Greek Government Press Briefing, 98-11-11

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

YPOYRGEIO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

Aqhna, 11 Noembrioy 1998

H ENHMERWSH TWN POLITIKWN SYNTAKTWN KAI TWN ANTAPOKRITWN JENOY TYPOY APO TON YPOYRGO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS KAI KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO DHMHTRH REPPA

Geia sas.

* Sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio syzhthqhke shmera o Proypologismos toy 1999, o opoios katatiqetai shmera sth Boylh kai qa syzhthqei sta mesa Dekembrioy. Shmeiwnw oti, enw apwtato xroniko orio kataqeshs toy einai to telos Noembrioy, h Kybernhsh proxwrei sthn kataqesh toy Proypologismoy 20 hmeres prin apo to xroniko orio poy htan ypoxrewmenh na to prajei. Ara, exoyme th dynatothta, sto diasthma ayto twn 35 kai pleon hmerwn poy mesolaboyn ews th syzhthsh toy Proypologismoy sth Boylh, na syzhthsoyme -ta kommata, oi foreis, oi Ellhnes polites- ola ta sxetika qemata, prokeimenoy na yparxei mia plhrhs enhmerwsh gia to periexomeno kai tis epidiwjeis poy periexontai sto keimeno toy Proypologismoy toy 1999.

O Proypologismos einai ena "ergaleio" ths oikonomikhs politikhs. Efarmozoyme ena eniaio diaxroniko programma sygklishs me tis alles xwres ths Eyrwpaikhs Enwshs apo to 1994 ews shmera. Exontas ektelesei me synepeia kai pistothta toys Proypologismoys twn etwn poy perasan, mporoyme na milame pleon, me aisiodojia blepontas pros to mellon, gia Proypologismo entajhs ths xwras mas sthn ONE.

Se oloys toys tomeis -ston tomea ths anaptyjhs, ton tomea ths oikonomikhs kai koinwnikhs sygklishs me tis alles xwres ths Eyrwphs, ton tomea ths diasfalishs ths koinwnikhs synoxhs h ths askhshs koinwnikhs politikhs, me thn ayjhsh twn koinwnikwn dapanwn gia thn anakoyfish twn oikonomika asqenesterwn strwmatwn- mporoyme na poyme oti exoyme apolytws epityxh apotelesmata, ola ayta ta xronia. Stoxos mas einai na synexisoyme ayth thn politikh poy odhgei sthn anakoyfish twn laikwn eisodhmatwn, odhgei se megala ofelh gia ton oikogeneiako proypologismo kai enisxyei ton polith-katanalwth, afoy se polla proionta kai yphresies oi times bainoyn meioymenes. Oxi mono den menoyn staqeres, oxi mono o ryqmos ayjhshs twn timwn einai mikros se sxesh me ayton toy parelqontos, alla exoyme kai meiwsh twn timwn yphresiwn kai proiontwn, opws to diapistwnete ki eseis. Ayta einai prwtofanh sthn ellhnikh koinwnia kai oikonomia kai ta epishmainw.

H prospaqeia poy kanei h Kybernhsh pisteyoyme oti qa oloklhrwqei me thn epiteyjh toy kentrikoy politikoy stoxoy poy exoyme qesei gia thn isotimh entajh mas stis eyrwpaikes diadikasies, dhladh thn entajh mas sthn ONE. H Ellada qa einai plhres melos apo thn 1h Ianoyarioy toy 2001. H apofash ayth pisteyoyme oti qa lhfqei entos toy 2000 sto plaisio twn organwn ths E. E., opws allwste problepetai.

* Kata th shmerinh syzhthsh o Prwqypoyrgos anaferqhke sta apotelesmata ths epishmhs episkechs toy sthn Polwnia. Oi dimereis sxeseis me th filh xwra einai poly kales, para thn apostash poy mas xwrizei. Oi politikes sxeseis twn dyo xwrwn einai stenotates. Epidiwkoyme beltiwsh kai twn oikonomikwn sxesewn sto plaisio ths oikonomikhs synergasias mas. Bebaiws, sto plaisio ths E. E. h Polwnia einai apo tis xwres poy endiaferontai idiaitera kai amesa gia th dieyrynsh ths E. E.. Anaptyssontai politikes apo diafores xwres, oi opoies epidiwkoyn na prowqhsoyn ta dika toys symferonta. Emeis xarakthrizoyme ws qetiko to gegonos ths enarjhs twn diapragmateysewn entajhs kai me thn Kypro, enocei aytoy toy neoy kykloy dieyrynshs ths E. E.. Pisteyoyme oti ayto einai ena istoriko gegonos.

* Sto plaisio ths shmerinhs synedriashs toy Ypoyrgikoy Symboylioy, o Ypoyrgos Paideias Gerasimos Arsenhs mas enhmerwse me sygkekrimena stoixeia gia thn politikh sto xwro ths Paideias ypo to fws twn teleytaiwn ejelijewn. Qa moy epitrecete na metaferw edw liga apo ta stoixeia ayta, prokeimenoy na ta exete ypoch sas:

-O k. Arsenhs eixe prosfata synanthsh me toys Proedroys twn Texnologikwn Ekpaideytikwn Idrymatwn. H katastash sto xwro ayto einai ikanopoihtikh. Meta tis ryqmiseis stis opoies exei proxwrhsei to Ypoyrgeio Paideias ikanopoioyntai xronia aithmata twn kaqhghtwn kai twn spoydastwn twn TEI.

-Epishs, sthn Krhth egine prosfata synanthsh me toys Prytaneis twn Anwtatwn Ekpaideytikwn Idrymatwn kai syzhthqhkan ta qemata poy ta apasxoloyn.

-Ayth thn wra parathroyntai problhmata se dyo Anwtata Ekpaideytika Idrymata. Sto Panteio Panepisthmio kai to Polytexneio Krhths. Ta problhmata ayta, kata thn ektimhsh toy Ypoyrgeioy Paideias kai ths Kybernhshs, den exoyn sxesh me tis ekpaideytikes allages poy prowqoyme, alla phgazoyn apo diaforetikes proseggiseis kai tribes sto eswteriko aytwn twn Idrymatwn.

