Greek Government Press Briefing, 03-01-30

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

YPOYRGEIO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

Aqhna, 30 Ianoyarioy 2003

JENOY TYPOY APO TON YPOYRGO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

KAI KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO XRHSTO PRWTOPAPA

Geia sas.

Opws gnwrizete, synedriase shmera to Ypoyrgiko Symboylio me qema thn metanasteytikh politikh, toso se o,ti afora eidikotera to eswteriko ths xwras, oso kai se o,ti afora thn Ellhnikh Proedria. O ypoyrgos Eswterikwn, Dhmosias Dioikhshs kai Apokentrwshs K. Skandalidhs, se synenteyjh toy, qa anaferqei sta epimeroys qemata gia ta opoia apofasise to Ypoyrgiko Symboylio.

Sthn eisagwgikh parembash toy, o Prwqypoyrgos anaferqhke se tria basika zhthmata: Prwton tis ejelijeis sto Irak, deytero to Kypriako kai trito ta qemata eswterikhs epikairothtas.

Se o,ti afora to Irak, o Prwqypoyrgos eipe oti oi elegktes twn Hnwmenwn Eqnwn exoyn kataqesei ta symperasmata toys sto Symboylio Asfaleias. Yparxei mia dieqnhs piesh na apofasistoyn oi ejelijeis sto plaisio toy Symboylioy Asfaleias. Th Deytera to prwi, h Eyrwpaikh Enwsh ejedwse chfisma, to opoio topoqeteitai safestata, tonizontas th shmasia poy exei to Symboylio Asfaleias kai oti prepei na exei prwtagwnistiko rolo se aytes tis ejelijeis. O Prwqypoyrgos tonise oti einai olo kai pio entonh h syneidhsh stoys kyrioys prwtagwnistes oti den einai dynato na ginei apodekth mia monomerhs energeia kai oti gia thn opoia energeia -eite polymerh, eite twn HPA- prepei na yparxei mia peistikh dikaiologia, mia aitiologhsh me stoixeia. Ayto exoyn zhthsei oi Galloi kai oi Germanoi kai gi` ayto oi HPA dhlwsan oti sto Symboylio Asfaleias qa paroysiasoyn ta stoixeia poy exoyn kai oti ayta qa apodeiknyoyn kai syndesh ths kybernhshs toy Irak me thn Al Kainta. Gi` ayto exei sygklhqei to Symboylio Asfaleias stis 5 Febroyarioy, sto opoio qa proedreysei o ypoyrgos Ejwterikwn ths Germanias.

O Prwqypoyrgos eixe thlefwnikh epikoinwnia me ton k. Mpler kai ton k. Mperloyskoni. O k. Mperloyskoni qa synanthqei, shmera to apogeyma, me ton k. Mpoys kai o k. Mpler ayrio. O Prwqypoyrgos eipe oti apo tis synomilies poy eixe einai safes to symperasma oti kai oi dyo pisteyoyn sthn anagkh katadeijhs twn epixeirhmatwn me peistiko tropo gia thn opoiadhpote energeia sto Irak. Kai stoys dyo htan emfanhs o distagmos na synexisoyme mia poreia, opws diagrafotan mexri twra, xwris na exei kerdiqei h symparastash ths koinhs gnwmhs. Gi` ayto, allwste, eipan kai oi HPA oti arxizei mia diplwmatikh prospaqeia, wste na metapeistoyn kai oloi oi alloi symmaxoi gia thn anagkaiothta ayjhmenhs pieshs sto Santam h kai gia kapoia stratiwtikh parembash, opws aytoi pisteyoyn. Yparxei, epomenws -katelhje o Prwqypoyrgos- asafeia gia to mellon. Stis 5 Febroyarioy qa doyme poia mporei na einai ayth h synexeia.

