Greek Government Press Briefing, 08-12-17

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

Tmhma Dhmosiografikwn Kalycewn

Tetarth, 17 Dekembrioy 2008

Ariqmos Deltioy: 175675191

Ekdosh 1

brf1712

O KYBERNHTIKOS EKPROSWPOS

Aqhna, 17 Dekembrioy 2008

EYAGGELO ANTWNARO

Xairete.

" Ayrio Pempth, 18 Dekembrioy, stis 10.00 qa synedriasei sto Megaro Majimoy, ypo thn proedria toy Prwqypoyrgoy k. Kwsta Karamanlh, h Kybernhtikh Epitroph. Gia to qema qa enhmerwqeite argotera.

" Apo to Ypoyrgeio Oikonomias kai Oikonomikwn anakoinwnetai oti pistwqhke sthn Agrotikh Trapeza eidikos logariasmos, apo ton opoio qa kataballetai, apo ayrio Pempth 18 Dekembrioy, h amesh oikonomikh enisxysh ycoys 10.000 eyrw se epaggelmaties kai epixeirhseis poy apasxoloyn ews kai 50 ergazomenoys, gia thn antimetwpish twn zhmiwn poy proklhqhkan kata th diarkeia twn prosfatwn epeisodiwn. H katabolh aytwn twn enisxysewn ginetai basei ypeyqynwn dhlwsewn poy qa kataqetoyn oi dikaioyxoi kai me bebaiwseis ths Pyrosbestikhs h ths topikhs astynomikhs Arxhs h toy oikeioy dhmoy h toy topikoy Epimelhthrioy.

Me allh apofash toy Ypoyrgoy Oikonomias kai Oikonomikwn k. Alogoskoyfh, systhnetai Kentrikh Syntonistikh Epitroph, h opoia apoteleitai apo ton k. Giannh Sidhropoylo, Geniko Grammatea toy Ypoyrgeioy Oikonomias kai Oikonomikwn, ws Proedro, kai toys kyrioys Giwrgo Kasimath, Proedro ths Kentrikhs Enwshs Epimelhthriwn Ellados, Dhmhtrio Armenakh, Proedro ths Eqnikhs Synomospondias Ellhnikoy Emporioy kai Dhmhtrio Ashmakopoylo, Proedro ths Genikhs Synomospondias Epaggelmatiwn Biotexnwn Emporwn Ellados, ws melh. Ayth h Kentrikh Syntonistikh Epitroph exei ws ergo thn epopteia kai to syntonismo twn trimelwn epitropwn poy sygkrotoyntai apo toys ekproswpoys twn topikwn Epimelhthriwn twn oikeiwn syllogwn kai toy Ypoyrgeioy Oikonomias me antikeimeno, opws gnwrizete - -sas exoyme enhmerwsei- - th xorhghsh bebaiwsewn, me tis opoies pistopoieitai oti oi epixeirhseis h oi epaggelmaties exoyn plhgei sth diarkeia aytwn twn epeisodiwn. Pistopoieitai epishs to ycos twn sxetikwn zhmiwn se ktiria, mhxanologiko kai loipo ejoplismo, prwtes kai bohqhtikes yles kai emporeymata, kaqws kai h piqanh asfalistikh apozhmiwsh poy dikaioyntai na laboyn oi plhgentes gia opoiadhpote apo aytes tis zhmies. Etsi, proxwraei kai ginetai prajh h apofash poy phre h kybernhsh kentrika, na apozhmiwqoyn to taxytero dynato kai xwris kamia apolytws xronotribh, osoi epaggelmaties kai oses epixeirhseis eixan zhmies.

Parakalw tis erwthseis sas.

PALAIOLOGOS: Kyrie Ekproswpe, xqes o Prwqypoyrgos, milwntas sthn Koinoboyleytikh Omada toy kommatos toy, paradexqhke pws se sxesh me to skandalo toy Batopaidioy, oti den eide egkaira tis diastaseis toy, diabazw epi lejei th frash poy xrhsimopoihse kai oti den eixe plhrh eikona otan klhqhke gia prwth fora na topoqethqei. Ayto, symfwna me orismenes ektimhseis qewrhqhke ws adeiasma gia kapoioys tews synergates toy h gia kapoioys Ypoyrgoys. Isxyei ayth h ekdoxh;

ANTWNAROS: O Prwqypoyrgos ekane mia megalh anafora se ayto to qema. Einai safh osa eipe o Prwqypoyrgos. En pash periptwsei, osa eipe o Prwqypoyrgos den periexoyn tipote apo ayta poy eseis ypainisseste.