-Oson afora, to qema ths Prwtobaqmias kai Deyterobaqmias Ekpaideyshs tria einai ta shmeia sta opoia exei epikentrwqei to endiaferon oswn symmetexoyn se ayto to dialogo gia ta problhmata sto xwro ths Paideias:

To prwto, afora thn ariqmhtikh synqesh twn tajewn

To deytero, afora thn kalych twn qesewn twn ekpaideytikwn kai,

To trito, afora thn egkairh prowqhsh twn bibliwn stoys maqhtes.

Oson afora to prwto qema, pragmati, symfwna me ta osa problepei to nomiko plaisio, proxwroyme, opoy einai aparaithto, se symptyjh toy ariqmoy twn maqhtwn se polles tajeis, wste na epityxoyme sth men Prwtobaqmia Ekpaideysh na exoyme kat` anwtato orio 30 maqhtes se mia tajh, se mia aiqoysa, sth de Deyterobaqmia Ekpaideysh na exoyme kat` anwtato orio 35 maqhtes se kaqe tajh. Prepei na sas pw oti eimaste mesa sta oria, ta opoia problepontai se eyrwpaiko epipedo. Sto shmeio ayto qa moy epitrecete na kanw mia mikrh anafora se ariqmoys: Apo tis 46.000 tajeis poy leitoyrgoyn shmera se olh thn Ellada -kai milw gia thn Prwtobaqmia Dhmosia Ekpaideysh- exoyme mono se 73 tajeis, 73 aiqoyses, kapoio sxetiko problhma. Dhladh, stis tajeis aytes -kai gi` ayto milw gia th sxetikothta toy problhmatos- o ariqmos twn maqhtwn proseggizei to anwtato orio. Poyqena den to yperbainei. Ayto einai to qema kai sas to anefera gia na gnwrizete ki eseis poia einai h alhqeia. Oi ariqmoi aytoi twn ana tajh-aiqoysa maqhtwn exei ginei katorqwto na ejasfalistoyn kai briskontai se ikanopoihtika epipeda. Qa elega oti se polles periptwseis einai se xamhlotera epipeda apo ta oria poy exoyn epityxei, gia logoys poy antilambaneste, ta sxoleia ths Idiwtikhs Ekpaideyshs. Exei shmeiwqei, loipon, poly shmantikh proodos.

Oson afora to deytero qema, exoyn ginei polles proslhceis kaqhghtwn. Den yparxoyn kenes organikes qeseis. Ekei poy parathroyntai leitoyrgika kena, ayta exoyn dhmioyrghqei, epeidh oi idioi oi ekpaideytikoi exoyn parei adeia logw asqeneias h gia alles aities. Enapokeitai pleon stis armodies Perifereiakes kai Nomarxiakes Yphresies na kalycoyn ta kena ayta. Exoyn sth diaqesh toys tis analoges pistwseis kai prepei, afoy einai dikh ths armodiothta, na proboyn sthn kalych aytwn twn kenwn.

Oson afora ta biblia, prepei na pw oti apo tis arxes Septembrioy o problepomenos kai kata tis ektimhseis twn armodiwn anagkaios ariqmos bibliwn exei paradoqei sta kentra ths eparxias, apo ta opoia qa eprepe na synexisei th dianomh h armodia yphresia sta kata topoys sxoleia. Shmeiwnw oti ekdoqhkan fetos 82 neoi titloi bibliwn. Ayto htan kati poly shmantiko, isws den exei prohgoymeno sthn ekpaideytikh istoria toy topoy mas. Exoyn dhmioyrghqei kapoia problhmata se poly eidikes periptwseis kai qelw na ejhghsw pws dhmioyrghqhkan ayta ta problhmata. Logw ths ekpaideytikhs metarryqmishs doqhke h dynatothta se maqhtes poy foitoyn se ena orismeno klado, se ena orismeno tmhma, sth Mesh Ekpaideysh na epilejoyn, mexri tis 23 Oktwbrioy, an qa parameinoyn s` ayto ton klado h qa metaphdhsoyn se kapoion allon, apo thn klasikh gia paradeigma sthn Texnikh thn Texnlogikh Ekpaideysh. Oi ariqmoi einai entypwsiakoi: Oson afora thn Texnikh kai Epaggelmatikh Ekpaideysh, ta legomena TEE, enw oi ektimhseis poy eixan ginei problepan oti qa foithsoyn sta sxoleia ayta peripoy 10.000 maqhtes, oi maqhtes oi opoioi ekdhlwsan endiaferon kai exoyn hdh eggrafei gia na foithsoyn s` ayta ta sxoleia jepernoyn tis 40.000. Ayto deixnei oti h ekpaideytikh metarryqmish (poy, metajy twn allwn, epidiwkei na enisxysei thn epaggelmatikh ekpaideysh kai kata proektash th sxesh ths ekpaideyshs me tis pragmatikes anagkes ths koinwnias, me thn paragwgh kai thn oikonomia, wste na exoyn tis aparaithtes gnwseis oi maqhtes ths deyterobaqmias ekpaideyshs kai na mporoyn eykolotera na apasxolhqoyn otan apofoitoyn) epitygxanei. O ariqmos aytos einai apokalyptikos.

Apo ekei kai pera den antilambanomaste thn kinhtopoihsh ayth. Einai apolytws adikaiologhth. Afora paragontes twn opoiwn ta symferonta qigontai apo aytes tis ekpaideytikes allages. Den einai dynaton, den mporei na anhkoyn sto ekpaideytiko kinhma oi foreis, oi opoioi sxediazoyn kai ylopoioyn tetoies kinhtopoihseis, me stoxo na plhgei h ekpaideytikh metarryqmish.

