos ths kybernhshs; Mhpws den to qymaste.

BLAXOS: Apo enan ekproswpeitai h kybernhsh;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Sas qymizw, oti prin apo dyo ebdomades, egine mia ekdhlwsh se kentriko jenodoxeio ths Aqhnas, opoy o omilwn htan kai omilwn se ekeinh thn ekdhlwsh. Kai egw kai o k. Boylgarakhs diaqetoyme akoma thn ypoyrgikh idiothta. Ean exoyn paei kai alloi ypoyrgoi kai exoyn milhsei eilikrina den to qymamai, den to gnwrizw. Se kaqe periptwsh, emeis eyxomaste stis neolaies mas na kanoyn tis kalyteres, dynaton, ekloges, na epilejoyn toys kalyteroys giati ayto qa bohqhsei ta panepisthmia kai th dikh toys poreia sth zwh.

PAPADHMHTRIOY: Qelw na rwthsw gia to qema twn Pakistanwn, oi opoioi kataggelloyn oti meta apo parembash toy k. Boylgarakh, mesw ths presbeias toys dexqhkan kapoia xrhmata kai kapoies adeies paramonhs gia na allajoyn tis kataqeseis toys. Poio einai to sxolio sas;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Exoyn yparjei antifatikes plhrofories stis efhmerides. Qymamai thn prwth fora h plhroforia htan oti synelhfqhsan apo Ellhnes, oti synelhfqhsan apo jenoys, en synexeia h plhroforia -katagrafw panta dhmosieymata twn efhmeridwn kai twn MME- oti den synelhfqhsan akribws alla toys stamathsan kai toys eginan orismenes erwthseis. En synexeia h plhroforia apo ton presbh toy Pakistan oti oydepote dexqhke kanenos eidoys enoxlhsh sthn presbeia. En synexeia mia allh plhroforia oti h presbeia kinhqhke me ton alfa h bhta tropo. Twra kati kainoyrgio, prin apo ena mhna h prin apo liges hmeres dhmosieyma ths ``Kaqhmerinhs'' -an qymamai kala- anefere oti metajy toys kapoioi eixan ntyqei astynomikoi kai synelaban me xeiropedes kapoioys alloys ypodyomenoi toys astynomikoys. Einai toso antifatika kai toso polla. As perimenoyme kalytera thn opoia ereyna poy ginetai apo th Dikaiosynh.

PAPAGIANNHS: Skopeyei h kybernhsh kai eseis proswpika, na kalesete se enan dialogo toys dieyqyntes eidhsewn kai twn idiwtikwn thleoptikwn staqmwn wste na teqei epi taphtos to zhthma twn metrhsewn; Dhladh na apokleistoyn ta deltia ayta apo to endexomeno twn metrhsewn;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Sas qymizw oti o dialogos exei hdh oloklhrwqei. Se ayton eixan klhqei 35 foreis, metajy twn opoiwn oles oi Enwseis syntaktwn, oles oi Enwseis idiokthtwn, oloi metexontes sto gignesqai twn MME kai topoqethqhkan kai se ayto to qema.

PAPAGIANNHS: Epeidh yparxoyn plhrofories pws exete sta xeria sas metrhseis poy aforoyn th dikh sas politikh kariera, mporeite na mas peite se poia eklogikh perifereia telika qa eiste ypochfios gia na mhn to doyme dhmosieymeno ypo th morfh ``parapolitikoy'' entos twn prosexwn ebdomadwn;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den exw kanei tetoies metrhseis kai nomizw oti einai poly nwris akomh.

GALIATSATOS: Kyrie Ekproswpe, xqes to brady sth NET kai sthn ekpomph toy k. Polith, o k. Gkargkanas, o dioikhths ths Trapezhs ths Ellados, eipe orismena pragmata, sta opoia qa hqela to sxolio sas. Eipe oti mphkame me to spaqi mas sthn ONE. Eipe oti h kybernhsh sas akoloyqei peripoy thn idia oikonomikh politikh me thn prohgoymenh kybernhsh poy aposkopei sth meiwsh twn dhmosiwn elleimmatwn kai sygkrathsh twn dapanwn. Kai sto qema ths katagrafhs twn amyntikwn dapanwn, poy einai h meizona politikh antiparaqesh panw sto qema ths apografhs, eipe oti ``gi` ayta ta qemata den ginetai na topoqethqw dhmosia, oti eixa na pw to eipa kai exei kanei h trapeza to kaqhkon ths'', afhnontas kata th gnwmh moy aixmes oti diafwnoyse me ayto ton tropo poy egine h istoria ayth. Exei h kybernhsh kapoio sxolio panw stis dhlwseis toy k. Gkargkana;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Oxi.

IWANNOY: Xqes o k. Panagiwtopoylos se mia radiofwnikh synenteyjh eipe oti epiqymei na epistrecei to taxytero dynato se kybernhtikh qesh, otan ton rwthsan an qa einai telika eishghths sthn anaqewrhsh toy syntagmatos. Qa hqela na rwthsw, yparxei kapoia skech, twra, syntoma, na ginei anasxhmatismos;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Kat` arxas to syndyazete me mia dhlwsh thn opoia den gnwrizw pws exei diatypwqei. Se kaqe periptwsh o,ti eixa na pw peri anasxhmatismoy to eipa kai oti eixe na pei o Prwqypoyrgos to eipe, epishs, prin apo molis enamisi-dyo mhnes.

SARANTAKOS: Exei ginei protash ston k. Panagiwtopoylo na einai pragmati o genikos eishghths apo thn pleyra ths kybernhtikhs pleiochfias sto qema ths anaqewrhshs toy syntagmatos;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den exw enhmerwsh gia kati tetoio.

SARANTAKOS: Ara, profanws, gia na mhn to gnwrizete eseis, mallon den exei ginei protash.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den shmainei oti ta gnwrizw ola. Oydepote to yposthrija ayto.

SARANTAKOS: Epeidh einai mia basikh epilogh kai eseis ekproswpeite thn kybernhsh, ypoqetw oti qa to jerate.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Sas qymizw oti einai mia diadikasia koinoboyleytikwn kommatwn, sthn opoia symmetexoyn oloi oi boyleytes, symmetexoyn ta kommata. Den gnwrizw kati ayth th stigmh. Ean to gnwriza qa sas to elega.

SARANTAKOS: Epeidh to eipe o k. Panagiwtopoylos xqes, gi` ayto sas rwtw.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Katalaba to erwthma sas, aplws den gnwrizw na pw kati.

MANH: Kyrie Ekproswpe, dyo shmantikes genikes grammateies, toy Oikonomias kai h GGA paramenoyn akefales gia panw apo enan mhna. Ayto shmainei -h megalh xronikh anesh ennow- h oti einai peritth h stelexwsh toys h oti yparxei ena problhma synennohshs twn ypoyrgwn. Eidika gia thn GGA. Panw apo ena mhna, den einai poly megalo to diasthma gia mia toso sobarh qesh, na paramenei xwris@.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den qymamai na einai panw apo enan mhna, eidika h GGA.

MANH: Kala, eidika toy k. Mixaloy einai stoys dyo mhnes.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Eidika h GGA den nomizw oti einai ena mhna@

MANH: Ena mhna einai.

ROYSOPOYLOS: @.alla me briskete aparaskeyo gia na apanthsw sto giati exei yparjei ayth h kaqysterhsh.

Sas eyxaristw.

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