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U.S. Department of State Daily Press Briefing #100, 97-07-07

U.S. State Department: Daily Press Briefings Directory - Previous Article - Next Article

From: The Department of State Foreign Affairs Network (DOSFAN) at <http://www.state.gov>


1160

U.S. Department of State
Daily Press Briefing

I N D E X

Monday, July 7, 1997

Briefer: Nicholas Burns

ANNOUNCEMENTS/ STATEMENTS
1           Introduction of Lee McClenny, new Director of the Office of
            Press Relations
1           Results of National Elections in Mexico
1-2         Violence in Cambodia/Issuance of Travel Warning to American
              Citizens

CAMBODIA 2-8 Update on Political Situation/No Evacuation of American Citizens Planned UnderSecretary Pickering to Meet with ASEAN Ambassadors Candidacy for Membership in ASEAN/Relationship to Candidacy of Burma Secretary's Decision to Defer Travel to Cambodia Implication of Current Instability for Future of Paris Peace Accords Whereabouts of Pol Pot

MEXICO 8-9 Reported Death of Narco-trafficker Amado Carrillo-Fuentes 8-9 Election Results/Implications for Stability

CYPRUS 10 Amb. Holbrooke Mtgs. with Cypriot Leaders 11,14-15 UN-Sponsored Talks in New York This Week

FORMER YUGOSLAVIA 11-12 Attempts to Bring Indicted War Criminals to Justice 12-13 Discussions in Madrid/Amb. Gelbard Report to Secretary 13 Obligation of Croatian Government re: Dayton Commitments

GREECE/TURKEY 14 Possible Mtgs. at Madrid Summit on Greek-Turkish Issues

RUSSIA 14 Forthcoming Legislation on Religion 18-19 Nuclear Cooperation with Iran

ZAIRE 15-16 UN Investigation of Massacres/Composition of Investigative Team

NORTH KOREA 16-17 Assumption of Leadership by Kim Jong Il

NORTHERN IRELAND 17 Weekend Violence/Future of Peace Talks

CHINA 18 Commitment to Parliamentary Elections in Hong Kong


U.S. DEPARTMENT OF STATE
DAILY PRESS BRIEFING

DPB #100

MONDAY, JULY 7, 1997 1:10 P.M.

(ON THE RECORD UNLESS OTHERWISE NOTED)

MR. BURNS: It is my great pleasure to introduce Lee McClenny to all of you. I know that many of you know him well. It is Lee's first day on the job as the new director of our Press Office.

Lee is a career USIS Officer and he embodies the spirit of integration.

As we integrate our press offices among the four foreign affairs agencies over the next few years, Lee will be the leader of that effort. He will be directing the Press Office for several years to come.

I am delighted that he's here. I ask all of you to work with him as you've worked with me and with Glyn and with John Dinger and, now, with Jim Foley, cooperatively. I think you will find that Lee not only is an expert on Latin American affairs, but he will surprise you with his encyclopedic knowledge of affairs around the world.

Isn't that right, Lee? Excellent.

Okay. I have two statements to give you today before we go to questions. The first is on the Mexican elections. Yesterday's Mexican elections mark another step forward in the consolidation of democracy in Mexico. The independent body charged with running the elections, political leaders from all three major parties, and civic organizations which observed the elections appear to be unanimous in their judgment that these elections were free and fair and orderly. The United States congratulates the winners and all who participated in the process, but most of all we congratulate the Mexican people on this important step in the advancement and consolidation of Mexico's democracy. I will be glad to take any questions on that should you be interested.

The second issue that is of great concern to us this morning is the situation in Cambodia. We are deeply concerned that the violence and loss of life caused by the conflict between security forces loyal to the two prime ministers. We call on the authorities to take decisive measures to prevent further violence. We urge Cambodia's leaders to resolve their political differences peacefully and to abide by the principles of the Paris Peace Accords. The United States Embassy in Phnom Penh under the leadership of our Ambassador Ken Quinn has been in constant contact with the Royal Cambodian Government, including representatives of both political parties of the two prime ministers.

The United States is also actively consulting today with other countries, including ASEAN countries, the Perm-5 and other countries that were signatories to the 1991 Paris Accords. The safety of American citizens, including our embassy staff, is our primary concern. The embassy is operating and will continue to operate.

It is monitoring the political situation very closely. It is working to assure the welfare of American citizens in Cambodia.

The embassy over the weekend made extensive use of its warden network. It has used radio broadcasts to inform American citizens about the dangers of certain areas of Phnom Penh. In fact, I believe you know we issued a travel warning last evening warning America citizens against travel to Cambodia at this time.

We have no reports of American deaths or casualties as a result of the fighting. We strongly recommend that American citizens defer travel to Cambodia for the time being. We will certainly keep the resident American population informed of events in Phnom Penh and throughout the country as they unfold. This is a situation that has the attention of the Secretary of State. As you know, she made some comments on it earlier today in Madrid and, also, the attention of our Acting Secretary of State, Tom Pickering, here in Washington.

George?

QUESTION: Well, how many Americans are in Cambodia? Do you have any thoughts on evacuation? What is the condition at the airport? Are you considering the evacuation, for starters, of dependents of U.S. officials?