H ekpaideytikh metarryqmish antapokrinetai se pragmatikes anagkes ths ellhnikhs koinwnias. Anadiarqrwnei to ekpaideytiko systhma se kateyqynsh poy einai para poly kairia, krisimh kai xrhsimh gia to mellon ths ellhnikhs koinwnias. Kai me ayth thn ennoia, einai adikaiologhtes oi enantiwseis poy ekdhlwnontai. Poly perissotero otan xrhsimopoioyn stoixeia prosxhmatika, dhladh stoixeia poy den antapokrinontai sthn alhqeia twn pragmatwn.

* Shmera, meta th synedriash toy Ypoyrgikoy Symboylioy, synedriase kai to KYSEA, prokeimenoy na epilejei to neo Arxhgo twn Enoplwn Dynamewn ths xwras. Omofwnws, neos Arxhgos epelegh o mexri twra Arxhgos GES, Antistrathgos Manoysos Paragioydakhs. Oi stratiwtikoi syntaktes to gnwrizoyn, alla periorizomai se mia syntomh anafora: H qhteia toy shmerinoy Arxhgoy GEEQA k. Tzogannh ejantleitai kata anwtato orio -afoy paremeine sth qesh ayth gia tria xronia kai den problepetai dynatothta peraiterw paratashs ths qhteias toy- stis 15 Febroyarioy 1999. Symfwna me osa o nomos problepei, h epilogh toy Arxhgoy GEEQA prepei na ginei treis mhnes prwtytera. H epilogh Arxhgwn twn Oplwn ginetai ena mhna prin thn oloklhrwsh ths qhteias twn yphretoyntwn Arxhgwn. Kai kata synepeia, qa prepei na anamenetai to argotero, mexri tis 15 Ianoyarioy, na synedriasei kai pali to KYSEA, gia na kalycei thn kenh qesh toy Arxhgoy GES h na krinei toys alloys Arxhgoys. Pisteyoyme oti h epilogh ayth antapokrinetai stis shmerines anagkes twn Enoplwn Dynamewn. O k. Paragioydakhs exei poly shmantikh paroysia kai prosfora me thn idiothta toy Arxhgoy toy GES, ayta ta xronia. Ston aperxomeno Arxhgo k. Tzogannh, o opoios qa askei ta kaqhkonta toy mexri thn hmera poy qa paradwsei sto neoepilegenta Arxhgo, dhladh stis 15 Febroyarioy, aponemetai o titlos toy epitimoy Arxhgoy GEEQA, gia thn polytimh prosfora toy stis Enoples Dynameis kai thn patrida.

Akoyw tis erwthseis sas.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: Poios Ypoyrgos sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio kai gia poies efhmerides eipe oti ypokinoyn tis ekpaideytikes kinhtopoihseis;

REPPAS: Syzhthqhke ayto to qema, eginan sxolia kai epishmanseis, egine anafora se dhmosieymata. Ayto to opoio exei shmasia, kai kalw kai sas na meinoyme s` ayto to stoixeio, einai to oti stoys treis tomeis, gia toys opoioys polla legontai, dhladh, thn ariqmhtikh synqesh twn tajewn, thn prowqhsh twn bibliwn kai thn kalych twn qesewn apo ekpaideytikoys, exoyn ginei shmantika bhmata apo to Ypoyrgeio Paideias, wste na mh dikaiologeitai h kritikh h opoia askeitai kai poly perissotero na mh dikaiologeitai h kinhtopoihsh poy einai se ejelijh.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: O k. Arsenhs sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio eipe oti h "Kaqhmerinh" kai o "Rizospasths" ypokinoyn tis ekpaideytikes kinhtopoihseis;

REPPAS: O k. Arsenhs exei kanei kai dhmosiws dhlwseis stis opoies anaferei pws oi kinhtopoihseis aytes -kata th dikh toy apoch- ypokinoyntai apo paragontes twn opoiwn qigontai ta symferonta apo thn proodo kai thn efarmogh ths ekpaideytikhs metarryqmishs.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: Den moy apanthsate. Ennoeite oti anaferqhke s` aytes tis efhmerides kai oti ta symferonta twn efhmeridwn aytwn qigontai apo th metarryqmish;

REPPAS: Den qelw na me ermhneyete, alla antilambaneste ki eseis pws exoyme thn koinh logikh oloi edw pera, wste otan miloyme gia symferonta poy qigontai, na mhn anaferomaste se efhmerides, se ekdotika sygkrothmata, alla na anaferomaste se foreis poy amesws h emmesws emplekontai me thn ekpaideytikh diadikasia. Miloyme, fer` eipein, gia ta polyariqma didaskalia h anepishma "idiwtika panepisthmia", ta opoia logiko einai, logw twn ekpaideytikwn allagwn, na antilambanontai kai na foboyntai pws h drasthriothta toys kai h leitoyrgia toys ta epomena xronia qa syrriknwqei, qa perioristei. Idiws, me to anoigma ths portas twn panepisthmiwn stoys neoys ths patridas mas, mesa apo orismenes proypoqeseis me bash tis diadikasies, oi opoies exoyn chfistei. Ola ayta ta opoia syzhtoyme, ayth thn wra, einai sto nomo gia thn ekpaideytikh metarryqmish.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: Qa hqela na moy ejhghsete thn antifash pws einai dynaton, me bash ta epishma stoixeia ta opoia exoyn dhmosieyqei, oi eggrafes sta frontisthria, prwth xronia ths ekpaideytikhs metarryqmishs, na exoyn mia ayjhsh ths tajews toy 30% ews 50%, thn wra poy lete pws h Kybernhsh akribws ekei stoxeyei me thn ekpaideytikh metarryqmish. To na fygoyn, dhladh, ta paidia apo ta frontisthria.

