[01] Metallagmenes gates sth maxh kata toy AIDS

Prokeitai gia gates poy, meta apo mia skopimh genetikh metallajh, feggoboloyn prasines kai oi opoies diaqetoyn kyttara poy antistekontai sth molynsh apo ton qanathforo io. To epiteygma anamenetai na bohqhsei oxi mono sthn katapolemhsh toy AIDS stis gates, idiws tis agries, opoy epishs parathreitai mia analogh epidhmia, alla kai na symbalei stis antistoixes ereynes stoys anqrwpoys.

Oi ereynhtes, m? epikefalhs ton moriako biologo-iologo Erik Poesla ths klinikhs Magio sto Rotsester ths Minesota, poy dhmosieysan th sxetikh meleth sto periodiko "Nature Methods", symfwna me to praktoreio Roiter, th bretanikh "Gkarntian", to "Science" kai to "New Scientist", eishgagan sta wokyttara twn gatwn gonidia maimoydwn poy mplokaroyn thn anaptyjh toy ioy. Einai h prwth fora poy ayth h meqodos (genetikh tropopoihsh me molynsh twn wariwn me ena jeno gonidio, me thn bohqeia enos akindynoy ioy-oxhmatos) xrhsimopoieitai me epityxia se ena sarkoboro zwo.

Epishs oi episthmones, eishgagan sto DNA jena gonidia apo mia fwsforizoysa prasinh medoysa poy ekanan ta genetika tropopoihmena kyttara twn gatwn, katw apo to yperiwdes fws, na lampoyn ki ayta me mia prasinh antaygeia, etsi wste ta metallagmena gonidia na mporoyn na entopizontai pio eykola.

Oi dokimes poy eginan se kyttara apo ta peiramatozwa, edeijan oti oi gates einai anqektikes ston io FIV, poy prokalei sta sygkekrimena zwa to syndromo ths anosopoihtikhs aneparkeias (to analogo toy ioy HIV poy prokalei AIDS stoys anqrwpoys). Oi anqrwpoi den mporoyn na kollhsoyn ton io apo tis gates, oyte oi gates apo toys anqrwpoys, omws h basikh bioxhmeia twn dyo syggenikwn iwn einai idia kai ta symptwmata paromoia.

Gia prwth fora, opws eipan oi ereynhtes, kaqistatai efikto na melethsoyn se ena zwo eyalwto sto AIDS tis synepeies ths eisagwghs se ayto prostateytikwn gonidiwn. Ektos apo toys anqrwpoys kai, se ena baqmo, toys ximpatzhdes, oi gates einai ta mona qhlastika poy prosballontai apo ton sygkekrimeno io.

``Oi gates ypoferoyn apo ton io se olo ton kosmo'', dhlwse o Erik Poesla. Kai sth dikh toys periptwsh, opws stoys anqrwpoys, o ios katastrefei ta amyntika kyttara-T toy anosopoihtikoy systhmatos toys. O ios molynei kyriws agriogates (oxi katoikidia), oi opoies ypologizetai se peripoy miso disekatommyrio ston planhth. Metadidetai basika me to dagkwma poy kanoyn ta arsenika, otan proaspizoyn thn ``epikrateia'' toys.

Oi ereynhtes diastayrwsan tis fwsforizoyses gates metajy toys kai proekycan gatakia poy epishs exoyn ta kyttara me thn prasinwph lamch. Omws oi episthmones den qeloyn na anaptyjoyn tetoies diadoxikes genies metallagmenwn gatwn, alla na melethsoyn telika tis gates, wste na broyn qerapeies gia ton io toy AIDS stoys anqrwpoys.

Pros to paron, oi ereynhtes exoyn kanei dokimes mono me tropopoihmena kyttara apo tis fwsforizoyses gates, omws se epomeno stadio protiqentai na ekqesoyn tis idies tis gates ston io gia na doyn kata poso exoyn prostasia. An ayto ontws symbainei, opws eipe o Poesla, tote qa apokthqoyn polytimes plhrofories gia thn maxh kata toy AIDS stoys anqrwpoys (o ios exei skotwsei panw apo 30 ekat. dieqnws, enw den diafainetai apotelesmatiko embolio ston orizonta). Parallhla, gia tis idies tis gates mporei na yparjei mia gonidiakh h farmakeytikh qerapeia kata toy ioy FIV, poy qa bohqhsei shmantika to ergo twn kthniatrwn, kaqws o ios skotwnei ekatommyria agries gates kaqe xrono.

[02] Apo toys idiokthtes kai oxi toys enoikiastes, to eidiko telos

Ayto dieykrinise shmera se dhlwseis toy sto radiofwniko staqmo Bhma fm o kybernhtikos ekproswpos, Hlias Mosialos.

Shmeiwnetai oti ews kai shmera to prwi den eixe dieykrinistei ean to neo telos twn akinhtwn qa katablhqei mono apo toys idiokthtes h kai apo toys enoikiastes sto onoma twn opoiwn einai oi logarismoi ths DEH.

[03] Ellhnes skhnoqetes miloyn sto APE-MPE gia th brabeysh toy G. Lanqimoy

Xaroymena ta melh ths kinhmatografikhs oikogeneias exoyn mono kala logia na poyn gia to nearo kinhmatografisth poy xwris thn idiaiterh sthrijh ths politeias exei kataferei na ftasei me dyo tainies se dieqneis kai koryfaies anametrhseis. Thn deyterh fora, apo thn 68h Mostra ths Benetias me to brabeio senarioy poy moirazetai me ton proerxomeno apo diafhmistikh etaireia keimenografo Filippo Eyqymh.

To APE-MPE zhthse apo pente skhnoqetes ths palaioterhs alla kai ths neas genias na sxoliasoyn thn brabeysh

Giannhs Smaragdhs

``Einai parhgoro kai enqarryntiko to gegonos, oti o ellhnikos kinhmatografos kai idiws otan ekproswpeitai apo neoys anqrwpoys, fernei synexws brabeyseis, times kai sthn oysia kyros kai qetikh ayra se mia katatalaipwrhmenh sto ejwteriko, patrida. H dieqnhs brabeysh toy Giwrgoy Lanqimoy epibebaiwnei gia akomh mia fora oti yparxoyn megala talenta sthn Ellada, poy anejarthta apo to ean exoyn thn sthrijh h oxi ths xwras mas -poy ayth th stigmh dokimazetai- briskoyn tropoys n' apodeijoyn to talento toys, poy den einai xrhsimo mono gia toys idioys h gia ton kinhmatografo, alla kai gia thn sterewsh ths kalhs eikonas ths patridas mas sto ejwteriko. To nomosxedio toy ypoyrgeioy Politismoy einai safestata yposthriktiko gia ton ellhniko kinhmatografo kai gia toys neoys dhmioyrgoys. To zhthma einai oti ayth th stigmh h Ellada pasxei apo apoysia xrhmatwn. Gegonos poly sobaro, poy den antimetwpizei mono o ellhnikos kinhmatografos, alla oloklhrh h ellhnikh koinwnia. Elpizw oti ta pragmata qa ejomalynqoyn sth xwra mas etsi wste na mhn feygoyn sto ejwteriko talenta opws einai o Lanqimos''.

