U.S. DEPARTMENT OF STATE 95/09/14 DAILY PRESS BRIEFING

From: hristu@arcadia.harvard.edu

U.S. State Department Directory

Subject: U.S. DEPARTMENT OF STATE  95/09/14 DAILY PRESS BRIEFING

FORMER YUGOSLAVIA

Holbrooke-Milosevic Meeting, Serb Ideas re Sarajevo .........1-9,11

Other Holbrooke Meetings, Travel to Zagreb, Mostar ..........1

Secretary Christopher Conversation w/ Izetbegovic ...........1,3

Pause in NATO Air Strikes, Targetting .......................2,4,10

Russia: Talbott-Kozyrev talks re Bosnia, Talbott Travel .....2-3

Call for Restraint in Fighting ..............................7

Displaced Serbs, Refugees ...................................7

Definition of Heavy Weapons .................................8

Possible NATO Involvement in Enforcing Peace in Sarajevo ....8

Coordination of Eventual Peace Conference ...................9

China Protests NATO Air Strikes in Bosnia, Role in Process ..15

[...]

MR. BURNS: Good afternoon. Welcome to the State Department briefing. If you would like to talk about any issue, I'd be glad to answer any questions you might have.

Q Can you tell us about the deal between Holbrooke and Milosevic?

MR. BURNS: What I can tell you is that Dick Holbrooke, who began the second phase of our peace offensive last evening in Belgrade, had an ll-hour meeting late into yesterday evening with the Serbian President, Mr. Milosevic. This was preceded, during the course of several days, by other contacts made by the European Union -- Carl Bildt -- and by the Russian Government -- First Deputy Prime Minister Ivanov -- with the Serbs, and others in the region.

As a result of the meeting last evening, Mr. Milosevic asked Dick Holbrooke to convey some Serb ideas on a possible agreement towards peace concerning Sarajevo. Therefore, Mr. Holbrooke postponed the planned Contact Group meeting that was to have taken place today in Geneva; and instead he's traveled to Zagreb for meetings with the Croatian President, Mr. Tudjman, and separately for meetings with General Janvier and Mr. Akashi.

Dick Holbrooke then went on to Mostar, where he is now meeting with the Bosnian President, President Izetbegovic.

Prior to that meeting, the meeting with President Izetbegovic, Secretary Christopher had a very good and full conversation with President Izetbegovic about the ideas that President Milosevic has offered. These ideas are being evaluated by the United Nations and by NATO, and we are awaiting the results of their evaluation. As President Clinton said this morning, there is some reason to hope for progress. There is some reason to hope that these ideas might be able to contribute to a peaceful outcome of a very difficult situation in and around Sarajevo.

We believe these are potentially very significant developments this morning. Meanwhile, we understand that NATO has announced a temporary l2-hour halt to airstrikes, pending a possible agreement.

Now, I'm not going to be able to go into any specifics on the ideas that have been offered by the Serbian Government because these discussions are taking place not only in Mostar and Zagreb and Sarajevo but also in Belgrade. There are simultaneous discussions going on in a number of cities and capitals in that part of the world, and the negotiations we hope will bear some fruit, but the announcement of an agreement has not yet been made.

Let me take you to Moscow, where the American Deputy Secretary of State, Strobe Talbott, had a three-hour meeting today with the Russian Foreign Minister, Andrei Kozyrev. Their discussions centered mostly on the situation in Bosnia, in the Balkans in general. They also looked ahead to next week, when Secretary Christopher and Andrei Kozyrev will meet in New York, and further ahead to the U.S.-Russian Summit that will take place in the United States between President Clinton and President Yeltsin.

I think on the basis of Strobe Talbott's conversations with Minister Kozyrev, I can say that they were open, frank, and constructive conversations on Bosnia. The Russians, as you know, are calling for a cease-fire and an end to the airstrikes; and Deputy Secretary Talbott conveyed the views of the American leadership, including those of Secretary Christopher, that the United States very much wants to turn this situation away from war and towards peace. That's why we have Dick Holbrooke's diplomatic delegation in the region.