MR. BURNS: I think there are approximately 1500 American citizens, perhaps a little less, in Cambodia. There are 900 Americans registered with our embassy in Phnom Penh, but our embassy believes that there are an additional number between four and six hundred unregistered residents and tourists who are in Cambodia at the present time. We are not contemplating any kind of evacuation at the moment. The fighting has subsided over the last 24 hours.

We hope that is the pattern over the next couple of days.

We have urged American citizens, if they feel insecure where they are in Phnom Penh to go to the Sofitel Hotel or Cambodiana Hotel.

I think there are roughly 100 Americans there, although now some of them have left to go back to their homes in Phnom Penh. Obviously, the safety of American citizens is our primary concern in a situation like this. We will keep this situation under very close review on a daily basis. Should it be necessary to help Americans in a formal way, we will do so, but right now we are hoping that the situation will calm itself sufficiently so that an evacuation will not be necessary.

On the second question, we are maintaining our embassy at its full strength today. This is another question that we will have to keep under daily review, given any fluctuations in the political situation but, more importantly, on whether or not fighting returns to the streets of the capital of Phnom Penh.

Politically, I can tell you that Ambassador Quinn will remain in very close contact with the parties of the two prime ministers.

Obviously, it is not possible for us to be in contact with - at least not Ambassador Quinn to be in contact with Prince Ranariddh who is, I believe, in Aix-en-Provence in France. But certainly he will do his best to make sense of the political situation there.

It is a very chaotic situation. It is hard to understand everything that may or may not be happening at the present time, but all of our efforts will go towards urging the two prime ministers and their political parties to respecting the Paris Peace Accords of 1991, to making sure that they abstain from violence, that they agree to work out their differences peacefully. No one wants to see a repetition of the fighting that occurred over the weekend that left so many people dead and endangered the lives of many others and that threw Cambodia into a state of political chaos.

QUESTION: Nick, you say that you are in contact with allies and other members of the Perm-5. To what end, specifically? Do you have any plans? Do you think that they might have some leverage that the U.S. Government does not?

MR. BURNS: Well, for instance, we will be meeting this afternoon here in the Department of State with the ambassadors from the ASEAN countries. Our Acting Secretary of State Tom Pickering will conduct that meeting, and the purpose of that meeting is to exchange information with them and to share our respective assessments over the meaning, the political meaning, of what happened over the weekend.

Some of the ASEAN countries do have close relations with the Royal Cambodian Government, as do we. We would hope that all of us internationally could agree that we ought to coalesce to argue for an end to the fighting and for the recommencement of some kind of political cooperation between the two co-prime ministers and their political parties so that the people of Cambodia do not have to live through a civil war.

QUESTION: Nick, correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Cambodia is slated to be invited into ASEAN in a few weeks time.

Does the current situation there have any bearing on that as far as the United States is concerned?

MR. BURNS: Well, I think it goes without saying that the current situation there has been the object of a lot of discussion within ASEAN over the last couple of weeks and among ASEAN partners.

That is certainly true of the United States in all of our dealings with the ASEAN countries and with some of the other countries that are part of the post-ministerial conference - Australia, for instance, and some of the European countries.

I think it stands to reason that Cambodia would be the subject of discussion in Kuala Lumpur at the end of this month at the ASEAN meetings. As to whether it is a formal discussion, I don't know at this time. I think it is too early to tell.

Steve?

QUESTION: So, is the United States going to use the suggestion that Cambodia is not ready to get into ASEAN as a way to keep Burma also out of ASEAN? Because the whole point was to get these last three in all at once.

MR. BURNS: Well, I think the United States would separate those questions and separate those candidacies. The United States has a very clear position on the issue of whether Burma is ready to be a member of ASEAN. We have made that position clear to the ASEAN member states. It is their decision, of course. It's their decision. They have to make this decision.

But the United States has a very strong view that the government in Burma is run by military dictators. What is happening in Burma is not consistent with what's happening in most of the rest of southeast Asia, either economically or, certainly, politically.

We will continue to try to isolate Burma through our own economic and political policies. I think we would separate the two and prefer to treat Cambodia individually rather than to lump it with Burma.

QUESTION: No. It's just that if you have what seems to be, in effect, a successful coup d'etat through military force by one of the prime ministers, it seems Cambodia becomes more analogous to Burma than it is, let's say, to a lot of other countries in ASEAN.

MR. BURNS: I think that is too early to say. Obviously, the fighting this weekend was engineered to produce certain results, but I think the origin of the fighting is, at least at this point, sufficiently murky so that we don't want to shoot arrows at one side or another today. What we would like to do is use the next 24 hours to try to make better sense of the political alignment of forces in Phnom Penh and throughout the country to share our views and to ask for the insights of other countries, and then to make some basic decisions about how the United States proceeds.

I can tell you that Secretary Albright is personally interested in this. As you know, she intended to visit Phnom Penh just two weeks ago. She was not able to do so because of the security situation. She has a long- standing interest in this country, has been to Cambodia before when she was UN Ambassador. She is following these events from Madrid rather closely and all of us in Washington are doing the same thing. So I think within 24 to 48 hours we should have a better sense of where people are lining politically in Phnom Penh and, therefore, be better positioned to make some basic decisions about United States policy.

Betsy?