Giwrgos Panoysopoylos

``Eimai enqoysiasmenos me thn poreia toy Giwrgoy Lanqimoy. Dystyxws den ephreazetai h ellhnikh paragwgh apo mia epityxia sto ejwteriko. Antiqeta deixnei oti mono an tolmhseis ejw apo thn Ellada mporeis na proxwrhseis. H ellhnikh pragmatikothta einai poly exqrikh pros ton egxwrio kinhmatografo. H politeia den einai ikanh na kanei tipota. Asxoleitai me alla pragmata. Den xreiazetai oi neoi dhmioyrgoi na meinoyn sto topo toys kai n' anadeijoyn ton talento toys, mporoyn na to kanoyn kai ejw. O kinhmatografos den exei patrida. Einai san ta xrhmata kai ton erwta. Ekpempei radienergeia''.

Katerina Eyaggelakoy

``Einai mia poly shmantikh diakrish, eite dianyoyme dyskoles synqhkes eite oxi, poy mono eyxarista synaisqhmata mporei na projenhsei stoys kinhmatografistes. Kai bebaia epibebaiwnei oti to teleytaio pragma poy ejagoyme sigoyra ton teleytaio diasthma ws xwra einai ellhnikes tainies. H diakrish twn "Alpewn" sthn Benetia strefei to blemma ths dieqnoys kinhmatografikhs koinothtas sth nea ellhnikh dhmioyrgia. Ayto einai h kalh pleyra.

H asxhmh einai oti ta pragmata einai ejairetika dyskola sthn Ellada gia oloys toys kinhmatografistes kai gia ton idio ton Lanqimo. Kai an apofasisei na meinei edw qa prepei na brei tropo/diejodo na kaneis tis tainies toys. To zhthma einai oti exoyme jexasei thn dhmosia yposthrijh kai enisxysh. Ton teleytaio enamish xrono zoyme thn "kataplhktikh" katastash na exoyme nomo kai na mhn yparxei eyrw gia to ellhniko sinema. Eytyxws poy antexoyn arketoi Ellhnes kinhmatografistes, oxi mono o Lanqimos kai katafernoyn kai kanoyn tainies. H politeia an qelei na exei kinhmatografo qa prepei na merimnhsei amesa. Kai oxi na ftiaxnei nomoys kai na toys afhnei na menoyn sta ntoylapia. H brabeysh toy Giwrgoy Lanqimoy kai toy Eyqymh Filippoy einai apo tis liges xares poy pairnei o kosmos toy ellhnikoy kinhmatografoy. Gia to 2011 einai isws kai h monadikh xara''.

Hlias Giannakakhs

``Hmoyn poly eytyxhs otan to emaqa, htan para poly xarmosyno neo oxi aplws epeidh einai Ellhnas kai epeidh einai shmantiko gia ton ellhniko kinhmatografo, alla kyriws epeidh qaymazw poly thn doyleia toy kai qewrw oti poly ajia eftase ews ekei poy eftase me tis dikes toy dynameis. Epiprosqetws omws einai kalo kai gia oloys emas kai gia oloys osoys prospaqoyn na kanoyn sinema sthn Ellada kai katw apo toso dyskoles synqhkes.

Kyriws omws qa prepei na dwsei kaneis sygxarhthria ston idio kai sthn omada toy kai gia aythn thn epityxia kai thn prohgoymenh''.

Eya Stefanh

``Prokeitai gia mia megalh epityxia toy Giwrgoy Lanqimoy kai toy Eyqymh Filippoy, oi opoioi tolmoyn se dyskoloys kairoys na kanoyn ena proswpiko kinhmatografo. Wstoso h epityxia ayth ofeiletai apokleistika sthn dikh toys grafh kai oxi se kinhmatografikoys qesmoys h kratikoys foreis oi opoioi qa speysoyn na oikeiopoihqoyn to brabeio''.

[04] H synenteyjh typoy toy prwqypoyrgoy sthn 76h DEQ

Dinoyme maxes. Briskomaste en mesw mias oikonomikhs qyellas dieqnws, alla kai sthn Eyrwph. Den qa afhsoyme pote kanenan, omws, na mas apeilhsei kai na mas bgalei apo ayth thn poreia. Epilejame ena dromo, nai dyskolo, nai anhforiko, alla einai o dromos poy ejasfalizei thn asfaleia toy shmera kai thn prooptikh toy ayrio. Kaqe allh poreia qa eixe katastrofikes synepeies gia th xwra kai, gia emas, einai adianohth.

Se kaqe bhma, oi qysies poy exei kanei o Ellhnikos laos exoyn piasei topo. Xqes, eixa thn eykairia na anaferw merika paradeigmata, poy apoteloyn qetika shmadia, opws einai h ayjhsh rekor twn ejagwgwn mas, h shmantikh strofh sth gewrgia mas, to rekor ston toyrismo mas kai h prasinh energeia poy anaptyssetai.

Gia na synexisoyme, omws, kai aytes tis allages, na diasfalisoyme ayth thn poreia kai na mporesoyme na pame se ena neo protypo anaptyjhs, xreiazetai na exoyme mia staqerh bash.

Kai edw, qymizw, oti ejasfalisame perysi ena daneio gia th xwra mas 110 disekatommyriwn eyrw, to opoio htan kai einai to megalytero poy eixe ejasfalisei pote opoiadhpote xwra ston planhth. Qymizw oti isws to megalytero, meta apo thn Ellada, daneio htan ayto ths Brazilias, me 30 dis dolaria, prin apo merika xronia - kamia sxesh me to daneio poy phre h xwra mas.

Ejasfalisame, loipon, ayth th staqerh poreia kai hrqan kai oi apofaseis toy Ioylioy, oi istorikes apofaseis toy Ioylioy, poy oxi mono mas dinoyn mia nea bohqeia, ena neo paketo, epishs istorikoy ycoys, alla symballoyn pia kai se ena allo qema, sthn kalyterh diaxeirish toy xreoys, dhladh sthn elafrynsh toy xreoys, poy einai qhlia sto laimo toy Ellhna polith.

