Greek Government Press Briefing, 00-05-16

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

YPOYRGEIO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

Aqhna, 16 Maioy 2000

JENOY TYPOY APO TON YPOYRGO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS KAI KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO DHMHTRH REPPA

Geia sas.

Akoyw tis erwthseis sas.

KWNSTANTINIDHS: Pws sxoliazete thn arnhsh ths Toyrkias na apozhmiwsei thn Tina Loizidoy, arnoymenh thn apofash toy Eyrwpaikoy Dikasthrioy. Malista, o k. Tzem apeilei oti an ylopoihqei ayth h apofash kindyneyei na mhn proxwrhsei to Kypriako.

REPPAS: Opws kaqe xwra, etsi kai h Toyrkia, prepei na symmorfwnetai me tis apofaseis toy Eyrwpaikoy Dikasthrioy Anqrwpinwn Dikaiwmatwn. H Toyrkia qa prepei sthn prajh na apodeijei oti epiqymei na enswmatwqei kai qesmika plhrws sthn Eyrwph.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, mporeite na mas peite, telika, ti isxyei gia tis taytothtes; H kybernhsh ti prokeitai na prowqhsei gia tis taytothtes;

REPPAS: Prwta ap` ola, yparxei to yfistameno nomiko kaqestws kai oi qeseis oi opoies ekfrazontai, oson afora thn efarmogh toy mas desmeyoyn oloys. H kybernhsh qa antimetwpisei, en kairw, ta qemata ayta me dialogo. Den einai qema to opoio qa antimetwpisoyme shmera h ayrio.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Ma, k. Ypoyrge, twra exei ``foyntwsei'' to qema. Den exete parei apofash, den exete qesh;

REPPAS: Asfalws, h kybernhsh exei qesh. H qesh ayth einai ekfrasmenh me to nomo, o opoios chfisthke sth Boylh twn Ellhnwn, thn prohgoymenh koinoboyleytikh periodo. Apo ekei kai pera, gnwrizete poly kala oti xreiazetai h oloklhrwsh twn yphresiakwn diadikasiwn kai h ekdosh egkykliwn, kaqws kai h oloklhrwsh allwn drasthriothtwn, prokeimenoy na teqei se efarmogh to metro ayto. Ola ayta ta qemata, kata thn poreia efarmoghs aytwn twn apofasewn, qa ta syzhthsoyme me toys endiaferomenoys foreis.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Ayth h diatajh poy perase apo th Boylh proeblepe, o kaqenas an hqele na balei to qrhskeyma. Etsi den einai;

REPPAS: Anafereste sto nomo 1997. Epanalambanw, oti opws kaqe nomos kai o sygkekrimenos, problepei thn ekdosh egkykliwn kai allwn kanonistikwn prajewn, etsi wste na teqei se efarmogh. Se ayto to stadio briskomaste twra. Kai sthn poreia gia thn efarmogh toy nomoy aytoy qa ginoyn oi aparaithtes syzhthseis, prokeimenoy na antimetwpisoyme ta praktika qemata ta opoia qa exoyn prokycei.

STAMATOPOYLOS: H apofash poy ebgale o k. Dafermos einai ypoxrewtikh, opws leei, gia thn kybernhsh;

REPPAS: H apofash ths anejarthths Arxhs gia thn Prostasia twn Proswpikwn Dedomenwn den exei perielqei sta xeria mas. Otan thn exoyme, qa th melethsoyme. Asfalws, kaqe apofash anejarthths Arxhs, efoson sthrizetai se yfistameno nomo kai anaferetai sthn efarmogh toy, desmeyei oloys, opws desmeyei oloys o nomos, o opoios isxyei kai exei chfistei apo th Boylh twn Ellhnwn. Opoiadhpote anejarthth Arxh den exei nomoqetikh armodiothta, alla oi anejarthtes Arxes einai epifortismenes me sygkekrimenes armodiothtes. Sto plaisio twn armodiothtwn ths h sygkekrimenh anejarthth Arxh anaferetai sthn efarmogh enos nomoy poy chfisthke ta prohgoymena xronia apo th Boylh. H efarmogh toy nomoy aytoy qa mas apasxolhsei, epanalambanw, sto plaisio syzhthsewn poy qa ginoyn, oson afora praktikes leptomereies.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Den mas lete, ti isxyei. Isxyei ayto poy leei o k. Dafermos h ayto poy chfise h Boylh;

REPPAS: Ayta poy h Boylh exei chfisei desmeyoyn toys pantes. Den nomoqetei opoiosdhpote allos, peran ths Boylhs twn Ellhnwn. O k. Dafermos den ekane tipote allo para na anaferqei sto nomo poy exei chfistei apo th Boylh. Kai epanalambanw, oti ola ayta ta qemata ta opoia aforoyn thn efarmogh toy nomoy stis leptomereies toy qa apotelesoyn antikeimeno syzhthshs, wste na ta antimetwpisoyme en kairw.