QUESTION: Nick, do you have any information about the University of Oklahoma students and the students from the Oklahoma Baptist College who are in Phnom Penh? Are you aware of any other American student groups like that?

MR. BURNS: Well, I know that there was a group of roughly 40 American students from Oklahoma. Congressman J.C. Watts called us over the weekend to alert us to the fact that they were there and to see if we could help them. Our embassy in Phnom Penh has located them. They are safe. They are all in one location. We will obviously assist them in getting out of Phnom Penh, should they wish to do so.

I know that Senator Hatch has called about some Mormon students who are in Phnom Penh. Our embassy is doing everything it can to locate American citizens. Our advice to American citizens in Phnom Penh right now is to keep your heads down, stay where you are, don't venture into the streets, because we cannot assure anyone that fighting won't be started again in the streets of Phnom Penh or in other cities in the country. As the situation evolves over the next couple of days, we will continue to give advice to American citizens there.

Sid, you had another question?

QUESTION: In retrospect -- and I know retrospect is imperfect -- but do you think the Secretary should have gone to Cambodia, that possibly she would have been able to do something to calm the tensions in this situation?

MR. BURNS: In retrospect, and hindsight is always 20/20, I think the Secretary made the perfect decision. I think she made the right decision. We were very concerned about her security and the security of the press traveling with us and the security of all the people who travel with the Secretary of State. I think given what happened over the weekend - fighting at the airport, fighting downtown - it was obviously the right decision. She made the right decision in deferring travel for the time being.

I know that you all think the United States directs events around the world. That is not always true. The United States has interests in countries like Cambodia. Our ambassador has represented our interests in a very capable way on a day-to-day basis. The two co-prime ministers knew what the policy of the United States was.

The Secretary even had phone conversations and sent letters to both of them, so they knew what our position was. I do not think her presence there would have -- unfortunately, would not have been able to avert the tragic events of the past weekend.

We will continue to assert our views with the Cambodian leadership because we do think that after the killing fields of the 1970s and the horrors that the Cambodian people had to experience that the Paris Peace Accords hold out the best promise for them.

QUESTION: What about future travel? I mean she's going to be in the neighborhood in a couple of weeks. Do you think she might consider going there again?

MR. BURNS: Excuse me, Sid, if I can get my voice back.

Keep talking, Sid. Ask a longer question until I get my voice back.

All right. Future travel, thank you. I think it's too early to say. The Secretary is slated to be in Kuala Lumpur, I think, the middle of the third week of July. It is just too early to say whether or not a trip to Cambodia would make sense. I think we will have to see the direction in which events head there.

I can tell you that American interests are constant and we'll continue through Ambassador Quinn to assert those interests with both political parties.

QUESTION: On Cambodia. Ranariddh said today to Le Monde about Hun Sen, now that he has succeeded in his coup d'etat, dot-dot-dot, resistance must continue. And Hun Sen said after Sihanouk invited them both to Beijing for talks, it is too late and it is not necessary.

Everything is over. Does the United States recognize that this is a fait accompli, that it's a done deal? Or do you not?

MR. BURNS: I think it is too early to say. I have seen those same statements from Prince Ranariddh and from Hun Sen and his compatriots. We prefer to continue our consultations with both political parties today in Phnom Penh and with our allies before we are able to make that kind of a final judgment that the Paris Peace Accords have been ruptured.

The problem is that the Paris Peace Accords were really the glue that held the Cambodian Government together and that gave the people of Cambodia some prospect for a better life and a stable political situation and a stable government. We do not want to see those peace accords ruptured so easily as to be caused by one weekend of fighting. We would like to see some effort made to keep the situation as peaceful as it can, so we are going to resist the temptation to call it what other people are calling it until we can have further conversations.

QUESTION: And then also, do you think it was a mistake after the elections in Cambodia, which Ranariddh and his party won, to let Hun Sen pressure his way into an equivalent job in the government?

MR. BURNS: Well, that was a decision that was made by Cambodians and that was made through the free will of both Prince Ranariddh and his associates. I think that is for the historians to judge, not for us, especially on a day when the dust hasn't even cleared from Phnom Penh.

QUESTION: What time is Undersecretary Pickering meeting with the ASEAN people?

MR. BURNS: About an hour from now. I think 2:30 this afternoon.

QUESTION: And one other, just for the record. Do you have any credible late information on whether Pol Pot is alive, sick or whatever?

MR. BURNS: We don't have any information that would lead us to believe that Pol Pot is either alive or dead, and I mean that quite seriously. I don't believe there has been a sighting of Pol Pot in many, many years. There is conflicting information as to whether or not he is under house arrest by other Khmer Rouge leaders in the region of the country that the Khmer Rouge inhabits.

We have seen various claims that he is, that he is about to be sent to Phnom Penh, but we just don't know about the veracity of these reports. He is an international criminal. He is a barbarian responsible for the deaths of over a million Cambodians. He ought to be brought to justice. No country would like to see him brought to justice more than the United States. As Secretary Albright said on here trip to Asia two weeks ago, we would very much like to see him apprehended and brought to justice. But the problem is the people who are holding him have to take that step and they have not yet done that.

