Greek Government Press Briefing, 99-02-02

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

YPOYRGEIO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

Aqhna, 2 Febroyarioy 1999

H ENHMERWSH TWN POLITIKWN SYNTAKTWN KAI TWN ANTAPOKRITWN JENOY TYPOY APO TON YPOYRGO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS KAI KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO DHMHTRH REPPA

Geia sas.

Akoyw tis erwthseis sas.

MIXAHL: Hrqe, telika sthn Ellada, o Otsalan h oxi;

REPPAS: Oxi.

MIXAHL: Isxyrizontai para polloi, akoysthke apo ta radiofwna kai grafthke stis efhmerides, oti telika hrqe sthn Ellada, anefodiasthke to aeroskafos ki efyge. To epibebaiwnete h to diaceydete;

REPPAS: Den synebh kati tetoio. Aporw giati epanerxeste me ayton ton epimono tropo se mia ypoqesh gia thn opoia polla legontai, xwris na antapokrinontai sthn alhqeia. Ayto to qema pisteyw oti to kleisame xqes. Syzhthsame xqes, apanthsa se erwthseis, hmoyn sth diaqesh sas na apanthsw kai se alles erwthseis, an ayto htan dikh sas epiqymia. Antilambaneste pws o dialogos, shmera, pairnei allh troph. Me thn prwth apanthsh poy edwsa, h opoia htan monolektikh, blepw oti antidrasate me tropo poy dhmioyrgei ena klima, to opoio den antapokrinetai sth sobarothta poy exei to qema, to opoio qelete na syzhthsoyme. Egw qa apanthsw stis erwthseis sas. Eyxaristws eimai sth diaqesh sas. Pisteyw, omws, oti exei kleisei ayto to qema. An qelete kati kainoyrgio na syzhthsoyme, asfalws qa to syzhthsoyme. Den exw kanena logo na mhn to syzhthsoyme.

MIXAHL: Ti apantaei h kybernhsh, loipon, stis apoceis oswn lene oti qa eprepe na erqei o Otsalan sthn Ellada kai den eprepe h kybernhsh na krathsei ayth th stash, poy epishs xqes mas diatypwsate, oti den einai xrhsimh h skopimh h eleysh toy, dioti etsi, kaqe fora, poy den qeloyme na dhmioyrgoyme entash me thn Toyrkia, den qa dinoyme asylo ston Otsalan, oyte qa epekteinoyme ta xwrika mas ydata, oyte to ena, oyte to allo. Ti apantate se ayth th syllogistikh; Diatypwqhke shmera, kata koron, sta radiofwna.

REPPAS: Oti kanoyme mia politikh arxwn kai den kanoyme kairoskopikh ejwterikh politikh. Afoy apanthsa xqes oti h eleysh, h paroysia toy Koyrdoy hgeth sthn Ellada den einai oyte skopimh, oyte xrhsimh. Xrhsimh gia ton idio ton koyrdiko lao. Ta dikaiwmata toy koyrdikoy laoy, metajy twn allwn, kai h Ellada exei qesei ws qema pros syzhthsh sthn E. E. kai se alla dieqnh FORA. Ara, h sympaqeia kai h yposthrijh poy prosferoyme einai dedomenh kai qa synexistei, giati afora enan dikaio agwna gia thn anagnwrish twn Anqrwpinwn Dikaiwmatwn enos megaloy tmhmatos toy plhqysmoy ths Toyrkias. Apo kei kai pera den qeloyme na emplejoyme ayto to megalo qema, ws ena metajy twn allwn, sthn atzenta twn ellhnotoyrkikwn sxesewn. Giati pisteyoyme oti den einai ellhnotoyrkiko qema. Einai ena dieqnes qema o sebasmos twn anqrwpinwn dikaiwmatwn kai h anagnwrish twn dikaiwmatwn toy koyrdikoy laoy, sthn prokeimenh periptwsh. Apanthsame se ayta ta qemata me safhneia poy pisteyw oti den afhnei periqwria gia epanalhch sxetikwn erwthmatwn.