Einai mia symfwnia poy, otan efarmostei, qa katasthsei to xreos mas, gia prwth fora meta apo dekaeties, plhrws diaxeirisimo. Kai ayto einai poy dinei kai prooptikh sthn oikonomia mas, kai dynatothtes gia na mporoyme na elpizoyme.

Me thn efarmogh - na qymisw - twn apofasewn ths symfwnias toy Ioylioy, allazei plhrws to topio ths yperxrewshs kai diasfalizoyme thn kalych toy megalyteroy meroys twn daneiakwn anagkwn ths xwras gia ta epomena xronia. Epishs, diasfalizoyme thn poly shmantikh meiwsh twn ethsiwn ypoxrewsewn gia thn ejyphrethsh toy xreoys, me thn epimhkynsh ths apoplhrwmhs toy xreoys se trianta xronia, apo pente poy htan prin.

Ena epitokio daneismoy, staqera katw apo to 5%, kata meso oro. Th symmetoxh toy idiwtikoy tomea sta barh, mesa apo to legomeno ``PSI'', afoy 400 kai pleon xrhmatopistwtika idrymata qa symmetexoyn s? ayth thn prospaqeia, me apotelesma th meiwsh toy kaqaroy dhmosioy xreoys se onomastikes times ycoys 12% toy AEP mas, dhladh 26 disekatommyriwn eyrw, kaqws kai th dynatothta na epanagorasoyme xreos mesw toy mhxanismoy se xamhloteres times, dhladh kai edw na meiwsoyme to baros toy xreoys.

Kai bebaia, ola ayta, mesa apo mia poreia anadiorganwshs, sthrijhs kai enisxyshs toy trapezikoy systhmatos, wste na exoyme ena apo ta isxyrotera trapezika systhmata kai sthn Eyrwph kai pagkosmiws, poy qa bohqhsei s? ayto poy para polloi zhtoyn - kai oi foreis, me toys opoioys eixa milhsei - sto qema ths reystothtas, dhladh ths ependyshs sthn pragmatikh oikonomia, poy pragmati shmera apotelei ena shmantiko problhma.

Aytes oi apofaseis einai poy allazoyn oristika thn prooptikh ths xwras mas pros to kalytero, elafrynoyn ta barh ta epomena xronia, staqeropoioyn th xwra mas kai qa anakoyfisoyn akoma perissotero kaqe Ellhna kai Ellhnida apo thn anasfaleia.

Gi? ayto kai qa kanoyme o,ti apaiteitai, gia na ``kleidwsei'' h symfwnia toy Ioylioy se ola ta Koinoboylia ths Eyrwzwnhs kai, bebaiws, na symfwnhsoyn kai oi peripoy 400 trapezes. Ayth h krisimh apofash apaitei th dikh mas apofasistikothta. Kai aythn, thn exoyme.

Ara, loipon, opws eipa kai xqes, qa parw kai qa paroyme opoia apofash xreiastei, gia na mhn kindyneysei h patrida mas kai na diasfalisoyme thn omalh ths poreia. Kai opws exw pei, protimw na parw to politiko kostos me to na xasoyme oloi kati, apo to na xasoyme oloi ta panta kai gia panta.

Den qa epitrecoyme, opoio ki an einai to timhma, na teqei se amfisbhthsh h efarmogh aytoy toy programmatos poy exoyme apofasisei - mia staqerh poreia. Kai telika, apo ayth thn poreia qa bgoyme oloi kalyteroi.

Qa kanw opoia allagh apaiteitai, gia na allajei oristika h xwra kai na mhn janazhsoyme ola ayta poy zoyme shmera. Na staqoyme, xwris daneika, sta dika mas podia. Na teleiwsoyme me thn anasfaleia kai thn agwnia poy zoyme.

Tipota den mas xaristhke s\' ayth thn poreia. Twra einai poy koryfwnontai oi diapragmateyseis ths symfwnias toy Ioylioy, mesa sta krath-melh. Kai gi\' ayto, tipota den mas sygxwreitai. Kamia ekptwsh, kanena piswgyrisma.

Jeroyme oti yparxoyn problhmata sthn poreia kai eimaste apolytws eilikrineis. Mporei na kanoyme laqh ypo thn piesh toy xronoy. Mporei h Dioikhsh na mhn mporei na akoloyqhsei s\' ayth th nea epoxh, stis polles apofaseis poy pairnoyme. Mporei kai pragmati yparxoyn antistaseis apo syntexnies kai katesthmena. Mporei kai pragmati yparxei ena dieqnes periballon poy den bohqaei, opws me th fhmologia kai ta senaria poy dhmioyrgoyn anasfaleia, akoma kai fobo. Ola ayta, omws, prepei na ta antimetwpisoyme. Kai prepei na perasoyme ena mhnyma kai dieqnws - to lew ayto kai gia ta dieqnh Mesa - oti para tis dyskolies, exoyme kanei prwtofanh almata sth xwra mas.

Osa hdh exoyme kanei, me tis opoies adynamies, einai pragmatika prwtofanh, para to gegonos oti, ayto poy kanoyme, einai oti allazoyme tosa mesa se merikoys mhnes, osa den allajan epi polles dekaeties. Me dyskolies, alla proxwrame mprosta.

Ayth einai h alhqeia gia thn Ellada. Den thn ejwraizoyme, oyte omws kai thn isopedwnoyme. Kai einai alhqeia oti, prin apo dyo xronia, to na eixame apoklish - opws kai eixame - 30 disekatommyriwn eyrw sto elleimma, den idrwne kanenos to ayti. Twra poy eimaste sto mikroskopio, omws, den mas sygxwreitai oyte enos eyrw apoklish.

Kai sto shmeio opoy brisketai h Eyrwzwnh, to dieqnes kai to eyrwpaiko oikonomiko systhma, me ayto to politiko klima poy epikratei, kaqe allh mas epilogh apo to na kataferoyme toys stoxoys mas, na thrhsoyme th dikh mas pleyra ths symfwnias kai twn desmeysewn mas, einai dromos episfalhs, epikindynos gia th xwra kai, bebaiws, gia toys polites.

Gi\' ayto, to mhnyma einai oti h Ellada qa timhsei tis desmeyseis ths. Kai den qa afhsoyme thn Ellada na ginei to ejilasthrio qyma gia opoia problhmata yparxoyn - kai yparxoyn problhmata, qesmika, politikhs fyshs h alla, opws yparxoyn kai laikistikes politikes fwnes - sthn Eyrwph.

Twra xreiazomaste mia epipleon prospaqeia, wste na thrhsoyme plhrws tis desmeyseis mas kai na dwsoyme ayth th maxh, poy einai kaqoristikh. Kaqoristikh gia na diasfalisoyme th staqerh mas poreia, na krathsoyme makria kaqe kindyno kai na mh dwsoyme se kanenan to dikaiwma h to alloqi na pei oti den kanoyme osa prepei, oti den throyme ayta ta opoia exoyme symfwnhsei.