QUESTION: You said that we shouldn't get so excited and jump to conclusions about the Paris Peace Accord and the dust should be allowed to settle and fighting has subsided and we should just take time out to see what is going to happen tomorrow, but isn't part of the problem that even when the dust settles you still have two leaders vying for rule of this country and Cambodia can't seem to settle on a centralized form of government? I mean, it seems as though we are putting ourselves - not us, but that Cambodia puts itself in more danger down the road by continuing with this two-party, this two-headed leadership, if you will?

MR. BURNS: I'm not sure I would agree with that. I think that the merits of the co-habitation, as the French call it, of the two co-prime ministers over the last several years is that at least they haven't been fighting. It has been an uneasy relationship.

They are different political parties with different views of Cambodia's future, but they have been able at least to get along until this past weekend and they have been able to keep the situation peaceful for the people of Cambodia.

You contrast that with the situation of the 1970s when the Khmer Rouge ran amuck and murdered over a million people. I think the Paris Peace Accords were a historic improvement for the people of Cambodia. That is why we don't wish to see them pass so easily and so quickly from the scene when that seemed to be the only way to keep Cambodia a stable country.

Any others on Cambodia?

QUESTION: Yeah.

MR. BURNS: Yes.

QUESTION: I just wanted to know if you could tell us what is going on with the request made to Canada by Secretary Albright concerning Pol Pot. Can you confirm that?

MR. BURNS: Yes, I believe that - well, I know that after the original reports of the sighting of Pol Pot and the reports, the allegations, that he was going to be turned over to the central authorities in Phnom Penh, which did not occur, we did talk to Canada and to several of our European allies about possibly seeing as to whether or not, if he was apprehended, he could be tried in another country, in a European country or in Canada.

I think Prime Minister Chretien has spoken to this question and said that he did not think it was going to be possible in Canada, but we are still pursuing this really on a theoretical basis at this point with some other of our allies because we do want to see him brought to justice one day. He deserves to be put on trial for what he did to the Cambodian people.

QUESTION: Nick, one other on the same topic?

MR. BURNS: Yes.

QUESTION: Do you have or can you get us the amount of direct U.S. aid to Cambodia and whether we are cutting that off or suspending it or letting it go ahead? And then is there a separate figure for the American proportion of World Bank or IMF money?

MR. BURNS: I don't have in my head the figure for American assistance, but we can get that for you. We have not made a decision yet as to whether or not we should curtail American assistance to Cambodia. That is a question that may or may not lie ahead of us, but it is something that we are putting aside for today because we do want to concentrate on trying to clarify exactly where the alignment of political forces is in Phnom Penh.

QUESTION: On Mexico, the DEA reported the death of narco-trafficker Amado Carrillo Fuentes. Can you confirm that and, if not, can you tell us why not?

MR. BURNS: Well, I did see the DEA press statement of yesterday. DEA confirms death of major Mexican drug trafficker.

What I can tell you is that Amado Carrillo Fuentes, we understand both from the Mexican government and news sources, reportedly died on July 4th of complications relating to cosmetic surgery.

The preliminary reporting indicated a high degree of confidence that the deceased was Amado Carrillo Fuentes; however, we are still awaiting final confirmation, official confirmation, of his identity, the identity of the corpse, from the Mexican government.

I really think it is prudent to let the Mexican government speak about this. After all, it is their country and they are best placed to make this kind of assessment. They do have a corpse in their possession and they are doing medical tests on the corpse to see if they can positively identify that to be the corpse of Mr. Fuentes.

You have also seen in the press speculation that this could be a ruse designed to protect him from prosecution and incarceration.

So we will have to see what the Mexican government concludes, and we certainly have great faith in the Mexican authorities to get to the bottom of this.

QUESTION: In terms of the elections, do you see any change from the relation with Mexico, especially with the PRI to lose the majority in Congress and the PRD has already won the government of Mexico City?

MR. BURNS: Well, this is the way of democracies. You know, the people get to decide who sits in the seats of power.

We respect Mexico's democracy, which is a fully functioning democracy.

As Secretary Albright indicated earlier today in Madrid, we look forward to working with the people who have been elected to lead Mexico. We have the closest relationship with Mexico. We want that to continue. We are confident that our excellent relationship with Mexico will continue.

Yes, Laura.

QUESTION: I want to go back to Mr. Fuentes. Is an American official, though, going to attempt to identify the corpse independent of any Mexican official identification?

MR. BURNS: I don't believe that's going to be necessary for us to check up on what the Mexicans are doing. The Mexican government has an interest in answering this question, as well and we will certainly observe and live by the judgment of the government of Mexico on this particular case.

We do have a close drug cooperation with Mexico. I am personally not aware of any American who is going to be present at an autopsy or a scientific test to determine his identity. But I can tell you that we have great respect for Mexico and we will certainly trust the decision that is announced - the judgment that is announced by the government of Mexico.

QUESTION: Nick, if this is, in fact, true and he is dead, what effect do you believe this will have on the drug trade or efforts to assume his mantle by others?

MR. BURNS: Well, if he is proven to be dead, then we hope very much that this will interrupt the activities forever of the cartel that he ran and the perfidious nature of that cartel, which was to run drugs into the United States. We hope very much that the Mexican government will continue its efforts to break the cartels and to diminish the flow of drugs from Mexico and through Mexico from other countries to the United States, and Mexico will have our full cooperation in that effort.