MIXAHL: Apo tis plhrofories poy exei sth diaqesh ths h kybernhsh, apo alles kybernhseis h apo tis dikes ths Yphresies, mhpws jerete poy mporei na brisketai o Otsalan;

REPPAS: Den gnwrizoyme kai den exoyme kanena logo na metablhqoyme se ereynhtes, prokeimenoy na gnwrizoyme poy brisketai o Koyrdos hgeths. Gnwrizoyme oti den einai sthn Ellada. Polla akoygontai, polla legontai, ayta, omws, qa prepei oloi na ta antimetwpizoyme me poly megalh sygkrathsh, poly perissotero otan aforoyn tetoia qemata, ta opoia prepei na ta xeirizomaste me pollh eyaisqhsia.

PARIS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, den amfisbhtw ayta ta opoia lete, alla to basiko stoixeio exei na kanei me ena aeroplano poy prosgeiwqhke xqes sthn Kerkyra. H Astynomikh Dieyqynsh ths Kerkyras htan gyrw apo ayto to aeroplano, apo to opoio kapoioi bghkan, phgan se kapoia apoqhkh ki ejafanisthkan. Yphrxe ena terastio peplo siwphs xqes. Se epaneilhmmenes prospaqeies mas kai me to ypoyrgeio Dhmosias Tajhs kai me alla ypoyrgeia na maqoyme ti synebh yphrje ena peplo siwphs. Yphrxan malista kai antikroyomenes dhlwseis. Ayto loipon to FALCON einai to idio to opoio anaxwrhse nwritera apo to Milano ki htan mesa o Otsalan. Moiazei to aeroplano. Ki erwtw, loipon: Poioi htan se ayto to aeroplano, oi opoioi eixan thn anagkh ths kinhtopoihshs olhs ths Astynomikhs Dieyqynshs ths Kerkyras xqes. Poioi htan, epiteloys, poios htan aytos o Ellhnas epixeirhmatias -opws lene-h o Malaisianos. Poios htan telika aytos o anqrwpos poy eixe tetoia anagkh prostasias;

REPPAS: Prwta ap' ola milhsa me polloys synadelfoys sas, xqes, wste na mh dikaiologeitai ayth h kritikh, oti synanthsate kleistes portes sthn prospaqeia sas na kanete reportaz kai na enhmerwqeite gia ta gegonota. Apo kei kai pera, apeyqynqeite stis armodies Yphresies, gia mia pthsh enos aeroskafoys sthn ellhnikh perifereia, gia na parete sygkekrimenes plhrofories. Den einai dynaton na gnwrizw egw, ws Ekproswpos ths kybernhshs, to ti ginetai ana pasa stigmh, se olh thn Ellada. Den einai dynaton na gnwrizw poios kineitai poy. Gia to sygkekrimeno qema poy exei teqei kai afora ton Koyrdo hgeth, epeidh akribws einai ena idiaitero qema kai apasxolhse thn kybernhsh, exoyme ayth th qesh gia thn opoia sas enhmerwsa, oti den hrqe kai den brisketai sthn Ellada o Koyrdos hgeths.

ALEJAKH: Eseis eipate oti diaceysate xqes me safhneia to oti o Otsalan htan sthn Ellada, alla, endexomenws, ayto to opoio eseis qewreite safes, na mhn htan toso safes, dioti eipate xqes -an qymamai kala- "den nomizw oti briskomaste mprosta se ena tetoio endexomeno h oti qa breqoyme mprosta se ena tetoio endexomeno" anaferomenos sto na erqei. Isws, loipon, h amfisbhthsh na proerxetai kai apo ayto. Alla, h erwthsh moy einai allh kai einai h ejhs.... REPPAS: Ara, poio einai to symperasma to opoio bgainei apo ayth thn parathrhsh poy kanete; Oti mporei sto mellon na symbei kati to opoio egw den mporw na problecw; Pragmati, mporei na symbei kati to opoio den mporw na problecw.

ALEJAKH: Oxi, oxi, kati allo qelw na pw. Emeis ayto poy eisprajame xqes, eite apo th diaceysh toy ypoyrgeioy Ejwterikwn, htan oti htan ligo xliares aytes oi diaceyseis gia to an hrqe h oxi. To erwthma moy, omws, einai allo...

REPPAS: H opoia htan para poly safhs.

ALEJAKH: Oxi, eipate den nomizw, oti mporoyme na breqoyme mprosta se ayto to endexomeno. To "den nomizw" den leei "den hrqe pote".