ARMENHS: Egw qa rwthsw eyqews kyrie Ekproswpe. O Prwqypoyrgos xqes, adeiase ton Qodwro Roysopoylo;

ANTWNAROS: Epanalambanw oti osa eipe o Prwqypoyrgos den exoyn kamia sxesh me kati tetoio.

KAKALHS: Mporeite na mas peite poio einai to praktiko antikrisma ayths ths aytokritikhs kai ths analhchs twn eyqynwn ek meroys toy Prwqypoyrgoy gia thn ypoqesh toy Batopaidioy; Ti shmainei sthn prajh ayth h aytokritikh; Pws ginetai, dhladh, na analambanei thn eyqynh o Prwqypoyrgos kai thn idia stigmh na ``koykoylwnetai'' h ypoqesh mesw ths Ejetastikhs Epitrophs. Kai epishs qa perasoyn sthn kyriothta toy Dhmosioy osa eixan...

ANTWNAROS: Diabasate thn omilia toy Prwqypoyrgoy;

KAKALHS: Safws, th diabasa.

ANTWNAROS: Ola ayta gia ta opoia me rwtate, exoyn apanthqei.

KAKALHS: Mporeite na moy peite an qa synexisei h kybernhsh na dexetai ta xrysoboyla kai ta firmania, ws titloys idiokthsias gia th monasthriakh perioysia;

ANTWNAROS: Den prokeitai na anaferqw se nomika qemata. Den eimai eidikos...

KAKALHS: Kat` ejoxhn, politika einai ta qemata, ayto lew.

ANTWNAROS: Den eimai eidikos nomikos gia na sas apanthsw gia thn egkyrothta titlwn, aytwn h allwn. Ayto afora th nomikh pleyra. H kybernhsh exei labei politikes prwtoboylies, stis opoies anaferqhke kai xqes o Prwqypoyrgos kai oi opoies einai apolytws safeis.

KAKALHS: Me sygxwreite, mexri prin apo dyo ebdomades, apantoysate profanws ek meroys toy Prwqypoyrgoy, ws ekproswpos toy, oti den sas proekyptan politikes eyqynes. Pote jafnika sas proekycan;

ANTWNAROS: Edwsa apanthsh proxqes.

TSIOYFOS: Kyrie Ekproswpe, meta th xqesinh analhch twn politikwn eyqynwn apo ton Prwqypoyrgo kai me dedomeno to porisma ths Ejetastikhs Epitrophs - -to porisma ths Neas Dhmokratias sthn Ejetastikh ennow- - to opoio apodidei politikes eyqynes se dyo toylaxiston en energeia Ypoyrgoys, tiqetai qema...

ANTWNAROS: Apo poy to symperainete kati tetoio;

TSIOYFOS: Den anaferontai oi kyrioi...

ANTWNAROS: Proswpopoioyntai;

TSIOYFOS: Nai, sto porisma, ap` oso diabasa, proswpopoioyntai oi politikes eyqynes, toso gia ton k. Doyka, oso kai gia ton k. Konto. Telos pantwn, anejarthta apo ayto, meta th xqesinh analhch kai ta osa anaferontai sto porisma, tiqetai qema gia toys dyo sygkekrimenoys Ypoyrgoys, se o,ti afora th symmetoxh toys sthn kybernhsh;

ANTWNAROS: Ola ta stoixeia poy perilambanontai sto porisma meletwntai kai qa ajiologhqoyn.

DHMADHS: Thn antikeimenikh politikh eyqynh, dhladh, gia to skandalo ayto thn exei apokleistika kai mono o Prwqypoyrgos; Ayto mas lete;

ANTWNAROS: Diabaste thn omilia toy Prwqypoyrgoy. Einai safhs. Den exw na kanw kamia ermhneia epi ths omilias.

DHMADHS: O k. Karamanlhs sthrizei toys kyrioys Ypoyrgoys, k. Konto kai k. Doyka, akoma;

ANTWNAROS: Topoqethqhka pro oligoy.

BLABIANOS: Sygnwmh kyrie Ekproswpe, qa epanelqw sthn prwth erwthsh. Diabazw th dhlwsh toy Prwqypoyrgoy ``den eixa plhrh eikona otan klhqhka gia prwth fora na topoqethqw'', leei sth synexeia twn oswn eipe prohgoymenws h synadelfos. Egw ayto poy hqela na rwthsw einai to ejhs: Oydeis anqrwpos einai dynaton na gnwrizei ta panta. Ara, loipon, kapoioi ofeilan h eprepe na exoyn enhmerwsei ton Prwqypoyrgo gia diafora pragmata. Exei ginei ayto; Ayth einai h erwthsh thn opoia kanw.

