Greek Government Press Briefing, 99-07-28

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

YPOYRGEIO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

Aqhna, 28 Ioylioy 1999

H ENHMERWSH TWN POLITIKWN SYNTAKTWN KAI TWN ANTAPOKRITWN JENOY TYPOY APO TON YPOYRGO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS KAI KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO DHMHTRH REPPA

Geia sas.

Synedriase, shmera, to Ypoyrgiko Symboylio. Kyrio qema ths syzhthshs htan oi kateyqynseis ths metanasteytikhs politikhs, enocei ths katartishs sxetikoy sxedioy nomoy, thn epomenh periodo. Prokeitai, opws gnwrizete, gia ena shmantiko qema. H politikh mas ston tomea ayto, prepei na labei ypoch ths ta nea dedomena. Prepei na eksygxronistei to isxyon nomiko plegma. O nomos 1975/1991 qewreitai aneparkhs, jeperasmenos. Ara, katalhgoyme sthn anagkh chfishs enos neoy nomoy, poy qa qetei to nomiko-qesmiko plaisio gia thn antimetwpish twn qematwn poy exoyn sxesh me to fainomeno ths laqrometanasteyshs.

H politikh mas ston tomea ayto einai aysthrh, apotelesmatikh, oson afora ton elegxo twn synorwn, prokeimenoy na apotrapei h eisodos sthn Ellada laqrometanastwn, politwn, dhladh, oi opoioi den exoyn, ejasfalisei mesw twn problepomenwn nomimwn diadikasiwn, ta aparaithta eggrafa, prokeimenoy na eiselqoyn nomima sthn Ellada.

Einai politikh, h opoia epidiwkei na entajei omala sthn oikonomikh kai koinwnikh zwh ths xwras, aytoys poy diabioyn sthn Ellada, xwris na einai Ellhnes. Kai, bebaiws, einai politikh, h opoia qa antimetwpizei, kata periptwsh kai me ton analogo tropo, opoion emfanizei egklhmatikh symperifora.

Sto plaisio ayto oi kateyqynseis ths metanasteytikhs politikhs, opws diatypwqhkan shmera, einai safeis kai jekaqares. Apantoyme, xwris na paragnwrizoyme ta para polla kai krisima problhmata, ta opoia yparxoyn se ayto ton tomea. Problhmata ta opoia antimetwpisan -kai akomh antimetwpizoyn- polles xwres, oi opoies ypodexqhkan megalo ariqmo metanastwn. H Germania anaferqhke san ena tetoio paradeigma, me thn epishmansh oti xreiasthke na perasoyn arketa xronia, peripoy deka, gia na diatypwsei mia oloklhrwmenh metanasteytikh politikh. Alles xwres-opws h Gallia treis-tesseris fores- exoyn apopeiraqei na chfisoyn ena sygxrono nomo gia ta qemata ayta, xwris na to exoyn akomh epityxei.

Ola ayta anaferontai gia na ypogrammistei h dyskolia toy egxeirhmatos mias plhroys metanasteytikhs politikhs, mias politikhs poy na antimetwpizei ola ta synafh problhmata.

Exei prohghqei -opws gnwrizete- h meleth toy qematos poy exei ginei, kyriws apo to ypoyrgeio Eswterikwn, apo tote poy gia prwth fora ejaggeilame thn anagkh enos neoy nomosxedioy. Olo ayto to yliko ajiologeitai, ajiopoieitai, prokeimenoy na proxwrhsoyme sth diatypwsh toy neoy nomoy.

Sthn Ellada ypologizetai oti shmera oi metanastes anerxontai se 650.000. Exoyn ypoblhqei 373.000 aithseis. Sth diadikasia gia thn apokthsh prasinhs kartas symmetexoyn me aithseis toys 225.000. Aytoi oi opoioi exoyn hdh apokthsei thn prasinh karta einai peripoy 60.000. Prokeimenoy na epispeysqei ayth h diadikasia, apokthshs prasinhs kartas exei chfistei sxetikh diatajh, prin liges hmeres.

To prwto bhma, sto plaisio mias oloklhrwmenhs politikhs, einai h enisxysh twn mhxanismwn elegxoy sta synora, prokeimenoy na apotrapei h paranomh eisodos metanastwn sthn Ellada.

H apoqarrynsh eisodoy, peran twn astynomikwn metrwn, mporei na epiteyxqei me nees politikes prwtoboylies. Ws pleon xarakthristikh anaferetai h idea idryshs grafeiwn ergasias se geitonikes xwres. Mesw aytwn twn grafeiwn, ta opoia qa idryqoyn kai qa leitoyrgoyn sto plaisio dimerwn symbasewn poy qa synafqoyn, mporei na dieykolynqei h eisodos politwn poy qa exoyn sygkekrimeno logo eisodoy kai paramonhs sth xwra mas. Kai bebaiws, ta grafeia ayta qa leitoyrgoyn me thn epopteia synarmodiwn yphresiwn kai forewn, opws einai oi diplwmatikes arxes, o OAED k. lp.

Ena deytero shmeio einai oti h eisodos sthn Ellada qa exei ena proswrino, epoxiko xarakthra. Aytoi, dhladh, oi opoioi mesa apo tis nomimes aytes diadikasies qa eiserxontai sth xwra mas qa paramenoyn gia mia orismenh xronikh periodo, analoga me tis anagkes ths ellhnikhs oikonomias, tis epoxikes h topikes kai perifereiakes anagkes. H adeia poy qa toys didetai gia na eiselqoyn sthn Ellada den qa exei to xarakthra ths monimothtas.