I understand that Minister Kozyrev and Deputy Secretary Talbott underscored for each other, and agreed upon, the importance of having the United States and Russia work closely together to help the countries in the Balkans move toward peace. As a result of the meeting today in Moscow, both the United States and Russia support very strongly a comprehensive solution towards the problems in the Balkans -- a comprehensive peace conference that both of us hope might be scheduled in the future.

Tomorrow, Deputy Secretary Talbott will remain in Moscow for the better part of the working day there. He will be seeing a variety of Russian officials. He will be returning to the United States and to Washington tomorrow evening.

That is what I have to report about the situation in Bosnia today.

Q Nick, did Talbott and Kozyrev discuss a possible Russian role in the arrangement that's being considered by the U.N.?

MR. BURNS: They did not discuss any specific Russian role -- if you're referring to a military role -- in the arrangements that are being discussed; but, of course, the Russians have been actively involved, and we think very productively involved, in the diplomatic discussions. As I said, First Deputy Prime Minister Ivanov was in Belgrade over the weekend for talks with Mr. Milosevic and others in the region. The Russians have consistently said, and have consistently acted upon this week, a desire to further the peace negotiations. So I think that there is a U.S.- Russian understanding today and agreement that both of our countries should help the countries of the region work towards peace.

Q Well, I'm referring to the possibility of Russian peacekeepers being stationed around Sarajevo?

MR. BURNS: There is no discussion of that in Moscow; and, as I understand it, there has been no discussion of that idea in any of the meetings that have taken place today. I've seen the press reports to that effect; and I think I can say, with a great degree of certainty, that there is absolutely no truth to them.

Q Can you describe President Izetbegovic's reaction to the Serb ideas in his conversation with Secretary Christopher?

MR. BURNS: Secretary Christopher had an opportunity to present our understanding of some of these ideas, and let me just tell you that the Secretary was up for much of the evening talking to Dick Holbrooke and to others in our Government on the phone about this. So just as President Izetbegovic arrived in Mostar -- he arrived late due to bad weather -- the Secretary had a good chance to characterize the Serb ideas, to describe them. Following that conversation, President Izetbegovic went directly into the meeting with Dick Holbrooke.

As I understand it from the Secretary, Izetbegovic mainly listened and did not convey his own opinion of the ideas. I believe that's taking place right now with Dick Holbrooke, and that meeting is ongoing.

Q Nick, this whole thing can grow and grow and still be balanced on the issue of the Bosnian Serbs. What sense do you have of the way they view this, and obviously you have a certain degree of confidence that Milosevic speaks for them?

MR. BURNS: I think you'll have to ask them for their view of these developments. It's difficult for you and me to talk about some of this today because we are in the middle of these negotiations and they're taking place in several venues. So I just simply can't go into detail of what is being discussed.

We are hopeful that there can be an agreement based upon these ideas that could possibly be announced later in the day. That agreement would not be announced from Washington; it would be announced by the appropriate authorities on the ground -- namely, the United Nations and NATO. So, we are waiting for the U.N.'s evaluation of these ideas, whether or not these ideas meet some of the concerns that the United Nations has had about the situation in Sarajevo.

Steve.

Q Should there not be an agreement, whether later today or in the nearest future, is it safe to assume that NATO would then call a halt to its bombing pause and resume operations over Bosnia?

MR. BURNS: Well, as I listen -- I think the best thing for me is to quote NATO. As I listened to the NATO spokesman just about ten, fifteen minutes ago, before I came out here, he said that there is an agreement in NATO this morning -- and, of course, the United States participated in this discussion -- for a temporary pause which would last roughly twelve hours, and he specifically said -- this is now the NATO spokesman -- that should this agreement not materialize, should some of the commitments not be met, then of course NATO would resume its air strikes.

Q Any idea when this pause would begin?