ANTWNAROS: Anaferetai o Prwqypoyrgos. Einai mia oloklhrh paragrafos. Leei kai alla o Prwqypoyrgos. Parakalw na ta diabasete kai na mh moy apodidete epilektika, osa exei pei o Prwqypoyrgos.

MPALHS: Exete kapoio sxolio gia th diamartyria to prwi sthn Akropolh;

ANTWNAROS: Tetoies energeies einai aparadektes. Kai einai aparadektes akomh kai me thn ennoia oti amayrwnoyn kai thn eikona ths xwras pros ta ejw. Den dikaiologoyntai me tipote.

ARMENHS: Hqela ena sxolio gia to gegonos oti o dieqnhs oikos ajiologhshs City problepei ragdaia epideinwsh sta dhmosionomika kai ayjhsh toy elleimmatos.

ANTWNAROS: H kybernhsh exei topoqethqei polles fores kai exei ejhghsei me poio syneph tropo, edw kai peripoy pente xronia, exei katabalei kai ejakoloyqei na kataballei prospaqeies, wste akribws na antimetwpistoyn oi paqogeneies toy parelqontos sthn oikonomia. Na antimetwpistoyn, to eipe kai o Prwqypoyrgos xqes, me th meqodo ths hpias prosarmoghs, me th meiwsh twn terastiwn elleimmatwn poy mas afhsan oi prohgoymenes diakybernhseis. Kai ayto exei epiteyxqei. Briskomaste, bebaiws, se mia dyskolh dieqnh sygkyria kai gi` ayto akribws, opws eipe kai pali xqes o Prwqypoyrgos, oi prospaqeies oi metarryqmistikes, oi prospaqeies gia thn staqeropoihsh ths oikonomias prepei na einai synexeis. Den prokeitai na jefygoyme apo ayto to dromo ths swfrosynhs, pros ofelos olwn twn Ellhnwn politwn, ths koinwnias kai fysika kai ths xwras mas.

PALAIOLOGOS: Kyrie Ekproswpe, sthn erwthsh toy synadelfoy, an tiqetai qema gia dyo Ypoyrgoys, sygkekrimena ths kybernhshs, qema symmetoxhs toys sthn kybernhsh, eipate oti ola ta stoixeia toy porismatos meletwntai kai qa ajiopoihqoyn. Ayto shmainei oti den apolambanoyn ths empistosynhs toy Prwqypoyrgoy oi kyrioi Kontos kai Doykas oso paramenoyn sthn kybernhsh;

ANTWNAROS: Topoqethqhka. Den exw na pw kati allo. Oloi oi Ypoyrgoi poy metexoyn sthn kybernhsh tygxanoyn ths empistosynhs toy Prwqypoyrgoy. Ayto poy sas eipa einai safes.

PALAIOLOGOS: Oxi, mas eipate oti qa ajiologhqoyn ta stoixeia.

ANTWNAROS: Malista. Kai ejakoloyqw na to lew. Qelete na to pw kai trith fora;

PALAIOLOGOS: Oxi, oxi. Ayto shmainei, ayto lew, oti exei arqei h empistosynh toy Prwqypoyrgoy pros to proswpo twn kyriwn Kontoy kai Doyka;

ANTWNAROS: Sas apantw: Ola ta stoixeia poy perilambanontai se ayto to porisma, to opoio, to lew gia mia akomh fora, katartisthke meta apo endelexh ereyna, thn opoia ekane h Ejetastikh Epitroph, ths opoias th systash zhthse h Nea Dhmokratia, qa melethqoyn kai qa ajiologhqoyn.

MANH: Epeidh thn idia apanthsh mas dwsate kai th Deytera, oti ta stoixeia toy porismatos meletwntai kai qa ajiologhqoyn, yparxei deadline; Mexri pote;

ANTWNAROS: Den exw na sas pw kati, peran apo ayto poy sas eipa.

PALAIOLOGOS: Egw qa epimeinw sthn erwthsh ayth.

ANTWNAROS: Dikaiwma sas na epimeinete.

PALAIOLOGOS: Nai. Ayto shmainei oti efoson apo thn ajiologhsh twn stoixeiwn prokycei oti yparxei qema paramonhs toys sthn kybernhsh, milaw panta gia toys en logw dyo Ypoyrgoys, ayto shmainei oti qa fanei to ean telika h oxi exoyn thn empistosynh toy Prwqypoyrgoy apo ton anasxhmatismo.

ANTWNAROS: Den exw na kanw kanena apolytws sxolio gia qemata anasxhmatismoy. Kai en pash periptwsei, den exw na kanw epishs kanena sxolio se ypoqetikes erwthseis, tis opoies moy kanete.

