Greek Government Press Briefing, 02-06-25

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

YPOYRGEIO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

Aqhna, 25 Ioynioy 2002

JENOY TYPOY APO TON YPOYRGO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

KAI KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO XRHSTO PRWTOPAPA

Geia sas.

Na sas enhmerwsw gia to programma toy Prwqypoyrgoy:

Prin apo ligo, o Prwqypoyrgos mazi me thn politikh hgesia toy ypoyrgeioy Ygeias kai Pronoias, episkefqhke to Eqniko Kentro Koinwnikhs Bohqeias. Stis 13.30, qa exei synanthsh me ton presbh ths Kinas sthn Aqhna. Stis 14.30 qa synanthqei me ton ypoyrgo Oikonomias kai Oikonomikwn Niko Xristodoylakh kai ton ypoyrgo Eswterikwn, Dhmosias Dioikhshs kai Apokentrwshs Kwsta Skandalidh, me qema thn politikh misqwn sto Dhmosio. Stis 19.30, qa synedriasei to epikoinwniako epiteleio. Opws gnwrizete anakoinwseis den qa yparjoyn.

Thn Tetarth, stis 10 to prwi, qa exei synanthsh me ton ypoyrgo Oikonomias kai Oikonomikwn Niko Xristodoylakh. Stis 12 to meshmeri, me ton yfypoyrgo Sygkoinwniwn kai ypochfio Dhmarxo Qessalonikhs Spyro Boygia. Stis 12.30 me ton ypoyrgo Eswterikwn Kwsta Skandalidh. Stis 13.30 qa yparjei mia mikth ypoyrgikh kai kommatikh syskech, me antikeimeno thn proetoimasia ths episkechs toy Prwqypoyrgoy sthn Prebeza kai thn Arta.

Thn Pempth, stis 9.30 to prwi, qa exei synanthsh me ton ekproswpo ths DOE k. Osbalnt. Stis 10 to prwi, qa synedriasei h Kybernhtikh Epitroph. Qa ejetasei prwton, tis arxes ths forologikhs metarryqmishs me eishghth ton ypoyrgo Oikonomias kai Oikonomikwn Niko Xristodoylakh kai deyteron, qemata metanasteyshs kai laqrometanasteyshs me eishghtes ton ypoyrgo Dhmosias Tajhs Mixalh Xrysoxoidh kai -gia thn eyrwpaikh optikh toy qematos- ton ypoyrgo Anaplhrwth Ejwterikwn Taso Giannitsh.

Thn Paraskeyh, stis 10 to prwi, o Prwqypoyrgos qa ginei dektos apo ton Proedro ths Dhmokratias, prokeimenoy na ton enhmerwsei gia tis ejelijeis sta eyrwpaika qemata kai eidikotera gia to qema toy ESDP, toy legomenoy eyrwstratoy. Sth synexeia, epikefalhs kybernhtikoy klimakioy qa anaxwrhsei gia episkech stoys nomoys Prebezas kai Artas. Thn Paraskeyh qa brisketai sthn Prebeza kai to Sabbato qa episkefqei thn Arta.

Thn Kyriakh, kata pasa piqanothta, qa episkefqei th giorth neolaias toy PASOK, sto Renth.

Thn epomenh ebdomada problepontai: Episkech toy Prwqypoyrgoy sthn Oykrania (2 kai 3 Ioylioy). H dihmerh Panelladikh Syndiaskech toy PASOK, me aixmh ta organwtika qemata, alla kai genikotera qemata politikhs. Synedriash toy Eqnikoy Symboylioy gia thn Topikh Aytodioikhsh, thn epomenh Kyriakh, amesws meta thn eqnikh syndiaskech. Opws blepete, qa yparxei idiaiterh drasthriothta kai thn epomenh ebdomada.

Parakalw, tis erwthseis sas.

MIXAHL: Elpizw na ginoyn ola sto idio meros kai mias kai moy dinete to logo, na sas rwthsw kati tetrimmeno poy omws den payei na exei panta to endiaferon toy: Blepoyn to fws ths dhmosiothtas dhmoskophseis poy den einai eynoikes gia thn kybernhsh. Plhrofories anaferoyn oti yparxoyn kai alles dhmoskophseis, oi opoies kai aytes den qa einai eynoikes.

PRWTOPAPAS: Tis jerete;

MIXAHL: Etsi legetai. Sas eipa, ti anaferoyn plhrofories. Exete eseis kapoio sxolio na kanete;

PRWTOPAPAS: Na giati, qa prepei epiteloys na yparjei enas Kwdikas Deontologias gyrw apo tis anakoinwseis twn dhmoskophsewn, gia na stamathsei ayto to "lene" kai "plhrofories anaferoyn".

MIXAHL: Afoy to qigete, omws, h dikh sas prwtoboylia poy htan meta to Pasxa exei kaqysterhsei.