QUESTION: On the Mexican elections. The Mexican people, they don't have any experience at all in living a pluralistic system. Do you think that the election of the PRI as a major in Mexico City will create some sort of instability?

MR. BURNS: It needn't. There are a lot of examples of democracies that live with divided governments. The French Government is an example of that. The United States Government is an example of that. We have the executive branch controlled by one party, currently, and the legislative branch by another. We have been able to maintain our own stability in our own democratic system.

So there is no reason that a democracy cannot survive with cohabitation.

In fact, that really is the lifeblood of a democracy, that certain parts of the government can be controlled by one party, others by another.

But we know that the people who have been elected to these positions - and we certainly know that President Zedillo - are committed to maintaining Mexico's democracy, and therefore will find a way to work with these various political parties who now will share power with the PRI.

We did not involve ourselves in the elections, and that would not have been appropriate. But we certainly respect the results and we wish the Mexican people and the people who won the elections well. We will very definitely want to work with all these people.

Any others on Mexico? Yes, Mr. Lambros. Yes.

QUESTION: Cyprus. Yesterday it was said that Mr. Holbrooke is going to see separately Cypriot President Glafcos Clerides and Turkish Cypriot leader Rauf Denktash. Do you know why Mr. Holbrooke is going to meet also privately with the Cypriot foreign minister Ioannis Kasoulides? Is there any particular reason for such a separate meeting?

MR. BURNS: Well, Ambassador Holbrooke simply wants to inform himself of the positions of all the parties going into these talks. It makes perfect sense for him to meet with Foreign Minister Kasoulides, who is a very responsible person and for whom we have great respect.

QUESTION: He is going to see the President and the Turkish Cypriot leader. Why he has to see separately the foreign minister?

MR. BURNS: This is not unusual in diplomacy, Mr. Lambros.

I can cite probably a million examples where you have a meeting with the president of the country and then you meet with the foreign minister, perhaps to go into further detail on an issue. So there is no conspiracy here. Ambassador Holbrooke is an experienced politician, experienced diplomat, and he looks forward to all these meetings.

QUESTION: According to reports, the Holbrooke plan is targeting the recognition by the Cyprus Government over the illegal, unilateral declaration of independent (inaudible) of the Turkish Cypriot UDI via Dayton-type process. Do you have any comment on that report?

MR. BURNS: The Holbrooke plan?

QUESTION: Yes.

MR. BURNS: I am not aware of a Holbrooke plan. I talked to Dick last Thursday, and I think Dick is still in the planning stages. He doesn't have a plan yet. In fact, he very much supports the efforts of the Secretary General to convene the parties in New York beginning tomorrow night and then Wednesday and for the rest of the week.

So there is a UN plan, and the United States supports that plan.

If we can be helpful in furthering that effort, we will do so.

QUESTION: And the last one. Bulent Ecevit, the one known master of the Turkish invasion and occupation of Cyprus in 1974, with new statements is threatening again the free Cyprus with advances. Any comments since you are mediating in the upcoming talks in New York City?

MR. BURNS: We are not going to be mediating in the talks on Cyprus. That is the United Nations that will do the mediating, not the United States. I have not seen statements by Mr. Ecevit, but I have seen statements by Mr. Yilmaz about his intention to govern effectively, and we look forward to working with the Yilmaz Government.

QUESTION: You said you are not mediating. Just you are getting (inaudible) in those talks?

MR. BURNS: The United Nations is sponsoring the talks in New York. So the United Nations, I think, could be called the mediator. The United States is an interested party to the talks and a friend to all concerned. That is, I think, the appropriate way to describe our respective involvements.

QUESTION: Party in those talks? Not mediation? Not involvement?

MR. BURNS: As you know, Mr. Lambros, these are United Nations talks, not United States-sponsored talks. Ambassador Holbrooke is simply conferring with the parties before the talks begin.

QUESTION: Can we go to another subject?

MR. BURNS: Yes.

QUESTION: What is the current state of play in the U.S. policy toward taking a more active role in the arrest of indicted war criminals in Republika Srpska?

MR. BURNS: Well, I think that Secretary Cohen stated our policy quite succinctly this morning when he said that we are doing everything we can to support the Tribunal, and that we can't, at this stage, rule anything in or anything out. I would refer you to General Shalikashvili's statements on national television yesterday, Secretary Cohen's statements this morning, that we are looking for wars to bring indicated war criminals to justice.

Mr. Karadzic, who is a poisonous figure, and who is inserting his poisonous views in Serbian politics just over the last couple of days, is someone who ought to end up under prosecution. We hope that is the case. Obviously, we are not going to be specific about what we may or may not be contemplating at the present time.

QUESTION: You are saying that you are not ruling anything in or ruling anything out sounds different from what spokesmen, including yourself, have been saying for the past couple of weeks, which was that the policy had been the same as previously and that there would no concerted effort to capture indicted war criminals.

MR. BURNS: No. I know what I have said over the last couple of months, and that is that we are working hard and are considering various options to strengthen the War Crimes Tribunal in the Hague and its ability to prosecute the most notorious war criminals. That is what we have said.

Therefore, we would never rule anything in our out publicly. But neither would we want to share, with all due respect, with all of you publicly what we may or may not be considering because this is an avenue best pursued privately at the current time.

QUESTION: Nick, let me follow on that a little further.