PALAIOLOGOS: Wraia. Epanalambanw sthn oysia to erwthma poy eqese kai h k. Manh. Pote qa ajiologhqoyn ta stoixeia h mallon mexri pote qa ginei ajiologhsh twn stoixeiwn toy porismatos;

ANTWNAROS: Otan exw kati neotero, qa sas enhmerwsw.

DHMADHS: H aytokritikh toy Prwqypoyrgoy eprepe na exei ginei telika nwritera, opws dhlwse shmera h k. Mpakogiannh se radiofwniko staqmo;

ANTWNAROS: Menw sthn topoqethsh toy Prwqypoyrgoy. Den exw na prosqesw kati.

DHMADHS: Qa kataqesete proanakritikh Epitroph, opws sas kalese o Proedros toy PASOK, gia toys kyrioys Fwtiadh kai Dry;

ANTWNAROS: Einai safh ta osa eipe xqes o Prwqypoyrgos. Kai qa sas pw kai kati akomh, to opoio epishs proerxetai apo thn omilia toy Prwqypoyrgoy: Den symprattoyme, se kamia periptwsh, stis prospaqeies tis opoies kataballei to komma ths ajiwmatikhs antipoliteyshs na ekmetalleytei politika ayth thn ypoqesh, ayto to qema kai na poinikopoihsei thn politikh zwh toy topoy.

GALIATSATOS: Kyrie Ekproswpe, epeidh lete oti den kanete kanena sxolio gia to qema toy anasxhmatismoy, alla o anasxhmatismos einai sta xeilh olwn aytes tis hmeres, sas rwtw loipon eyqews: Qa ginei anasxhmatismos kai an ginei, pote;

ANTWNAROS: Epeidh me rwtate, qa sas apanthsw kai egw me ton tropo ton opoio gnwrizete kai fantazomai oti ws empeiros dhmosiografos, asfalws den amfisbhteite: To qema toy anasxhmatismoy einai apokleistiko pronomio toy Prwqypoyrgoy. Ekeinos krinei kai ekeinos apofasizei.

PALAIOLOGOS: Ara, to epibebaiwnete dhladh kai apla menei o xronos gia to pote qa oloklhrwqei.

ANTWNAROS: Ayto katalabate apo ola ayta;

PALAIOLOGOS: Fysika.

ANTWNAROS: Ayto einai diko sas qema. Ayto kanete, an den kanw laqos, pente xronia synexws.

PALAIOLOGOS: Kai kati parapanw.

KAKALHS: Pws sxoliazete to gegonos oti para to paketo twn 28 dis eyrw pros tis trapezes, oi trapezes den rixnoyn ta epitokia sta daneia, emfanizontai aproqymes na xrhmatodothsoyn mikromesaies epixeirhseis kai epipleon zhtoyn kai deytero sxedio sthrijhs;

ANTWNAROS: Opws exw pei syxna, einai ena sxedio gia th sthrijh ths reystothtas sthn oikonomia. Einai ena sxedio to opoio, me dikh ths prwtoboylia, mesa sto plaisio twn kanonwn poy eixe apofasisei h Eyrwpaikh Enwsh, apofasise kai efere sth Boylh pros egkrish h ellhnikh kybernhsh. Einai ena apo ta prwta tria - -an den kanw laqos- - paromoia sxedia ta opoia egkriqhkan se xwra ths Eyrwpaikhs Enwshs kai ayth th stigmh brisketai sto stadio ths ylopoihshs. Twra arxizei h ylopoihsh. Den exei arxisei akomh oysiastikh ylopoihsh. Mhn protrexete, loipon, gia na peite oti kati ginetai, to opoio den exei ginei akomh. Perimenete kai qa deite. Stoxos toy einai na enisxyqoyn akribws - -to eipe kai o Prwqypoyrgos xqes- - sygkekrimenoi tomeis, na enisxyqei h ellhnikh oikonomia kai me thn enisxysh ths ellhnikhs oikonomias na qwrakistei h apasxolhsh poy plhttetai se olh thn Eyrwph logw ths dieqnoys oikonomikhs krishs. Mhn kanoyme oti den katalabainoyme pws yparxei mia dieqnhs oikonomikh krish, h opoia brisketai se ejelijh, brisketai se ejarsh, brisketai se ena poly krisimo shmeio.

KAKALHS: Mexri pote qa perimenoyn oi endiaferomenoi gia na doyn thn antanaklash...

ANTWNAROS: Brisketai sto stadio ths ylopoihshs. Twra arxizei h ylopoihsh.