REPPAS: Ayto to sxolio, xwris na exw twra sth diaqesh moy analoga stoixeia, gia to pososto ayjhshs sto opoio eseis anaferqhkate, se genikes grammes antapokrinetai sthn alhqeia. Exoyme ayth thn prosfygh sthn parallhlh paideia h gia alloys parapaideia. Nomizw, omws, oti to fainomeno ayto einai proskairo. Epeidh akribws eimaste sthn arxh ths ekpaideytikhs metarryqmishs, polloi maqhtes kai goneis, poy den exoyn katanohsei plhrws pws qa ejelixqoyn ta pragmata, anazhtoyn mesw aytwn twn idiwtikwn frontisthriwn na endynamwsoyn th qesh toys. Pisteyoyme oti apo th stigmh poy qa leitoyrghsei o neos qesmos mesa sta sxoleia ths enisxytikhs didaskalias, ths prosqeths dwrean eswsxolikhs bohqeias, qa exoyme mia antistrofh poreia, qa exoyme mia meiwsh, dhladh, twn maqhtwn poy prosfeygoyn sta idiwtika frontisthria. Epishs, kaqws o megalos ogkos twn kaqhghtwn gnwrizei plhrws, pleon, tis allages oi opoies eperxontai sto ekpaideytiko systhma kai ara, mporei na antapokriqei stis ypoxrewseis toy, pisteyoyme oti to fainomeno ayto qa antimetwpistei. Yparxoyn shmera kataggelies h anafores kai apo maqhtes, oi opoioi miloyn gia kaqhghtes poy toys parotrynoyn na entaxqoyn se frontisthria, prokeimenoy ekei na didaxqoyn kapoia maqhmata poy den einai eykolo, logw twn allagwn poy exoyn epelqei, na ta didaxqoyn apo toys taktikoys kaqhghtes, apo toys kaqhghtes sta sxoleia ths Meshs Ekpaideyshs. Yparxoyn tetoies kataggelies, exoyn parathrhqei tetoia fainomena. Pisteyoyme oti ayth h ayjhsh h opoia einai oriakh, ejhgeitai kai ermhneyetai apo to logo oti eimaste sthn arxh ths ekpaideytikhs metarryqmishs. Poly syntoma to fainomeno ayto qa exei antistrofh fora. Ayth einai h ektimhsh poy kanoyme.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: Me aforistiko tropo, sthn arxh, eipate oti osoi symmetexoyn s` aytes tis apolytws adikaiologhtes kinhtopoihseis, den mporei na anhkoyn sto ekpaideytiko kinhma. Hqela na rwthsw, aytoys toys xiliades maqhtes, toys foithtes, toys daskaloys, poy kinhtopoioyntai apo to prwi, toys katatassete sto kinhma twn "marionetwn", apo kapoioys oi opoioi toys ypokinoyn. An den einai ekpaideytiko kinhma, ti einai;

REPPAS: Pantote h Kybernhsh me eyaisqhsia kai prosoxh parakoloyqei tis apoceis h tis antidraseis apo diafores koinwnikes omades. Poly perissotero tis apoceis kai tis antidraseis poy ekdhlwnontai se ena xwro, o opoios idiaitera mas sygkinei kai mas eyaisqhtopoiei sto xwro ths ekpaideyshs. Apo ekei kai pera qa moy epitrecete na pw, oti sto plaisio aytwn twn kinhtopoihsewn, parathroyntai kai fainomena ta opoia, kaqe allo, para qa prepei na ta dikaiologhsoyme. Isa-isa, qa prepei na ta kaythriasoyme. Egw milhsa gia fainomena, opws einai ayto ths kinhtopoihshs, ta opoia sthrizontai se stoixeia ta opoia eite paraxarazontai, eite aposiwpoyntai, eite en pash periptwsei xrhsimopoioyntai kata tetoio tropo, wste na dikaiologhqoyn oi kinhtopoihseis. Ta stoixeia, sta opoia egw anaferqhka kai mporw na anaferqw kai se polla alla akomh, apodidoyn thn alhqeia. H alhqeia ayth, nomizw oti, efoson ginei gnwsth, qa odhghsei para polloys sto na anaqewrhsoyn th stash toys. Bebaiws, qa yparxoyn kai ekeinoi poy gia alloys logoys qa fwnazoyn ta dika toys synqhmata poy den exoyn sxesh me thn politikh sthn ekpaideytikh metarryqmish. Qa probainoyn se prajeis bias poy den exoyn kamia sxesh me thn askhsh twn dikaiwmatwn toys kai bebaiws, qa paramenoyn antiqetoi se mia ekpaideytikh metarryqmish apo logoys ideologikoys kai politikoys, pragma, omws, to opoio den qa empodisei th dikh mas politikh na proxwrhsei kai na oloklhrwqei h efarmogh ths. Giati pisteyoyme oti h efarmogh ayths ths metarryqmishs einai pros to kalo twn maqhtwn kai ths koinwnias mas.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, dhladh, aytoi oloi poy mazeythkan shmera kai htan to megalytero syllalhthrio poy exei ginei pote sthn Aqhna apo ekpaideytikh koinothta, den gnwrizoyn to kainoyrgio ekpaideytiko systhma; Den exei, dhladh, ginei enhmerwsh; Poios ftaiei poy den to jeroyn an den to jeroyn;

REPPAS: Gia ola ayta apanthsa. Arkoymai mono na pw pws, an ayto apotelei stoixeio, oti opoioi symmetexoyn se mia kinhtopoihsh shmainei oti den gnwrizoyn tis allages kai gi ayto symmetexoyn, mporw egw ej antidiastolhs na noiwqw thn ikanopoihsh oti oi para polloi perissoteroi poy den symmetexoyn, shmainei oti exoyn antilhfqei plhrws pws akribws exoyn ta pragmata, sto plaisio ths prowqoymenhs ekpaideytikhs metarryqmishs. Oyte to ena symbainei, oyte to allo. Prepei na eimaste realistes. Yparxei ena keno enhmerwshs kai plhroforhshs. Ginetai prospaqeia mesw diaforwn drasewn na enhmerwqoyn oi goneis kai oi maqhtes gia tis allages aytes. Pisteyoyme oti einai qema ligoy xronoy, ayth h prospaqeia na oloklhrwqei kai na apodwsei, wste na allajei se megalo baqmo to topio sto xwro ths ekpaideyshs. Kai metajy twn allwn, etsi na antimetwpistoyn kai fainomena san ayta, sta opoia anaferqhke kai o synadelfos sas, gia thn ayjhsh, dhladh, ths eggrafhs maqhtwn se idiwtika frontisthria.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Eipate oti foreis sxediazoyn kai exoyn stoxo na xtyphqei h ekpaideytikh metarryqmish. Poioi einai aytoi oi foreis; Politikoi einai...