REPPAS: Pisteyw oti h qesh poy exei ekfrasei h ellhnikh kybernhsh einai toso safhs kai sygkekrimenh, wste den epitrepetai se opoiondhpote na thn paranohsei kai na kanei kinhseis h xeirismoys, oi opoioi qa agnooyn to periexomeno ayths ths politikhs qeshs ths ellhnikhs kybernhshs.

ALEJAKH: Exete to xarisma toy logoy, kyrie Ypoyrge, kai paroysiazete ta pragmata...

REPPAS: Den apantw edw gia na mh xalasw to sxolio sas!

ALEJAKH: Xqes, klhqhke sto toyrkiko Ypoyrgeio Ejwterikwn o k. Nezeriths dyo fores. To prwto poy qa hqela na rwthsw einai an emeis prokeitai na zhthsoyme apo thn Toyrkia na mas zhthsei syggnwmh, giati kalese ton presbh dyo fores kai malista -ap` oti legetai kai ap` oti dhmosieyoyn oi efhmerides- toy milhsan kai se poly ojy tono. Kai to deytero: Apo to Ypoyrgeio Ejwterikwn eipan ston presbh na mhn dextoyme ton Otsalan sthn Ellada, na mhn erqei edw, opws toys eixame yposxeqei. Pote emeis yposxeqhkame stoys Toyrkoys oti den prokeitai na dexqoyme ton Otsalan edw; Dwsame kapoia yposxesh, gia to qema toy Otsalan sthn Toyrkia; Giati, ayto akoysthke apo to Ypoyrgeio Ejwterikwn ths Toyrkias, oti emeis eixame yposxeqei, leei, na mhn erqei o Otsalan edw, na mhn ton dextoyme. Exoyme kanei kati tetoio;

REPPAS: Giati, prepei na pistecoyme ayto poy leei to toyrkiko Ypoyrgeio Ejwterikwn kai na mhn parameinoyme se ayta poy leei h ellhnikh kybernhsh h oi paragontes ths ellhnikhs kybernhshs; O k. Nezeriths eipe oti h Ellada einai synephs se ayta ta opoia leei. Eixe dhlwsei h ellhnikh kybernhsh, me aformh th syzhthsh poy egine sto prosfato parelqon gia ypotiqemenh episkech sthn Ellada toy Koyrdoy hgeth, poia einai h qesh mas. Eixe dhlwsei kai tote oti den einai skopimh h eleysh toy Amptoylax Otsalan sthn Ellada. Pisteyw oti ayth h safhs qesh apotelei mia genikh politikh topoqethsh apenanti se ayto to endexomeno, apenanti se ayto to fainomeno. Den hmastan parontes, den hmastan aythkooi martyres gia na gnwrizoyme pws ejelixqhke o dialogos sto toyrkiko Ypoyrgeio Ejwterikwn opoy eklhqh o k. Nezeriths. Alla, profanws, peri aytoy prokeitai. Peri epanalhchs ths pagias kai gnwsths, poly sygkekrimenhs kai safoys ellhnikhs qeshs gia to qema ayto. Apo ekei kai pera einai praktikh twn diplwmatikwn sxesewn na kaloyntai diplwmates diaforwn xwrwn apo toys ekproswpoys twn ypoyrgeiwn ths xwras opoy einai diapisteymenoi. Aytes einai syzhthseis oi opoies ginontai. Den gnwrizw an yparxei kapoio prwtokollo to opoio baqmologei thn ojythta toys. Gnwrizw, omws, oti einai syzhthseis poy aforoyn qemata ta opoia eite h mia, eite h allh pleyra epilegei na qesei. Einai kati paradekto, einai kati qemito. Den prepei oles aytes tis diadikasies na tis antimetwpizoyme me mia ypermetrh kaxypocia kai na bgazoyme symperasmata ta opoia, telikws, den tekmhriwnontai.

ALEJAKH: Dhladh, ennoeite oti thn pagia ellhnikh qesh thn ejelaban oi Toyrkoi ws yposxesh se aytoys, oti emeis den qa dextoyme ton Otsalan; Giati kai o k. Nezeriths se ayta poy dhlwse kati tetoio afhse na ennohqei. Gi` ayto sas to lew, giati den einai monon oi Toyrkoi. Kai o k. Nezeriths...

