U.S. DEPARTMENT OF STATE 95/08/09 DAILY PRESS BRIEFING

From: hristu@arcadia.harvard.edu (Dimitrios Hristu)

Subject: U.S. DEPARTMENT OF STATE 95/08/09 DAILY PRESS BRIEFING

OFFICE OF THE SPOKESMAN

FORMER YUGOSLAVIA

Consultations by National Security Adviser Lake and

  Under Secretary of State Tarnoff ........................1-2

President Yeltsin's Proposal for Tudjman/Milosevic Talks ..2-3

--Participation of Bosnian Government .....................4

--Role of Bosnian Serbs ...................................7

Widening of Hostilities/Possibility of Further Serb

  Aggression ..............................................3-4

Humanitarian/Refugee Situation ............................4-6

Contact Group Map and Plan ................................6

Protection of UN Troops ...................................6-7

Reported Atrocities Against Bosnian Males .................7

[...]

MR. JOHNSON: Good afternoon, Mr. Schweid. How are you?

Q I'm fine. So is everybody else, I think. You could poll it, if you want to.

MR. JOHNSON: Would you care to call the roll?

Q I don't really have any questions on Bosnia, which I suppose other people do, so why don't I pass.

MR. JOHNSON: Okay. I suppose no one else has a question. (Laughter)

Q We want to know what secret plan Tarnoff and Lake are bringing to the mix in Europe.

Q I didn't have to ask because we have that already.

MR. JOHNSON: If we told you, it wouldn't very well be a secret then, would it?

I'm afraid I'm going to frustrate you a bit on your inquiries there. I'll tell you what I can tell you about what they're doing and let you know that the Administration has been working over the past several weeks on a set of ideas designed to advance the peace process in the Balkans. Those discussions have included consideration of the future of UNPROFOR, our long-term objective in the region, and some diplomatic initiatives.

Based on those discussions here, we've begun a process of consultation with our allies and others involved in the Balkan crisis to seek renewed progress toward a settlement. National Security Adviser Lake and Under Secretary Tarnoff left this morning to go to Europe for further elaboration of those ideas. They're going to be accompanied by others from this Department, from the Office of the Secretary of Defense, and the National Security Council staff.

Their planned itinerary includes stops in London, Bonn and Paris. In addition to their trip, we're going to be consulting widely with others, especially those countries that are contributing troops to the U.N. Protection Force.

Q Not Moscow, though.

MR. JOHNSON: There are no plans at this time for a Moscow stop.

Q The hills are alive with rumors about something, a successor to UNPROFOR which would have a more specific and perhaps effective mandate. Is that one of the ideas?

MR. JOHNSON: I'm not going to exclude that, but I'm just not in a position to confirm or to set aside any idea that might be reported widely or not so widely in the press. We'd like to have an opportunity to talk to our allies about some of the discussions we've had here and to see if we could work together to take advantage of the new dynamic that's been created by the changed situation on the ground and see if we can move this diplomatic process forward.

Q Is there a reason why this team is not going to Moscow?

MR. JOHNSON: I think that we're going to start with the stops that I've outlined for you, and we want to have a consultation with our allies and then see if it's appropriate and possible to move on to other things. But I want to emphasize for you that just because they are not going there doesn't mean that we're not consulting actively with other capitals, including Moscow.

Q And Moscow is still a member in good standing of the Contact Group?

MR. JOHNSON: Yes.

Q Speaking of Moscow, a few days ago whoever was at the podium indicated that there would be very soon a U.S. appraisal of the Yeltsin initiative to bring the President of Croatia and the President of Serbia to Moscow. Curiously, there hasn't been anything from the podium for several days now, and in fact I'm hearing that the U.S. isn't enthralled with the idea of just having those two in Moscow. What is the U.S. view of this Russian initiative?

MR. JOHNSON: I think, Barry, I would disagree a little bit with some of the sermonette that preceded your question. I don't think we said that we were going to provide an analysis promptly. We just said we were unable to do it at that time, and we hoped --

Q Do it the next day. On Monday the Spokesman said "It's new and fresh. We'll have something for you tomorrow." Whoever was running around the press room the next day had nothing to say. Here it is Wednesday, and I think there is a reason you have nothing to say. Either you haven't decided what to make of it, or you don't think it's a terrific idea, and I'd like you to come clean now.