REPPAS: Anaferqhka kai se ayto. Den anaferqhka;

STAMATOPOYLOS: Poioi einai aytoi; Poioi, yparxoyn kommata pisw apo ayto;

REPPAS: Apanthsa kai se ayto. Eipa oti h ekpaideytikh metarryqmish qigei kai symferonta. Qigei symferonta ekeinwn poy amesws h emmesws emplekontai sthn ekpaideytikh diadikasia kai diablepoyn oti sto kontino mellon qa syrriknwqei h drasthriothta toys. Oi epixeirhseis toys qa gnwrisoyn krish. Giati h ekpaideytikh metarryqmish janafernei toys maqhtes sto sxoleio -ayto filodojei kai qa to epityxei- prokeimenoy ekei na apoktoyn tis gnwseis poy einai aparaithtes, ws efodia, wste sth synexeia na akoloyqhsoyn tis spoydes sthn Tritobaqmia Ekpaideysh.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Poioi einai aytoi, k. Ypoyrge; Den lete. Sygkekrimena peite poioi;

REPPAS: Ma, milhsa prin. Den milhsa gia ta legomena idiwtika panepisthmia, gi` ayta ta didakthria, ta didaskaleia, opws ta onomasa; Milhsa gi` ayta, k. Stamatopoyle.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Ta Idiwtika Panepisthmia einai pisw apo ayth thn istoria;

REPPAS: Ta legomena, eipa, k. Stamatopoyle.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Ta "legomena" Idiwtika Panepisthmia einai pisw apo ayth thn istoria;

REPPAS: Prepei na parakoloyqeite oles tis apanthseis poy dinw, opws egw parakoloyqw oles tis erwthseis, poy kanete. Sas parakalw na enteinete thn prosoxh sas, wste na exete ypoch sas oles tis erwthseis poy ginontai, giati oi apanthseis poy dinw -prospaqw toylaxiston- einai se armonia me tis erwthseis sas. Otan exw antimetwpisei ena qema se prohgoymenes erwthseis, parakalw na mhn epanerxomaste.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Eipate oti egine ektimhsh oti 10.000 qa phgainan sta TEE kai phga 40.000. Poios thn ekane ayth thn ektimhsh kai an einai akoma sth qesh toy;

REPPAS: H ektimhsh ayth egine apo tis armodies yphresies me bash thn istoria. Me bash to poioi htan oi maqhtes poy mexri twra foitoysan se TEL, me bash poioi htan aytoi, oi opoioi foitoysan se alloys kladoys, se alles kathgories twn Lykeiwn. Eixame, logw akribws ths metarryqmishs poy fainetai oti einai elkystikh kai peistikh gia toys neoys ths patridas mas, mia megalh ayjhsh toy ariqmoy twn maqhtwn poy epelejan thn Texnikh Epaggelmatikh Ekpaideysh. Jerete oti xronia twra h ekpaideysh ayth htan peripoy apajiwmenh. Opoioi maqhtes epelegan na foithsoyn sta TEL h se omoeidoys kathgorias sxoleia, antimetwpizontan san maqhtes B' kathgorias. Twra exoyme mia megalh, pragmatika, strofh pros thn Texnikh Epaggelmatikh Ekpaideysh kai ayto einai ena stoixeio to opoio mas ikanopoiei.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Kai aytoi einai armodioi gia thn texnikh ekpaideysh kai paramenoyn stis qeseis toys!

REPPAS: Asfalws einai. Kai ayto deixnei, poso swsth doyleia exoyn kanei aytoi oi armodioi poy sxediasan thn ekpaideytikh metarryqmish, wste na peisoyn toses xiliades maqhtwn na proselqoyn se ayta ta sxoleia, ta opoia, mexri protinos, o megalyteros ariqmos twn maqhtwn ta antimetwpize peripoy me perifronhsh, toys gyrize thn plath, enw twra ta epilegei, dialegei na foithsei se ayta. Ayto einai mia megalh allagh.

KIAOS: Ayta poy mas eipate prohgoymenws, peri toy problhmatos ths Paideias kl. p., htan toy k. Arsenh, opws ta eipe sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio h ta eipate ws anakoinwsh ths Kybernhshs;

REPPAS: Htan oi apoceis poy ejefrase o k. Arsenhs sto plaisio ths enhmerwshs. H eishghsh kai h enhmerwsh toy k. Arsenh egine dekth apo to Ypoyrgiko Symboylio. Para to oti den htan qema syzhthshs, den eixe problefqei sthn hmerhsia diatajh toy Ypoyrgikoy Symboylioy na syzhthqei ena tetoio qema, antilambaneste pws mia kai exoyme apofasisei gia thn ekpaideytikh metarryqmish h efarmogh ths mas endiaferei kai mas eyaisqhtopoiei. Kai kata kairoys oloi, gia alla qemata kai gi ayto, qa kanoyme sxetikes syzhthseis.

KIAOS: Htan eishghsh, htan enhmerwsh toy k. Arsenh, epakoloyqhse syzhthsh, ti akribws egine;

REPPAS: Eseis pws qelete na to onomasete; Eishghsh, enhmerwsh, mono eishghsh, mono enhmerwsh;

KIAOS: Eseis qa moy peite. Sas erwtw.