Ayto den qa to epitrecw. Den qa epitrecw se kanenan na apeilhsei th xwra. Den qa epitrecw se kanenan na mas balei se qanasimo kindyno katarreyshs. Den qa kanw th xarh se kanenan na mporei na amfisbhthsei ta osa symfwnhsame ton Ioylio - mia istorikh apofash, poy einai pros ofelos ths xwras kai ths dinei prooptikh kai sigoyria.

Kai opws eipa xqes, eimai apofasismenos kai, exontas synedriasei kai to Ypoyrgiko Symboylio nwritera, mporw na sas pw oti eimaste kai omofwna apofasismenoi na proxwrhsoyme mprosta. Na profylajoyme th symfwnia toy Ioylioy, poy parexei asfaleia gia to mellon ths xwras, giati den exoyme dikaiwma na afhsoyme ayth thn prospaqeia sth mesh. Giati an meinei sth mesh, qa exoyn prwta ap? ola xaqei oi qysies twn Ellhnwn kai den qa exoyme kai thn eykairia na allajoyme pragmati selida, opws poqei o Ellhnikos laos.

Kai mporw na pw oti eimaste poly konta sto na allajoyme oristika selida. Qa akoysate kai ton Antiproedro kai Ypoyrgo Oikonomikwn, stis dhlwseis toy. Mporei na einai oros texnikos, alla einai shmantikos oros to prwtogenes pleonasma, dhladh na mhn exoyme elleimmata. Na exoyme esoda osa exoyme ejoda, h perissotera esoda ap? o,ti ejoda, xwris na ypologizoyme bebaiws ta xreh twn palaioterwn etwn.

Kai qymizw oti, to 2009, eixame prwtogenes elleimma 24 dis eyrw. Kataferame to 2010 kai katebhke to prwtogenes elleimma sta 11 dis eyrw. An fetos eimaste synepeis, kai prepei na eimaste synepeis, to 2011, to prwtogenes elleimma qa einai mono 1,8 dis eyrw. Kai thrwntas to programma, to 2012, den qa exoyme prwtogenes elleimma. Qa exoyme prwtogenes pleonasma kai ayto qa mas dwsei megalh sigoyria. Qa einai h endeijh oti pame mprosta. Den prepei na xasoyme ayth thn eykairia. Thn kerdizoyme kaqe mera kai kanenas den prokeitai na mas sterhsei ayth thn prooptikh.

G. PAPAXRHSTOS (``TA NEA''): Kyrie Proedre, anarwtiemai pragmatika an ws Arxhgos ths Ajiwmatikhs Antipoliteyshs, meta ta shmerina, qa apofeygate ton peirasmo na xarakthrisete ta nea metra ws ``omologia apotyxias'', gia na paw sto erwthma moy poy einai: ayth h akatasxeth metrologia poy anakoinwnete synexws, pisteyete oti synteinei sthn asfaleia, th sigoyria toy ellhnikoy noikokyrioy, opws kai twra eipate; Ayto einai to ena.

To deytero einai an yparxei xronikos orizontas se ayto. Qa stamathsei kapote ayth h istoria; Kai pote; Giati ayto poy apasxolei ton Ellhna polith, einai ti toy jhmerwnei ayrio, poy den to jerei.

Kai to trito bebaiws exei na kanei me to genikotero: an me ayth thn taktikh, dhladh ths synexoys anakoinwshs metrwn, ejakoloyqeite na pisteyete oti oi polites qa sas krinoyn to 2013. Sas eyxaristw.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Krinomaste kaqe mera, alla epeidh rwtate gia to qema twn eklogwn, na to jekaqarisw. Krinomaste kaqe mera kai dinoyme mia megalh maxh. Ayth th maxh qa th dwsoyme, den fygomaxoyme, opws ekanan alloi. Den petame ``kayth patata'' se kapoion allo. Emeis analabame kai analambanoyme tis eyqynes mas. Kai o Ellhnikos laos den qelei ekloges, qelei allages, qelei prooptikh.

Qelei mia Kybernhsh poy maxetai. Qeloyme kai qelw na eimai eilikrinhs: prwta ap\' ola, to programma einai se kalo dromo. Sas lew oti, toy xronoy, me mia mikrh, dyskolh alla mikrh prospaqeia, sxetika me oles aytes poy exoyme kanei edw kai ena xrono - giati peripoy enas xronos kai kati mhnes einai poy jekinhse ayto to programma, den milame gia tria h tessera xronia - qa eimaste se mia poly staqerh bash prwtogenoys pleonasmatos gia prwth fora.

Kai ayth h bash, einai ayth poy mporei na dwsei elpida kai sigoyria kai gia ton ependyth, gia ton Ellhna kai ton jeno, kai gia ton daneisth, kai gia thn anaptyjh. Einai h prwth proypoqesh, an qelete. Kai mas qwrakizei apo opoiesdhpote diakymanseis h alla problhmata mporei na yparxoyn.

Ara, to programma mas einai se ena swsto dromo. Bebaiws yparxoyn astoxies, bebaiws yparxoyn kai elleiceis. Sas eipa kai prin: otan o forologikos mhxanismos h h Dhmosia Dioikhsh, para toys nomoys poy emeis chfizoyme, den leitoyrgei opws qa eprepe, ayth einai mia pragmatikothta.

Einai h Kybernhsh, poy qa pathsei ena koympi kai qa lyqoyn ayta ta problhmata; H otan emeis milame gia to qema ths arnhsidikias sth Dikaiosynh, otan stelnoyme anqrwpoys sth Dikaiosynh, eite einai forofygades, eite gia alles shmantikes prajeis, gia na perasoyme akribws to mhnyma ths eynomias, kai exoyme mia xronia pia taktikh - anabolh sthn anabolh, apo ton ena dikasth ston allo - ayto einai ena problhma kai einai h pragmatikothta ths Elladas.

Otan yparxoyn kinhmata, poy lene ``Den plhrwnw'', den lene ``Den ladwnw'', lene ``Den plhrwnw'', dhladh xtypane to kratos kai oxi th diafqora, tote bebaiws ola ayta, mazi kai me th dieqnh anasfaleia, paizoyn rolo.

Ara, qelw na perasw ki ena mhnyma oti, den prokeitai kamia kybernhsh, eite qa einai ayth, eite qa einai ayrio mia allh, na lysei ta problhmata xwris th symmetoxh olwn, xwris na synaisqanqoyme tis eyqynes mas - alloi perissotero, alloi ligotero, den lew - en pash periptwsei, xwris na synaisqanqoyme oti den mporei na allajei h xwra kai oti den qa pame mprosta, an den bohqhsoyme oloi. Ayto einai to basiko mhnyma.