PRWTOPAPAS: Den exei kaqysterhsei, proetoimazetai. Qelei pollh prosoxh. Kanoyme mia prasinh biblo sthn arxh, dhladh mia diapistwsh toy problhmatos kai anaptyjh piqanwn lysewn. Qa kalesoyme se dialogo oloys toys endiaferomenoys, giati ayta ta qemata xrhzoyn idiaiterhs prosoxhs. Doyleyoyme ayth th stigmh. Alla na apanthsw sto politiko erwthma sas, dioti den protiqemai oyte na amfisbhthsw kamia dhmoskophsh, oyte na antidikhsw me kanenan: Kaqe mia apo aytes tis etaireies kanei th doyleia ths kai qelw na pisteyw oti thn kanei kala. Oles aytes oi dhmoskophseis -kai aytes poy eidan to fws ths dhmosiothtas, alla fantazomai kai oi ypoloipes- katagrafoyn, opws panta, thn aisqhsh poy yparxei sthn koinh gnwmh, toys problhmatismoys toy laoy kata th sygkekrimenh periodo. Gnwrizete oti briskomaste se mia idiaiterh kamph toy kybernhtikoy ergoy, sto meson ths tetraetias. Qa elega oti, pera apo tis diafores poy katagrafontai metajy twn kommatwn h opoiadhpote alla stoixeia twn dhmoskophsewn -ta opoia bebaiws einai ajiopoihsima, kai ola mas problhmatizoyn kai den einai mhnymata- prepei na shmeiwsoyme kai orismena alla: Prwta apo ola oti yparxei poly megalo pososto anapofasistwn. Kai sthn teleytaia dhmoskophsh ayto exei katagrafei. Kai bebaiws, thn idia wra, to komma ths N.D. emfanizei ychlotata pososta syspeirwshs. Sxedon exei ejantlhsei th dynatothta ths na syspeirwsei ton kosmo ths. Apo thn allh pleyra, bebaiws. emfanizetai mia poly xamhlh, ews idiaitera xamhlh, ikanopoihsh toy kosmoy, oxi pia mono kritikh h problhmatismos pros thn kybernhsh, alla kai mia pantelhs elleich ikanopoihshs apo thn taktikh ths ajiwmatikhs antipoliteyshs. Kai ayto ti apodeiknyei; Oti h N.D. den mporei na apokthsei thn politikh hgemonia. H N.D. den exei qesh kai programma. O kosmos apo emas perimenei kai ayto to mhnyma stelnei: Oti einai h wra ths drashs, oti einai h wra na ylopoihsoyme apofasistika kai enwmenoi to programma mas. Einai h wra ths drashs kai ths doyleias.

I. XASAPOPOYLOS: Mia dieykrinish: Ayto poy lete "einai h wra na kanoyme to programma mas kai th drash mas", se poion akribws to lete, se poion apeyqyneste;

PRWTOPAPAS: Sas eipa oti ayto einai to mhnyma poy pairnoyme apo ton aplo polith. Den sas krybw oti xqes poy hmoyn sth Leykada, opoy ekproswphsa thn kybernhsh se mia qrhskeytikh ekdhlwsh opoy symmeteixe polys kosmos, eixa thn eykairia na milhsw me para polloys polites toy nhsioy, oi opoioi moy elegan ayto to mhnyma: "perimenoyme na proxwrhsete mprosta, einai h wra ths drashs". Kai ayto prepei na to ajiopoihsoyme, giati einai ena mhnyma poy afora oloys mas: Einai h wra ths drashs kai ths doyleias. Ayto perimenei apo emas o poliths.

I. XASAPOPOYLOS: Etsi, opws to lete, shmainei oysiastika oti h anastrofh toy klimatos ejartatai apo th sygkekrimenh symperifora deka h 20 anqrwpwn poy einai mesa sthn kybernhsh;

PRWTOPAPAS: Oxi. Milaw gia to synolo toy energoy dynamikoy ths paratajhs mas. Anaferomai sto synolo kai oxi se deka anqrwpoys. Einai ena mhnyma poy prepei oloys na mas problhmatisei kai na ekfrastei kai stis ergasies ths Syndiaskechs.

I. XASAPOPOYLOS: Mhpws exete na kanete kapoio sxolio gi` ayth th dhmoskophsh poy dinei shmera sth dhmosiothta o "Aqhna 2004" gia thn poreia twn olympiakwn ergwn kai thn proetoimasia twn Olympiakwn Agwnwn;

PRWTOPAPAS: Prepei prwta na melethsoyme th dhmoskophsh.

IWANNOY: Eipate oti ta mhnymata poy lambanete einai oti "twra einai wra drashs"...

PRWTOPAPAS: Oti o kosmos synexizei na perimenei apo emas. O kosmos den prosdoka apo th N. D. Den exei thn politikh hgemonia h allh paratajh, giati den proballei qeseis kai programmata. Kai ayto fanhke kai sto Asfalistiko.

IWANNOY: Ayto shmainei oti h kybernhsh prepei na katabalei kapoia epipleon prospaqeia, an katalabame kala, dioti gia na yparxoyn ayta ta mhnymata, shmainei oti yparxei kai kapoia "problhmatikh".

PRWTOPAPAS: Safws. An ta pragmata@

IWANNOY: Na oloklhrwsw thn erwthsh. Epeidh eida shmera kai se kapoio prwtoselido dhmosieyma, oti etoimazei o Prwqypoyrgos "sarwtikh allagh" sthn kybernhsh, meta apo tis dhmotikes ekloges, gia osoys den dwsoyn th maxh kai gia tis dhmotikes ekloges, alla kai se epipedo kybernhshs, mhpws kai ayto poy lete eseis promhnyei kapoies ejelijeis meta tis dhmotikes ekloges;

PRWTOPAPAS: Qelw na jekaqarisw me ton pio kathgorhmatiko tropo, oti den yparxei epikeimenos anasxhmatismos.

KAPPOS: Parathrhsate oti oi dhmoskophseis katagrafoyn to klima ths sygkekrimenhs periodoy. Sas problhmatizei to gegonos oti h sygkekrimenh periodos san na exei paratrabhjei; Xronika ennow.