REPPAS: Ma, eipa prin, den eipa; Xrhsimopoihsa th lejh molis prin. An sas parapemcw sthn apanthsh poy edwsa sthn prohgoymenh erwthsh sas, qa exete thn apanthsh gia thn epomenh erwthsh sas.

KIAOS: Nai, sas lew: Egine syzhthsh;

REPPAS: Den egine syzhthsh.

KIAOS: Ara, dhladh, milhse mono...

REPPAS: Den htan qema to opoio eixe problefqei na syzhthqei. Den htan grammeno sthn hmerhsia diatajh. Den ta eipa ayta;

KIAOS: Kai egw qelw na janarwthsw. Ti kako exei ayto;

REPPAS: Tipota. Epanalambanoyme ta idia.

KIAOS: Gi` ayto to logo eimaste edw.

REPPAS: Eisaste edw gia na eisaste edw. Dhladh, gia na parakoloyqeite th syzhthsh, gia na mhn epanerxomaste se qemata gia ta opoia exoyme milhsei.

KIAOS: Oxi, sas parakalw. Egw qa rwthsw gia na katalabw ti ginetai.

REPPAS: Malista.

KIAOS: Ara, den milhsan alloi ypoyrgoi; Mono o k. Arsenhs milhse;

REPPAS: Etsi opws to lete akribws.

KIAOS: Ara, dhladh, h ektimhsh toy Ypoyrgikoy Symboylioy phgazei apo thn eishghsh toy k. Arsenh kai mono;

REPPAS: Gia ta qemata ths ekpaideytikhs politikhs, asfalws phgazei apo thn ektimhsh poy kanei o armodios Ypoyrgos. Den einai dynaton na phgazei apo thn ektimhsh poy kanei o Ypoyrgos Dhmosias Tajews, fer` eipein!

KIAOS: Chfoforia typikws, me thn typikh ennoia toy oroy, meta thn enhmerwsh den egine sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio.

REPPAS: Den yphrxe tetoio endexomeno.

KIAOS: Kati allo. Ta problhmata ths Paideias poy yparxoyn shmera, etsi opws ta ejeqese o armodios Ypoyrgos, einai qema politikhs h xeirismwn ekei poy blepete kapoia problhmata;

REPPAS: Apla, qa prepei h ekpaideytikh metarryqmish na proxwrhsei me pio gorgoys ryqmoys.

KIAOS: Oxi, politikhs h xeirismwn;

REPPAS: H politikh einai gnwsth, exoyme apofasisei gia thn ekpaideytikh politikh. Apo kei kai pera, an ta biblia den exoyn prowqhqei mexri kai to teleytaio sxoleio ths Elladas, enw einai bebaio oti apo tis arxes Septembrioy exoyn paei se ola ta ekpaideytika kentra, se oloys toys nomoys, yparxei kapoio problhma poy prepei na antimetwpistei sygkekrimena. Sthn periptwsh poy exoyme, p. x. problhma oson afora ton ariqmo twn maqhtwn se kapoies tajeis, kai ekei exoyn lhfqei metra. Einai poly mikros o ariqmos twn tajewn ekeinwn poy o ariqmos twn maqhtwn proseggizei to orio poy exoyme qesei. Poyqena alloy den exoyme problhma. Den epitrepetai, loipon, na dhmioyrgeitai mia koinh entypwsh, na yparxei ena genikeymeno symperasma peri twn pollwn maqhtwn se mia tajh. Ayta ta genikeymena symperasmata den antapokrinontai sthn alhqeia.

KIAOS: H Kybernhsh h o armodios Ypoyrgos poy milhse, anhsyxoyn gia ta tektainomena shmera sto xwro ths Paideias;

REPPAS: Anhsyxoyme gia o, ti symbainei se oloys toys xwroys. Eimaste mia Kybernhsh, h opoia endiaferetai na epityxei to majimoym. Exoyme ychloys stoxoys kai filodojies, exoyme qesei ychla ton phxh, oi stoxoi poy exoyme qesei einai se ena poly ychlo epipedo. Logiko einai, loipon, ola ayta na dhmioyrgoyn antidraseis, problhmata. Logiko einai kai sto xwro ths Paideias na exoyme aytoy toy eidoys toys kradasmoys sthn arxh ths efarmoghs ayths ths neas politikhs, mias kai efarmozetai mia allh politikh. H ekpaideytikh metarryqmish einai mia rizospastikh tomh, einai kati qeamatika diaforetiko apo ayto poy isxye sto parelqon. Den exoyme, omws, apo thn allh pleyra, anhsyxia oson afora thn plhrothta ths politikhs mas. Pantote qa prospaqoyme na kanoyme to kalytero, na antapokriqoyme stis apaithseis poy emeis oi idioi exoyme qesei ston eayto mas.

MIXAHL: Anhsyxeite to idio gia piqanes epikeimenes agrotikes kinhtopoihseis; Yparxoyn kapoia dhmosieymata to teleytaio kairo kai mia synenteyjh toy k. Pattakh shmera se kapoia efhmerida.

REPPAS: Anhsyxoyme gia ta panta. Kai otan anhsyxoyme gia ta panta eimaste taytoxrona hsyxoi kai gia ola osa exoyme kanei kai pisteyoyme oti einai orqa. Einai sto plaisio mias politikhs, ths opoias stoxos kai epidiwjh einai na beltiwsei th zwh twn politwn diaforwn koinwnikwn omadwn kai twn agrotwn.

FASOYLAS: Kyrie Ekproswpe, to KYSEA mono me thn topoqethsh toy neoy arxhgoy asxolhqhke; Syzhthqhke tipota allo;

REPPAS: Mono me ayto to qema.

XASAPOPOYLOS: Apo tis topoqethseis twn Ypoyrgwn gia ton Proypologismo prokyptoyn kapoies, as poyme, diafwnies; Giati o k. Pagkalos ekane mia dhlwsh kai eipe oti o Proypologismos den ton ekfrazei.