MR. BURNS: I would have to refer you to NATO for the specific hour, but I believe the pause is now in effect.

Q Do you know when it started?

MR. BURNS: No, I don't know the exact hour, but as I read the tickers and as I listened to Jamie Shea from Brussels, the pause is in effect right now, as we speak.

Judd.

Q Nick, if the Russian peacekeepers -- the question of the Russian peacekeepers has not come up to guarantee the security of Bosnian Serbs around Sarajevo, which presumably would have been their role, what guarantees, if any, have been given to the Bosnian Serbs to get them to move their heavy weapons?

MR. BURNS: That gets us into the details of some of these Serb ideas, and some of the conversations that have taken place in Belgrade, Zagreb, in Mostar, in Brussels, and I can't go into those, because it would really jeopardize unnecessarily the state of the negotiations right now and would not be helpful to those negotiations.

Q How many parties will there have to be to this agreement? Would the Croatians have to do certain things as well as the Bosnian Muslims or not?

MR. BURNS: As I understand it, we are really talking about Serb ideas concerning the situation in Sarajevo, and so certainly the Serbs and Bosnian Serbs and the U.N. and NATO are involved here. From the Western perspective, the international perspective, the United Nations and NATO have a leading role here. Member governments, of course, are following this. The American Government has led this diplomatic initiative and we are actively involved. But it is the United Nations and NATO that have to look at this, these ideas, and determine if, in fact, they represent ideas that can lead us to peace and that can perhaps even in the next couple of hours or days lead us away from the situation that we have had over the last couple of weeks and the very difficult situation in Sarajevo.

Q It seems clear, given that Assistant Secretary Holbrooke is carrying the ideas around, showing them to the others, that he thinks they may represent the answer. Is that right?

MR. BURNS: Well, yes, of course. We would not have conveyed these ideas in the way that we have, postponing a meeting in Geneva today of the Contact Group, having Dick travel to three cities in Europe, if we didn't think these ideas had promise. I would just direct you to the comments the President made this morning at the White House. I believe the President said that there is some reason to hope for progress, that we hope that these ideas can contribute to a peaceful outcome of the situation.

Q Nick, this story has been dribbling out over the past few days. I was wondering if the Serbs had in fact communicated this to NATO, the U.N., the United States before Holbrooke returned to Belgrade yesterday, and if his mission there yesterday was a refining one rather than a receiving of ideas one?

MR. BURNS: No, I believe that the first time that anyone in the international community had heard of these ideas was last evening during the eleven-hour marathon meeting that Dick Holbrooke had with Milosevic. That was the first time that the United States had heard these ideas, and I am quite sure the first time that the United Nations and NATO had heard of them. That is why Dick traveled this morning to Zagreb to meet with Janvier and Akashi to apprise them of these ideas, to convey them specifically to them, and also to President Tudjman and now to President Izetbegovic.

So I believe this all started, quite sure it all started last evening.

Q And how did the U.N. officials react to this, can you say?

MR. BURNS: Well, I wasn't in the meeting and I haven't spoken to them, so I really can't characterize their reaction.

I can say, though, Steve, I think these ideas are being considered very, very seriously by the United Nations.

Q During the eleven-hour meeting, did President Milosevic say he had General Mladic's agreement to these ideas?

MR. BURNS: I think it is fair to say that, yes, that President Milosevic, as you know, has formed a joint delegation with the Bosnian Serbs, and that he believes, in fact that is sure, that the Bosnian Serbs are in agreement with the ideas that were presented. Of course, I haven't characterized those ideas.

Bill.

Q Nick, my favorite subject. In this eleven-hour engagement in Belgrade, did the subject of a freeze of offensive military operations, excepting NATO and U.N. military operations, did that come up, and, specifically, with regard to some of the offensives that have taken territory recently?

MR. BURNS: Well, I believe these ideas center around the situation in Sarajevo, and I think that they focus on that situation. But I can't go into the details of what these ideas are because I have been asked not to do that.