Oson afora aytoys oi opoioi hdh briskontai sthn Ellada einai se ejelijh h diadikasia gia thn katagrafh kai th nomimopoihsh toys, me teliko shmeio thn apokthsh prasinhs kartas. H diadikasia ayth epitaxynetai. Dhmioyrgoyntai kai alles epitropes prokeimenoy na exoyme syntomotera ta apotelesmata ta opoia epidiwkoyme. To kainoyrgio stoixeio, sto opoio katalhjame shmera, einai h enarjh mias parallhlhs diadikasias, kyriws gia ekeinoys oi opoioi mexri twra den exoyn parei meros sth diadikasia poy hdh akoloyqeitai. H nea ayth diadikasia, h opoia den ypokaqista thn trexoysa politikh gia thn apokthsh kartas, qa kinhqei me thn epopteia twn OTA, twn Dhmwn. Krinetai, loipon, anagkaio na proxwrhsoyme se ena tetoio metro, prokeimenoy na antimetwpisoyme ena yparkto problhma, dedomenoy oti polloi metanastes poy parepidhmoyn sthn Ellada -enas shmantikos ariqmos- den exoyn mexri twra labei meros stis diadikasies, gia na epidiwjoyn th nomimopoihsh ths edw paramonhs toys. Bebaiws, oi OTA qa synergastoyn gia na epityxoyn sto ergo toys ayto me thn EL. AS kai foreis poy exoyn synarmodiothta.

Prepei na poyme oti h diadikasia ayth, h opoia einai se ejelijh, gia thn katagrafh kai nomimopoihsh aytwn poy dikaioyntai na nomimopoihqoyn kai na parameinoyn sthn Ellada kai gia thn epanaprowqhsh stis xwres toys aytwn poy den nomimopoioyntai, einai diarkhs. Den exei xroniko periorismo o elegxos twn metanastwn sthn Ellada.

Ektimoyme oti to fainomeno ayto, ths metanasteyshs kai idiaitera ths laqrometanasteyshs, den mporei na ekleicei apo th mia hmera sthn allh. H prospaqeia gia na steganopoihsoyme ta synora mas synexizetai, proxwra. Gia na epityxoyme, omws, ta arista apotelesmata, na mhn eiserxetai, dhladh, kapoia stigmh oyte enas laqrometanasths xreiazontai epimonh kai xronos.

Oson afora thn entajh me omalo tropo sthn ellhnikh koinwnia kai oikonomia, aytwn poy hdh briskontai sthn Ellada, to nomosxedio ayto qa exei ryqmiseis, oi opoies qa antimetwpizoyn qemata poy qa aforoyn (pera apo thn apasxolhsh gia orismenh periodo aytwn poy oysiastika metakaloyntai sthn Ellada) th synenwsh twn oikogeneiwn, thn anagnwrish kai perifroyrhsh twn dikaiwmatwn twn metanastwn poy zoyn kai ergazontai sthn Ellada, th symmetoxh twn paidiwn toys sthn ekpaideytikh diadikasia. Opws anaferqhke kai sth shmerinh synedriash h ekpaideytikh diadikasia apotelei ena kalo paradeigma ychloy baqmoy entajhs sthn ellhnikh koinwnia twn paidiwn poy exoyn goneis metanastes. Se para polla sxoleia, idiws sthn ellhnikh perifereia, ta paidia ayta ekpaideyontai, foitoyn kai proodeyoyn.

To nomosxedio ayto qa ryqmizei, epishs kai qemata iqageneias. Ayto, bebaia, einai ena megalo kefalaio kai apaitei leptomerestath syzhthsh. Epishmanqhke sxetika ena stoixeio, to opoio sas anaferw: Apo 1980 mexri shmera, exei xorhghqei iqageneia se 35.560 polites. O ariqmos einai sxetika mikros. Qa ginei, loipon, mia analytikh syzhthsh gia to qema, me stoxo thn anamorfwsh toy kaqestwtos xorhghshs ellhnikhs iqageneias.

Ayta, se poly genikes grammes, htan ta qemata poy teqhkan kata thn eishghsh ths armodias ypoyrgoy kai proseggisthkan, me diaforoys tropoys, apo synadelfoys poy elaban to logo. Antilambaneste oti syzhthsame th metanasteytikh politikh kai oxi to qema ths egklhmatikothtas. Egine safes apo th syzhthsh oti, enw oi kykloi ths egklhmatikothtas kai ths laqrometanasteyshs temnontai, den taytizontai apolytws. Ta dyo ayta qemata den apoteloyn tis dyo oceis toy idioy nomismatos. Parolo, omws, oti ta dyo qemata den taytizontai, den prepei na parablepoyme to gegonos oti, apo to neo ayto fainomeno ths laqrometanasteyshs, dhmioyrgoyntai epiprosqeta problhmata, ta opoia prepei na antimetwpisoyme.