PRWTOPAPAS: Ola osa hqela na pw, ta eipa. Kai bebaiws mas problhmatizei kaqe ti to opoio den einai qetiko. To eipa, hdh.

KAPPOS: Kai pali shmera, sthn eisodo toy ypoyrgeioy einai sygkentrwmenoi synadelfoi poy ergazontai ston omilo Androylidakh. Qelw na sas rwthsw, loipon, prwton ean egine h ypesxhmenh synanthsh sas me ton idiokthth toy sygkekrimenoy omiloy kai deyteron, pws epembainei dhmosia arxh, se sxesh me ola ta problhmata poy epikratoyn ston omilo; Anaferw ws paradeigma to gegonos oti h Astynomia den briskei ton k. Androylidakh, otan "trexoyn" aytofwres diadikasies, alla erxetai otan thn kalei o k. Androylidakhs, prokeimenoy na epembei otan oi ergazomenoi kinhtopoioyntai. Kai, deyteron, oti yphrje apo pleyras ESHEA parembash pros to SDOE, to Sabbato, an den kanw laqos, kai to SDOE, poly apla, den kinhtopoihqhke.

PRWTOPAPAS: Mhn kathgoroyme to SDOE. Qa syzhthsw me ton k. Manwlako gia na maqw ti akribws egine, giati, opws gnwrizete, apoysiaza sth Sebillh. Alla mhn kathgoroyme to SDOE. Qa enhmerwqw kai qa sas apanthsw.

KAPPOS: Plhrofories lene oti ekeinh thn wra synebainan "shmeia kai terata" sto logisthrio toy staqmoy.

PRWTOPAPAS: Qelw na sas pw oti, pragmati, synanthqhka me ton k. Androylidakh, o opoios moy eipe oti qa katabalei kaqe prospaqeia gia na einai synephs stis ypoxrewseis poy anelabe kata thn trimerh synanthsh poy pragmatopoihqhke sto ypoyrgeio Ergasias, paroysia kai ekproswpoy ths politikhs hgesias toy ypoyrgeioy Typoy. Bebaiws, den moy ekryce oti protiqetai na prospaqhsei na brei ependyth gia to radiofwniko staqmo Planet. Dioti einai safes oti mia proswrinh katastash den mporei na diaiwnizetai. Epeshmana ston k. Androylidakh oti oi ypoxrewseis poy anelabe pros toys ergazomenoys, kata th diarkeia ths syskechs poy egine sto ypoyrgeio Ergasias, prepei na ylopoihqoyn.

KARGOYDH: Gia th metanasteysh, doqentos oti exei dwsei mia synenteyjh o ypoyrgos Dhmosias Tajhs shmera, leei oti exei teqei to plafon toy ariqmoy twn metanastwn, qa hqela na rwthsw prwton, poio einai to krithrio poy sas ekane na allajete politikh enanti ths metanasteyshs; Kai an einai dynato na mas dwsete ena perigramma gia to ti exete ypoch sas;

PRWTOPAPAS: Thn Pempth prokeitai na synedriasei h Kybernhtikh Epitroph kai den mporw na prokatalabw apofaseis. Qelw, omws, na sas qymisw oti ayto poy eipe o k. Xrysoxoidhs exei eipwqei epaneilhmmena kai sth diarkeia twn synanthsewn mas exw tonisei oti h Ellada den einai xwra anoiktwn synorwn. Exoyme tonisei kat` epanalhch oti exoyme proxwrhsei se metra opws ayta twn synoriakwn fylakwn gia thn perifroyrhsh twn synorwn mas, oso kai oti exoyme ypogracei kai apaitoyme na thrhqoyn oi symfwnies kai me th geitona xwra, thn Toyrkia, gia thn epanaprowqhsh twn laqrometanastwn pros tis xwres proeleyshs toys. Einai safes oti ta pragmata ayta exoyn ginei kai eimaste apofasismenoi na epimeinoyme se ayta. Bebaiws, mporei na yparjoyn prosqeta stoixeia apo thn Kybernhtikh Epitroph. Kaqe kybernhtiko organo to opoio synedriazei bgazei kai kati kainoyrgio. Alla h politikh mas einai safhs se ayton ton tomea. H politikh mas ayth eixe dyo skelh: Gia osoys htan hdh sthn Ellada kai ergazontan, htan h nomimopoihsh toys me thn ekdosh proswrinhs kartas paramonhs kai ergasias kai ayto egine kai malista me aples diadikasies. Alla, apo ekei kai pera, na jekaqarisoyme kai pros oloys -kai ayto to kaname kai sthn E.E., alla kai sth symfwnia poy ypografhke me thn Toyrkia, alla kai pros olo ton kosmo- oti h Ellada den einai xwra anoiktwn synorwn kai oti den mporei na synexizetai h aqroa eisroh laqrometanastwn. Ara, ayto poy eipe o k. Xrysoxoidhs einai apolyta mesa sto plaisio poy exoyme xarajei.

KARGOYDH: Epeidh lete oti exoyme ypogracei dimerh symfwnia me thn Toyrkia@

PRWTOPAPAS: Exei teqei se mas kai exei apasxolhsei poly to qema kai ta organa ths E.E. Kai mhn jexnate oti qa apotelesei ena apo ta kyria zhthmata poy qa antimetwpisoyme sth diarkeia ths Ellhnikhs Proedrias.