Oson afora to Kypriako, einai gnwsto oti o k. Ntenktas emmenei sthn adiallajia toy. Epomenws, h epiteyjh lyshs ws stis 28 Febroyarioy toy 2003 qa einai ejairetika dyskolh. O k. Klhridhs eixe thn ekth synanthsh me ton k. Ntenktas, aney apotelesmatos. Ayto poy einai pio endiaferon einai oti o k. Nte Soto kai ta Hnwmena Eqnh aisqanontai oti briskontai se adiejodo kai yparxoyn skeceis gia allagh ths diadikasias, h opoia akoloyqhqhke. Eixame pei kai palaiotera -kai ayto epibebaiwnetai- oti, prwta ap` ola, kyriarxei h skech na paroysiastoyn kapoies nees protaseis h na paroysiastei ena trito sxedio, to opoio bebaiws enexei kindynoys. Dioti, ean qeloyn na metapeisoyn toys Toyrkokyprioys, mporei ta Hnwmena Eqnh -kai ayto qa einai arnhtiko- na proboyn se kapoies ryqmiseis poy den qa einai apodektes apo thn ellhnokypriakh pleyra. Xreiazetai, loipon, poly prosoxh sth diapragmateysh. Alla, pera kai apo ayto, yparxei h skech mhpws ginei ena dhmochfisma stis dyo koinothtes, prin thn ypografh apo toys dyo hgetes. O k. Klhridhs exei ekfrastei arnhtika se ayth thn prooptikh. To qema prepei na to prosejoyme, giati an ginei kati tetoio mporei na prokycoyn diafores ejelijeis, poy piqanon kai aytes me th seira toys na dyskolecoyn thn ellhnokypriakh pleyra. Symperasmatika, yparxei kinhtikothta kai prepei na perimenoyme tis ejelijeis, idiaitera meta tis synanthseis poy qa exei o k. Nte Soto sthn Agkyra.

O Prwqypoyrgos anaferqhke, epishs, sth synexish ths skandalologias apo th N.D., h opoia proetoimazei me ton tropo ayto th syzhthsh, poy qa ginei thn Trith sth Boylh. Epanelabe oti emeis proxwroyme stis kateyqynseis poy exoyme orisei. Tonise oti shmera dhmosieyqhke stis efhmerides reportaz, symfwna me to opoio exei sygkentrwqei sthn Eisaggelia toy Areioy Pagoy terastio yliko poy diabibasan oi eisaggeleis Efetwn olhs ths xwras -prokeitai gia polles ekatontades ypoqeseis- antapokrinomenoi sto aithma toy k. Kroystallakh na ton enhmerwsoyn analytika gia tis ypoqeseis diaspaqishs toy dhmosioy xrhmatos kai thn prowqhsh twn sxetikwn ereynwn apo th Dikaiosynh. Oles aytes oi ypoqeseis (peripoy 1.500) einai sta dikasthria, xarh stis energeies twn elegktikwn arxwn kai ths kybernhshs. Den proekycan, epeidh kapoioi eisaggeleis diereynhsan gegonota kai odhghsan ypoqeseis sto dikasthrio. Yparxoyn sygkekrimenes kathgories apo toys elegktikoys mhxanismoys ths kybernhshs, opws to SDOE. Epiprosqeta, to yliko ayto sygkentrwqhke ystera apo aithma mas na yparxei kentrikh parakoloyqhsh apo thn Eisaggelia toy Areioy Pagoy, wste h diereynhsh twn ypoqesewn aytwn na mhn apotelmatwnetai. Mesa se ayto to plaisio, polloi ypoyrgoi -metajy aytwn kai o ypoyrgos Oikonomias kai Oikonomikwn k. Xristodoylakhs- ekanan anafora pros ton k. Kroystallakh gia to oti proxwrei me idiaitera argoys ryqmoys h ypoqesh ths ETBA. Olh ayth h kinhtikothta einai apodeijh ths qelhshs ths kybernhshs, me entolh toy Prwqypoyrgoy, gia ejygiansh. Einai apodeijh ths kinhtikothtas twn elegktikwn arxwn. Ta ariqmhtika stoixeia einai endeiktika, idiaitera an ta sygkrinoyme me tis alles periodoys. Aytes oi 1.500 ypoqeseis apodeiknyoyn poso exei drasthriopoihqei o mhxanismos, poso proxwra o elegxos se baqos, poso eimaste apofasismenoi na ejasfalisoyme th diafaneia se oloys toys tomeis, na antiparateqoyme me oles tis esties diafqoras, opoy ki an yparxoyn. Na epimeinoyme, bebaiws, sth grhgorh ekdikash kai timwria, opoy ayto diapistwnetai.

To deytero shmeio einai oi ekbiasmoi dhmosiografwn enanti politwn. O Prwqypoyrgos tonise oti prepei na jekaqarisei ayth h ypoqesh, to taxytero. Ayth h ypoqesh proekyce giati h idia h kybernhsh esteile ston eisaggelea stoixeia kai plhrofories poy eixe parei gi` ayto to qema.