KALOGEROPOYLOY: Kyrie Ekproswpe, o k. Papandreoy, o Proedros toy PASOK, eipe xqes oti qa mporoyse na apodexqei na mpei kai o k. Drys kai o k. Fwtiadhs mesa sto paketo, prokeimenoy na ginei Proanakritikh. Pws blepete thn protash toy;

ANTWNAROS: Apanthsa ligo prin erqete.

KALOGEROPOYLOY: Gia ton k. Dry kai ton k. Fwtiadh;

ANTWNAROS: Apanthsa ligo prin erqete.

KALOGEROPOYLOY: Sas rwtw sygkekrimena, pws blepete thn kinhsh toy k. Papandreoy gia ton k. Dry kai gia ton k. Fwtiadh.

ANTWNAROS: Sas apanthsa.

KALOGEROPOYLOY: Apanthsate sto qema ths Proanakritikhs.

ANTWNAROS: Isxyei h idia apanthsh. Ta paketa toy k. Papandreoy den me apasxoloyn.

DHMADHS: Me ton k. Zagorith exete milhsei kaqoloy to teleytaio 24wro;

ANTWNAROS: Giati me rwtate;

DHMADHS: Gia na doyme an exete enhmerwqei gia thn karatomhsh toy k. Karaxalioy apo th Genikh Grammateia Politikoy Sxediasmoy. To gnwrizete;

ANTWNAROS: Egw gnwrizw peri paraithsews apo osa diabasa. Alla, opws gnwrizete, gia qemata poy anaferontai sthn kommatikh leitoyrgia ths Neas Dhmokratias den eimai armodios kai den apantw.

DHMADHS: Sas eixan enhmerwsei, pantws.

ANTWNAROS: Sas eipa, ``apo osa diabasa''.

KALOGEROPOYLOY: Xqes, sth ekpomph toy Lakh Lazopoyloy sthn thleorash toy ALPHA, emfanisthke ena binteo opoy deixnei koykoyloforoys me ropala na bgainoyn mesa apo tis omades twn MAT. Prokeitai gia ena ntokoymento, opws katalabainete, gia mia dhmosiografikh apokalych. Qa hqela na moy sxoliasete to gegonos ayto: Stoys kolpoys twn MAT yparxoyn anqrwpoi oi opoioi droyn probokatorika, spane bitrines, dhmioyrgoyn en pash periptwsei fasaria, parakinoyn toys maqhtes;

ANTWNAROS: Moy anaferete kati, to opoio den exw dei kai synepws den mporw na sxoliasw. Apeyqynqeite sto Ypoyrgeio Eswterikwn.

TSIOYFOS: Kyrie Ekproswpe, xqes o Prwqypoyrgos anagnwrise to problhma. Ayth th stigmh, ston tomea ths oikonomias einai to ychlo kostos daneismoy. To ychlotero, an qelete, ayth th stigmh yparxei gia thn Ellada se sxesh me tis ypoloipes xwres ths Eyrwzwnhs. Pws skopeyete na antimetwpisete ayto to problhma;

ANTWNAROS: Topoqethqhke o Prwqypoyrgos. Eipe oti yparxoyn polla problhmata, metajy twn opoiwn kai ayto. Kai kalo qa einai, orismenoi oi opoioi kykloforoyn diafores fhmes na pacoyn na to kanoyn, dioti ...

TSIOYFOS: To eipe o Prwqypoyrgos (den akoygetai)

ANTWNAROS: Den anaferomai se esas, bebaiws. Aytes oi fhmes den exoyn kamia bash kai einai kai epikindynes. Opws sas eipa kai alles fores, h Ellada, apo th metapoliteysh kai meta - -anaferomai apo th metapoliteysh, giati einai h enarjh ths epanaleitoyrgias ths Dhmokratias sthn Ellada- - exei antapokriqei se oles tis daneiakes ypoxrewseis tis opoies eixe.

TSIOYFOS: Egw den anaferomai se ayto, stis daneiakes ypoxrewseis, sthn ejyphrethsh toy xreoys. Egw rwthsa, pws h kybernhsh qa antimetwpisei, me poies energeies skopeyei na antimetwpisei to ychlo kostos daneismoy poy exei. Ayto den einai kati amfisbhthsimo oti yparxei ychlo kostos daneismoy, ayth th stigmh. Den amfisbhteitai apo kanena fantazomai kai to exei paradexqei kai o Prwqypoyrgos. Me kapoio tropo, telos pantwn, den prepei na to antimetwpisete;

ANTWNAROS: Me antimetwpish twn paragontwn poy prokaloyn ayto to ychlo kostos daneismoy.