Sth shmerinh synedriash egine, epishs, mia enhmerwsh apo thn ypoyrgo Eswterikwn, Dhmosias Dioikhshs kai Apokentrwshs Basw Papandreoy gia to gnwsto problhma plhroforikhs toy "ioy toy 2000". Epigrammatika sas anaferw oti me bash to programma poy exoyme katartisei kai efarmozetai, exoyme, hdh, antimetwpisei, se megalo baqmo, ta sxetika problhmata. Exoyn analhfqei sygkekrimenes prwtoboylies kai leitoyrgei Yphresia, me ariqmo thlefwnikhs klhshs to 1204, sthn opoia mporei kapoios na apeyqynetai gia sxetikes plhrofories. Exoyn katartistei gia oles tis yphresies sxedia enallaktikhs leitoyrgias gia tis hmeres ekeines, ta opoia qa teqoyn se efarmogh ektaktws ean xreiastei gia na antimetwpisoyme ta problhmata poy endexomenws qa prokycoyn. Exoyme enhmerwsei toys Dieqneis Organismoys gia thn ejelijh toy ergoy poy exoyme epitelesei sthn kateyqynsh ayth. Genika to qema ayto, to opoio mas apasxolei edw kai kairo, antimetwpizetai me ikanopoihtiko tropo.

Sthn arxh ths synedriashs, o Prwqypoyrgos ekane kapoies epishmanseis.

* Anaferqhke, prwta ap` ola, sthn anagkh na antimetwpisoyme to fainomeno ths kalliergeias prosdokiwn, eite gia proslhceis, eite gia ayjhsh twn apodoxwn toys se diafores koinwnikes omades. H anakoinwsh twn opoiwndhpote metrwn qa prepei na ginetai, afoy prohgoymenws ta metra ayta qa exoyn syzhthqei me to oikonomiko epiteleio, prokeimenoy na prosmetratai to oikonomiko kostos poy synepagontai.

* Epishmane, gia mia akomh fora, to arnhtiko fainomeno twn tropologiwn poy katatiqentai kata th syzhthsh synafwn nomosxediwn. Apo palaiotera exei diatypwsei jekaqara th qesh toy gia to qema ayto. H qesh ths kybernhshs paramenei h idia: Den qa prepei, otan syzhtoyntai shmantika qemata, na didetai eykairia se koinwnikes omades, se atoma na piezoyn prokeimenoy na epityxoyn eidikes ryqmiseis poy epiqymoyn.

* O Prwqypoyrgos ekane, telos, mia anafora sth xqesinh episkech toy sto Kossyfopedio, opws epishs, kai sthn episkech poy prokeitai na pragmatopoihsei meqayrio sto Saragebo, opoy qa ginei h Dieqnhs Diaskech gia to Symfwno Staqerothtas. Gnwrizete oti h Ellada diaqetei stratiwtika tmhmata sthn Albania, sto Oyrosebats, opoy phgame xqes, alla kai sth Bosnia. Einai politikh mas epilogh h paroysia ellhnikwn stratiwtikwn tmhmatwn stis perioxes aytes. To kostos gia thn leitoyrgia aytwn twn tmhmatwn anerxetai se arketes dekades disekatommyria draxmes. Einai, omws, epibeblhmeno giati pisteyoyme oti h epilogh ayth apotelei tmhma ths ejwterikhs politikhs mas, pera apo to gegonos oti symbalei stis prospaqeies toy dieqnoys paragonta gia thn apokatastash synqhkwn eirhnhs kai omalothtas stis perioxes aytes.

Ayta apo meroys moy. Akoyw tis erwthseis sas.

BITALHS: Qelw mia dieykrinish. H kybernhsh yposthrize palaiotera oti den yparxei megalh sysxetish anamesa sth laqrometanasteysh kai sthn ayjhsh ths egklhmatikothtas. O Prwqypoyrgos sthn Kybernhtikh Epitroph kai sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio, prosfata, synedese stis dhlwseis toy eyqews ta dyo ayta qemata. Meta tis synanthseis toy me toys politikoys arxhgoys, ekana mia pio metriopaqh topoqethsh kai shmera, eseis milhsate gia epallhloys kykloys. Telika, poia einai h apoch ths kybernhshs, syndeetai h oxi h egklhmatikothta me th laqrometanasteysh;

REPPAS: Asfalws syndeetai to ena qema me to allo, alla ta dyo qemata den taytizontai apolytws. An qelete na sas anaferw sygkekrimena stoixeia, mporw na to kanw. Sas lew mono toyto: To fainomeno twn kaloymenwn oikonomikwn prosfygwn sthn Ellada exei, bebaiws, tis eyergetikes epidraseis toy se kapoioys tomeis, opws einai h oikonomikh anaptyjh, h prosfora ergasias se apasxolhseis poy synhqws apofeygoyn oi Ellhnes polites. Apo thn allh, omws, exei kai parenergeies, alla kai arnhtikes synepeies. Oi arnhtikes synepeies den ekdhlwnontai mono me egklhmatikh symperifora. Gnwrizete oti ayto to megalo kyma twn oikonomikwn prosfygwn sthn Ellada epibarynei, an qelete, th leitoyrgia twn dhmosiwn nosokomeiwn; Gnwrizete oti megala dhmosia nosokomeia, se ena poly shmantiko pososto, prosferoyn noshleia se oikonomikoys prosfyges; Kai oti synepagetai ayto, oxi mono gia to kostos leitoyrgias toys, alla kai gia tis sxeseis poy anaptyssontai me toys giatroys, me to noshleytiko proswpiko, ton tropo me ton opoion toys antimetwpizoyn kai antimetwpizontai apo aytoys. Den einai swsto ola ayta ta qemata na ta syzhtoyme, blepontas mono th mia pleyra. Yparxoyn polles pleyres. Asfalws, loipon, exei sxesh to ena qema me to allo, xwris -epanalambanw- na taytizetai to ena me to allo. Alla, to oti exoyn sxesh ta dyo qemata, bebaiws kai exoyn.