Trith ypoqesh einai to podosfairo, o aqlhtismos. Edw, qelw na qymisw oti h drastikh parembash twn elegktikwn arxwn egine dynath, logw enos nomoy ton opoio chfise ayth h kybernhsh kai me bash ayto to nomo arxisame thn parembash kai qa synexisoyme, opws tonisan xqes o k. Benizelos kai o k. Lianhs.

Ola ayta, bebaia, ta opoia kanoyme, synodeyontai apo kapoia prospaqeia apoprosanatolismoy poy kanei h N.D. Orismenoi grafoyn, gia paradeigma, oti einai propetasma kapnoy gia na sygkalycoyme kybernhtikes adynamies. Ayto einai asteio. H skandalologia einai to propetasma kapnoy ths N.D. gia na apokrycei thn programmatikh endeia ths, thn adynamia ths na arqrwsei programmatiko logo kai qeseis se ola ta epipeda. H programmatikh endeia kai h arnhsh ths N.D. fanhke kaqara sthn ypoqesh toy asymbibastoy, opoy h N.D. katachfise to nomosxedio ths kybernhshs, xwris na jerei oyte giati to kanei, oyte kai poia einai h qesh ths. Den mas to eipe pote. Htan kata, alla den jerei giati prepei na einai kata kai den jerei ti prepei na yperaspisei. Ayto -tonise o Prwqypoyrgos- prepei na to anadeijoyme, giati etsi apodeiknyetai oti h ajiwmatikh antipoliteysh den exei na prosferei sth xwra tipote oysiastiko, diaforetiko, tipote kainoyrgio. Ekeino poy prosferei einai arnhsh. Kai h ypoqesh toy asymbibastoy to apodeiknyei. Oson afora emas, opoy xreiazontai tomes tis kanoyme. Proxwroyme staqera, para tis antidraseis, giati qeloyme o dhmosios bios na exei diafanh leitoyrgia, na mhn yparxei qesh gia drasthriothtes poy den synodeyontai apo thn plhrh prostasia toy dhmosioy symferontos.

Parakalw, tis erwthseis sas.

MIXAHL: Poio einai to sxolio ths kybernhshs kai ean ekane anafora o Prwqypoyrgos sthn kinhsh twn '8' eyrwpaikwn xwrwn, pente melwn ths E.E. kai triwn ypo entajh xwrwn, na bgaloyn koinh diakhryjh me thn opoia tassontai oysiastika sto pleyro twn Amerikanwn se oles aytes tis diergasies gia ton polemo sto Irak;

PRWTOPAPAS: H qesh ths E.E., epomenws kai h qesh ths Proedrias ekfrazetai apo thn omofwnh apofash twn '15', h opoia sygkerazei tis apoceis olwn panw sto qema. H E.E. exei oso pote thn anagkh na akoloyqhsei mia koinh stash panw se ena idiaitera krisimo dieqnes problhma, opws einai to problhma toy Irak. Qelw na tonisw oti ayth h koinh stash epidiwxqhke apo thn arxh apo thn Ellhnikh Proedria. Exoyme thn apofash ths Deyteras. Emeis emmenoyme stis kateyqynseis ayths ths apofashs, h opoia sygkerazei tis apoceis olwn. Ayth einai h apofash ths E.E. Yparxei h anagkh, yparxei h qelhsh na epimeinoyme staqera sthn anazhthsh mias koinhs poreias ths Eyrwphs se ena idiaitera krisimo zhthma.

MIXAHL: Epitrecte moy na synexisw, kat` arxhn pote to maqate eseis, ws Proedria, exei shmasia ayto. Edw den milame gia mia kybernhsh poy emaqe kati sto dromo, milame gia thn Proedria ths E.E.. Kata deyteron lete oti epimenete sthn kateyqynsh ths apofashs ths Deyteras kai oti ekfrazetai h qesh ths E.E. apo th qesh twn '15@. An oi pente apo toys '15' erxontai kai kanoyn kati diko toys jexwristo me diaforetikh kateyqynsh apo ayto poy eipate th Deytera, pws to sxoliazete;