Kai bebaiws, den einai eyxaristo na prepei na kanoyme diorqwtikes kinhseis, oi opoies mporei na epibarynoyn toys polites. Qeloyme na tis kanoyme me ton pio dikaio tropo, me ta ligotera barh gia toys ftwxoys kai me ta perissotera barh gia ekeinoys poy exoyn. Kai ayto kanoyme. Kai ayto allazoyme ws systhma, kai me to forologiko poy qa erqei, kai me ayto poy hrqe, alla poy qa allajei kai qa ginei akomh pio dikaio kai akomh pio apotelesmatiko. Aytos einai o stoxos mas.

Ayta ta diorqwtika metra, omws, exoyn shmasia, dioti dinoyme ena patriwtiko agwna ayth th stigmh, gia na staqeropoihqei h xwra. Kai qa staqeropoihqei. Kanoyme ayto poy prepei. Gia thn amyna ths xwras mas, an qelete. An eixame ena polemo, qa legame oti xreiazomaste kapoia xrhmata gia kapoia stratiwtika opla kai qa legame ston Ellhniko lao, ``nai, ta xreiazomaste ayta gi\' ayto ton polemo''. E loipon, einai paromoia h katastash.

Alla jeroyme pia oti den einai kati qewrhtiko. Exoyme mia poly sygkekrimenh symfwnia, exoyme poly sygkekrimenes prooptikes. Aythn qeloyme na epibebaiwsoyme kai, me ayta ta metra, pisteyw oti qa exoyme qetikes ejelijeis.

I. XASAPOPOYLOS (``MEGA''): Kyrie Proedre, qa hqela na staqw sth frash poy akoysthke tis teleytaies meres kai poy katalabainw oti qelete kai edw, sth Dieqnh Ekqesh ths Qessalonikhs, na to tonisete oti qa kanete o,ti einai dynato, o,ti apaiteitai gia na ``kleidwsei'' ayth h symfwnia.

Kai blepoyme thn teleytaia ebdomada se dyo Ypoyrgika Symboylia, oti sto prohgoymeno enas dhmosios ypallhlos exase to miso toy misqo, oi misoi dhmosioi ypallhloi xanoyn to miso toys misqo, ki oti oi alloi misoi dhmosioi ypallhloi h telos pantwn polloi dhmosioi ypallhloi, oysiastika, niwqoyn oti mporei kai na apolyqoyn me thn ergasiakh efedreia.

Kai shmera, eixame ena neo foro sta akinhta. Mporeite na diabebaiwsete toys polites oti ayta ta metra einai ta teleytaia poy pairnete; H kaqe ebdomada qa exoyme Ypoyrgiko Symboylio kai qa kanoyme kai kainoyrgies diorqwtikes kinhseis; Sas to lew ayto, giati h aisqhsh poy yparxei einai oti o Ellhnikos laos plhrwnei tis kaqysterhseis ths dikhs sas Kybernhshs, oti den ylopoieite to Mesoproqesmo.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Eipa kai sthn prohgoymenh apanthsh oti h Kybernhsh kanei ena megalo agwna. Prwta ap\' ola, h Kybernhsh exei ejasfalisei to megalytero paketo sthrijhs ths xwras mas, poy yphrje pote sthn istoria toy planhth mas. Emeis ferame ayta ta xrhmata sth xwra. Yparxoyn kapoies desmeyseis. Ean aytes oi desmeyseis den ylopoioyntai, epeidh pragmati - kai ayto yphrxe apo thn arxh kai to eixa pei kai stoys etairoys mas - h Dhmosia Dioikhsh sth xwra mas exei terastio problhma, einai o megalos asqenhs, ean den eimaste synepeis, tote bebaiws qa erqei h Kybernhsh, gia to kalo, gia to symferon ths patridas, na parei diorqwtika metra.

Ara, loipon, egw qelw na metaferw ena mhnyma sto dhmosio ypallhlo, ston ergazomeno, ston polith: prepei na eimaste synepeis s? ayta ta opoia apofasizoyme kai chfizoyme, para tis dyskolies.

Maxes dinoyme kai qa dwsoyme kai alles. Ayth h maxh, omws, poy dinoyme twra einai kaqoristikh, giati kaqorizetai ean ayto to megalo paketo, ean h apofash toy Ioylioy qa efarmostei, ean qa symfwnhsoyn ola ta Koinoboylia kai oloi oi etairoi mas.

Kai yparxoyn polloi, blepontas oti einai ena para poly gennaiodwro paketo gia thn Ellada, poy to amfisbhtoyn. Egw qa sas pw kai qa sas to exei pei kai o Ypoyrgos Oikonomikwn, se alles synenteyjeis, oti oi xwres sto DNT lene, ``giati sthn Ellada, poy einai mia apo tis 30 ploysioteres xwres ston kosmo, na dinoyme emeis ayta ta posa, otan qa mporoysame na ta dwsoyme sthn Afrikh, otan qa mporoysame na ta dwsoyme sth Latinikh Amerikh h sthn Asia;''. Kai omws, ayta ta diasfalisame.

Ara, loipon, emeis qewroyme oti ta metra ayta, ta opoia anakoinwse kai o Ypoyrgos, einai eparkh kai gia to 2011, kai gia to 2012. Alla qa einai eparkh, oso eimaste synepeis. Kai den einai mono qema nomoqethshs apo mia koinoboyleytikh pleiochfia. Prepei oloi na katanohsoyme pws ayth h xwra prepei na allajei. Einai patriwtiko mas kaqhkon, einai patriwtiko kalesma.

P. SWKOS (``ELEYQEROTYPIA''): Kyrie Proedre, o k. Soimple, o Ypoyrgos Oikonomikwn ths Germanias, prin apo merikes meres, kalese safws thn Ellada na bgei apo to eyrw, afoy den mporei na antapokriqei stis ypoxrewseis ths.

To Spiegel shmera poy, se ena megalo baqmo, aphxei tis qeseis toy Ypoyrgeioy Oikonomikwn ths Germanias, leei to idio pragma. Prin apo ligh wra, o k. Antiproedros ths Kybernhshs ypenohse safws oti h Germania kai alles xwres piezoyn thn Ellada se ena adiejodo, gia dikoys toys logoys.

Qelei pragmati h Germania na bgei h Ellada apo thn Eyrwzwnh; Poies einai aytes oi xwres poy paizoyn ena paixnidi eis baros ths xwras mas, ayth thn periodo; Kai ean synexistoyn aytes oi pieseis, me poio tropo qa apanthsete; Pali me nea metra;

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Prwta ap? ola, emeis exoyme ena programma me sygkekrimenoys stoxoys. Den allazoyn oi stoxoi kaqe ligo kai ligaki, einai poly sygkekrimenoi oi stoxoi. Aytoys toys stoxoys prepei na thrhsoyme.