KARGOYDH: Epeidh, loipon, o k. Xrysoxoidhs, alla kai alloi ypoyrgoi, diapistwnoyn teleytaia oti h Toyrkia den threi tis symbatikes ypoxrewseis ths@

PRWTOPAPAS: Exei, ontws, diapistwqei ena problhma.

KARGOYDH: Qelw na rwthsw ean sth sygkekrimenh symfwnia yparxei kapoia rhtra.

PRWTOPAPAS: Opws gnwrizete se ayta ta zhthmata den mporei na yparxei rhtra. Ypotiqetai oti otan kapoios synaptei symfwnia analambanei kai thn eyqynh na thn thrhsei. Qa zhthqei kai apo th geitona xwra -kai exei hdh zhthqei- na thrhqoyn aytes oi symfwnies. Ayto einai safes. Epiballetai na thrhqei ayth h symfwnia.

I. XASAPOPOYLOS: Dinete thn entypwsh oti oloi aytoi oi sxediasmoi ginontai gia to qema ths laqrometanasteyshs kai ths metanasteyshs gia na ginei h diapragmateysh ths Ellados sta @Organa ths Eyrwpaikhs Enwshs. Kai to lew ayto giati oloi aytoi oi sxediasmoi ginontai gia na petyxete sth diapragmateysh poy kanete sto @Organa ths EE kai oxi oysiastika gia na pataxqei to fainomeno. Kai to lew ayto, giati, xqes, sth Qrakh, as poyme, egine ena apisteyto gegonos. Dhladh, bghkan oi laqrometanastes, poy htan stibagmenoi se kapoies fylakes kai etrexan mesa sta xwrafia, 2.500 anqrwpoi, kai edw syzhtame@

PRWTOPAPAS: Yparxei ena poly megalo qema sth Qrakh ayth th stigmh.

I. XASAPOPOYLOS: Den yparxei twra, yparxei poly kairo.

PRWTOPAPAS: Yparxei poly megalo qema sth Qrakh, to teleytaio diasthma. Ginetai mazikh prospaqeia eisdoxhs laqrometanastwn apo ton Ebro. Einai ena pragmatiko gegonos poy to exoyn katagracei kai to ypoyrgeio Dhmosias Tajhs kai h Nomarxiakh Aytodioikhsh @Ebroy, ws idiaitera anhsyxhtiko. To teleytaio diasthma, epeidh akribws exoyn lhfqei polla metra sta qalassia synora mas me peripolies toy limenikoy, me prospaqeies k.o.k., kapoioi - einai aytoi oi gnwstoi poy ekmetalleyontai ton anqrwpino pono fainetai oti kathyqynan to kyma twn laqrometanastwn apo ta boreia synora mas, sygkekrimena apo ton Ebro. Kanoyme ta adynata dynata, prokeimenoy na antimetwpisoyme ayto to problhma, lambanontas ola ta aparaithta metra kai enisxyontas ta synora mas gia na anakocoyme ayto to kyma. Qeloyme omws na tonisoyme oti kai h Toyrkia prepei na analabei tis eyqynes ths kai na thrhsei th symfwnia poy exei ypogracei.

KWNSTANTINIDHS: Qa hqela na anaferqw sto qema toy eyrwstratoy. Oi apoceis diistantai gia to ti petyxame sth Sebillh, oson afora ton eyrwstrato. Bebaia, eseis eipate oti "petyxame ayto to opoio qelame". Yparxei mia allh apoch poy leei to antiqeto kai bebaia ayto fainetai apo to gegonos oti to Keimeno ths Agkyras synexizei na yfistatai kai qa erqei sthn ellhnikh Proedria, eite allagmeno, eite opws einai. Qa hqela, epishs, me thn eykairia na moy peite ti petyxame, oson afora thn entajiakh poreia ths Kyproy, an syzhthqhke kapoy kai to Kypriako kai ti apotelesmata eixe.

PRWTOPAPAS: Exete qesei dyo erwthseis. Prwton: Me th doyleia mas kai tis prospaqeies mas toys teleytaioys eji mhnes petyxame, me tis apofaseis ths E.E. gia to ESDP, na diasfalisoyme plhrws ta eqnika symferonta. Qa perilhfqoyn, epomenws, rhtres stis apofaseis ths E.E., otan yparjei symfwnia me to NATO, symfwna me tis opoies qa diasfalizontai plhrws ta eqnika mas symferonta. Katalabainete, bebaiws, oti ayth th stigmh exoyme mia praktikh dyskolia. Poia einai h praktikh dyskolia; Oti den mporei h E.E. na anakoinwsei monomerws poio plaisio exei apofasisei gia tis sxeseis ths me to NATO. Omws, ayto to opoio eipame kai eipan kai oi etairoi mas einai oti, enw ek prwths ocews fainotan oti oi "14" qa epimeinoyn sto legomeno keimeno ths Agkyras -poy den htan ena qesmiko keimeno, ws plaisio sxeshs E.E. kai NATO kai monon h Ellada diafwnoyse- shmera h katastash den einai ayth. Shmera oi "15" exoyn symfwnhsei se ena sxedio gia th sxesh E.E kai NATO, gyrw apo to qema toy sxediasmoy kai ths anaptyjhs twn epixeirhsewn toy ESDP, to opoio ikanopoiei plhrws ta eqnika symferonta mas kai bebaiws efere thn Toyrkia se qesh na ekfrasei plhrws th diafwnia ths. Metatraphke, loipon, mia diafainomenh antiqesh ths Elladas me toys etairoys mas, se antiqesh ths Toyrkias me thn E.E. Ayto apotelei anamfibola mia prwth megalh epityxia. To plaisio twn "15" poy symfwnhqhke sthn E.E. kai malista omofwna, einai tetoio poy ikanopoiei plhrws ta eqnika symferonta mas. Diasfalizei plhrws ta zhthmata ths eqnikhs kyriarxias kai ta synora mas kai genikotera ta eqnika symferonta mas se ola ta zhthmata poy syndeontai me to sxediasmo kai thn anaptyjh twn epixeirhsewn toy ESDP. Gi` ayto to qema, o ypoyrgos Ejwterikwn G. Papandreoy qa enhmerwsei poly syntoma toys politikoys arxhgoys.