PRWTOPAPAS: H apofash twn '15' - to tonisa ayto- sygkerazei tis apoceis olwn. Einai mia apofash poy lambanei ypoch oti yparxoyn kai diaforetikes optikes se orismena melh, alla ekei oles oi apoceis exoyn sygkerastei se ena eniaio keimeno poy dinei safeis kateyqynseis. Ayto den shmainei -kai den yparxei kanenas tropos na to empodiseis- oti mia xwra den mporei na ekfrasei oloklhrwmena th dikh ths optikh. Ayto, omws, epishs den shmainei oti den isxyei h apofash ths Deyteras. H apofash ths Deyteras, opws kai oles oi apofaseis ths E.E., sygkerazoyn oles tis apoceis kai -kamia fora- diaforetikes optikes. Otan, omws, exoyme symfwnhsei kapoy prepei na emmenoyme se ayto poy exoyme symfwnhsei kai na to akoloyqoyme, prokeimenoy na to feroyme se peras. H prwtoboylia, h opoia analhfqhke apo tis epimeroys aytes xwres, einai sto plaisio toy S.A. toy OHE kai bebaiws den shmainei oti aytes oi xwres den chfisan th Deytera to sxetiko keimeno kai thn apofash ths E.E.. Kaqe allo malista. Sas eipa oti den kryboyme pws prokeitai gia ena keimeno sygkerasmoy. An hmastan monoi mas, piqanon to keimeno na htan diaforetiko. Omws, o rolos ths Proedrias einai na enwnei apoceis, na briskei koinoys stoxoys, na anadeiknyei lyseis poy mporei na dhmioyrghsoyn th symfwnia olwn twn xwrwn-melwn ths E.E., h opoia proxwrei, pairnei apofaseis kai tis efarmozei, estw kai an yparxoyn diaforetikes optikes sto eswteriko ths. Den einai h prwth fora poy ginetai ayto. Se oles tis apofaseis twn Symboyliwn Koryfhs yphrjan diafwnies kai sto telos chfisan oloi mazi. Ayto den shmainei oti den eixan thn optikh toys. Shmainei oti yphrje anagkh enos sygkerasmoy. Den shmainei oti den eipan thn apoch toys kai dhmosia. Safws thn eipan. Kai ayto den einai antiqesmiko. Alla sto telos yphrje sygkerasmos poy apotelese thn apofash ths E.E., thn opoia akoloyqhsan.

MIXAHL: Kat` arxhn, den moy apanthsate pote to maqate eseis ws Proedria@

PRWTOPAPAS: To maqame. Den htan idiaitera dyskolo na to maqoyme.

MIXAHL: Dyskolo mporei na mhn einai, alla prosejte ti symbainei, otan apo th Deytera mexri xqes eginan oi diapragmateyseis twn '8' aytwn xwrwn, katalhgoyn se ayth thn protash kai eseis den exete, ws Proedria, mia antidrash kai na peite giati kyrioi kanete, estw@

PRWTOPAPAS: Pws ennoeite thn antidrash ths Proedrias;

MIXAHL: Den qa sas ypagoreysw egw politikh@

PRWTOPAPAS: Sas parakalw. Kat` arxas, qa prepei na antilhfqeite pws leitoyrgei h E.E..

MIXAHL: Plhrws.

PRWTOPAPAS: An qymaste, loipon, h E.E. den desmeyei mia xwra ths na pei thn apoch ths.

MIXAHL: Jerete ti mas eipate, oti hrqan sto Symboylio ths Deyteras, eipan tis apoceis toys, tis ejefrasan kai dhmosia kai katalhjate se ena keimeno@

PRWTOPAPAS: To keimeno isxyei.

MIXAHL: Isxyei to keimeno, alla thn idia wra, oi idies xwres eipan poly wraia, as ftiajoyme allo keimeno. Ayto rwtw pws to sxoliazete;

PRWTOPAPAS: To keimeno poy ferei thn ypografh olwn twn xwrwn -kai exei shmasia ayto- dinei safeis kateyqynseis gia th drash olhs ths E.E., alla kai gia ton tropo me ton opoio qa ginoyn oi xeirismoi enocei toy S.A. kai apo thn Proedria. Kai einai safes ayto. Omws, ayto den shmainei oti kapoioi den exoyn dikaiwma na epilejoyn kai na ekfrasoyn thn apoch toys se ena qema, to opoio, en telei, den antistrateyetai to keimeno.

MIXAHL: Den to antistrateyetai;

PRWTOPAPAS: Den to antistrateyetai, ypo mia genikh ennoia.