Q Yesterday -- go ahead.

Q Just let me follow. So you have no information beyond Sarajevo, and you cannot comment specifically. Can you tell us, have there been any more offensive operations or gains of ground by Croatians or Bosnian Muslim forces?

MR. BURNS: Yes, we believe that the military actions taken by the government of Bosnia and by the government of Croatia and by others in the area have continued over the last twenty four hours. We continue to be very concerned about this ongoing Bosnian and Croatian offensive.

We have repeatedly urged them and all parties in the region at the highest levels not to take actions which could aggravate the situation in the Balkans. The United States believes that there can be no military settlement to the conflict in the Balkans. We believe that a negotiated settlement is the only possible outcome to that conflict, and we believe that all the parties, including Bosnia and Croatia, should focus their energies on peace talks, not on military activities.

That call for restraint has been made once again to Croatia and Bosnia during the last twenty four hours.

Q And their response?

MR. BURNS: I can't characterize their response. I don't wish to characterize everything that we say to them, but we have been in communication with them.

Q Nick, just to follow that, yesterday Dr. Karadzic said apparently that, as tens of thousands of Serbs had been put to flight, he said something to the effect that Serbia won't be a nation until Serbs learn to live as Serbs and not necessarily where their ancestors lived. How is the Department evaluating that comment? What is that saying to you?

MR. BURNS: It's hard for me to evaluate that particular comment. We do know that the UNHCR and the International Committee of the Red Cross believe as many as forty thousand Bosnian Serbs may be evacuating a large section today of Bosnia, western Bosnia, and moving towards Banja Luka. It's a very serious situation -- these numbers approach the number of Bosnian Muslims who were forced to become refugees after the siege of Srebrencia and Zepa -- a very serious situation. We do call upon Bosnia and Croatia to exercise restraint.

Q Does the U.S. and the State Department share the view of some analysts that has been bruited about recently that the Bosnian Serbs are not responding to the Croatians and Muslims because this is land they are going to have to give up at the peace conference anyhow?

MR. BURNS: I'm not quite sure I understand the direction --

Q The supposition that the Bosnian Serbs are not resisting the advance of the Bosnian and Croatian military in that sector because this is land they are going to have to give up as part of -- to reach the 5l/49.

MR. BURNS: Well, 51/49 is going to be the basis of any peace negotiation, but what comprises 51 and 49 has not been decided, if you know what I mean. Therefore, I would not give that suggestion much credence.

Q Nick, you remember in your previous life how for months and months there were questions about defining an intermediate-range missile and a long-range missile and how, artfully or not, people on the Hill were causing problems for arms control agreements with the Russians, claiming that the Russians were fudging on the definition of a "weapon."

I'm reminded of this because of the issue of the definition of "heavy weapons." Is it really that difficult to define -- or to put it another way, does the U.S. or NATO or the U.N. have in a drawer someplace the dimensions of a heavy weapon so there needn't been any hustling or even delay in defining what a heavy weapon is so far as removing it from the outskirts of Sarajevo?

MR. BURNS: I think the United Nations, which is the relevant military authority on the ground monitoring weapons, undoubtedly does have a definition that it uses to determine what's a heavy weapon and what's not a heavy weapon. I can't recite the characteristics of it for you, though.

Q Like pornography, you know it when you see it.

MR. BURNS: You know it when you see it, Barry. Exactly.

Q Can we go from there to ask the State Department, or you, if there then will be any reasonable cause for delay in a withdrawal of heavy weapons because the Bosnian Serbs are having problems figuring out which ones are heavy weapons?

MR. BURNS: If there is to be any kind of an agreement about Sarajevo, if there is to be any kind of a future where the heavy weapons are withdrawn -- and we very, very much want to see that occur -- then I think the Bosnian Serbs also would know it when they see it. They own the guns.

Q Would it include all mortars?

MR. BURNS: I think that's a question, David, for the U.N. I don't have a specific set of criteria for what's a heavy weapon and what is a set of weapons that need to be withdrawn.