BITALHS: Yparxoyn oi ekqeseis toy Panepisthmioy ths Aqhnas poy deixnoyn oti den yparxei eyqeia syndesh laqrometanasteyshs kai egklhmatikothtas. O k. Nikolaoy, prosfata, paroysiase kai stoixeia toy ypoyrgeioy Dhmosias Tajhs poy edeixne to xamhlo pososto ths symmetoxhs laqrometanastwn sthn egklhmatikothta. Telika, ayta ta stoixeia kai aytes oi ekqeseis isxyoyn shmera;

REPPAS: Prwta ap` ola, den dexomai thn apoch poy isxyrizontai kapoioi oti to pososto egklhmatikothtas poy proerxetai apo toys oikonomikoys prosfyges einai peripoy sto idio epipedo me to pososto egklhmatikothtas twn Ellhnwn politwn kai ara, den yparxei problhma. Prwta ap` ola, yparxoyn Ellhnes polites, oi opoioi gennhqhkan edw, einai Ellhnes kai prepei na antimetwpistei h egklhmatikh symperifora toys apo ta organa toy kratoys. Apo th Dioikhsh, th Dikaiosynh, thn Astynomia. Ti sxesh exei ayto me toys metanastes oi opoioi erxontai paranoma s` ayto ton topo kai qa prepei na ypaxqoyn se kapoies diadikasies, se kapoioys kanones. Na katagrafoyn kai na entaxqoyn, me bash apofaseis poy pairnei to ellhniko kratos, sthn ellhnikh koinwnia kai den to kanoyn. Kai ayto kaythriazetai. Parakalw, mh ginetai ayth h sygxysh kai ayth h sygkrish. Pisteyw oti den einai swsth.

TROYPIWTHS: Pote h ka Papandreoy qa kataqesei to nomosxedio kai an prin to kataqesei to dwsei sta kommata ths antipoliteyshs.

REPPAS: H syzhthsh epi twn kateyqynsewn poy shmera syzhthsame kai apofasisame qa synexistei, prokeimenoy na ejeidikeytoyn polles pleyres ayths ths arxikhs protashs se enan kyklo synarmodiwn ypoyrgwn. To epomeno diasthma, prin oloklhrwqei h diatypwsh aytoy toy nomosxedioy, h armodia ypoyrgos qa syzhthsei me toys ekproswpoys twn politikwn kommatwn, prokeimenoy na epidiwxqei kai na epiteyxqei h megisth dynath synainesh kai symfwnia gia tis diatajeis aytoy toy nomosxedioy. Giati, ta qemata ths metanasteytikhs politikhs einai para poly shmantika kai xrizoyn mias koinhs antimetwpishs. Ola ayta, qa ginoyn to syntomotero dynato. Den mporoyme, ayth thn wra, na prosdiorisoyme sygkekrimenh hmeromhnia.

FILHS: Eipate oti h diadikasia katagrafhs twn oikonomikwn prosfygwn mia diarkhs diadikasia. Ti ennoeite, akribws; Den isxyoyn oi proqesmies poy yphrxan apo ton OAED gia thn apokthsh ths kartas;

REPPAS: Isxyoyn apolytws. Ayto to opoio eipa kai to akoysate einai toyto: H stigmh ekeinh, kata thn opoia qa exoyme katorqwsei na kalycoyme apolytws ta xersaia kai ta qalassia synora mas, einai makrinh kai isws na mhn yparjei kai pote. Giati, pantote, antilambaneste oti yparxei problhma, estw kai enas laqrometanasths na einai piqano na eiselqei sthn Ellada. Ara, to qema ths katagrafhs aytwn poy paranoma erxontai sthn Ellada, einai ena qema poy exei diarkeia kai megalo baqos xronoy.

FILHS: To kinhtro gia na katagrafei kapoios aytoboylws kai oxi na syllhfqei kai synepws parelkei h idea ths katagrafhs, poio einai, an toy parexetai dia ths katagrafhs h dynatothta nomimopoihshs toy;

REPPAS: Prwta ap` ola, einai se ejelijh ayth h diadikasia gia th xorhghsh ths leykhs kai prasinhs kartas. Para polloi den exoyn labei meros s` ayth th diadikasia. Apofasisame, shmera, na analaboyn oi OTA, se synergasia me thn Astynomia kai alloys foreis, thn katagrafh aytwn poy briskontai sthn Ellada kai den exoyn mexri twra symmetasxei sth diadikasia, h opoia, edw kai arketo kairo exei jekinhsei kai ejelissetai, gia thn apokthsh prasinhs kartas. To kinhtro gi` aytoys einai oti, efoson proserxontai kai pairnoyn meros se mia tetoia diadikasia, den qa epanaprowqoyntai. Opoioi, dhladh, briskontai shmera sthn Ellada kai den exoyn labei meros sth diadikasia apokthshs twn nomimwn eggrafwn, mporoyn...

FILHS: Ayto einai eidhsh.

REPPAS: Asfalws, einai eidhsh.

FILHS: Den to eipate etsi, sthn arxh.