I. KAMPOYRAKHS: Sto politiko pedio qewreite oti meta apo ayth thn kinhsh twn '8' kai ayto to keimeno, dyskoleyoyn oi prospaqeies ths Ellhnikhs Proedrias gia thn ejeyresh koinhs stashs, koinhs lyshs;

PRWTOPAPAS: Dyskolies se ayto to qema yphrxan apo thn arxh, dioti yphrxan polles kai diaforetikes apoceis. To qema einai oti h Ellhnikh Proedria katebale poly megales prospaqeies, oi opoies katelhjan se mia prwth epityxia th Deytera gia na ejasfalistei mia koinh stash. An me rwtate, an qa synexistoyn oi dyskolies, apantw eyqews nai. An me rwtate, an h Ellhnikh Proedria qa synexisei tis prospaqeies ths, sas apantw oti einai apofasismenh na to kanei, giati pisteyoyme baqia pws h Enwmenh Eyrwph prepei na exei mia koinh stash apenanti sta megala dieqnh problhmata. Kai epeidh to pisteyoyme qa ejantlhsoyme tis prospaqeies mas pros ayth thn kateyqynsh, me synexeis prwtoboylies. Se telikh analysh o kaqenas krinetai.

IWANNOY: Alhqeyei oti o Prwqypoyrgos enhmerwqhke gi` ayto to qema apo ton Oyggro Prwqypoyrgo kai ean sthn kat` idian synanthsh poy eixan toy eipe kati gi` ayto to qema;

PRWTOPAPAS: O Prwqypoyrgos enhmerwqhke. Qa moy epitrecete na meinoyme edw. Eixe enhmerwqei hdh. O Prwqypoyrgos enhmerwqhke xqes.

TAKHS: Oi Prwqypoyrgoi twn xwrwn poy ypegracan ayth thn apofash, prin katalhjoyn sto na syntaxqei ayto to keimeno eixan kapoia epikoinwnia me ton k. Shmith, mias kai einai o proedreywn ths E.E.; Ton enhmerwsan h o Prwqypoyrgos to emaqe afoy syntaxqhke to keimeno, afoy parqhke h apofash;

PRWTOPAPAS: Eipa o,ti eixa na pw.

TAKHS: Nai, alla den mas apanthsate.

PRWTOPAPAS: Eipa o,ti eixa na pw gia thn enhmerwsh sas. Ekeino poy prepei na krathsoyme einai to qema oysias. Ti leei to qema oysias; Leei oti yparxoyn sobares dyskolies kai polles apoceis sto zhthma ths stashs ths Eyrwphs apenanti sto Irak. Leei oti h Ellada ws Proedria ths E.E. ekane megales prospaqeies gia na yparjei koinh apofash. H apofash ayth elhfqh th Deytera kai isxyei. O dromos einai eykolos; Oxi. Yparxoyn kai qa yparxoyn sobares dyskolies apo tis diaforetikes apoceis. Omws, qa synexisoyme na analambanoyme prwtoboylies. Einai swsto na exei h E.E. eniaia stash; Nai, giati ayto qeloyn oi laoi ths. Epiballetai na exei mia koinh ejwterikh politikh kai politikh asfaleias. Ayto epitassei h logikh mias pragmatika enwmenhs Eyrwphs. Emeis, staqeroi se ayth thn ideologia, se aytes tis arxes, se aytoys toys stoxoys, synexizoyme tis prwtoboylies. Kai einai qetiko to gegonos oti yphrje h prwth epityxia ths Deyteras. To keimeno ayto isxyei, oi qeseis aytes isxyoyn.

TAKHS: Epimenoyme sto qema ths hmeromhnias gia enan aplo logo: Dioti h antipoliteysh sas kathgorei oti oi xwres poy ypegracan den lambanoyn ypoch toys thn Ellhnikh Proedria kai den thn enhmerwnoyn kai kanoyn o,ti qeloyn.