Has the increase in diplomatic pressure prompted the Bosnian Serbs to make any move at all to surrender Karadzic?

MR. BURNS: No, it's up to the Bosnian Serbs, to Mr. Krajisnik, especially, who is a close associate of Mr. Karadzic to turn him over to the War Crimes Tribunal for prosecution. Mr. Krajisnik -- I believe his initials and his signature are in the Dayton accords, and he is violating the Dayton accords by not fulfilling that commitment, as are all the other leaders of the Republika Srpska. So we are calling upon them to do the right thing.

Now, if they don't do the right thing, obviously we will have to consider our options. But we are not going to do that in a public way.

QUESTION: So as far as you can see at the moment there is no movement, then, by the Government of Srpska to hand over Karadzic?

MR. BURNS: There has been no movement that has been apparent to anybody that the Republika Srpska intends to fulfill its commitments.

That is why it is being penalized and not being given even a fraction of the foreign assistance that is now currently flowing to the government of President Izetbegovic, who is doing the right thing, that government being in Sarajevo.

I think General Shali said it best: Let's keep Karadzic guessing, as to what we may or may not have in store for him.

QUESTION: We have discussed this for a couple of years now. Doesn't this put U.S. and all NATO troops at greater risk and a greater risk of conflict to have the U.S. poised to go in with special forces and take Karadzic?

MR. BURNS: No one has said that that is under consideration.

We have said we can't rule anything in or anything out and that we are considering ways, looking at ways, to strengthen the Tribunal.

No one has talked about that specific option.

QUESTION: Can I go back to the Greece and Turkey?--

QUESTION: (Inaudible) Madrid meeting, Nick, are you aware, are they going to talk specifically about this part of the Dayton agreements or what is going to be a topic? Mr. Benjamin said that President Clinton is going to talk bilaterally with others about Bosnia. Could you tell us more detail?

MR. BURNS: I think Bosnia is on the minds of everybody meeting in Madrid. It is not the first order of business. The first order is enlargement. But certainly, I know that Ambassador Gelbard is currently in Madrid. He is briefing Secretary Albright about his most recent trip -- he just came out yesterday - his most recent trip to the Balkans and his conversations with Mrs. Plavsic and others. We are concerned obviously about the situation in the Republika Srpska. President Plavsic dissolved the assembly - the Serb assembly - on July 3rd. The United States will, therefore, not recognize any actions taken by the assembly after July 3rd.

We want the Republika Srpska to follow the rule of law and democratic norms and practices. President Plavsic was elected last summer by the people of the Republika Sprska to lead them. The current political crisis creates, we think, instability and uncertainty at a time when they all should be concentrating on the business, the really central business, which is the implementation of the Dayton accords.

The further along we go in implementing the Dayton accords, the further back the Bosnian Serbs find themselves. Their economy is not growing. People don't have jobs. They don't have international assistance and won't have unless they conform to the Dayton accords.

Their neighbors in Sarajevo, the Bosnian government, will be increasingly more stable and increasingly wealthier and increasingly on better footing than the Bosnian Serbs as long as the Bosnian Serbs refuse to implement the Dayton accords.

QUESTION: Are you --

QUESTION: Another topic?

MR. BURNS: I think she has a follow-up.

QUESTION: Just the other one. President Tudjman granted an interview to Reuters. And he said he did everything he possibly could regarding the Hague and this issue. So what is your message for the Zagreb government?

MR. BURNS: We believe that the Croatian Government can do more, can do a better job at implementing the Dayton accords.

We are not satisfied that the Croatian Government has met its obligations to parties and to the international community on the subject of war criminals.

QUESTION: And last one, Mate Boban, you know, Mate Boban.

Do you have any idea, is it going to be something different among Bosnian Croats since they have new leaders but old politics all the time? Do you believe that they are going to change because some people says that Mate Boban influenced Herzeg-Bosnia as Karadzic influenced Republika Srpska.

MR. BURNS: Well, you see, we want to see Herzeg-Bosnia wither away and cease to exist in any way, shape, or form. We want to see that part of Bosnia fully cooperating with the Bosnian Government in Sarajevo and not trying to keep alive the vestiges of a Croatian mini-state in Bosnia. That is our objective and has been for a long time.

QUESTION: Nick, the Turkish Prime Minister, Mr. Yilmaz, he offered his friendship. And also he said that he can't repeat -- when he was the foreign minister, he met the Greek foreign minister and he established some kind of committee to solve the dispute between the two countries. Did you see this report or do you have any comment on this?

MR. BURNS: I have not seen the report but, obviously, the United States wishes that Turkey and Greece would work more closely together to resolve their respective bilateral disagreements.

QUESTION: And, also, we heard that the Secretary of State, she will met at Madrid Mr. Cem, the new Turkish Foreign Minister and, also, Mr. Pangalos, to talk about the Aegean problem and the Greek-Turkish dispute.

MR. BURNS: I don't know if those meetings are on her schedule, yet. I know there was at least some talk about them. I just don't know if they're going to happen. I'll have to consult with my associates in Madrid.

QUESTION: On another topic?

MR. BURNS: Yes.

QUESTION: Is the United States concerned about final passage by the Upper House of the Russian Parliament of the law that would put restrictions on religions that haven't been there for 15 years?