EYSTAQIOY: Dhladh, an qelei kapoios ej hmwn, na paei sto astynomiko tmhma kai na allajei thn taytothta toy kai pei ``parakalw sto qrhskeyma keno'' h na gracei aqeos h den jerw ti allo, exei th dynatothta;

REPPAS: Eipa, oti qa prepei na anamenetai h ekdosh egkykliwn, prokeimenoy na antimetwpistoyn, praktika, oi leptomereies efarmoghs toy yfistamenoy nomoy. Ayto to qema, loipon, qa antimetwpistei di` aytoy toy tropoy. Efoson oloklhrwqei ayth h diadikasia, ola ayta ta qemata qa exoyn sthn prajh pleon apanthqei.

EYSTAQIOY: Se poso diasthma problepetai na oloklhrwqei ayth h diadikasia;

REPPAS: Mhn perimenete, ayth thn wra, na orisw egw sygkekrimeno xronodiagramma. Pantws, den einai qema to opoio, opws eipa, qa antimetwpisoyme shmera h ayrio.

BITSENTZOY: Epeidh ekane kai kapoies dhlwseis o k. Benizelos qa hqela na rwthsw, ean h apofash ayths ths Arxhs einai pragmati desmeytikh gia th Dioikhsh. Qelw akomh na rwthsw, ean h apofash ayth prosballetai kai se poio dikasthrio -sto Epikrateias, gia paradeigma;- kai akomh an qa mporoyse h Ekklhsia na prosfygei sto Dikasthrio Anqrwpinwn Dikaiwmatwn.

REPPAS: Den qa prepei na syzhthsoyme perissotero ayto to qema, giati antilambaneste pws h syzhthsh exei parei ena xarakthra qewrhtiko, oi erwthseis poy tiqentai exoyn ypoqetiko xarakthra. Kaqenas, sto plaisio toy yfistamenoy nomikoy plaisioy ths xwras kai twn diatajewn toy Syntagmatos, mporei na analabei sxetikes prwtoboylies. Na prosfygei opoy dei, prokeimenoy na diekdikhsei thn anagnwrish twn dikaiwmatwn toy. Apo ekei kai pera, h sygkekrimenh anejarthth Arxh, opws kai oles oi Arxes allwste, kineitai, me bash tis armodiothtes poy exoyn chfistei gia thn kaqe Arxh. Dhladh, entos toy nomikoy plaisioy, to opoio apofasizei h Boylh twn Ellhnwn kai monon ayth.

GIAKOYMHS: Protiqetai o Prwqypoyrgos na synanthqei me ton Arxiepiskopo Xristodoylo, tis prosexeis hmeres;

REPPAS: Den exei programmatistei opoiadhpote tetoia synanthsh.

I. KAMPOYRAKHS: Gia thn kybernhsh, poioi einai oi emplekomenoi foreis poy qa laboyn meros se ayto to dialogo gi` ayto to qema; Mhpws mporoyme na toys kaqorisoyme, ayth th stigmh, na jeroyme dhladh poioi qa laboyn meros se ayto to dialogo; Qa labei h Ekklhsia, qa laboyn ta kommata; Pws qa ginei aytos o dialogos;

REPPAS: Prwta apo ola, miloyme gia thn efarmogh enos nomoy, o opoios exei chfistei apo th Boylh twn Ellhnwn. Den eimaste enocei ths chfishs, eimaste meta thn chfish enos nomoy. Apo ekei kai pera, asfalws, h Ekklhsia einai metajy ekeinwn twn forewn poy oi armodioi ypoyrgoi qa exoyn epikoinwnia kai qa syzhthsoyn synafh qemata.

ARGYROS: Gia tis ypoloipes protaseis poy periexontai sthn apofash ths Epitrophs Proswpikwn Dedomenwn, symfwnei h kybernhsh; Poia einai h qesh ths;

REPPAS: Ma, den exete ypoch sas to sygkekrimeno nomo, gi` ayto akribws anafereste sth qesh ths anejarthths Arxhs, h opoia -epanalambanw- den nomoqetei. H anejarthth Arxh kineitai sto gramma kai to pneyma toy nomoy poy exei chfisei h Boylh twn Ellhnwn.