REPPAS: Etsi to eipa kai sthn arxh. Otan proserxetai kapoios se mia diadikasia apografhs den qa to kanei, asfalws, gia na paradoqei. Qa proselqei, prokeimenoy na apografei, epeidh eyelpistei oti qa apokthsei mia dynatothta nomimhs paramonhs toy sthn Ellada. Ayth th dynatothta toy prosferoyme me ayth thn parallhlh diadikasia, h opoia jekina twra. Kai bebaiws, ola ta qemata qa kriqoyn me thn analogh eyelijia poy epiballei to krisimo ayto qema poy oloys mas apasxolei.

FILHS: Poio nomiko kaqestws qa diepei thn paramonh aytwn twn xiliadwn oikonomikwn prosfygwn sthn Ellada, poy den qa exoyn oyte prasinh karta, oyte leykh;

REPPAS: Aytoi oi opoioi entopizontai meta apo elegxoys kai diapistwnetai oti den diaqetoyn nomimopoihtika eggrafa, eite giati den ta dikaioyntai, den mporesan na ta apokthsoyn, eite giati apefygan na laboyn meros stis sxetikes diadikasies gia th nomimopoihsh toys, qa epanaprowqoyntai. Ayth einai dedomenh epilogh mas. Isxyei atalanteyta. Twra, jekina parallhlws mia allh diadikasia, thn opoia qa diaxeiristoyn, kyriws, oi OTA kai h ELAS, epeidh gnwrizoyn proswpa kai pragmata, o kaqenas gia thn perioxh toy. Aytoi oi opoioi einai se mia orismenh perioxh qa exoyn th dynatothta na proselqoyn kai na dhlwsoyn thn ekei paroysia toys, diasfalizontas etsi, se prwth fash, oti den epanaprowqoyntai. Ayto einai to prwto bhma kai to poly shmantiko kinhtro, giati kai eseis milhsate peri kinhtrwn kai pragmati etsi einai. Apo ekei kai pera, ola ayta qa ta antimetwpisoyme kata periptwsh.

FILHS: Yparxei periptwsh se deytero stadio aytoi oi anqrwpoi me th dikh toys boylhsh na katagrafoyn kai mpoyn se ena plaisio nomimothtas, na toys doqei deyterh eykairia na zhthsoyn leykh kai prasinh karta;

REPPAS: Milhsa gia thn ekkinhsh mias neas parallhlhs diadikasias. Einai poly prowro na mpoyme se alles leptomereies. Efoson kapoios epiqymei na entaxqei sthn ellhnikh koinwnia, efoson kapoios epidiwjei na nomimopoihqei, qa antimetwpistei analogws. Gnwrizete poly kala oti opoioi proselqoyn den qa kriqoyn oloi me to idio metro. An kapoios, pragmatika, einai parabaths, qa antimetwpistei diaforetika apo enan oikogeneiarxh o opoios ergazetai, exei egkatasthsei ston topo opoy ergazetai thn oikogeneia toy, exei apodoxh kai einai kata koinh omologia xrhsimos. Ola ayta qa antimetwpistoyn analogws.

FILHS: Pote qa arxisei ayth h diadikasia katagrafhs;

REPPAS: H diadikasia ayth qa jekinhsei, efoson arxisei na isxyei o neos nomos. Qa problepetai sto ypo katartish nomosxedio.

FILHS: Mexri tote, an oikonomikoi prosfyges epikaloymenoi bebaiwseis dhmotikwn forewn...

REPPAS: Den problepetai diadikasia xorhghshs adeiwn h pistopoihtikwn apo dhmoys, symfwna me ta osa isxyoyn mexri twra. Paramenoyme s` ayth thn politikh.

FILHS: Mexri na chfistei o nomos qa yparxoyn epanaprowqhseis. Apo th stigmh poy qa chfistei o nomos qa yparxoyn ejaireseis stis epanaprowqhseis. Ayto lete.

REPPAS: Apo th stigmh poy chfizetai kai isxyei o nomos, jekina mia parallhlh diadikasia gia thn katagrafh toy anqrwpinoy dynamikoy twn metanastwn. To dynamiko ayto qa antimetwpistei analogws. Xrhsimopoihsa th lejh "eyelijia". Parakalw, ayto na to labete ypoch sas. Epanalambanw, oti oi topikes arxes poy gnwrizoyn proswpa kai pragmata, mporoyn na epideijoyn ayth thn eyelijia, prokeimenoy na antimetwpisoyme me ton kalytero tropo, diasfalizontas toys polites apo th mia, alla taytoxrona, kalyptontas, apo thn allh, kai toys metanastes poy dikaioyntai ayth thn kalych, wste oloi na einai ikanopoihmenoi.