DHMADHS: O k. Karamanlhs, xqes sth Boylh, eipe oson afora sto epixeirhsiako sxedio to opoio akoloyqhse h Astynomia aytes tis hmeres gia thn antimetwpish twn epeisodiwn poy fanhke ek toy apotelesmatos oti htan aneparkes, epitrecte moy na pw, oti qa ajiologhqoyn kai qa bgoyn ta katallhla symperasmata. Qa yparxei kapoia kinhsh paraithsews toy arxhgoy ths Astynomias h qa analabei thn eyqynh kai pali o idios o Prwqypoyrgos gia ola osa pragmatopoihqhkan kai eginan;

ANTWNAROS: Menw sth dhlwsh toy Prwqypoyrgoy.

KALOGEROPOYLOY: Prin apo ligo, o Proedros toy SEB periegrace thn pragmatikothta etsi opws th biwnei o kosmos, en pash periptwsei, etsi opws th blepei o idios, legontas oti ta paidia mas briskontai stoys dromoys, oti spane bitrines, oti spane katasthmata kai eipe sto telos oti xreiazetai mia isxyrh kybernhsh. Me dedomeno oti h kybernhsh sas den einai isxyrh, qewreite eseis oti leei oti qa prepei na pame se ekloges gia na yparjei mia pio isxyrh kybernhsh;

ANTWNAROS: Prwton, pisteyw oti h shmerinh kybernhsh einai isxyrh kai antapokrinetai sthn apostolh ths. Kai deyteron, den sxoliazw dhlwseis oydenos.

DHMADHS: Oson afora stis katalhceis sta sxoleia, oi opoies synexizontai kai pollaplasiazontai, pisteyete oti krybontai apo pisw kapoies politikes dynameis poy kinhtopoioyn toys maqhtes na bgoyn kai na diadhlwsoyn kai na proboyn se katalhceis;

ANTWNAROS: Den eimai bebaios oti symfwnw me to arxiko skelos ths erwthshs.

DHMADHS: Gia tis katalhceis, pantws, ti exete na peite;

ANTWNAROS: To qema twn katalhcewn, opws gnwrizete, einai ena qema to opoio bebaiws mas apasxolei. Den einai toso megalo se ektash oso prospaqoyn orismenoi na to paroysiasoyn. Kai en pash periptwsei, oi ligoi den exoyn to dikaiwma na empodizoyn thn prosbash twn pollwn stoys xwroys maqhshs kai paideias.

DHMADHS: Aytoi oi ligoi, profanws pisteyete oti ypokinoyntai apo kommatika symferonta;

ANTWNAROS: Einai ligoi pantws. Ayto exei shmasia.

DHMADHS: Ypokinoyntai eseis pisteyete; Oti yparxoyn kapoioi poy ypokinoyntai.

ANTWNAROS: Einai ligoi pantws.

KAKALHS: Me sygxwreite, poy to jerete oti einai ligoi; Me dhmokratikes diadikasies, apo o,ti exw enhmerwqei egw, lambanontai oi apofaseis stis syneleyseis, dia chfoforias. Eseis poy jerete oti einai ligoi;

ANTWNAROS: Qa hqela na maqw - -pisteyw oti qa to maqete kai eseis- - posoi proserxontai sthn chfoforia gia na chfisoyn kai me ti pleiochfies lambanontai oi apofaseis.

KAKALHS: Me tis pleiochfies eklegetai kai h kybernhsh fantazomai. Me to 42% toy ellhnikoy laoy, apo ayto poy chfizei.

ANTWNAROS: Ean amfisbhteite to ellhniko Syntagma, ayto apotelei diko sas problhma.

KAKALHS: Ton eklogiko nomo amfisbhtw poy einai lhstrikos.

ANTWNAROS: Apotelei pali diko sas problhma na amfisbhteite nomoys, oi opoioi chfisthkan apo th Boylh.

KAKALHS: Me sygxwreite, alla eseis den sebeste tis dhmokratikes diadikasies twn maqhtwn. Ayto einai to problhma.

KALOGEROPOYLOY: Kyrie Ekproswpe, xqes eixame mia prwtofanh katastash sthn kratikh thleorash. Jerw th dhlwsh sas, mhn moy thn epanalabete. Qa hqela na sas rwthsw to ejhs: En pash periptwsei yparxei kapoios elegxos; Einai prwtofanes to oti 100 anqrwpoi mporesan, me ton tropo poy mporesan kai mphkan mesa sthn kratikh thleorash. An paw egw qa moy zhthsoyn thn taytothta. Se aytoys toys anqrwpoys...

ANTWNAROS: Qa moy epitrecete na to amfisbhthsw.