ANTYPAS: An den kanw laqos, o nomos toy @97 elege oti einai proairetikh h anagrafh toy qrhskeymatos, dhladh, qa mas rwtoyn otan phgainoyme na bgaloyme taytothta. H anejarthth Arxh, twra, leei oti den prepei na yparxei kaqoloy h sxetikh endeijh ``qrhskeyma'', opws kai kapoia alla stoixeia. Epeidh yparxei o nomos, poy lete, kai qa yparjoyn ermhneytikes egkyklioi, poio apo ta dyo qa efarmostei, dhladh;

REPPAS: Qelete na protrejoyme kai na diatypwsw egw to periexomeno twn egkykliwn, prin kan ekdoqoyn; Ola ayta ta qemata -epanalambanw- qa syzhthqoyn gia na antimetwpistoyn en kairw ta praktika problhmata. Htan poly safh ayta ta opoia eipa.

ANTYPAS: Sygnwmh Ypoyrge, o nomos den exei gia daktylika apotypwmata. Pws qa afaireqoyn, ama @

REPPAS: Ola ayta ta qemata -epanalambanw- qa antimetwpistoyn kai etsi den qa yparxei apo thn efarmogh toy nomoy opoiadhpote praktikh synepeia, tetoia, wste na dhmioyrgei th dysareskeia se opoiondhpote exei logo na asxoleitai me ta qemata ayta.

KALARITHS: Eipate oti h qesh ths kybernhshs einai ekfrasmenh. Einai ayth poy yparxei sto nomo h ayth ths anejarthths Arxhs; Poia einai telika h qesh ths kybernhshs; Proairetikh h ypoxrewtikh h anagrafh;

REPPAS: H kybernhsh eixe th nomoqetikh prwtoboylia. Chfisthke o sygkekrimenos nomos. Epanalambanw oti thn apofash thn anejarthths Arxhs den thn exoyme ypoch mas, den exei perielqei epishmws sth diaqesh mas. Qa antimetwpisoyme ta sxetika qemata me ton tropo ston opoio me leptomereies anaferqhka, apantwntas se prohgoymenes erwthseis.

KARGOYDH: Ayrio, o ypoyrgos Paideias exei mia synanthsh me ton Arxiepiskopo. Hqela na rwthsw, ean h kybernhsh protiqetai na qesei qema ston Arxiepiskopo proairetikhs didaskalias toy maqhmatos twn Qrhskeytikwn.

REPPAS: Einai h prwth synanthsh, meta thn analhch kaqhkontwn apo ton k. Eyqymioy, me to Makariotato Arxiepiskopo. Gnwrizete poly kala pws pantote ginontai aytes oi synanthseis epi th analhcei kaqhkontwn apo ton ekastote ypoyrgo Paideias. Qa exoyn, fantazomai, mia genikh syzhthsh kai den nomizw oti einai wrimes oi synqhkes, wste na proxwrhsoyn se antimetwpish ejeidikeymenwn, sygkekrimenwn qematwn. Ayto einai kati to opoio qa antimetwpisoyn oi idioi sth synexeia ths synergasias toys, orizontas kai to plaisio ths epikoinwnias toys.

BITSENTZOY: Qa hqela na rwthsw ean gnwrizete, an o k. Eyqymioy, sto plaisio ths analhchs twn kaqhkontwn toy, qa synanthqei kai me iereis allwn dogmatwn.

REPPAS: Den gnwrizw na exei programmatistei kapoia tetoia drasthriothta, alla einai kati poy den apokleiw. Pantws, o k. Eyqymioy einai aytos kai to ypoyrgeio Paideias, poy orizei to programma, tis drasthriothtes, tis epikoinwnies toy.

EYSTAQIOY: Moy kanei entypwsh to ejhs: Oti, molis thn perasmenh Paraskeyh, o armodios ypoyrgos Dikaiosynhs, meta to Ypoyrgiko Symboylio, fanhke oxi aplws na einai enhmerwmenos, alla na exei labei sta xeria toy, na exei melethsei thn apofash ths Epitrophs Proswpikwn Dedomenwn. Synepws, ekplhssomai pragmatika, pws lete oti h kybernhsh den exei enhmerwqei gia thn @

REPPAS: Den exei perielqei sthn kybernhsh, se opoiondhpote kybernhtiko paragonta, h apofash ths Arxhs.

EYSTAQIOY: Ma, o k. Staqopoylos @

REPPAS: O k. Staqopoylos exei mia empeiria kai gnwsh twn qematwn, giati yphrje melos ayths ths anejarthths Arxhs. Den to gnwrizete ayto;

EYSTAQIOY: Bebaiws.