MR. JOHNSON: I shall frustrate you yet again --

Q That's all right. There are other (inaudible) in the building.

MR. JOHNSON: -- and let you know that we're pursuing right now, I believe, this mission that we've launched this morning for the National Security Adviser and the Under Secretary and his team to go forward.

There are some press reports about who's coming and who's not coming to Moscow. It's clearly a situation which is evolving rather rapidly, so I think it would be unwise and potentially inaccurate for me to try to give you an assessment at this point.

Q But is the Russian initiative a troubling distraction?

MR. JOHNSON: I wouldn't describe it that way.

Q And let me ask you something else which bears on this mission and the situation generally. Before the Serb -- before the Croatians succeeded in Krajina, there was great anxiety from the podium about a wider war. What is the current feeling about the possibility, or even a likelihood, whatever -- you can supply the word, if you will -- for Serbia jumping into the war in Croatia?

MR. JOHNSON: I wouldn't want to provide a word for you there. I would say that our concerns continue about activities in the region that could cause hostilities to break out in other places.

As we did before the Croatian offensive took place, we continue to urge restraint on all the parties in the area and to continue to reaffirm our belief that the best, durable solution to this conflict will take place at the negotiating table; and that's what we're hoping to pursue with this consultative trip which began today.

Q I was looking more specifically for Serbia, because, you see, you folks have seen a dynamic. Every day you remember to say there's a new dynamic, and the dynamic apparently is the Serbs have gotten bloodied in Croatia and part of the dynamic, I understand, is there's a split in the Bosnian Serb leadership.

It sort of creates the image that the Serbs are a little bit weaker and may be more receptive to negotiations. I'm trying to turn the coin around and see if there's still concern though that the Serbs are muscular enough to be ready to jump into the conflict with Croatia, if you see any danger of that?

MR. JOHNSON: We certainly see danger of a wider war, which is a result of some of the aspects of this offensive which took place, especially the increased refugee flows which have resulted from it. I don't think anyone doubts the combat capability of the army which is in the former Republic of Yugoslavia.

I'm not predicting anything that's going to happen. I'm just suggesting that our concerns remain, and it remains one of our objectives to try to prevent the outbreak of wider hostilities during this entire conflict.

Q On the Russian idea, you say what you've been saying all along, that the best durable solution is at the negotiating table. Does the State Department believe that the Bosnia-Herzegovina people belong at that negotiating table?

MR. JOHNSON: We believe that any conclusive outcome to this has got to include them, certainly.

Q Then you would fault the Yeltsin idea --

MR. JOHNSON: That's a conclusion that I'm not going to draw for you there. I'm not going to exclude other activities which might bring progress; but I think that any solution has to include, of course, the Government of Bosnia-Herzegovina.

Q Have you been able to confirm reports of atrocities committed against Serb refugees in the Krajina or as they've crossed over the border?

MR. JOHNSON: Say that one more time. I'm not sure I understand.

Q Have you looked into reports, and have you been able to confirm the reports of atrocities committed by Croat and Bosnian troops against Serb refugees?

MR. JOHNSON: The information we have on that at this point remains kind of sketchy. We note that the Croatian Government has pledged to protect the human rights of Croatian Serbs and has guaranteed to protect its Serbian citizens from discrimination, and we plan to hold them at their word.

We are looking into that situation through representatives of international organizations that are there on the ground. We don't have anybody in those regions that reports directly to us who can make such confirmation or rebuttal, and so we're looking into that with some view toward determining whether or not any atrocities have in fact taken place.

There are without a doubt significant refugee flows which have resulted from this, and there were reports earlier of the use of UNCRO forces as human shields during the hostilities themselves. There have been some other reports of some shooting on the refugees as they try to get out of the way of those hostilities. But that's not something we're in a position to confirm.

Q There seems to be some dispute between the United States and Britain, for example, on whether what happened in the Krajina constitutes ethnic cleansing. What is the position of the U.S. Government? Is that ethnic cleansing?