FILHS: Pantws, yparxei mia antifash. Ean qewroyme oti kapoioi apo aytoys einai anagkaioi kai dinoyme mia eykairia kapoias nomimopoihshs me th diadikasia ths parallhlhs katagrafhs, tote gia poio logo synexizoyme tis epanaprowqhseis, mexri na chfistei o nomos;

REPPAS: Den yparxei kamia antifash politikhs. H antifash einai synolikh. Einai antifash ths ellhnikhs koinwnias, poy epiqymei fqhna ergatika xeria kai me th dysh toy hlioy, otan pia teleiwsoyn oi wres ergasias, qa epiqymoyse -me poio tropo, isws me aeroplano; - oloi aytoi oi metanastes na metaferontai pali ston topo proeleyshs toys. Ayth einai h antifash ths ellhnikhs koinwnias. Qeloyme metanastes, edw, gia tis wres ergasias, qeloyme na toys apasxoloyme kai tis wres ektos ergasias, qa qelame oloi aytoi na zoyn ektos Elladas. Ayth einai h antifash ths ellhnikhs koinwnias kai toy kaqenos ej hmwn. Den yparxei kamia allh antifash. Epeidh anaferate ayto to qema, tis prohgoymenes hmeres milhsa kai gia thn ypoxrewsh poy exoyn oi ergodotes poy apasxoloyn jenoys. Yparxoyn periptwseis poy ergodotes den toys epetrecan na laboyn meros s` aytes tis diadikasies gia th xorhghsh ths prasinhs kartas. Asfalws, loipon, ayth h deyterh eykairia, dinetai mesw ths neas diadikasias h opoia qa jekinhsei.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Ayto poy eipe o Prwqypoyrgos gia proslhceis, apeyqynotan sthn ka Papandreoy;

REPPAS: Oxi. Miloyse genika gia th syzhthsh poy exei proklhqei dhmosiws peri epikeimenwn proslhcewn xiliadwn (!) politwn. Ola ayta -epeidh kai allh fora to syzhthsame sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio- den qa prepei na diogkwnontai, na antimetwpizontai ws qemata poy apoteloyn kyria shmeia ths politikhs mas, ws politikes epiloges, basei twn opoiwn apeyqynomaste ston ellhniko lao. Ekei opoy xreiazontai proslhceis, qa ginoyn, opws poly sygkekrimena exoyme pei. Pantws, qa einai sta idia epipeda me ta prohgoymena xronia. Einai gnwstes oi qeseis poy einai kenes kai prepei na kalyfqoyn. Den yparxei politikh proslhcewn -as xrhsimopoihsw ayth th frash- kai gi` ayto den qa prepei na ginetai peraiterw syzhthsh peri dhqen megaloy kymatos proslhcewn. Den einai ayth h politikhs mas. Den yparxei tetoio qema.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Ma, h ka Papandreoy ejhggeile proslhceis, exei kataqesei nomosxedio, metatajeis, proslhceis. To nomosxedio milaei gia 30 xiliades proslhceis gia na kalycoyn, leei, qeseis aytwn poy feygoyn. Den ta diabazete kaqe mera; Apo poy bgainoyn; Apo to ypoyrgeio Eswterikwn bgainoyn.

REPPAS: Ma, ti einai ayta poy lete, k. Stamatopoyle. To nomosxedio ayto kata bash, problepei oti osoi apasxoloyntai sto Dhmosio me symbaseis aoristoy xronoy, alla diepontai apo ena kaqestws idiwtikoy dikaioy, metatassontai se kaqestws dhmosioy dikaioy, ginontai, dhladh, kai typika monimoi ypallhloi. Ayto krinetai aparaithto, giati den dhmioyrgeitai kanena epiprosqeto kostos, afoy den prokeitai gia nees proslhceis. Einai anqrwpoi oi opoioi ergazontai epi polla xronia sto Dhmosio me symbaseis aoristoy xronoy. Ayto, omws, to opoio einai qetiko einai oti qa mporoyn na analambanoyn kaqhkonta sthn ierarxia, na exoyn pleon dikaiwma ypografhs, na ekdidoyn apofaseis, pragma to opoio den dikaioyntai shmera me to kaqestws ths ergasiakhs sxeshs poy toys xarakthrizei.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Opote einai proslhceis.

REPPAS: Ayto katalabate eseis. Sas lew oti yparxoyn aytoi oi 30 xiliades ypallhloi poy ergazontai dia bioy, mexri na paroyn syntajh. Den mporei kaneis na toys apomakrynei apo to Dhmosio. Exoyn symbaseis aoristoy xronoy. Twra, anti na einai ypallhloi idiwtikoy dikaioy, ginontai dhmosioy dikaioy. Giati; Sas to ejhghsa. Gia na exoyn th dynatothta na ypografoyn apofaseis, pragma to opoio den toys epitrepetai shmera, me apotelesma se polles periptwseis o dhmosios tomeas na xwlainei. Anti na proslaboyme neo proswpiko, ayta ta kaqhkonta ta anaqetoyme, pleon, se ypallhloys poy ergazontai hdh sto Dhmosio, edw kai arketa xronia kai einai sthn oysia, sthn pragmatikothta, monimoi.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Kai gia thn tropologia poy anaferotan se boyleytes;

REPPAS: Gnwrizete poly kala oti gia qemata tropologiwn, exoyme milhsei polles fores. Den einai h prwth fora poy kanoyme tetoies epishmanseis. Antilambaneste oti ayto to fainomeno twn pollwn tropologiwn qa prepei na ekleicei. To exoyme pei me safhneia kai kathgorhmatikothta.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Epimenw. Anaferotan sth sygkekrimenh tropologia twn boyleytwn;

REPPAS: Anaferotan se oles tis tropologies. Exoyn epishmanqei ta fainomena ayta. Oi ypoyrgoi exoyn thn eyqynh gia thn eishghsh poy kanoyn me to nomosxedio to opoio kataqetoyn. Kai bebaiws, oi symplhrwseis kai oi beltiwseis poy eishgoyntai, otan einai xrhsimes, kai aytes prepei na ginontai dektes. Apo ekei kai pera, miloyme synolika gia tropologies, oi opoies erxontai ek twn ysterwn, prokeimenoy na antimetwpistoyn qemata poy den exoyn amesh sxesh, para th synafeia toys, me to ypo syzhthsh nomosxedio. Ayto to fainomeno kaythriasthke polles fores kai, gia mia akomh fora, shmera.