REPPAS: Diapistwnw oti se oles tis erwthseis poy qetete, pairnete ws bash gia to syllogismo sas to ti afhnoyn diaforoi na ennohqei. Sas lew oti o k. Nezeriths eipe pws h Ellada threi ayta ta opoia leei. H Ellada exei pei oti den einai skopimh h eleysh toy Otsalan sthn Ellada. Kai pisteyoyme oti ayth h safhneia me thn opoia exoyme ekfrasei th qesh mas, exei lhfqei ws mhnyma apo oloys ekeinoys oi opoioi endiaferontai na epejergastoyn ena sxedio gia episkech toy Otsalan sthn Ellada. Ayto, akribws, einai. H qesh mas ayth, loipon, paramenei h idia kai se ayth th qesh menei kai o k. Nezeriths kai oloi oi paragontes ths ellhnikhs kybernhshs.

T. MPERMPERAKHS: Tyxon eleysh mh Ellhna yphkooy sthn Ellada, alla h mh apobibash ek toy aeroskafoys kai katopin h anaxwrhsh toy, kalyptoyn ton epishmo oro poy lete eseis "den hrqe sthn Ellada";

REPPAS: Exw apanthsei kai thn prohgoymenh fora se antistoixh erwthsh, an qymaste. Eipa oti oyte ena tetoio gegonos exei episymbei, ara den exoyme antikeimeno pros syzhthsh.

KIAOS: Eipate, prohgoymenws, oti to qema apasxolhse thn kybernhsh. Poio qema apasxolhse thn kybernhsh;

REPPAS: To an brisketai sthn Ellada o Otsalan. Enw, thn kybernhsh den thn apasxolei to qema ths pthshs enos aeroplanoy se mia perioxh ths Elladas h ths ekdhlwshs enos gegonotos, enos fainomenoy sthn ellhnikh perifereia. Alla, ayto to qema, epeidh akribws antilambaneste oti exei ena idiaitero endiaferon kai mia jexwristh shmasia, den mporei na afhsei adiaforh thn kybernhsh. H kybernhsh, loipon, h opoia antimetwpise ayto to qema, ereynhse kai katelhje se ayto to opoio apo xqes, me pollh safh kai kathgorhmatiko tropo, anakoinwsa kai se esas.

KIAOS: Pote eixe thn plhroforia h kybernhsh oti brisketai sthn Ellada o Otsalan; Xronika, erwtw.

REPPAS: Eyqys ws sta MME arxisan na diakinoyntai aytes oi plhrofories.

KIAOS: Apo ta MME, dhladh, eixe thn plhroforia;

REPPAS: Ma, etsi akribws egine gnwsto se oloys oti yparxei tetoio qema.

KIAOS: Oxi, h kybernhsh lew egw, k. Ypoyrge.

REPPAS: Ek meroys ths kybernhshs omilw kai sas lew, otan oi plhrofories aytes arxisan na diakinoyntai sta MME, otan egine gnwsto oti syzhteitai ena tetoio endexomeno.

KIAOS: Kai se poio epipedo apasxolhse thn kybernhsh;

REPPAS: Se ychlo epipedo. Se epipedo ypoyrgwn.

KIAOS: Metajy poiwn ypoyrgwn;

REPPAS: Twn ypoyrgwn poy exoyn armodiothta gia ta qemata ayta.

KIAOS: Sygkekrimena; Proswpa sygkekrimena einai, den mporeite na mas peite;

REPPAS: Toy k. Pagkaloy, toy k. Petsalnikoy, toy k. Papadopoyloy, toy k. Tsoxatzopoyloy. An yparxoyn kai alloi, oi opoioi exoyn asxolhqei epeidh erwthqhkan na diereynhsoyn ston tomea armodiothtas toys stoixeia, kai den to gnwrizw, toys paraleipw. Mhn to qewrhsete ayto ws hqelhmenh paraleich. Otan milw gia kybernhsh, milw gia kybernhsh.

KIAOS: O Prwqypoyrgos asxolhqhke;

REPPAS: O Prwqypoyrgos asfalws exei enhmerwqei.