REPPAS: Den gnwrizw ti dhlwsh ekane o k. Pagkalos. Gnwrizw omws oti sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio epi toy qematos aytoy den elabe to logo o k. Pagkalos.

XASAPOPOYLOS: Stis topoqethseis twn allwn Ypoyrgwn, to symperasma poio einai;

REPPAS: Den prokyptei opoiadhpote diafwnia, oyte kan apoklish.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: Ena diadikastiko gia na mas bohqhsete. Qelw na rwthsw, epeidh eixe kanei sxetikh nyjh o Proedros ths Kybernhshs sto Synedrio toy Kentroy Eyrwpaikoy Syntagmatikoy Dikaioy, qelw na mas peite an exete prosdiorisei pote qa fqasei h Synqhkh toy Amsterntam gia epikyrwsh sthn Olomeleia ths Boylhs.

REPPAS: Ej oswn gnwrizw, to qema ayto syzhteitai sthn Epitroph Eyrwpaikwn Ypoqesewn ths Boylhs, me thn paroysia kai symmetoxh sth syzhthsh toy Ypoyrgoy Anaplhrwth Ejwterikwn k. Papandreoy. Qa exete mia plhrh enhmerwsh gia to qema ayto. Apo kei kai pera h epikyrwsh ths Synqhkhs sth Boylh exei parei to dromo ths. Einai qema xronoy.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: Einai dedomeno oti qa pate se epikyrwsh se epipedo olomeleias;

REPPAS: Sas eipa oti ola ayta ta qemata exoyn parei to dromo toys. Parakalw na anamenete th syzhthsh poy ginetai sto plaisio ths Epitrophs Eyrwpaikwn Ypoqesewn. Ginetai shmera sthn Ellhnikh Boylh.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, allo sas rwtaw...

REPPAS: Kai egw sas apanthsa gia ayto to opoio rwtate. Me rwtate, an qa asxolhqei en olomeleia h Boylh gia na epikyrwsei th Synqhkh. Kai sas apantw oti to qema ayto qa to antimetwpisei h Epitroph Eyrwpaikwn Ypoqesewn poy syzhta shmera ayto to qema. H Kybernhsh exei jekaqarisei th qesh ths, qa proxwrhsei sthn epikyrwsh ayths ths Synqhkhs. Tis diadikastikes, leitoyrgikes leptomereies qa tis syzhthsoyme.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: H Kybernhsh qewrei "leptomereia" to an qa epikyrwqei h Synqhkh se epipedo Olomeleias h sto epipedo mias kleisths synedriashs kapoias koinoboyleytikhs diadikasias;

REPPAS: Den tiqetai tetoio qema...

MPOGIOPOYLOS: Poio qema den tiqetai;

REPPAS: Kai den einai swsto ayto poy lete, oti sto plaisio mias kleisths epitrophs ginetai dhqen prospaqeia na apofygoyme ta fwta ths dhmosiothtas, wste ekei na epikyrwsoyme mia Synqhkh. Gnwrizete allwste poly kala, oti h megalh, h syntriptikh pleiochfia twn Ellhnwn boyleytwn kai twn kommatwn exoyn taxqei yper ths Synqhkhs kai ths proodoy twn diadikasiwn ths eyrwpaikhs enopoihshs. Ara, "paizete en oy paiktois". Mhn epimenete s` ayto to qema me ayto ton tropo. Antilambanomai oti qa prepei na anadeijete to epixeirhma: pente ta kommata, alla dyo oi politikes. Apo thn allh omws, ayto einai hdh gnwsto, den einai kati kainoyrgio. Opws einai gnwsto kai den einai kainoyrgio poia einai h qesh ths Kybernhshs, alla kai twn allwn kommatwn oson afora th Synqhkh toy Amsterntam.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: Kai egw antilambanomai thn agwnia sas na apodeijete th logikh "xilia kommata mia h ONE". Ayto to opoio egw erwtw einai, qa paei h Kybernhsh se Olomeleia ths Boylhs gia thn epikyrwsh nai h oxi;

REPPAS: Apanthsa s` ayto to qema.

MPOGIOPOYLOS: Den apanthsate. Gi' ayto sas janarwtw.

REPPAS: Apanthsa, k. Mpogiopoyle. Eipa sthn arxh oti to qema ayto exei parei to dromo toy. Qa moy epitrecete na mhn mpw se alles leptomereies, para to oti mporw na sas pw kathgorhmatika oti "nai, qa pame sthn olomeleia", alla qa prepei epishs na epilejoyme ton tropo me ton opoio qa proxwrhsoyme s' ayth th diadikasia. Antilambaneste pws oi xeirismoi aytoi ginontai parallhla me xeirismoys se alla qemata, poy einai se ejelijh sthn E. E. Otan dinw mia apanthsh, parakalw na arkeiste sthn apanthsh poy dinw. Den dinw tyxaia thn opoia apanthsh dinw.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, mhpws mporeite na moy peite, pote h Kybernhsh -meta kai thn parakamch toy ellhnikoy beto kai apo to Symboylio Ypoyrgwn Ejwterikwn- qa prosfygei sto Eyrwpaiko Dikasthrio;

REPPAS: Einai h tetarth h pempth fora poy qetete thn erwthsh, qa dwsw thn idia apanthsh. Den exei lhfqei tetoia apofash.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Aporw pws...

REPPAS: Giati apanthsh exei doqei proswpika se esas, kat' epanalhch...

STAMATOPOYLOS: Den qa pate;

REPPAS: Aporw pws ayto den to eixate...

STAMATOPOYLOS: Eixate pei, oti otan parete ta praktika ths Komision, qa kanete thn prosfygh.