KALOGEROPOYLOY: Ti lete kyrie Ekproswpe! Loipon, den breqhke enas anqrwpos na toys zhthsei thn taytothta; Pws eftasan; Den anarwthqhke kapoios, mia asfaleia mesa sthn ERT, poioi einai aytoi oi anqrwpoi, poy phgainoyn oloi mazi;

ANTWNAROS: Gnwrizw oti exei diataxqei h diejagwghs ereynas, opws to gnwrizete kai eseis endexomenws. H ereyna qa deijei an kai poy yphrxan kapoia problhmata. Ekeino to opoio qelw na pw, gia mia akomh fora, einai oti einai aporias ajion giati kapoioi ekproswpoi kommatwn, kyriws toy kommatos ths ajiwmatikhs antipoliteyshs, alla oxi mono, apofeygoyn systhmatika na katadikasoyn me jekaqaro tropo, na paroyn safeis apostaseis, apo prajeis san kai ayth, poy einai epikindynes gia thn omalh leitoyrgia twn dhmokratikwn qesmwn kai qetoyn se kindyno thn aparaithth eyryqmh leitoyrgia twn anejarthtwn MME. Den mporei kaneis na xarakthrizei ws dhqen neanikes diamartyries thn eskemmenh diatarajh ths leitoyrgias twn MME.

KALOGEROPOYLOY: En pash periptwsei, den mphkan mesa me kalaznikof. Mphkan eirhnika.

ANTWNAROS: Ayto deixnei akribws oti exoyme diaforetikh proseggish, eseis kai egw.

KALOGEROPOYLOY: En pash periptwsei. Xqes mphkan mesa sthn ERT. Shmera anebhkan sto braxo ths Akropolhs kai ebgalan ena pano me th lejh ``antistash'' se oles tis glwsses. Ti allo perimenete; Dhladh, den mporw na fantastw, en pash periptwsei, poy mporei na ftasei kai eseis exete ws kybernhsh mia stash entelws paqhtikh. Parakoloyqeite ta gegonota.

ANTWNAROS: Prokeitai gia dikh sas antilhch, thn opoia den symmerizomai.

GKATSIOS: Kyrie Ekproswpe, eipate prin apo ligo, oti einai ajion logoy giati ekproswpoi kommatwn apofeygoyn na katadikasoyn tetoies energeies. Einai oi idioi ekproswpoi toys opoioys kalese ek neoy xqes o Prwqypoyrgos na katadikasoyn me prajeis kai xwris ``nai men, alla'' tis prajeis biaiothtas;

ANTWNAROS: Den jerw an einai oi idioi. Shmasia exei oti kapoioi dyskoleyontai na katadikasoyn ayto poy aytonohta prepei na katadikasoyn. Kai epilegoyn kapoia misologa, katafernontas mono ena pragma: Na ekqesoyn toys idioys toys eaytoys toys.

KALOGEROPOYLOY: Ola ta kommata, akoma kai to Synaspismo ton opoio ton eixate kathgorhsei, katadikasan th bia. Dhladh, ti allo prepei na kanoyn; Diko sas einai to problhma.

ANTWNAROS: Menw sth dhlwsh poy ekana.

DHMADHS: Tiqetai qema apomakrynshs toy k. Panagopoyloy apo th qesh toy;

ANTWNAROS: Oxi.

GKATSIOS: Xqes, o Prwqypoyrgos anakoinwse thn enarjh dialogoy gia thn allagh toy tropoy eisagwghs sthn tritobaqmia ekpaideysh. Qa yparxei kapoio xronodiagramma se ayto to dialogo h qa pame se ena anoixto orizonta, opws p.x. o dialogos poy egine gia thn anabaqmish twn AEI kai TEI;

ANTWNAROS: Einai ena qema sto opoio exoyme anaferqei kai alles fores. O Prwqypoyrgos to ebale xqes se pio sygkekrimeno plaisio. Bebaiws qa proxwrhsoyme se ayto to dialogo. Den nomizw, omws, oti se ena tetoio dialogo qa prepei na yparxei ena aysthro, steno xroniko plaisio. Shmasia exei na akoystoyn oles oi apoceis, wste na odhghqoyme sthn kalyterh dynath lysh.

KALOGEROPOYLOY: Kyrie Ekproswpe, ston eperxomeno anasxhmatismo o Prwqypoyrgos qa labei ypoch toy kai tis epiqymies twn Ypoyrgwn; To rwtaw me aformh tis dhlwseis ths k. Mpakogiannh oti ``egw qelw na meinw sto Ypoyrgeio moy''. O k. Abramopoylos me enan emmeso tropo exei pei oti, en pash periptwsei ``oloklhrwsa to ergo moy sto Ypoyrgeio Ygeias''. O k. Alogoskoyfhs exei pei ``kalo qa htan na eimai kai kapoy alloy''. Gi` ayto to rwtaw. Qa labei ypoch toy;

ANTWNAROS: Egw den jerw tipota gia anasxhmatismo.