MR. JOHNSON: I think what's going on in the Krajina area now looks to be a departure of refugees. We don't have any direct evidence that the Croatian Government has sought to rid that area of its Serbian population. But that's something that we're certainly going to look into. That's something we're certainly exploring to see if anything which could be called that might be taking place, and we won't hesitate to call it what it is if that's what we see.

Q But at this point you don't consider it ethnic cleansing?

MR. JOHNSON: At this point we don't have anything that would allow us to draw that conclusion simply because we don't have people on the ground there, and we don't have the evidence which would allow us to draw such a conclusion.

Q Isn't the effect the same? You have an entire population of one ethnic group moved out.

MR. JOHNSON: I think what has been called ethnic cleansing in the past is where it's the government policy and where the people are driven, whether they want to remain or not. I think there is some distinction between that and refugees leaving because of their belief that there might be a lack of safety there, as distinct from being driven from their homes as a government policy.

Q One administrative detail. Does this trip mean that Tarnoff will not be able to keep his appointment in Beijing?

MR. JOHNSON: It does not. We're not in a position now to announce such a trip but we still plan for such a trip to take place. We wouldn't expect this to affect Under Secretary Tarnoff's itinerary.

Q David, how wedded is the United States now to the 51/49 breakdown put forward previously by the Contact Group? And is the United States willing now for there to be a confederation between the Bosnian Serbs and Serbia proper?

MR. JOHNSON: I don't know of any reason to believe that our position on either of those two issues has changed as a result of anything in the last few days, so I don't have anything to contradict our positions we've taken before on that.

Q But what is your position on the map? Because you sent out little signals, like you did with the Spokesman yesterday -- that that division isn't immutable; that we're looking at things, we're considering things. You sure are looking at things and considering things. But it would be helpful if you could state, even if it's the same old position, what the U.S. position is on that proffered map, that creation of ethnic zones, and the way that they're drawn?

MR. JOHNSON: We've said in the past that it's the basis for negotiations. I don't think I want to say anything more than that today.

Q You mean, you don't want to say that they could be changed at the bargaining table?

MR. JOHNSON: It has to be the basis, and it could be changed at the bargaining table. The same thing we've said, I think, innumerable times in the past.

Q David, a recent wire out of Moscow, via UPI, quotes Mr. Andrei Kozyrev as being quite upset with the U.N. for -- well, let's say quite upset about the lack of protection of U.N. troops during the Croatian offensive in Krajina; also decrying the lack of NATO air power to prevent the offensive.

Have the Russians come to the United States to lodge their complaints about the Krajina offensive?

MR. JOHNSON: I'm unaware of them coming to the United States to make any sort of complaint like that.

I would note that the U.N. Security Council President, on behalf of all the members of the Security Council, made at least two statements over the weekend with respect to protection of U.N. personnel in the Krajina; and the United States, from this lectern, made statements as well. We share the sentiment that U.N. personnel should be protected. We condemned the use of any U.N. personnel in combat as human shields or in any other way that was improper. We called upon the Croatian Government to investigate those allegations and to punish those who were responsible.

Q David, has the Croatian Government expressed to our Ambassador, or through any other channel to our government, their displeasure with the criticism by the Russians that might be precluding Tudjman from going to Moscow?

MR. JOHNSON: I'm unaware of anything that would let me know that. It would be unusual for them to complain through our Ambassador about something like that, that another state had said. I would find it a bit puzzling if I read it, but I haven't read anything like that.

Q Do you have any information on U.S. spy plane photos of an apparent mass grave outside the stadium in Srebrenica?

MR. JOHNSON: I can say that we've got some evidence from sensitive sources that tend to corroborate accounts of atrocities against the Bosnian men and boys who were prevented from leaving Srebrenica. That's an issue that we're going to be taking up at the U.N., and I'm going to refer you to our mission in New York City on how this issue is going to be pursued.

Q David, just one other point. In these negotiations that the United States would like to see, do you still believe that the Bosnian Serbs also belong at the negotiating table?

MR. JOHNSON: We believe that the Bosnian Serbs certainly have a role to play.

Q At the table?

MR. JOHNSON: They have a role to play. I'll leave it at that. I'm not going to try to define "tables" for you today; how many sides they have and who sits where.

[...]

(The briefing concluded at 1:43 p.m.) END