PRWTOPAPAS: H antipoliteysh kai eidika h N.D. qa prepei na stamathsei na xairetai kaqe fora poy yparxoyn problhmata sthn Eyrwph kai epiteloys na katalabei oti monon an syntaxqei me tis kybernhtikes prospaqeies qa mporei h xwra na emfanizetai apolyta isxyrh stis dieqneis prwtoboylies poy analambanei. As mas pei h antipoliteysh poia einai h qesh ths gia to Irak. Den mas to exei pei mexri twra. As mas pei h N.D., qelei polemo h oxi; As mas pei, epiteloys, h kata ta alla lalistath N.D. kai oloi aytoi poy bgainoyn sta kanalia ek meroys ths, poies einai oi apoceis toys gia th stash ths Eyrwphs sto qema. Poies einai oi apoceis toys gia th stash twn HPA. Poies einai oi apoceis toys gia to an prepei na yparjei h oxi epembash sto Irak kai katw apo poia dedomena. As mas pei, epiteloys, mia qesh h N.D.. As stamathsei na apodynamwnei th xwra sto ejwteriko kai as katalabei oti h Proedria den einai ypoqesh poy afora ena komma, alla afora to Eqnos, th xwra, thn Ellada. Einai mikrocyxh kai aparadekth, gia mia akomh fora, h stash ths N.D.. Einai poly ligh mprosta stis ejelijeis.

POYLIDOY: Yparxei qesmoqethmenh mia diadikasia poy legetai "enisxymenh synergasia", opoy orismenes xwres-melh mporoyn na synennohqoyn metajy toys gia na ekfrasoyn mia diaforetikh apoch, afoy dexqoyn kai thn omofwnh gnwmh twn ypoloipwn hgetwn. Oi pente aytes xwres, jerete an akoloyqhsan ayth th qesmikh diadikasia;

PRWTOPAPAS: Epanalambanw pws, profanws oi pente aytes xwres synennohqhkan me tis alles treis, me dikh toys prwtoboylia. Ayto einai safes.

KARGOYDH: Stis prwtes anafores poy mas metaferate apo thn eishghsh toy Prwqypoyrgoy, lete oti oi k. Mpler kai Mperloyskoni ejefrasan ena distagmo gia th synexish ths poreias kai oti qa prepei na lhfqei ...

PRWTOPAPAS: Gia th synexish ths poreias ths epembashs. Gia thn epembash milw.

KARGOYDH: Ayto hqela na rwthsw, giati den htan poly safes. Dhladh, diapistwqhke mia diastash me tis koines gnwmes twn xwrwn;

PRWTOPAPAS: Eipa oti epeshmanan oi idioi pws qelei pollh prosoxh h diamorfwsh ths koinhs gnwmhs kai sth xwra toys kai se olh thn Eyrwph, se periptwsh poy akoloyqhqei mia poreia pros thn epembash. Dhladh, diapistwsan kai oi idioi pws ayth h poreia -pros thn epembash ennow- synanta sobares antistaseis, problhmatismoys kai kritikh apo toys idioys toys eyrwpaikoys laoys. Ayto eipwqhke.

ELENOPOYLOS: Qelw na rwthsw dyo pragmata. To prwto einai, ean yparxei -epeidh o xronos einai mikros kai mporei na mhn yparxei- mia prwth ektimhsh gia thn katastash, ayth thn wra, sthn E.E., an laboyme ypoch oti yparxoyn se ejelijh diadikasies kai qesmikoy xarakthra. Kai to deytero, hdh, diatypwqhke apo eyrwpaioys paragontes -qa anaferqw se enan apo aytoys, se eyrwboyleyth kai malista ellhnikhs katagwghs- oti yparxei ena qesmiko qema gia thn Eyrwph, prwto, kai deytero, oti yparxei ena qema poy afora tis treis nees xwres apo tis pente oi opoies omonohsan, poly perissotero epeidh den exei oloklhrwqei kai h qesmikh entajh toys, as to poyme etsi. Ekei, poia einai h skech poy epikratei se sas, twra;

PRWTOPAPAS: Oi treis xwres enhrghsan ws treis kratikes ontothtes. Den eixan ejalloy kamia ypoxrewsh.

ELENOPOYLOS: Oxi, dhladh, ws xwres poy entassontai sthn E.E.

PRWTOPAPAS: Den exei ypografh h diadikasia akomh.

ELENOPOYLOS: Gi` ayto rwtw. Poly perissotero ayto...

PRWTOPAPAS: Apo ekei kai pera, den exw kanena logo na tis krinw ayth th stigmh, oyte na sthrixqw se plhrofories poy edwse kapoios eyrwboyleyths se kapoion. Oi qesmikes diadikasies ths Proedrias synexizontai. Kai to keimeno ths Deyteras isxyei kai nees prwtoboylies qa yparjoyn gyrw apo ayto kai o k. Papandreoy, sto genikotero plaisio twn prwtoboyliwn ths Proedrias, einai shmera -sas ypenqymizw- sthn Agkyra.