REPPAS: E, loipon; Ma kai egw exw plhroforhqei ta ths apofashs, apo dhmosieymata efhmeridwn h apo alles phges. Ayto, omws, den shmainei oti exw sth diaqesh moy thn apofash ths anejarthths Arxhs.

EYSTAQIOY: O ypoyrgos Dikaiosynhs thn exei, omws.

REPPAS: Xqes apofasise h anejarthth Arxh. Den diatypwse thn apofash ths, wste na exei perielqei epishmws, kaqarogrammenh, me kaqe leptomereia sth diaqesh toy ypoyrgoy Dikaiosynhs. Gnwrizete kati tetoio eseis; Giati lete oti thn exei, loipon, kai to lete malista kathgorhmatika; Sas lew pws den exei perielqei.

EYSTAQIOY: Ma, ekane dhlwseis.

REPPAS: Ti sxesh exei to ena me to allo; Den epitrepetai na kanei dhlwseis;

EYSTAQIOY: Mia akomh erwthsh ep` aytoy: O k. Staqopoylos, stis idies dhlwseis poy ekane, oysiastika eipe oti h Epitroph Proswpikwn Dedomenwn exei apofasistikes armodiothtes kai sthn oysia thn proetrece na efarmostei o nomos. Dhladh, na parei metra enantion oswn arnoyntai na efarmosoyn to nomo.

REPPAS: To nomo ton efarmozei h Dioikhsh. H Arxh Prostasias Proswpikwn Dedomenwn, einai anejarthth Arxh. To plaisio, basei toy opoioy leitoyrgei, exei apofasistei, einai gnwsto. Den allazei tipote ws pros ayto. Ara, kaqe syzhthsh einai, qa elega, peritth.

EYSTAQIOY: Otan o ypoyrgos Dikaiosynhs leei oti prepei na lhfqoyn metra enantion oswn den efarmozoyn to nomo@

REPPAS: Poia einai h erwthsh poy qetete; Asfalws -eipa sthn arxh- h apofash ths Anejarthths Arxhs, efoson sthrizetai sto nomo poy exei chfisei h Boylh twn Ellhnwn kai afora thn efarmogh toy, diatypwnei th qesh ths poy einai sebasth. Den nomoqetei h Anejarthth Arxh. H Dioikhsh einai ayth poy efarmozei to nomo. Ayto prepei na einai safes. Oi armodies yphresies, efoson oloklhrwqei ayth h diadikasia, poy afora, metajy twn allwn, thn ekdosh egkykliwn kai alles odhgies gia thn efarmogh toy nomoy, qa antimetwpisoyn praktika ta qemata ta opoia prokyptoyn. Einai safh ayta ta opoia eipa.

EYSTAQIOY: Einai safh ayta poy lete, alla ejisoy safh, kai se antistrofh troxia twn oswn lete eseis, htan ayta poy eipe o ypoyrgos Dikaiosynhs k. Staqopoylos.

REPPAS: Ti eipe o k. Staqopoylos; Peite to sas parakalw gia na synennohqoyme.

EYSTAQIOY: O k. Staqopoylos kalese na efarmostei o nomos kai na lhfqoyn metra. Oti opoios ypallhlos sto astynomiko tmhma h opoiosdhpote allos dioikhtikos ypallhlos epimenei na anagrafetai to qrhskeyma h opoia alla anaferontai sthn apofash, qa prepei na lhfqoyn peiqarxika metra, basei toy nomoy, enantion toy sygkekrimenoy ypallhloy.

REPPAS: Loipon, gia na synennohqoyme. Eseis isxyrizeste, oti o k. Staqopoylos eipe, pws shmera-ayrio, enas poliths mporei na apaithsei thn ekdosh taytothtas, h opoia qa ypakoyei se ayto to plaisio, stoys periorismoys, dhladh, poy eqese h Arxh Prostasias Proswpikwn Dedomenwn. Prepei na sas pw, oti o ypoyrgos Dikaiosynhs den eqese tetoio qema. Eipe oti qa prepei na oloklhrwqei ayth h diadikasia gia na pame sthn efarmogh toy nomoy, symfwna me to pneyma ths apofashs ths Arxhs Prostasias Proswpikwn Dedomenwn. Ayto lew ki egw tosh wra.