MR. BURNS: Well, we have, of course, made our views clear to the Russian Government and to Russian legislators as we meet them that we would fully expect that in a democratic society like the Russian Federation that religious rights would be fully protected.

We have had an interest in particular pieces of legislation.

I am not up to date today on the status of that particular bill, but I can take that question and see if we can give you a fuller answer in the coming days.

Dimitris?

QUESTION: Yes. I want to get back on the issue of the discussions in New York. Your announcement on Thursday, you said - you called actually the two Cypriot communities and all other interested sides or parties to work hard towards the process that would bridge the differences in the island.

Mr. Denktash, before his arrival in New York, he visited Ankara and had meeting with the Turkish leadership. After this meeting a statement published and, also, Mr. Sezgin, the designate Deputy Prime Minister, made some kind of provocative statements like annexation of the occupied part of Cyprus, that the principal negotiator in this process is Turkey and not Mr. Denktash. And at the same time, you know that President Clerides and Foreign Minister Kasoulides during his last visit in Washington in a meeting with Secretary Albright, they say that they will go to the discussions with an open mind and with a political will towards progress to the process.

Do you think in general that this kind of statements from the part of the Turkish leadership are helpful right now in view of the discussions?

MR. BURNS: We think that all the parties are approaching these talks in New York with an effort to cooperate with the United Nations and with each other. I haven't seen any indication of any party not wishing to be open- minded and to be cooperative in these talks. I do not want to take a snapshot of certain statements and comment upon them because I am not aware of all the various comments that have been made over the last couple of days. We urge all the parties, Turkey - but not just Turkey - Greece and the Turkish Cypriots as well as the Greek Cypriots to be constructive in these talks.

QUESTION: Nick, today was the day that the UN was supposed to begin investigating the massacres in Eastern Zaire. To my knowledge, it hasn't started. Do you have anything to say about that?

MR. BURNS: Well, we're aware that the United Nations representatives in Congo and the Government of the Democratic Republic of Congo were not able to reach an agreement on the composition of the investigative team and of the time frame to be investigated.

Consequently, I understand the matter has now been referred to Secretary General Kofi Annan. We understand that he will prepare an investigation under his own auspices. We very much support this decision. We agree with the Secretary General that getting the facts is what is most important. It is crucial to get an investigative team on the ground as soon as possible and we believe that only impartial investigators should be part of this mission.

We also believe that the investigative time frame should date back to the initiation of the cycle of violence in Central Africa.

That was in 1993. The Foreign Minister of the Democratic Republic of Congo is in Washington. He arrived on Saturday. He will have appointments this week at the State Department. I can tell you more about those tomorrow. I know that Ambassador Simpson has already informed President Kabila of the critical need for this investigation.

We think that justice must be done. There were certainly massacres that took place in and around Kisangani earlier this year as the rebel forces, the then-rebel forces were proceeding with their drive against the government of President Mobutu. The people who conducted those massacres ought to be held responsible for them. That is just part of the picture here, but it is a very important part of it.

QUESTION: Do you think it is proper, though, that the possible subject of the investigation, Kabila, is being allowed to determine the composition of the investigators?

MR. BURNS: I wouldn't agree that he is being allowed to determine the composition of the team. It is a negotiating process and he is negotiating with the UN Secretary General. The Secretary General is a respected man. He has agreed now to take this negotiation under his own authority and to decide, himself, the composition of the team. The United States believes that only impartial investigators should be part of this team. That should solve the problem that evidently concerns you.

QUESTION: The head of the investigative team, are you saying that the allegations that he was partial or that Kabila made are correct?

MR. BURNS: Excuse me? I didn't understand the question.

QUESTION: Kabila had objected to the head of the team.

He claimed he was not impartial. You are now taking up this opinion?

MR. BURNS: No, no. We are agreeing with the UN Secretary General Kofi Annan who says that he will form the team and that only impartial investigators should be part of it. We agree with that. Now, it is up to the Secretary General to determine who will be part of that team. We have every confidence in Secretary General Kofi Annan.

QUESTION: Does he have any reason to believe that the team as it was composed had people in it who were not impartial?

MR. BURNS: No, I don't believe the United States questioned the composition of the team. There was a great controversy by other parties, not by the United States, about that. But we stayed out of that. Our priority is to see a team formed and launched and on the scene as quickly as possible so that first-hand accounts can be taken, people who were objects of the massacre can be interviewed, and the people who are responsible for them can be brought to justice.

QUESTION: As he said, it is curious, the two things that Kabila demanded, or his people demanded, were a different team and for the investigation to go back to '93, and now, Kofi Annan and the United States support that position.

MR. BURNS: Sid, let's just get the references here correct.

This was a discussion between the government of the Congo and the United Nations. And the United Nations Secretary General, who was the first person to call attention to the atrocities near Kisangani publicly and to ask for a full accounting, has said that he will make sure this team gets in and it will be impartial. I think in the current environment we ought to put our faith in him. We ought to trust that he is going to do the right thing because we know he will.

Yes, sir?

QUESTION: I would like to ask you about North Korea. So far there have been a lot of prediction and speculation that Kim Jong Il, the leader of the North Korean government, will assume the title of presidency three years after his father, Kim Il Sung, died. Today is the third anniversary of his father's death. Can you give us some assessment of North Korean situation in terms of assumption of the presidency?