TRIANTAFYLLOY: Gnwrizete to periexomeno ths synanthshs toy Amerikanoy presbh me ton ypoyrgo Ejwterikwn; Doqhke h entypwsh espeysmenhs kai programmatismenhs synanthshs, ligo prin apo thn apostolh.

PRWTOPAPAS: Den htan dynath h epikoinwnia moy me ton k. Papandreoy. Pantws, apo o,ti eida kai apo thn enhmerwsh toy k. Mpeglith den yparxei sxetikh anafora.

KACIWTHS: Exei zhthqei apo tis ellhnikes Arxes h adeia na katapleysei sth Soyda galliko pyrhnokinhto aeroplanoforo;

PRWTOPAPAS: Qa enhmerwqw kai qa sas apanthsw.

KACIWTHS: Oi plhrofories anaferoyn oti qa katapleysei gyrw stis 21 Febroyarioy.

PRWTOPAPAS: Qa rwthsw kai qa sas pw, alla den blepw na yparxei kapoio eidiko problhma.

MIXAHL: Sas qymizw oti ekkremei meres twra analogh apanthsh sto erwthma moy.........

PRWTOPAPAS: Opws gnwrizete h Gallia einai kata twn epembasewn.

I. KAMPOYRAKHS: Meta apo mia synedriash toy Ypoyrgikoy Symboylioy, qa hqele na sas rwthsw, eipwqhke apo ton Prwqypoyrgo, kati sxetika me th leitoyrgia toy kommatos, giati polla dhmosieymata blepoyme ton teleytaio kairo, poy dhmosieyoyn kai onomata, apo th mia o Grammateas toy kommatos kai apo thn allh alla stelexh. Yparxei kapoio idiaitero problhma;

PRWTOPAPAS: Blepw diafora dhmosieymata kai kata parekklish ths synhqeias poy akoloyqw edw, qa kanw mia prwth kai teleytaia anafora, gia na jekaqarisoyme mia kai kalh, ola ayta poy legontai kai grafontai. Den yparxei kanena problhma sth synergasia toy Prwqypoyrgoy kai Proedroy toy PASOK me ton Grammatea toy Kinhmatos Kwsta Laliwth. H synergasia einai ef olhs ths ylhs kai yparxei enas apo koinoy sxediasmos proteraiothtwn kai drasewn toy Kinhmatos. To E.G., poy synedriase th Deytera, meta apo enan ploysio kai polywro dialogo, katelhje omofwna -kai ayto exei megalh shmasia- se ena sxedio gia thn anasygkrothsh toy kommatos kai tis politikes prwtoboylies toy epomenoy diasthmatos. Yparxei stenh synergasia toy Grammatea toy Kinhmatos me ola ta stelexh toy E.G., metajy twn opoiwn bebaiws, einai kai o k. Mixalhs Neonakhs, o opoios drasthriopoieitai apokleistika mesa sto komma.

MIXAHL: H kybernhsh mporei na mas diafwtisei se ena qema. Exei ginei gaitanaki to ean mporei h den mporei, logw nomikwn kwlymatwn, na eispraxqei h perifhmh apozhmiwsh apo ton tews. Kai sas rwtw gia ton ejhs logo....

PRWTOPAPAS: Den exoyme kamia agwnia.

MIXAHL: Oyte emeis exoyme agwnia. Alla, ekproswpos toy tews dhlwse shmera oti ola ayta poy lete kai kanete, oti yparxei h oxi problhma, den yfistantai apo thn apoch toy tews, rwthste thn kybernhsh giati den ta eisprattoyme; Ayto einai to erwthma moy.

PRWTOPAPAS: H kybernhsh exei dwsei ta xrhmata, exoyn tamieyqei kai den mas endiaferei ti kanei h ti leei h pws drasthriopoieitai o tews. Einai diko toy qema. Ej oswn gnwrizw eyrwpaios poliths einai kai exei ola ta dikaiwmata.

POYLIDOY: Hqela na sas zhthsw na plhroforhqeite ean ejakoloyqei na krateitai o kapetanios toy ``PRESTIZ'' xwris na toy exei apaggelqei kathgoria apo tis ispanikes arxes;

PRWTOPAPAS: Qa enhmerwqw kai qa sas apanthsw.