STAMATOPOYLOS: @h opoia den eixe bgei. Pws to elege tote ayto;

REPPAS: Den elege kati to diaforetiko. Eipe oti qa paroyme nomoqetikh prwtoboylia, eipe oti prepei na ginei kati allo; Eipe oti prepei na efarmostei o nomos. O nomos qa efarmostei, basei ths diadikasias h opoia einai se ejelijh kai sto plaisio ayths ths diadikasias qa ginei kai syzhthsh me armodioys foreis, prokeimenoy na antimetwpisoyme ta praktika qemata. To eipa me diaforetikoys tropoys, apantwntas se polles erwthseis, shmera.

PAPADOPOYLOS: O nomos gia thn ekklhsiastikh perioysia giati den efarmosthke;

REPPAS: Ayth thn erwthsh prepei na thn apeyqynete stoys armodioys ypoyrgoys, poy prepei na antimetwpisoyn to qema enos nomoy, o opoios exei chfistei kai exei meinei anenergos.

PAPADOPOYLOS: Perasan toses kybernhseis PASOK kai den efarmosthke, k. Ypoyrge.

REPPAS: O ellhnikos laos, o opoios kat` epanalhch klhqhke kai chfise thn kybernhsh ths xwras mas, exei staqmisei, fantazomai, ola ayta, prokeimenoy na labei thn telikh toy qesh.

PAPADOPOYLOS: Na mhn efarmozetai, dhladh, o nomos;

REPPAS: Den eipa oti o laos apofasise kati tetoio. Eipa oti o ellhnikos laos gnwrize, metajy twn allwn, pws edw exoyme enan anenergo nomo, qema me to opoio qa prepei na asxolhqoyn, na to antimetwpisoyn oi armodioi ypoyrgoi.

PAPADOPOYLOS: H kybernhsh, dhladh, den to antimetwpizei;

REPPAS: Ma, oi armodioi ypoyrgoi ths kybernhshs einai. Den yparxoyn armodioi ypoyrgoi ektos kybernhshs.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Yparxei diabhma twn Palaistiniwn gia th mh episkech;

REPPAS: Pragmati, diatypwqhke eggrafo diabhma. H kybernhsh, epeidh -opws kat` epanalhch exoyme tonisei- epiqymei th diathrhsh twn sxesewn me tis Palaistiniakes Arxes se aristo epipedo, qa antidrasei me th deoysa eyaisqhsia se ayto to diabhma.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Pws qa antidrasei;

REPPAS: Einai kati to opoio qa plhroforhqeite mesa se wres h liges hmeres.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Poios ftaiei gi` ayto poy egine;

REPPAS: Hmoyn safhs. Den ftaiei kaneis. Apo thn allh, mporei na pei kaneis oti to diabhma einai mia pragmatikothta, alla h ellhnikh kybernhsh kai oi Palaistiniakes Arxes, epanalambanoyn kai pali th qelhsh toys na diathrhsoyn se ychlo epipedo tis sxeseis toys. Kai se ayto to plaisio qa ejelixqoyn oi sxeseis mas, pragma to opoio qa antilhfqeite ki eseis, me tis prwtoboylies poy qa analabei h ellhnikh kybernhsh.

BITSENTZOY: Hqela na rwthsw ean mas diamhnyqhke apo toys Palaistinioys h akyrwsh ths synanthshs twn Aqhnwn, poy eixe qesmoqethqei epi Kranidiwth. Kai na moy apanthsete, ean jerete, gia poio logo synanthqhke o Proedros ths Ellhnikhs Dhmokratias me ton Israhlino Dhmarxo, sthn Ieroysalhm, pragma poy den ekanan alloi eyrwpaioi hgetes, oyte o Klinton, kata thn episkech toy ekei.

REPPAS: Prwta ap` ola, epanalambanw oti pragmati diatypwqhke to diabhma. Apo thn allh, prepei na pw oti o Proedros ths Ellhnikhs Dhmokratias episkeptetai to kratos toy Israhl, proskeklhmenos apo tis Arxes toy. To programma apofasisthke apo koinoy. Den tiqetai opoiodhpote allo qema kai parakalw na mh bgazete politika symperasmata. Oson afora tis sxeseis mas me tis Palaistiniakes Arxes einai kai qa parameinoyn se ychlo epipedo. Den yparxei opoiodhpote problhma. Kai ayto akribws pisteyw oti qa fanei peritrana kai poly syntoma. Oi sxeseis mas qa synexistoyn sto idio epipedo poy briskontai shmera. Kai nomizw oti den qa teqei se opoiodhpote kindyno h prwtoboylia poy exei analabei h ellhnikh kybernhsh -xairomai poy anafereste se aythn- gia th synanthsh twn Aqhnwn, Israhlinwn kai Palaistiniwn, sthn Ellada.

Sas eyxaristw poly.

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