Ara, loipon, me to ``alfa'' h ``bhta'' metro, me thn ``alfa'' h ``bhta'' politikh, prepei na thrhsoyme aytoys toys stoxoys. Oso ginetai na einai pio dikaioi, ayth einai h prospaqeia mas, alla prepei na thrhsoyme aytoys toys stoxoys. Ayto einai kaqaro.

Ean den toys thrhsoyme, olh ayth h fhmologia qa foyntwsei. Alloy yparxei megalyterh bash kai piqanws megalytera symferonta, alloy ligotera symferonta. Alla oso emeis eimaste Kybernhsh kai oso emeis paleyoyme, akribws dinontas aytes tis maxes opws tis exoyme dwsei, poy tis exoyme dwsei kai tis exoyme kerdisei, kai tis exoyme kerdisei giati exoyme deijei oti, para tis dyskolies, kai pali mporoyme kai fqanoyme stoys stoxoys mas, tote h katastash olo kai qa beltiwnetai.

Ton Ioylio, h symfwnia den qa yphrxe, ean den eixame deijei thn apofasistikothta mas sth Boylh, me thn chfish toy mesoproqesmoy. Twra, oi dyo aytoi mhnes poy einai mprosta mas, einai dyskoloi, alla emeis deixnoyme kai pali thn apofasistikothta mas. Kai qa ``kleidwsoyme'' ayth th symfwnia. Kai ``kleidwnontas'' ayth th symfwnia, ayta ta senaria qa arxisoyn na sbhnoyn.

ST. MOYRELATOY (``ANT1''): Kyrie Proedre, polles fores exete pei oti o dhmosios tomeas einai poly megalos kai kyriws antiparagwgikos. Eiste diateqeimenos na balete maxairi ston steno dhmosio tomea, anoigontas zhthma kai proteinontas arsh ths monimothtas sthn epikeimenh syntagmatikh anaqewrhsh;

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Prwta ap? ola, epeidh legontai polla, qelw na pw oti oyte mazikes apolyseis ginontai, oyte qa ginoyn, oyte sto miso paei o misqos olwn twn dhmosiwn ypallhlwn. Pame se ena eniaio misqologio kai baqmologio. Den mporei enas klhthras enos Ypoyrgeioy na pairnei perissotera apo enan dieyqynth enos alloy Ypoyrgeioy, h apo enan kaqhghth h opoiondhpote allon. Prepei na pame se ena eniaio misqologio. Ara, to prwto einai qema dikaiosynhs.. Makari na eixame kai polla lefta, na ta anebazame ola. Den mporoyme.

Deyteron, sto steno dhmosio tomea, yparxei monimothta. Den exei ton fobo ths apolyshs o stenos dhmosios tomeas, toylaxiston shmera, den yparxei aytos o fobos - gia istorikoys logoys, ta jeroyme, den xreiazetai na mpw s? ayth th leptomereia.

Omws, o dhmosios tomeas hdh exei meiwqei. Hdh exoyme meiwsei to dhmosio tomea. Den exw mprosta moy statistikes, alla mporw na sas pw oti, ayta ta dyo xronia, an ypologisoyme tis idiwtikes symbaseis, ta stage, th meiwsh logw syntajiodothshs kai th meiwsh poy ginetai, logw toy oti emeis proslambanoyme poly ligoteroys, exoyme mia meiwsh peripoy kata ekato xiliades sto proswpiko. Pote exei ginei ayto; Pote sth xwra mas.

Jerete oti o k. Trise mas deixnei ena xarti, kaqe fora poy briskomaste, me to opoio prospaqei na ajiologhsei kai na ejhghsei giati aytes oi treis xwres, poy einai sto mhxanismo sthrijhs, briskontai ekei; Kai brhke mia statistikh, poy qewrei oti einai mia bash: poio einai to misqologiko kostos twn dhmosiwn ypallhlwn, ta teleytaia deka xronia.

Oi treis xwres poy einai prwtes sthn ayjhsh toy misqologikoy kostoys einai prwta h Ellada, deyterh h Irlandia kai trith h Portogalia.

H Ellada ayjhse to misqologiko kostos twn ypallhlwn kata 110%, dhladh yperdiplasiasthke to dhmosionomiko kostos poy plhrwnei telika o Ellhnas forologoymenos, mesa se deka xronia. Kai ayto einai aplws ena deigma aytoy toy spataloy dhmosioy tomea.

Twra, ws pros to qema ths syntagmatikhs anaqewrhshs, egw pisteyw oti den prepei na yparxei tampoy sto ti qa syzhthsoyme, opws bebaiws kai oti prepei na syzhthsoyme ola ta qemata. Kai prepei se kaqe periptwsh na eimaste kai swstoi kai dikaioi, gia na mporoyme na diasfalisoyme thn apokommatikopoihsh olwn aytwn twn diadikasiwn mesa sto Dhmosio.

Na yparxei ena Dhmosio poy qa doyleyei oydetera, patriwtika, eqnika, xwris kommatikes antilhceis, dioti ayto einai poy dhmioyrghse thn plateia Klayqmwnos. Kai ayto einai, bebaiws, gia to opoio anagkasthke kapoia stigmh h Politeia na pei, ``oloi oi dhmosioi ypallhloi einai kai monimoi ypallhloi''.

Yparxoyn alles xwres, anaptygmenes xwres, me poly kalo Dhmosio, opws einai h Soyhdia, poy den exoyn monimoys ypallhloys, alla ekei den yparxei to kynhghto, epeidh exeis kapoies pepoiqhseis.

F. GIWTAKH (``EQNOS''): Kyrie Proedre, einai pasifanes, to eipate kai eseis me alla logia isws, oti h Kybernhsh sas akrobatei, logw twn ragdaiwn ejelijewn kai ayths ths ychloy baqmoy abebaiothtas poy yparxei.

Exete metarryqmistikh rhtorikh, h opoia synhqws plaisiwnetai apo nea - nea - nea metra kai, sigoyra, ayth th stigmh, perigrafoyn oloi ena topio poy, kata kapoioys, isws qa odhghsei se ekloges. Eipate, ``oxi ekloges''.

Prin apo ligo, o k. Benizelos mas enhmerwse oti, ayto poy kanate amesws meta to Ypoyrgiko Symboylio, htan na enhmerwsete eseis ton k. Samara kai o k. Benizelos sth synexeia.