KWNSTANTINIDHS: An moy epitrepete, eipate oti kai oi "15" symfwnhsan. Shmainei oti symfwnhse kai h M. Bretania poy eixe ypogracei to Keimeno ths Agkyras, mazi me toys Amerikanoys;

PRWTOPAPAS: H M. Bretania to eixe dhmioyrghsei.

KWNSTANTINIDHS: Nai. Akoma perissotero, to eixe dhmioyrghsei. Dierwtwmai, oi Amerikanoi symfwnhsan me ayto to kainoyrgio eggrafo ths apofashs twn "15";

PRWTOPAPAS: Bebaiws, oi apofaseis ths E.E. aforoyn thn idia. Apo ekei kai pera, ean kapoia xwra-melos toy NATO den symfwnei, den einai eykolo na synypografei apo to NATO kai na apotelesei ena plaisio symfwnias metajy E.E.-NATO. Gi` ayto leme oti h antidrash ths Toyrkias -epeidh einai xwra-melos toy NATO- prokalese thn anagkh synexishs twn syzhthsewn. Bebaiws, se nea bash, me neo plaisio. Dioti, pleon, oi syzhthseis den ginontai me bash to legomeno "plaisio ths Agkyras", to ejwqesmiko dhladh keimeno. Qa ginontai me bash to neo plaisio poy exei dhmioyrghqei me thn apofash twn "15" sth Sebillh. Kai ayto einai poly shmantiko gia thn Ellada.

Oson afora to qema ths Kyproy, poy qesate, prepei na sas epishmanw oti sto sxedio twn apofasewn ths Synodoy Koryfhs sth Sebillh, perilambanetai, toso h diapistwsh twn "15" gia thn anagkh epilyshs toy Kypriakoy sto plaisio twn apofasewn ths Dieqnoys Koinothtas kai toy OHE, oso kai h staqerh emmonh stis apofaseis toy Elsinki gia thn entajiakh poreia ths Kyproy.

MIXAS: San proektash ths anakoinwshs poy kanate thn Pempth, sxetika me thn ekqesh toy Dieqnoys Dikasthrioy, qelw na rwthsw to ejhs: H ekqesh toy Dieqnoys Dikasthrioy stis selides 3 kai 57, anaferei jekaqara oti to kentro ths xrhmatodothshs toy stratiwtikoy mhxanismoy toy Milosebits kata th diarkeia 1994-2000 htan h Ellada kai h Kypros. Se olh ayth thn periodo, 1994-2000, oi ellhnikes arxes, h Trapeza ths Elladas, to ypoyrgeio Dikaiosynhs kai oi kybernhtikoi ekproswpoi aperriptan meta bdelygmias opoiodhpote dhmosieyma anaferotan sthn yparjh aytwn twn logariasmwn sthn Ellada. Shmera, qa mporoyse na pei kaneis oti, eite prokeitai gia oligwria twn ellhnikwn arxwn, eite gia prospaqeia sygkalychs drasthriothtwn poy parabiazan tis apofaseis toy Symboylioy ths Eyrwphs, ths E.E. kai toy Dieqnoys Dikasthrioy. Se opoiadhpote eyrwpaikh xwra qa eixe systaqei hdh epitroph gia na diereynhsei ayto to fainomeno. Eseis qa proxwrhsete;

PRWTOPAPAS: Epitrecte moy na epanalabw oti -opws tonisa kai thn Pempth- exoyme kanei ta panta gia na symbaloyme sthn prospaqeia ths Dieqnoys Koinothtas gia thn ereyna kai ton entopismo tyxon tetoiwn problhmatwn. Den mporoyme emeis na kanoyme tis sygkriseis, toys aparaithtoys sysxetismoys, dioti den exoyme oyte olh thn plhroforhsh gia tis kinhseis poy ginontan apo th Gioygkoslabia eite apo opoiadhpote allh xwra, eite apo opoiadhpote alla proswpa sto ejwteriko. Ayto mporei na to kanei monon kapoios, o opoios qa exei sta xeria toy ola ta stoixeia. O,ti mas zhthqhke exei ginei kai apo thn Trapeza ths Elladas kai apo to ypoyrgeio Dikaiosynhs. Exei ginei ereyna me paroysia dikastikwn leitoyrgwn gia ola ta stoixeia poy zhthse to Dieqnes Dikasthrio. Meta apo ta grammata poy estalhsan exei ginei ereyna kai apo thn Trapeza ths Elladas, se synergasia me ola ta pistwtika idrymata, gyrw apo aytoys toys logariasmoys. O,ti stoixeio mporesame na mazecoyme estalh stoys armodioys toy Dieqnoys Dikasthrioy. Oi sysxetismoi poy qa apodeijoyn telika ti exei symbei, prepei na ginoyn apo ekei. Dioti monon apo ekei yparxoyn analoga stoixeia apo oles tis xwres. Prokeimenoy na ejaxqoyn symperasmata, apaiteitai mia dieqnhs sysxetish sthn kinhsh twn logariasmwn aytwn kai opoiwndhpote tetoiwn stoixeiwn yparxoyn. Emeis kaname to kaqhkon mas me ton kalytero tropo kai perimenoyme ta apotelesmata poy qa yparjoyn apo aytes tis dieqneis sysxetiseis. Den nomizw oti ayth th stigmh mporoyme na kanoyme kati allo.