KIAOS: Egine syskech h metajy toys epikoinwnhsan;

REPPAS: Den egine kapoia idiaiterh syskech.

KIAOS: Poses wres apasxolhse toys ypoyrgoys to qema Otsalan, xqes, sthn kybernhsh;

REPPAS: Toso, oso xreiazotan, gia na katalhjoyme sthn telikh kai egkyrh plhroforhsh poy eprepe na exoyme sth diaqesh mas gia na milhsoyme sxetika. Poly liges wres.

KIAOS: Mporeite na mas prosdiorisete poses wres;

REPPAS: Ton ariqmo twn wrwn adynatw na ton prosdiorisw. Lypoymai poy den qa sas eyxaristhsw se ayto.

KIAOS: Ma den einai qema eyxaristhshs, einai qema...

REPPAS: Einai qema enhmerwshs sas na gnwrizete poses wres asxolhqhke h kybernhsh. Mporw na sas pw poses wres asxolhqhka egw. Den mporw na gnwrizw an enas synadelfos asxolhqhke perissoteres h ligoteres wres.

KIAOS: Otan moy lete oti, sxedon, h mish kybernhsh kai o Prwqypoyrgos asxolhqhkan me to qema, olh thn hmera, den jerw pote ki ekei einai to symperasma...

REPPAS: Eipa, poly liges wres. Oses wres xreiazetai na diastayrwsoyme tis plhrofories, gia na doyme an einai egkyres. Eipa, "poly ligo xrono, poly liges wres" kai lete: "Poses wres sygkekrimena; ", gia na bgalete to politiko symperasma apo to poses wres asxolhqhke h kybernhsh.

KIAOS: Ayto einai diko moy to symperasma.

REPPAS: Asfalws, einai diko sas to symperasma. Exete dikaiwma na bgazete dika sas symperasmata. Den einai h prwth fora poy ginetai ayto.

KIAOS: Sth bash ths politikhs arxwn, opws eipate, poy exei h kybernhsh kai tis opoies akoloyqei, ean ton Otsalan den ton dexqoyn -poy den ton dexontai- poyqena, einai diateqeimenh h kybernhsh na pei "nai, ton dexomai", sth bash ths politikhs arxwn;

REPPAS: Den epiqymoyme na mpoyme se ayth th syzhthsh, mesw ypoqesewn kai malista gia ena tetoio qema. H qesh poy exoyme ekfrasei paramenei ayth poy gnwrizete kai pisteyoyme oti apotelei kai mhnyma gia kaqe apodekth poy endiaferetai na thn ermhneysei.

KARGOYDH: To antikeimeno ths synanthshs Pagkaloy-Mperns htan h aposafhnish ths ellhnikhs qeshs enanti ths episkechs Otsalan;

REPPAS: H synanthsh ayth htan sto plaisio twn taktikwn synanthsewn poy exei o ypoyrgos Ejwterikwn me diplwmates jenwn xwrwn. Syzhtoyntai qemata koinoy endiaferontos. Mhn taytizete -giati peri aytoy prokeitai- ayth th synanthsh me to qema poy syzhtoyme.

KARGOYDH: Yparxei mia antidrash apo ekproswpo toy STATE DEPARTMENT, o opoios zhta apo th dieqnh koinothta na lhfqoyn metra, wste na parapemfqei o k. Otsalan sth Dikaiosynh. Yparxei sxolio ths ellhnikhs kybernhshs;

REPPAS: H ellhnikh kybernhsh askei ejwterikh politikh sth bash arxwn. Ayto to opoio eipa prin, einai kati to opoio sth sygkekrimenh periptwsh exei idiaiterh ajia kai shmasia kai to epanalambanw. Apo kei kai pera, den exei antimetwpisei tetoio qema h Ellada.