Qa kanete ena akoma bhma pros thn kateyqynsh ayth, opws eixate kanei kai prin dyo mhnes, ton Ioynio, kalwntas ton k. Samara akoma kai na sygkybernhsete;

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Prwta ap? ola, den einai rhtorikh ayto poy kanoyme. H metarryqmish einai pragmatikothta. Kanoyme megales allages kai anatropes, poy den eixan ginei edw kai dekaeties.

Sto systhma ths anwtaths paideias, kanoyme mia terastia metarryqmish, gia thn opoia kataferame kai eixame mia eyrytath synainesh mesa sth Boylh - elpizw kai eimai sigoyros kai mesa sthn ellhnikh koinwnia, makari kai sthn akadhmaikh koinothta. Metarryqmiseis sto asfalistiko systhma, metarryqmiseis ston ``Kallikrath'', sto Dhmosio, sthn ygeia.

Ara, loipon, den yparxei rhtorikh edw. Edw yparxei prajh. Bebaiws, oles aytes oi metarryqmiseis eprepe na eixan ginei polla xronia prin. Ki an eixan ginei aytes oi metarryqmiseis, den qa milagame gia ta metra, den qa milagame gia to xreos, den qa milagame gia ta elleimmata, den qa eixame na antimetwpisoyme ayto to tsoynami twn dieqnwn agorwn, poy den empisteyontan thn Ellada. Den qa eixame ta 36 dis elleimma to 2009.

Ayta einai poy plhrwnoyme shmera. Kai exoyme dyo pleyseis: h mia einai bebaiws na meiwsoyme ta elleimmata, gia na ftasoyme sto prwtogenes pleonasma. Kai h allh, na kanoyme tis aparaithtes metarryqmiseis.

Egw dokimasa kai synexizoyme na dokimazoyme tis eyryteres synaineseis, opws eidate, kai sto qema ths paideias, kai twra sto qema ths oikonomias. Den eidame omws thn wrimothta apo thn allh pleyra. Den qa mpw se mia dielkystinda antipoliteytikh. Mia paratajh, h opoia exei terasties eyqynes gia to poy eimaste shmera, qa eprepe na balei plath.

Kai eimai sigoyros kai jerw oti yparxoyn para polla stelexh sth Nea Dhmokratia, poy qa symfwnoysan me mia tetoia stash alla, profanws, fainetai oti h hgesia ths Neas Dhmokratias akoloyqei thn politikh ths prohgoymenhs, dikhs ths kybernhshs, poy den blepei to problhma, alla qelei na rixnei tis eyqynes alloy.

Makari ayto na allajei, makari kai twra na allajei. Dokimasame, den htan wrimo to klima gia sygkybernhseis. Kai den milame, opws eipa kai prin, gia ekloges.

Einai h wra ths maxhs. Eimaste se mia poreia poly apaithtikh. Oles mas oi dynameis ws xwra, oxi ws Kybernhsh mono, alla ws xwra, prepei na einai strammenes sto na kerdisoyme aytes tis maxes kai na qemeliwsoyme ayto to opoio apofasisame.

Phrame mia apofash ton Ioylio, poly shmantikh apofash - ayth, as qemeliwqei. Kai apo ekei kai pera, qa prepei na proxwrhsoyn oi allages, gia na exoyme mia oikonomia poy den prokalei elleimmata, den dhmioyrgei yfesh, alla mia nea anaptyjh.

D. KROYSTALLH (``TO BHMA THS KYRIAKHS''): Lete synexws oti brisketai h xwra se polemo kai oti, s? ayth th fash, den epitrepontai oyte distagmoi, oyte piswgyrismata. Omws, polla apo ta piswgyrismata toy prohgoymenoy diasthmatos ofeilontai se distagmoys twn Ypoyrgwn, kapoiwn Ypoyrgwn telos pantwn, oi opoioi den hqelan na proxwrhsoyn me to ryqmo poy apaitoysan oi peristaseis.

Ti qa kanete gia na antimetwpisete ayto to problhma kai na yparjei eniaia fwnh sthn Kybernhsh;

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Kat' arxhn, prokeitai gia mia Kybernhsh, poy anelabe sthn pio dyskolh stigmh twn teleytaiwn dekaetiwn meta th metapoliteysh. Exei na antimetwpisei sysswreymena eswterika problhmata ths xwras mas, toy Dhmosioy, ths oikonomias kai, bebaiws, kai mia dieqnh katastash, poy epishs einai prwtofanhs, alla kai mia Eyrwph poly diaforetikh.

Qa htan poly periergo, mia Kybernhsh na mhn syzhta, na mhn yparxoyn diaforetikes apoceis, na mhn agwnia gia to an kanei to kalytero. Kai egw, ayth thn Kybernhsh, th xairomai, dioti eixame kybernhseis - na sas qymisw - me prwqypoyrgoys poy spania emfanizontan kai Ypoyrgika Symboylia poy htan anyparkta. Den yphrxan Ypoyrgika Symboylia. Kai kathgoroymaste twra, oti agwnioyme kai syzhtame gia to kalo ths xwras;

Kai deyteron, prospaqoyme na kanoyme o,ti einai dynaton, wste na mporesoyme me pio hpio tropo na perasoyme mesa apo ayth th stenwpo, alla qa perasoyme apo ekei kai, telika, katafernoyme kai pairnoyme apofaseis kai, malista, kai omofwnes apofaseis.

Kai bebaiws, polla pragmata ta syneidhtopoioyme ki emeis kata th diarkeia ths poreias mas. Syneidhtopoioyme tis dyskolies toy dhmosioy tomea poly perissotero, opws kai o Ellhnas poliths to blepei, syneidhtopoioyme tis antistaseis.

Poses antistaseis yphrjan gi? ayth thn ``katakahmenh'' hlektronikh syntagografhsh, poy kamia prohgoymenh kybernhsh den to tolmoyse, enw emeis to fwnazame pente xronia; Giati; Epeidh htan dyskolo na mpei ena kompioyter; Oxi. Den yphrxe politikh boylhsh, yphrxan ta symferonta kai yparxoyn ta symferonta, poy qeloyn na yponomeysoyn ayto to aplo, thn hlektronikh syntagografhsh.

Giati; Giati h diafaneia meiwnei tis times, meiwnei to kostos gia ton asfalismeno kai ta Asfalistika Tameia, meiwnei ta kerdh twn megalwn farmakobiomhxaniwn. Kai kapoiwn giatrwn, bebaiws, poy jerete pws ameibontai.

Yparxoyn antistaseis. S? aytes tis antistaseis, emeis qa eimaste ameiliktoi, alla xreiazomaste th synergasia olwn. Kai an yparxoyn piswgyrismata, yparxoyn otan den katanooyme oti prepei na proxwrhsoyme mprosta, oti prepei na allajei h Ellada. Twra einai h megalh mas eykairia. Mhn th xasoyme, mhn deiliasoyme.