Yes, Lee.

Q You seem to rule out the use of Russian troops intermediately enforcing any peace agreement. What's the possibility of NATO troops becoming involved in enforcing any peace agreement either by September 25 or in general?

MR. BURNS: I heard the date of September 25 this morning being bandied about. I don't attach any significance to that date. I don't know where it comes from.

Ultimately, if we are to proceed with this peace progress, then we're going to try to convene at some point in the future an international peace conference. When that peace conference unfolds, if it is ultimately successful in resolving the differences among the parties, then there is going to have to be a way found to secure a peace agreement.

The United States has said consistently over many years that we would part of that. Secretary Perry said two nights ago that he could not give you any kind of detail on what the magnitude of American troop involvement would be because we don't know what the shape of the peace is yet. So we have to wait, I think, further for those details.

If we get to that point, that a peace agreement has been negotiated and that it needs to be implemented and secured, that will be a great accomplishment and we'll be very glad to look at that question.

Q What about as part of the cease-fire arrangement by September 25? Do you see --

MR. BURNS: I know nothing about the deployment of United States or Russian troops to secure a cease-fire. I'm quite sure that the United States has not been involved in any discussions about that particular issue regarding a September 25 deadline. I don't know where it comes from. The United States is not entertaining this notion.

UNPROFOR is in the field. We expect UNPROFOR to stay in the field throughout the fall and the winter. There is very little question in our minds about the fact that UNPROFOR will continue to play the leading role to monitor any of the developments -- positive or negative -- that take place there.

Steve.

Q If the process should reach an international peace conference, whose show would that be? Would it be a group of nations? Would it be the United States? Would it be NATO countries? Might it be the United States and Russia? Has some discussion gone into that?

MR. BURNS: That has not yet been decided because we're still talking about the very difficult issues that separate the parties. We have not talked in any detail about where a conference would be and who would chair it, and so forth. There have been some preliminary discussions about that, but not detailed ones. So it hasn't been decided.

I think, though, that the current arrangement whereby the Contact Group, and in essence, an expanded version of the Contact Group, is pushing forward towards peace, and is probably the most likely arrangement. We certainly want to keep this Contact Group and the expanded group of countries around it together. That's one of the principal reasons why Secretary Christopher asked Strobe Talbott to visit Moscow today.

Q In case this all doesn't work out, there are reports in the newspaper today quoting Pentagon officials saying they're running out of targets within Level 2 bombing. Is that true?

MR. BURNS: That's a question you have to ask the Pentagon. I think more appropriately -- not just the Pentagon -- NATO and the United Nations.

Q You don't know the answer?

MR. BURNS: I have not seen anybody say that on the record. I have heard Secretary Perry say on MacNeil/Lehrer the other night that the air campaign could continue for weeks.

NATO has just announced within the last hour a temporary pause in the air campaign. We hope very much that the conditions will be produced by the Bosnian Serbs to enable that to continue. We'll have to see about that. If conditions are not met, of course, NATO would resume airstrikes.

Q So you're saying it's up to the Bosnian Serbs, but actually, isn't the ball now in the Bosnian Government's court? They have to respond to these Serb ideas; isn't that right?

MR. BURNS: It was a way of saying, David, that ultimately if the Bosnian Serbs are willing to create the conditions that would turn a temporary pause into a lasting one, then that would be a very good thing.

The Bosnian Government does have to react to the ideas that have been conveyed by Dick Holbrooke from the Bosnian Serb joint delegation.

Q Does the U.S. think that the Serb ideas are -- presumably, they want some kind of quid pro quo, some kind of behavior on the part of the Bosnian Muslims in response for their behavior. Does the U.S. think that their ideas are reasonable in that regard?

MR. BURNS: That's really part and parcel of discussions that are underway right now.

(Inaudible)

MR. BURNS: I know you know.

[...]

(The press briefing concluded at l:57 p.m.) END