MIXAS: Epitrecte moy na epanelqw, oti to porisma exei bgei. To dikasthrio apofasise, yparxei to porisma, oti apo to 1994 mexri to 2000 parabiazontan apofaseis toy Symboylioy Asfaleias sthn Ellada.

PRWTOPAPAS: Oxi apo thn Ellada. Ayto exei shmasia.

MIXAS: Sthn Ellada, oxi apo thn Ellada. Thn idia periodo oi kybernhtikes arxes, o ypoyrgos Dikaiosynhs kai h Eqnikh Trapeza ths Elladas aperriptan kaqe dhmosieyma poy anaferotan se ayto to qema. Dhladh, apla, elegan cemata.

PRWTOPAPAS: Oxi, den elegan cemata.

MIXAS: Wraia, elegan "den hjera".

PRWTOPAPAS: Ta stoixeia twra estalhsan kai twra zhthqhkan ...

MIXAS: Wraia. Ti ekanan olh ayth thn periodo;

PRWTOPAPAS: Twra -kai otan lew "twra" ennow to 2001- yphrjan sygkekrimena stoixeia gia sygkekrimenoys logariasmoys kai oxi afhrhmena dhmosieymata. O,ti zhthqhke exei stalei. Bebaiws, apo toys sysxetismoys poy qa ginoyn qa prokycoyn orismena symperasmata. Ean mporoyme na ta ajiopoihsoyme, na eiste bebaios oti qa to kanoyme. Den yparxei kanena problhma peri aytoy. Emeis, opoia ereyna eixame na kanoyme, thn kaname kai einai endelexestath. Egine pragmatika me ton tropo poy zhthse to Dieqnes Dikasthrio, se oloys toys logariasmoys kai gyrw apo oles tis piqanes periptwseis pistwtikwn idrymatwn h logariasmwn se pistwtika idrymata. Egine kai apo to ypoyrgeio Dikaiosynhs kai apo thn Trapeza ths Elladas. Mporw na sas pw oti apo tis armodies arxes den egeiretai kanena qema. Moy kanei entypwsh pws egeiretai tetoio qema apo sxolia toy Typoy, otan oi armodies arxes den exoyn problhma me thn ellhnikh kybernhsh. Den yparxei kanena qema to opoio na egeiroyn pros thn ellhnikh kybernhsh oi armodies arxes.

MIXAS: Kamia armodia arxh den eqese to qema sthn Ollandia. H idia h ollandikh kybernhsh eqese to qema kai eftiaje thn epitroph gia th Semprenitsa. To qema einai eyaisqhsias ths kybernhshs.

PRWTOPAPAS: Gnwrizete oti to qema ths Semprenitsas aforoyse epishmh apostolh ths ollandikhs kybernhshs, apostolh ollandikoy stratoy. Den eixe na kanei me drash kapoioy idiwth, ekei.

MIXAS: Ma, den milame gia idiwth. Milame gia thn ellhnikh kybernhsh kai thn kypriakh.

PRWTOPAPAS: Mhn taytizete anomoia pragmata. H ypoqesh ths Ollandias aforoyse epishmh apostolh eirhneytikhs dynamhs toy ollandikoy kratoys. Kai einai logiko, otan kathgoreisai gia kapoia drasthriothta kratikwn leitoyrgwn, na prepei na to cajeis. Edw den yparxei tetoio qema.

KWNSTANTHS: Epeidh ayrio qa synanthqei o Prwqypoyrgos me ton yfypoyrgo Metaforwn Spyro Boygia, qelw na rwthsw, ean syndeetai ayth h synanthsh me to qema ths antikatastashs kai toy idioy, alla kai toy alloy yfypoyrgoy toy k. Koyrakh. Pote qa ginei, en pash periptwsei, ayth h antikatastash; Qa ginei mhpws meta tis dhmotikes ekloges, se periptwsh ekloghs toys h nwritera;

PRWTOPAPAS: Opws gnwrizete den mporei na ginei meta tis dhmotikes ekloges.

KWNSTANTHS: Se periptwsh ekloghs toys eipa, epeidh qa yparxei asymbibasto meta.

PRWTOPAPAS: Yparxei asymbibasto me thn epishmh anakhryjh. Qa ginei se xrono poy qa kaqoristei apo ton idio ton Prwqypoyrgo, o opoios qa krinei poia stigmh qa ginei ayth h allagh. Qa ginei, omws, allagh twn dyo yfypoyrgwn prin tis dhmotikes ekloges. Ayto einai safes.

I. XASAPOPOYLOS: Yparxei endexomeno na ginei ayrio h allagh; Giati o k. Boygias to exei zhthsei epaneilhmmenws, dhmosiws ayto, na ginei oso to dynato syntomotera.

PRWTOPAPAS: O Prwqypoyrgos qa kaqorisei pote qa ginoyn aytes oi allages poy pantws qa ginoyn en eyqeto xrono.