ALEJAKH: O k. Roympin xqes to brady, legontas ayta bebaiws, eipe kai kati allo, oti mporei na perase apo thn Ellada, alla twra exei fygei. To eipe sxedon jhmerwmata, wra Ellados. Nomizete oti mallon eixan kakh plhroforhsh oi HPA gia ton Otsalan; Profanws, e;

REPPAS: O k. Etzebit eipe oti einai sthn Italia kai o k. Ntalema leei oti zhthse syggnwmh o k. Etzebit apo thn italikh kybernhsh gi` ayto to opoio eipe. Mia ypoqesh ekane o k. Roympin. An exei kapoia stoixeia, ton kalw egw apo to bhma ayto, na ta ferei sth dhmosiothta. Apo kei kai pera, oi ypoqeseis ginontai. Eimaste aytes tis hmeres se enan faylo kyklo, opoy anaparagontai oi plhrofories kai etsi epiteinetai h sygxysh. Gi` ayto akribws eipa apo xqes, oti den qeloyme na meinoyme se mia syzhthsh poy ej antikeimenoy odhgei sto na epiteinetai ayth h sygxysh. Prepei na einai safeis oi topoqethseis apo oles tis pleyres.

KARAKWSTAS: Hqela na rwthsw, an epalhqeyetai h plhroforia oti o Koyrdos hgeths eixe synomilia, epikoinwnhse me epifanes stelexos toy PASOK, toy opoioy zhthse th mesolabhsh pros thn ellhnikh kybernhsh gia na zhthsei asylo.

REPPAS: H kybernhsh den dexqhke mesolabhtes. Twra, an exei epikoinwnhsei me opoiodhpote stelexos h me opoiondhpote allon, einai kati poy den to gnwrizoyme.

KARAKWSTAS: Egine apodekths ayths ths eishghshs...;

REPPAS: Eipa oti h kybernhsh den dexthke mesolabhtes, den dexthke yphresies diamesolabhshs.

MOYRTHS: Den prosferqhkan aytes;

REPPAS: Ayto eipa molis twra.

MOYRTHS: "Den dexthke", eipate. Den tis apodexthke;

REPPAS: Ennow oti den anaferqhke kapoios sthn ellhnikh kybernhsh, eishgoymenos me th mesolabhsh toy, na yparxei kapoia antimetwpish gia th dieyqethsh enos tetoioy qematos.

BITSENTZOY: Mia dieykrinish, epeidh eipate oti h kybernhsh ereynhse an briskotan sthn Ellada o Otsalan, efoson gia thn prosgeiwsh idiwtikoy aeroplanoy apaiteitai adeia twn armodiwn arxwn kai afoy tetoia adeia den qa dinotan sto aeroplano toy Otsalan -ean bebaiws aytos den tajideyei me plasta tajidiwtika eggrafa- pws qa mporoyse na brisketai sthn Ellada o Otsalan, xwris na to gnwrizete;

REPPAS: Symmerizomai ton problhmatismo sas, o opoios einai mia poly kalh apanthsh se polla erwthmata poy exoyn teqei xqes kai shmera. Ayto eipa, allwste, ki egw xqes. Den prokyptei apo poyqena, eipa.

BITSENTZOY: Giati sthn Ollandia etsi egine.

REPPAS: Edw loipon, apo thn ereyna poy egine, den proekyce kati sxetiko.

KIAOS: To sxetiko, oti den zhthse dhladh. Gia na leme me apla logia.

REPPAS: Ma, einai toso apla ta pragmata.

PARIS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, na epanelqoyme sth syzhthsh gia to aeroplano sthn Kerkyra. O astynomikos dieyqynths, otan ton rwthsame, mas eipe lejh pros lejh oti "akoyste paidia, prokeitai gia kapoio kratiko qema". Erwtw loipon: Poio einai ayto to kratiko qema, to opoio eixe sxesh me thn prosgeiwsh toy Falkon sthn Kerkyra; Den jerete gia tis pthseis, poios edwse thn adeia. Alla profanws, an prokeitai gia kapoio kratiko qema, mallon qa jerete. Poios htan loipon o anqrwpos poy briskotan sto Falkon, poios o VIP epibaths toy, o opoios periballetai me ayto to mysthrio;

REPPAS: O sygkekrimenos astynomikos dieyqynths poy eipate, mporei na sas apanthsei poia einai ayth h kratikh ypoqesh, to kratiko qema. Egw den gnwrizw na yphrje mia tetoia pthsh, poy na eixe sxesh me kratiko qema. Eimai Ekproswpos ths kybernhshs, mhn perimenete na ginw ekproswpos toy sygkekrimenoy astynomikoy dieyqynth. Mporeite na rwthsete ton idio.

Sas eyxaristw.

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