TRIANTAFYLLOY: Opws eipate, o Prwqypoyrgos anefere oti xarh stis energeies twn elegktikwn arxwn ths kybernhshs ayth th stigmh yparxoyn hdh 1500 ypoqeseis sta xeria twn armodiwn eisaggelikwn arxwn. Ejefrase o Prwqypoyrgos problhmatismo gia to gegonos oti epi twn hmerwn toy PASOK shmeiwqhke enas toso megalos pragmati -opws ki eseis eipate- ariqmos kroysmatwn diafqoras kai paranomiwn sto Dhmosio;

PRWTOPAPAS: Qa elega oti einai poly shmantiko, oti epi twn hmerwn mas, apokalyptetai kai stelnetai ston Eisaggelea enas megalos ariqmos kroysmatwn kai qematwn diafqoras. To qema einai oti epi allwn kybernhsewn yphrxan polla tetoia kroysmata, alla den phgainan sto Eisaggelea.

KANELLOPOYLOS: Pali to parelqon....;

PRWTOPAPAS: Den einai parelqon h periodos 1990-1993, giati den apexei oyte 10 xronia. Oloi oi politikoi einai parontes, einai stelexh kai boyleytes ths N.D. Den einai ektos politikhs aytoi oi anqrwpoi. H periodos ekeinh synebale sto na apokalyfqoyn para polla pragmata, ta opoia mporoyme na ta poyme ean qelete. Oydepote yphrje stigmh poy na poyme oti den yparxoyn kroysmata diafqoras sto dhmosio tomea. Se ayth edw thn aiqoysa exw pei 4 h 5 fores mexri twra oti yparxoyn tomeis @qylakes eixa pei xarakthristika- sto dhmosio tomea, opoy shmeiwnontai kroysmata diafqoras. Eixa pei oti eimaste apofasismenoi @orismenh merida toy Typoy to sxoliase- na fqasei to maxairi sto kokalo kai na ejygianoyme ola ayta ta kyklwmata. H yparjh pollwn ypoqesewn poy stelnontai ston Eisaggelea kai to qarros ths kybernhshs @prwtofanes gia ta ellhnika xronika- poy bgainei kai leei oti prepei o Eisaggeleas na dwsei apanthsh stis ypoqeseis aytes kai zhta apo ton Eisaggelea toy Areioy Pagoy na elegjei o idios thn poreia toys, deixnei thn apofasistikothta mas gia thn ejygiansh toy dhmosioy bioy.

KANELLOPOYLOS: Eipate polles fores oti isxyei h apofash twn ``15'', h apofash ths Deyteras. Qa hqela na moy peite, pws ektima h Proedria to gegonos, oti mia metagenesterh apofash twn 5 ek twn "15"....

PRWTOPAPAS: Qa hqela na diabasete to keimeno, to opoio den anairei thn apofash twn "15". Yphrje enas sygkerasmos -to omologhsa apo thn arxh, den to ekryca- diaforetikwn apocewn. Ean kapoios qelei, pera apo th chfo poy edwse, na diatypwsei kai thn apoch toy se parapleyro qema poy syndeetai me to prwto, alla den einai to idio, ayto den mporoyme na to apagoreysoyme. Ekeino, omws, poy mporoyme na poyme anoixta kai kaqara, einai oti o sygkerasmos yparxei. H apofash yparxei kai qa sas pw ti qa kanoyme emeis. Apo thn arxh eixame mia filosofia: H E.E. den mporei na einai ``oyra'' kanenos. Prepei na exei logo kai rolo kai prwtoboylies se oles tis ejelijeis. Qa emmeinoyme se ayth thn kateyqynsh me synexeis prwtoboylies. Qeloyme na pisteyoyme oti den qa breqoyn orismenoi apo to eswteriko ths xwras poy qa prospaqhsoyn na apodynamwsoyn tis synexeis parembaseis, tis prwtoboylies kai th qelhsh ths ellhnikhs Proedrias. Prwta ap` ola, einai h xwra. Einai h Ellada kai h prooptikh ths stoys kolpoys ths E.E. Ayto prepei na to skefqoyn kala.

KANELLOPOYLOS: H apofash twn 5 enisxyei thn apofash twn "15";

PRWTOPAPAS: Den qa kanw peraiterw sxoliasmo, ej aitias toy sebasmoy kai ths baqias emmonh mas, sthn pisth ths koinhs poreias twn 15, sto megalytero dynato baqmo poy mporoyme na thn ejasfalisoyme.

Sas eyxaristw.

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