KARGOYDH: Sto plaisio toy ypo katartish nomosxedioy, kanate logo gia kapoia grafeia se geitonikes xwres...

REPPAS: Eipa oti mporoyme na dhmioyrghsoyme katopin dimerwn symfwniwn, grafeia se geitonikes xwres, wste h prowqhsh metanastwn sthn Ellada na ginetai me bash tis anagkes mas, me meqodeymeno tropo.

KARGOYDH: Ayto shmainei oti qa yparjoyn sygkekrimenes dimereis symfwnies stis opoies qa kaqorizontai posotika kai poiotika...

REPPAS: To lete poly kala.

DHMAKAS: H kalliergeia prosdokiwn sthn opoia anaferqhke o Prwqypoyrgos, afora kai to misqologio twn ajiwmatikwn; To rwtw, giati einai qema epikairothtas, einai to mono poy syzhthqhke xqes.

REPPAS: Ayto to qema syzhthqhke, proxqes. Teqhke apo ton armodio ypoyrgo kai apofasise to KYSEA oti qa apotelesei antikeimeno syzhthshs toy ypoyrgoy Eqnikhs Amynas kai toy ypoyrgoy Eqnikhs Oikonomias kai Oikonomikwn. Gia to qema ayto, exoyn endiaferon, logw ths symmetoxhs sth sxetikh syzhthsh, kai oi ypoyrgoi Dhmosias Tajhs (blepe Ellhnikh Astynomia) kai Emporikhs Naytilias (blepe Limeniko Swma). Einai ena qema to opoio qa antimetwpistei se syzhthsh h opoia qa ginei me ton ypoyrgo Eqnikhs Oikonomias.

DHMAKAS: Den aforoyse, dhladh, h epishmansh toy Prwqypoyrgoy to qema ayto.

REPPAS: Oxi, den eixe kamia sxesh, doqentos oti to qema ayto mas apasxolhse kai exoyme labei sygkekrimenh apofash.

FILIPPAKOPOYLOS: H epishmansh toy Prwqypoyrgoy, poioys aforoyse telika; Eipate, prin, oti den aforoyse thn ka Basw Papandreoy. Lete, twra, oti den afora to qema twn stratiwtikwn. Poioi, telika, kalliergoyn aytes tis prosdokies;

REPPAS: Prwta ap` ola, gnwrizete oti egine megalh syzhthsh, thn teleytaia periodo, gia to gegonos oti ws apotelesma, asfalws, ths sygkekrimenhs oikonomikhs politikhs mas, exoyme mia shmantikh ayjhsh twn esodwn toy Dhmosioy. Den ginetai, omws, analogh syzhthsh gia thn ayjhsh twn dapanwn toy Dhmosioy se tomeis poy aforoyn thn koinwnikh politikh. Mporei, loipon, na doqei h entypwsh oti ayth h ayjhsh twn esodwn toy Dhmosioy, dinei thn anesh, th dynatothta kai thn eyxereia na proxwroyme se proslhceis, prokeimenoy na ikanopoihsoyme etsi mia kommatikh pelateia. Eipa oti h kybernhsh den akoloyqei politikh proslhcewn. Den qa prepei na dinetai ayth h entypwsh, epeidh polla dhmosieymata blepoyn to fws ths dhmosiothtas, thn teleytaia periodo, me anafora se epikeimenes proslhceis. Ayto prepei na einai safes apo th dikh mas pleyra.

SIANHS: Dinetai, dhladh, h eyxereia stoys dhmoys na eishgoyntai sth Dioikhsh, sto kratos, ean sthn perioxh toys qeloyn na nomimopoihsoyn kapoia omada metanastwn kai katw apo poies diadikasies; Kai deyteron, an enocei toy nomosxedioy, kapoios epishmos kratikos foreas analambanei thn ypoxrewsh na ereynhsei poio ergatiko dynamiko xreiazetai sthn Ellada, se poies perioxes, se poia ektash kai se poies periodoys.

REPPAS: Oson afora to prwto qema, h nomimopoihsh apofasizetai apo tis yphresies toy kratoys. Oi OTA exoyn symmetoxh sth diadikasia katagrafhs toy anqrwpinoy dynamikoy. Ara, loipon, einai poly xrhsimh h dikh toys symmetoxh. Den qa apofasizoyn aytomatws gia thn paramonh aytoi oi opoioi katagrafoyn, alla h katagrafh einai ena prwto poly shmantiko bhma. Qa prepei na doyme poia einai ta ariqmhtika, koinwnika kai alla dedomena, prokeimenoy na laboyme tis telikes apofaseis.