DHMADHS: Epitrepetai apo memonwmenoys Ypoyrgoys na ekdhlwnoyn tetoioy eidoys epiqymies, an qa parameinoyn h qa fygoyn apo ta Ypoyrgeia toys, k. Antwnare;

ANTWNAROS: Prospaqeite me diaforoys tropoys na me odhghsete na sxoliasw, me opoiondhpote tropo, qema anasxhmatismoy. Den prokeitai na to kanw.

DHMADHS: Anejarthta apo ton anasxhmatismo, opote kai an ginei: Einai sebasto politika ayto to pragma, apo enan Ypoyrgo ths kybernhshs na leei an qelei na meinei h na fygei;

ANTWNAROS: Den topoqetoymai se qema to opoio den yparxei.

KAKALHS: Mporeite na mas peite ti eidoys Dikaiosynh einai ayth, poy aqwwnei toys prwtagwnistes toy agrioy jylodarmoy toy Kyprioy foithth; Dhladh, sthn pragmatikothta oysiastika toys aqwwnei. Me pente eyrw thn hmera mporoyn na dernoyn anenoxlhtoi. Ayto einai to mhnyma, ayth einai h Dikaiosynh, sthn opoia pisteyei apolyta o Prwqypoyrgos;

ANTWNAROS: Ayto to opoio den exw kanei pente xronia, den qa to kanw fysika oyte kai shmera. Den sxoliazw th Dikaiosynh. Egw sebomai th leitoyrgia ths Dikaiosynhs. Kai th sebomai th leitoyrgia ths Dikaiosynhs diaxronika. H astynomia exei mia sobarh, dyskolh apostolh, sthn opoia prepei na antapokrinetai. Memonwmena peristatika kapoiwn organwn ths, ta opoia den sebontai toys kanones mesa stoys opoioys prepei na leitoyrgoyn h ektrepontai apo thn apostolh toys kai symperiferontai me tropo o opoios prokalei to dhmosio aisqhma, den yparxei kamia amfibolia oti einai kai aporriptea kai katadikastea. Kai fysika kai ek meroys ths kybernhshs, thn opoia ekproswpw.

KAKALHS: Ayth h antilhch twn memonwmenwn peristatikwn exei odhghsei mexri shmera se dekades tetoia peristatika astynomikhs ayqairesias kai bias akribws giati eklambanetai ws epibrabeysh.

ANTWNAROS: Qelete na xrhsimopoihsw ton oro ``liga''; Na ton xrhsimopoihsw. Lambanontas, omws, ypoch tis xiliades twn gynaikwn kai andrwn, oi opoioi me pisth kai afosiwsh ston orko ton opoio exoyn dwsei, askoyn to kaqhkon toys, to kaqhkon to opoio toys exei anaqesei h Politeia, den yparxei kamia amfibolia oti ayth h symperifora, h opoia jefeygei, kai eidate pws th xarakthrisa, einai symperifora oligwn, memonwmenwn, mikroy ariqmoy. Poly mikroy ariqmoy.

TSIOYFOS: Na rwthsw kati sxetiko. Profanws einai ligoi. To qema einai omws an oi apofaseis aytes, oi opoies lambanontai apo thn ellhnikh Dikaiosynh, rixnoyn ladi sth fwtia, dhmioyrgoyn prohgoymena. Kai jerw oti qa apanthsete oti ``den sxoliazw tis apofaseis ths Dikaiosynhs''. Alla, jerete, tis apofaseis ths Dikaiosynhs den prepei na tis sxoliazoyme prin aytes ekdoqoyn. Otan ekdidontai kai meta, den nomizw oti aytes, oi opoies apofaseis, prepei na pernan asxoliastes. Dhladh, prepei na exoyme apoch kai prepei na symfwnoyme h na diafwnoyme akomh kai me tis apofaseis ths Dikaiosynhs. Nomizw, ena sxolio epi twn apofasewn, pia, ths Dikaiosynhs gia thn apofash den jefeygei apo ayto poy pagia lete oti ``emeis sebomaste th leitoyrgia ths''. Bebaiws. Oloi sebomaste th leitoyrgia ths Dikaiosynhs, alla tis apofaseis ofeiloyme kai na tis kritikaroyme pisteyw.

ANTWNAROS: Topoqethqhka synolika.

Sas eyxaristw.

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