DHMOSIOGRAFOS: H porismatikh ekqesh gia thn oikonomikh diaxeirish sto Panteio Panepisthmio, anaferei oti yparxoyn para polles paratypies sthn periodo @94-@98, anamesa stis opoies profanws einai kai to qema poy proekyce me to misqo toy Prwqypoyrgoy. Einai en gnwsei ths kybernhshs ayta ta stoixeia kai poio einai to sxolio sas;

PRWTOPAPAS: To exw kanei, hdh, apo thn properasmenh ebdomada, otan syzhthsame to sxetiko qema. Gnwrizete oti h ereyna ginetai apo kratikes arxes. Den thn kanei apo mono toy to Panteio Panepisthmio. Exei epembei to ypoyrgeio Oikonomikwn, h ereyna pairnei to dromo ths kai qa synexistei.

TRIANTAFYLLOY: Shmerino dhmosieyma anaferei oti odhghqhke se nayagio h anakataskeyh toy stadioy Karaiskakh. Gia poio logo synebh ayto;

PRWTOPAPAS: Den to gnwrizw. Qa enhmerwqw kai qa epanelqw ayrio.

TRIANTAFYLLOY: Gnwrizete toylaxiston poies yposxeseis eixe parei h koinoprajia Kokkalh-Alamanh apo thn ellhnikh kybernhsh gia to ergo; Einai ena megalo qema ayto.

PRWTOPAPAS: Den mporw na gnwrizw ola osa symbainoyn se enan terastio tomea. H anakataskeyh toy stadioy Karaiskakh einai ena megalo qema, den einai omws politiko. Einai ena eidiko qema texnikoy ergoy. Den mporw na gnwrizw, ana pasa stigmh, se poia fash briskontai ta texnika erga poy ginontai se olh th xwra. Efoson, omws, to qetete, eyxaristws na rwthsw kai na sas enhmerwsw ayrio. Den apotelei pantws politiko qema.

ALEJAKHS: H symfwnia poy epeteyxqh me toys "14" -epanerxomai sto qema toy eyrwstratoy- yparxei problech ean qa exei th morfh nomikoy keimenoy; Qa entassotan sta Symperasmata h qa htan mia aplh epistolh;

PRWTOPAPAS: Qa htan -kai to lew ayto me thn ennoia oti den mporei na ginei monomerws- mia politikh apofash ths E.E. gia ton kaqorismo twn sxesewn me to NATO gyrw apo thn anaptyjh kai leitoyrgia toy ESDP. Me bash ayth thn apofash-plaisio, o k. Solana eprokeito na steilei epistolh pros ton k. Rompertson, h opoia bebaiws qa anaferontan se hdh gnwsta kai symfwnhmena pragmata, dioti metajy dyo dieqnwn Organismwn den mporei na yparxoyn, oyte aifnidiasmoi, oyte monomereis energeies.

ALEJAKHS: Sto parelqon h ellhnikh kybernhsh den eixe antitaxqei se ayth thn praktikh; Epistoles Liponen p.x. sto parelqon;

PRWTOPAPAS: Ma, etsi einai h diadikasia. Lambaneis mia apofash. H apofash ayth, efoson ginetai apodekth apo ton allo Organismo, antallassontai oi epistoles metajy twn dyo ypeyqynwn, prokeimenoy na katalhjoyn sth sxetikh symfwnia. Aplws, ti ginetai: To NATO, oxi to NATO ws synolo, diafwnei, omws -opws gnwrizete- me bash to NATO sto opoio yparxei omofwnia, efoson diafwnei h Toyrkia mporei na mplokarei kai thn apofash toy NATO. Ara, efoson diafwnei h Toyrkia, den mporei to NATO na proxwrhsei se symfwnia. Einai safes oti me to na pareis apofash kai na steileis epistolh, dhmioyrgeis ena qema poy den einai swsto sth sxesh metajy dyo Organismwn poy synergazontai dieqnws. Epomenws, to plaisio ths E.E. einai safes, exei teqei ypoch toy NATO, ara kai ypoch ths Toyrkias kai otan yparjei symfwnia, qa yparjei kai ena plhres politiko keimeno ws plaisio apofashs kai panw se ayto to plaisio qa leitoyrgei o eyrwstratos kai qa epakoloyqhsei h prajh ths apostolhs epistolhs toy armodioy gi` ayta ta qemata, k. Xabie Solana pros ton k. Rompinson.

ALEJAKHS: Desmeyei, dhladh, nomika ola ta melh ayth h diadikasia.

PRWTOPAPAS: Ayth einai h diadikasia poy qa akoloyqhqei, otan yparjei symfwnia.

KWNSTANTINIDHS: Qa yparjei symfwnia me th symfwnh gnwmh kai ths Toyrkias, dhladh.

PRWTOPAPAS: Nai, dioti logw ths omofwnias me thn opoia leitoyrgei to NATO, h Toyrkia mporei na empodisei th symfwnia ths E.E. me to NATO.

ALEJAKHS: Se sxesh me ta gegonota sthn Pyla sthn Kypro: Yphrje mia prowqhsh -toylaxiston etsi qryleitai- twn toyrkikwn strateymatwn sth grammh antiparatajhs sthn Pyla. Yparxei kapoio sxolio;

PRWTOPAPAS: Gnwrizete oti gia thn apostolh toyrkikwn strateymatwn sthn Kypro, ws prajh, yparxoyn energeies kai apo thn ellhnikh kai kyriws apo thn kypriakh kybernhsh, stis opoies sas parapempw. Yparxoyn dhlwseis toy k. Papapetroy, apolyta swstes kai ekfrazoyn ayto poy eprepe na ekfrasoyn.