MR. BURNS: Well, in Secretary Christopher's famous words, "North Korea is an opaque society." Far be it from me to venture a guess as to what will happen within the leadership and who will assume which titles. We have seen all the press reporting on this, but I think we will have to wait until Kim Jong Il decides what to do. I don't want to predict what's going to happen there. We just hope that North Korea will continue to abide by the international agreements that are so important to us in our relationship with North Korea.

QUESTION: So far, the assumption of the title of presidency has been regarded as stability of North Korean society. So if the North Korean -- if the assumption will take place - can you say that there will be still uncertainty of North Korean politics?

MR. BURNS: As long as North Korea fails to be transparent, as long as it continues to be opaque, then I think it is going to be very difficult for us to have any degree of certainty about what's happening inside the country. It is a closed authoritarian communist society. It is very difficult for us to predict the leadership, the composition of the leadership or, even sometimes, the actions of a leadership. We have to make sure that we protect American interests by maintaining our troop presence in South Korea and by maintaining the agreed framework which is our paramount interest. Those two issues.

Laura?

QUESTION: On Northern Ireland, do you have any comments or observations about the violence this weekend? Can you give us an assessment of the state of play in the peace effort there?

MR. BURNS: Well, the United States was deeply concerned, deeply saddened, by the confrontations that took place once again in Northern Ireland over this past weekend. It is very regrettable that efforts to work out mutually acceptable arrangements between Catholic leaders and Protestant leaders, for the handling of the Portadown March, that those negotiations failed.

We are not going to second guess the decision of the British authorities and the Royal Ulster Constabulary to allow the parade. That decision was made on security grounds. It was a very difficult decision, as you know. The British Government and the Royal Ulster Constabulary believe that perhaps by making this decision they might even limit the violence. If you look at last week news events, that was obviously a good decision by the British Government. The urgent task of reconciliation now falls more heavily on the leaders of both communities, the Protestant and Catholic communities. The United States urges a return to calm and constructive efforts to invigorate the multiparty talks which still, we believe, offer the best hope for peace in Northern Ireland.

Yes?

QUESTION: In the Middle East. Can you confirm that an advisor to Netanyahu is having talks with the State Department?

His name is Uzi Arad, I believe.

MR. BURNS: I cannot confirm that. I can look into it and take the question for you.

QUESTION: I'd appreciate it.

MR. BURNS: I'd be glad to.

Yes?

QUESTION: Hong Kong.

MR. BURNS: Yes.

QUESTION: I just saw a report Martin Lee has established shadow cabinet in Hong Kong. Do you have any response to this report? Also, it's been a week since Hong Kong's hand-over.

So, what's so far your assessment in that situation?

MR. BURNS: On the first question, I don't have any comment to make except to say that the United States believes that elections should be held as soon as possible so that the people of Hong Kong can elect their own representatives. The current Legislative Council, of course, has been appointed; and, therefore, it does not in our view represent - cannot represent -- the people of Hong Kong. A way must be found to move to elections very quickly.

It is very difficult to give an assessment after one week. We were pleased, by the way, that the hand-over proceeded with great dignity on the part of the United Kingdom and with, we hope, firm commitments by the Chinese Government that it will honor everything it had agreed to in the joint declaration of 1984. We hope that the Chinese Government will honor its commitments because the people of Hong Kong have achieved a level of prosperity and freedom that most people on earth couldn't even imagine. And that political and economical success must be continued and best continued through elections and democratic government.

Yes?

QUESTION: Going back to North Korea. Sorry. I just wanted to know, this morning on the wires it said that there was some activity, North Korean military activity on the DMZ. I was wondering if you could confirm that and also perhaps state what the ROK and the US is doing.

MR. BURNS: I cannot confirm that. I have not seen that report, but I refer you to U.S. and South Korean military authorities in South Korea itself. But our troops are there to defend South Korea and will do so, if necessary. Bill.

QUESTION: Nick, Ken Bacon sent this question your way.

This is referring to Jeffrey Smith's article on Thursday, July 3, on the concern of the Administration of Russia's nuclear cooperation with Iran, specifically that Russia was continuing to help Iran in its mining and processing of uranium materials to allow them perhaps a large supply of fissionable material - an uncontrolled supply. I think Secretary Einhorn spoke out to this issue.

Is this accurate reporting?

MR. BURNS: Well, I can't - I read Jeff's article. It was, as usual, a very well researched article. But I can't remember all the details so I don't want to pronounce myself on the article itself except to say on the issue, Bill, which is more important, that we continue to talk to the Russian Government every week about the issue of its activities, its relationship with Iran.

We would hope that the Russian Government would conclude, as we have, that it is best to stop all activities with the Iranians because they wish - the Iranians intend to build a nuclear weapons capability, which cannot be in the interest of the Russian Federation.

So we will continue that dialogue with the Russian government itself.

QUESTION: So is there a discrepancy between what the Russians are telling us and what they are actually doing with the uranium, or can you say?

MR. BURNS: We think the Russians have dealt with us in a good faith manner since President Clinton and President Yeltsin agreed in September 1994 that certain Russian activities would be stopped. We believe they have been stopped, and we are pleased about that. Thank you.

(The briefing concluded at 1:55 P.M.)

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