REPPAS: Ayto qymaste oti eixa pei;

STAMATOPOYLOS: Meta yphrje Koreper kai Symboylio Ypoyrgwn. Pote, epiteloys, qa pate sto Eyrwpaiko Dikasthrio;

REPPAS: Isxyoyn ola osa exoyme pei. Oi desmeyseis poy exoyme analabei isxyoyn kai qa akoloyqhsoyme ayth thn poreia. Qa prosfygoyme sto Eyrwpaiko Dikasthrio. Asfalws qa to kanoyme. Kai einai mia diadikasia h opoia bebaiws ekteinetai se makros xronoy, alla einai kati to opoio qa anagkastoyme na kanoyme, efoson h E. E. epimenei se mia politikh h opoia dynamitizei to nomiko kai politiko plaisio panw sto opoio exei, mexri twra, leitoyrghsei h epi toy opoioy sthrizetai gia na pairnei tis apofaseis ths. Ta exoyme pei ayta.

ZHKIDHS: Pera apo ta gnwsta antiplhqwristika metra poy exei parei twra h Kybernhsh, yparxei skech gia kapoia nea diatajh s` ayth thn kateyqynsh;

REPPAS: Gnwrizete poly kala oti exoyme epityxei o plhqwrismos na kineitai stoys stoxoys poy exoyme qesei. Mexri teloys toy etoys qa exoyme epityxei kai ayto to krithrio, to krithrio toy plhqwrismoy. Pisteyoyme oti ta metra poy exoyme labei gia th meiwsh twn emmeswn forwn, toy F. P. A. h th meiwsh ths timhs twn kaysimwn qermanshs odhgoyn se megalo baqmo, peran ths apoklimakwshs toy plhqwrismoy, sthn enisxysh twn laikwn eisodhmatwn, sthn enisxysh twn oikogeneiakwn eisodhmatwn. Giati, opws eipa apantwntas se sxetikh erwthsh, prohgoymenws, exoyme to fainomeno sthn patrida mas, oi times se proionta kai yphresies, oxi mono na menoyn staqeres, alla na meiwnontai kiolas. Antilambaneste pws o poliths, o katanalwths einai aytos poy kyriws wfeleitai. Ayto einai to mhnyma: Kerdizei o katanalwths-poliths, kerdizei to oikogeneiako eisodhma apo thn politikh ayth.

KANELLOPOYLOS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, qa hqela na sas rwthsw an oi ejaggelies toy Ypoyrgoy PEXWDE k. Laliwth gia anaplash, gia anamorfwsh ths Plateias Omonoias einai sto plaisio twn yposxesewn poy edwse o Prwqypoyrgos, to brady twn eklogwn gia synergasia me oloys toys Dhmarxoys;

REPPAS: Einai sto plaisio twn yposxesewn poy exei dwsei h Kybernhsh, edw kai para polla xronia, gia thn proodo pollwn megalwn ergwn poy qa allajoyn th morfh ths Ellados, alla kai th morfh twn polewn ths xwras mas. Exoyn ginei polla tetoia erga. Gnwrizete oti sthn odo Ermoy, ta teleytaia xronia egine mia shmantikh anaplash. Kati analogo qa ginei kai gia thn Plateia Omonoias. To armodio Ypoyrgeio, to YPEXWDE, exei ena plhres sxedio kai qa prepei na anagnwristei oti to sxedio ayto to efarmozei me synepeia.

KANELLOPOYLOS: Epeidh anaferate thn odo Ermoy, pisteyw oti oloi qymomaste edw oti o k. Laliwths htan dipla ston k. Abramopoylo, se kapoies giortes, teletes kai egkainia. Giati ayth th fora agnoei to Dhmarxo ths Aqhnas, meta thn prosfath kiolas eklogikh toy nikh. Kai qelw na pw an einai prospaqeia falkideyshs twn armodiothtwn toy Dhmarxoy Aqhnaiwn.

REPPAS: Epi toy qematos aytoy den exei kamia armodiothta o Dhmarxos ths Aqhnas. Otan erqei h wra kai oloklhrwqoyn ta erga kai ginoyn ta egkainia kai sthn Plateia Omonoias, asfalws o Ypoyrgos PEXWDE qa kalesei to Dhmarxo Aqhnas na einai parwn sta egkainia. Den exoyme kanena logo na empodisoyme opoiodhpote polith, poly perissotero to Dhmarxo, na einai parwn sta egkainia. Kai pisteyoyme oti qa antapokriqei s` ayth thn prosklhsh o Dhmarxos ths Aqhnas.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Gi` ayto ejelegh; Gia na einai parwn sta egkainia; To 57% phre kyrie Ypoyrge.

REPPAS: Mporei na kanei dhmotika erga, opws exei kanei o k. Abramopoylos. Oti yparxei Dhmarxos sthn Aqhna -opws kai se kaqe polh yparxei enas dhmarxos o opoios kanei erga sthn polh toy- den shmainei oti payei na yparxei kai o armodios Ypoyrgos ths xwras, o opoios kanei erga, ta opoia -epeidh einai kai o proypologismos megalyteros- symbainei na einai kai poly perissotera. Allo an ayto den fainetai panta. Bebaiws, se mia mikrh koinwnia antilambaneste pws ta panta einai eykolotero na ta plhroforhqoyn oi polites, enw se eqniko epipedo den einai eykolo na exoyn tetoies plhrofories. Kai omws to ergo ayto yparxei.

GARGALAKOS: Qa anakoinwqoyn kai pali shmera, ws eiqistai, onomata forofygadwn, kyrie Ypoyrge;

REPPAS: Ayta einai qemata toy Ypoyrgeioy Oikonomikwn. Aplws pisteyw oti prepei na kanei ta panta gia na empedwqei, epiteloys, mia forologikh syneidhsh stoys Ellhnes polites, pragma poy apotelei, metajy twn allwn, kai mia symbolh: Sto na yparxei forologikh dikaiosynh, na yparxei mia antikeimenikh kai isotimh antimetwpish olwn twn forologoymenwn apo to kratos.

Sas eyxaristw poly.

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