I. XASAPOPOYLOS: Giati o k. Shmiths apofasise na mhn enhmerwsei toys politikoys arxhgoys o idios kai edwse ayth thn armodiothta ston k. Papandreoy;

PRWTOPAPAS: Den einai prwth fora poy ginetai enhmerwsh apo ton ypoyrgo Ejwterikwn, gia orismenes ejelijeis pros toys politikoys arxhgoys. Exei janaginei polles fores mexri twra. Qelw na to qymisw ayto.

I. XASAPOPOYLOS: Sygnwmh, to qema toy eyrwstratoy, ean qymaste kai eseis sthn prohgoymenh enhmerwsh, htan ena meizon qema. Kai eixe desmeyqei o k. Shmiths oti qa kanei apeyqeias enhmerwsh.

PRWTOPAPAS: Den exei lhjei to qema. Eimaste se mia fash safws kalyterh apo o,ti sto parelqon, h opoia hrqe ws apotelesma ths doyleias mas. Bebaiws, ajiopoihsame kai thn eqnikh omocyxia poy yphrje. Peri aytoy den yparxei kamia amfibolia. Kai emeis th qeloyme kai panta ergazomaste se ayth thn kateyqynsh. Bebaiws, omws, kaname mia poly shmantikh doyleia ws kybernhsh me oloys toys dieqneis Organismoys kai ajiopoihsame to megalo kyros ths Elladas se aytoys toy Organismoys. Systhmatikh kai ypeyqynh doyleia egine gia polloys mhnes. Omws, to qema den exei oloklhrwqei. Gia th fash poy pername -poy ta pragmata einai poly kalytera apo o,ti prin apo merikes meres, alla den payei na einai mia fash- qa yparjei plhrhs enhmerwsh apo ton ypoyrgo Ejwterikwn pros ta politika kommata kai qa zhthqoyn synanthseis me toys arxhgoys twn politikwn kommatwn.

Qelw, omws, na tonisw, me thn eykairia poy moy dinete, oti kai kaq` olh ayth th fash poy perasame yphrxe enhmerwsh. Pera apo thn enhmerwsh, se o,ti afora th strathgikh mas poy ekane analytika o idios o Prwqypoyrgos sth synanthsh toy me toys politikoys arxhgoys yphrxe eidika gia th N.D., alla kai gia ta alla kommata -to anaferw ayto giati yphrje mia diamartyria toy arxhgoy ths N.D.- enhmerwsh apo ton ypoyrgo Ejwterikwn G. Papandreoy pros ton k. Molybiath prin th Sebillh. Se polles periptwseis yphrxe enhmerwsh apo ton k. Skopelith pros ton entetalmeno symboylo -ean o oros einai swstos- toy arxhgoy ths N.D., ton k. Balinakh. Den yphrje kamia prospaqeia na apokrybei kati. Bebaiws, den einai dynaton, otan yparxei mia synexhs analhch prwtoboyliwn kai mia synexhs poreia syzhthsewn kai diapragmateysewn, na ginetai ayto se kaqe allagh lejhs, se kaqe mia fash twn synexwn diaboyleysewn kai prosarmogwn poy ginontai epi keimenoy. Kai ayto einai poly safes. Yphrxe, omws, safhs enhmerwsh kai gia tis proqeseis kai gia tis genikes kateyqynseis kai gia thn politikh. Apo ekei kai pera, se mia syzhthsh poy ginetai panw se ena keimeno, se mia synexh roh prwtoboyliwn oi opoies lambanontai, einai logiko na exeis th dynatothta na allajeis kapoies lejeis h na mporeseis na apodwseis kapoia nohmata kalytera.

KAPPOS: Se proektash ths erwthshs toy synadelfoy se sxesh me thn Kypro, kat` arxas se o,ti afora thn Pyla, ayto poy einai gnwsto einai oti ta toyrkika strateymata anoigoyn ena dromo strathgikhs shmasias apo opoy qa mporoyn na pernoyn strateymata kai barys oplismos. Shmasia exei oti oi foboi gia qermo epeisodio katw sto nhsi einai idiaitera entonoi kai pleon exoyn perasei kai sthn toyrkokypriakh zwnh kai malista diatypwnoyn foboys gia proodeytika strwmata toy toyrkokypriakoy...

PRWTOPAPAS: Mh dhmioyrgoyme oi idioi problhmata poy den prowqoyn ta eqnika mas symferonta.

KAPPOS: Na oloklhrwsw thn erwthsh moy kai qa deite oti kaqe allo para prospaqw na dhmioyrgw problhmata. Ayto, loipon, poy qelw na rwthsw einai to ejhs: Prwton, ean o ypoyrgos Ejwterikwn, o opoios apo o,ti gnwrizoyme prokeitai na synanthqei se liges wres isws me ton Toyrko omologo toy, prokeitai na qesei ayta ta zhthmata ston k. Tzem kai deyteron, ean leitoyrgoyn metajy Elladas-Toyrkias ekeinoi oi diayloi politikhs apotrophs, wste na mhn fqasoyme se endexomeno mias entashs.

PRWTOPAPAS: Toylaxiston na mhn thn kalliergoyme oi idioi, k. Kappo. Nomizw oti einai to prwto poy exoyme na kanoyme.

Sas eyxaristw.

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