Deyteron, oson afora thn katagrafh twn anagkwn poy yparxoyn sth xwra mas, prepei na sas pw oti apo ton OAED yparxoyn -giati exoyn syllegei- ayta ta stoixeia kai exoyn entopistei oi anagkes. Eipwqhke, epishs, oti prepei na enisxysoyme tis Epiqewrhseis Ergasias oi opoies -opws gnwrizete- eixan metaferqei sthn armodiothta ths Nomarxiakhs Aytodioikhshs. Dystyxws, den apedwse to sxhma ayto. Chfisame na entaxqoyn pali sto ypoyrgeio Ergasias. Qa prepei na enisxyqei para poly o mhxanismos aytos, prokeimenoy na exoyme mia safesterh eikona, giati shmera den yparxei h dynatothta elegxoy. Exoyme, loipon, apo th mia, katagegrammenes tis anagkes, apo thn allh, omws, den exoyme th dynatothta apolytoy elegxoy gia to poioi kai pws kalyptoyn aytes tis anagkes. Yparxoyn tetoia problhmata ta opoia syzhthqhkan, shmera. Ola ayta, epanalambanw, qa apotelesoyn antikeimeno peraiterw syzhthshs, metajy synarmodiwn ypoyrgwn, alla kai me ta kommata ths antipoliteyshs, prin diatypwqei to keimeno toy sxetikoy nomosxedioy.

SIANHS: Me ton oro "eyelijia" poy qesate, yparxei h dynatothta eishghshs apo kapoio dhmo oti "egw qelw aytoys"...;

REPPAS: Otan miloyme gia tis anagkes poy yparxoyn se kaqe perioxh, asfalws, peran twn kratikwn yphresiwn, kai oi OTA gnwrizoyn tis anagkes ths topikhs agoras. Apo ekei kai pera, bebaiws, oi apofaseis aytes qa lhfqoyn apo kratikoys foreis. Giati, oi apofaseis aytes -epanalambanw- qa lambanontai mesw leitoyrgiwn poy qa problepontai apo dimereis symfwnies.

KONTOPOYLOS: Exoyn parathrhqei fainomena paranomwn iqageneiwn. Yparxoyn, dhladh, kyklwmata poy "xorhgoyn" iqageneia kata tropo paranomo. Kai apo thn allh, yparxoyn kataggelies apo polites poy zoyn sth xwra mas kai dikaioyntai na paroyn thn ellhnikh iqageneia kai antimetwpizoyn problhmata. To qema ayto exei zhthqei; Yparxei proqesh ths kybernhshs na allajei tis diadikasies;

REPPAS: Eipa oti apofasisame na eksygxronisoyme th diadikasia gia th xorhghsh iqageneias. Yparxoyn problhmata, yparxoyn kapoioi oroi oi opoioi isxyoyn mexri twra, yparxoyn dyskolies, yparxoyn kai para polloi problhmatismoi gia to poia einai h kalyterh antimetwpish. Ola ayta ta qemata qa tyxoyn analytikhs epejergasias kai qa diamorfwsoyme thn telikh qesh mas, afoy synennohqoyme kai me ta alla kommata. Diatypwnetai, gia paradeigma, enas problhmatismos gia to an prepei kaqe periptwsh na ejetazetai xwrista h qa prepei na exoyme mia politikh gia omades, na exoyme mia, kat` arxhn, proseggish toy qematos se syllogiko epipedo. H deyterh epilogh isxyse kai isxyei akomh se megalo baqmo. Yparxoyn problhmatismoi, an einai apodotikh. Kapoioi epimenoyn oti odhgei se megales kaqysterhseis oti einai mia diadikasia h opoia den einai dikaih kai antikeimenikh kai proteinoyn, gi` ayto to logo, kaqe periptwsh na antimetwpizetai xwrista.

Ola ayta mas apasxoloyn. H qesh mas einai na proxwrhsoyme se enan eksygxronismo ths politikhs gia th xorhghsh iqageneias.

ELENOPOYLOS: Htan gnwsth h apoch ths hgesias toy ypoyrgeioy Ejwterikwn, symfwna me thn opoia idiaitera toys metanastes apo ta boreia synora, qa prepei na toys doyme me ena diaforetiko mati, etsi wste na exoyme thn analogh ryqmish twn sxesewn mas me tis geitonikes xwres. Ayth h apoch, katateqhke shmera;

REPPAS: Eipwqhke, pragmati, oti oi sxeseis mas me tis geitonikes xwres ephreazontai se shmantiko baqmo apo ton tropo me ton opoio dexomaste, filojenoyme kai entassoyme sthn ellhnikh koinwnia, polites poy erxontai apo tis xwres aytes. Gnwrizete poly kala oti mia aitia gia to megalo kyma oikonomikwn prosfygwn einai ayth h anisothta, to diaforetiko epipedo anaptyjhs, metajy ths xwras mas kai twn geitonikwn xwrwn. An pragmatika yparjoyn -kai eyxomaste na yparjoyn kai symballoyme s` ayth thn kateyqynsh, giati apotelei shmantiko qema gia emas, alla kai gia thn antimetwpish toy dedomenoy problhmatos- synqhkes politikhs staqerothtas kai oikonomikhs anaptyjhs, p. x. sth geitonikh Albania, poy na ejasfalizoyn synqhkes kalhs zwhs gia toys polites ths, antilambaneste pws qa exei antimetwpistei se shmantiko baqmo, to kyma oikonomikwn prosfygwn pros thn Ellada. Gi` ayto akribws, eipame oti ola ayta apoteloyn stoixeia askhshs kai ejwterikhs politikhs. Kai qa ejetastoyn kai yp` ayto to prisma. Ara, loipon, ola ayta ta ejetazoyme se para polla epipeda, wste na epityxoyme to kalytero.

Sas eyxaristw.

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