G. PITTARAS (``ALPHA''): Kyrie Proedre, epeidh anafereste synexeia sth forodiafygh, kai nwritera akoysa kai ton k. Antiproedro na milaei gia ``anyparjia forologikhs dioikhshs'', qelw na sas rwthsw kati poly sygkekrimeno.

Perysi, qymamai, o k. Pagkalos me entolh sas eixe anaxwrhsei, malista htan en mesw Ypoyrgikoy Symboylioy, gia thn Elbetia, kai otan gyrise eixe sta xeria toy ena DVD me stoixeia Ellhnwn kataqetwn kai mia diakratikh symfwnia gia ton entopismo Ellhnwn forofygadwn.

Twra ena xrono meta, mporeite na mas peite ti exei ginei ayth h ypoqesh; Exete kanei diastayrwseis; Dikaiologoyntai aytes oi kataqeseis; Exoyn plhrwsei aytoi foro edw, sthn Ellada; Kai to rwtw ayto, giati shmera poly eyloga o kosmos, akoygontas kai tis shmerines sas anakoinwseis, qa pei: ``ma kala, pali apo emas zhtane lefta'';

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Prwta ap? ola, sto deytero skelos poy anaferate, poy yponohsate, qa sas eipe o Ypoyrgos kai Antiproedros oti ayto to telos einai klimakwto. Ara, me mia apolyth prospaqeia koinwnikhs dikaiosynhs. Ta barh na pane pragmati ekei poy mporoyn na to antejoyn, h akoma kai ekei poy jeroyme oti me diaforoys tropoys forodiafeygoyn, dioti an den forodiefeygan, den qa eixame to problhma.

An qelete, ayto einai ena tekmhrio poy qa exoyme me to akinhto, gia to poia einai h oikonomikh katastash kapoiwn anqrwpwn, poy alliws dhlwnoyn kai alliws kerdizoyn. Ara, ayto einai to prwto.

Twra, se sxesh me ton elegxo, hdh exoyn chfistei, me eishghsh kai toy prohgoymenoy Ypoyrgoy Oikonomikwn, alla kai toy k. Benizeloy sth Boylh, shmantikes ryqmiseis pia gia th diafaneia, gia to anoigma logariasmwn, gia ton elegxo logariasmwn, gia thn kinhsh logariasmwn, kati poy den yphrxe prin. Einai h prwth fora poy ginetai sth xwra mas.

Deyteron, ola ayta ta stoixeia, ta opoia exoyn erqei, elegxontai apo tis armodies Yphresies. Kai ara, o elegxos aytos ginetai kai yparxoyn synepeies. Den exw mprosta moy ta stoixeia. Den einai paranomo to na bgaleis xrhmata ejw. Paranomo einai na mhn exeis dhlwsei xrhmata.

Omws, exoyme kai to ejhs: egw exw proswpika milhsei, kai prosfata pali, sto Parisi, me thn Prwqypoyrgo ths Elbetias. Hdh exei yparjei symfwnia me th Germania kai nomizw, amesws meta me th Bretania, me tis opoies oi kataqeseis allodapwn sthn Elbetia qa forologoyntai. Mporei na mhn apokalyptontai ta onomata, ayth einai mia symfwnia, alla qa forologoyntai kai qa dinontai ta xrhmata ayta sth xwra proeleyshs.

Ara, loipon, pame pros ayth th symfwnia, ws mia basikh, arxikh symfwnia. Pragmati, xrhmata ta opoia qa eprepe na forologoyntai kai qa eprepe na einai ston korbana ayths ths xwras gia ton Ellhniko lao, qa erqoyn sto ellhniko kratos. Einai mia apo tis polles energeies poy kanoyme, akribws gia na apokatasthsoyme to aisqhma dikaioy, poy zhta o Ellhnikos laos. Kai dikaiws to zhta.

K. ZOYLAS (``KAQHMERINH''): Kyrie Proedre, eipate prin apo ligo oti oi stoxoi den allazoyn, alla toys stoxoys prepei na toys petyxainoyme. Diapistwnei loipon kaneis poly eykola oti, profanws den epityxate toys stoxoys sas, gia na epibalete shmera ena neo metro, to opoio afora sthn ektakth forologhsh twn akinhtwn, diaceydontas etsi kai thn pro dihmeroy desmeysh toy k. Benizeloy, oti den qa forologhqoyn ek neoy xamhlomisqoi kai syntajioyxoi.

Ekana enan proxeiro ypologismo kai eida oti mia mesh ellhnikh oikogeneia poy exei ena spiti 100 tetragwnika kai ena mikro ejoxiko, qa klhqei na plhrwsei apo 600 ews 1.000 eyrw gia dyo xronia, me ayta poy anakoinwse prin apo mish wra o k. Benizelos. Kai anaferomai sth mesh ellhnikh oikogeneia, giati ayth einai poy prwtistws plhttetai apo tis diarkeis forologies poy epiballete, opws kai apo tis meiwseis twn eisodhmatwn ths kai tis akribes times sthn agora. Kai twra erxeste epi ths oysias na forologhsete to spiti ths, dhladh tis apotamieyseis ayths ths oikogeneias, giati h mesh ellhnikh oikogeneia antimetwpizei to spiti ths ws apotamieysh.

To erwthma moy loipon einai: kaqws ta teleytaia dyo xronia exei apodeixqei plhrws oti h politikh ths diarkoys afaimajhs ths meshs ellhnikhs oikogeneias einai anapotelesmatikh kai katastrofikh gia olh thn oikonomia, giati den pragmatopoieite mia drastikh peristolh pleon stis kratikes dapanes, stis dhmosies dapanes; Giati den kleinete mia DEKO;

Proxqes, anakoinwsate oti o OSE htan prwtos stoys megalo-ofeiletes toy Dhmosioy. Kai epeidh to eipate kai xqes, oti stoxos sas einai na yparxei enas ergazomenos ana spiti, alhqeia pisteyete oti, ayth th stigmh, mia mesh ellhnikh oikogeneia me enan ergazomeno twn 800 eyrw, mporei na epibiwsei me tis shmerines synqhkes; Eyxaristw.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Ayto to ebala ws elaxisto, oxi ws stoxo. Ws elaxisto.

Kai gi\' ayto exoyme kai ta programmata - einai edw o k. Koytroymanhs - akribws gia na diasfalisoyme, me ta koinotika kondylia poy exoyme, ta megala programmata poy exoyme, ta opoia den exoyn leitoyrghsei sto parelqon h den exoyn leitoyrghsei swsta kai exoyn xaqei. Na dwsoyme th dynatothta me programmata ayta, eite katartishs, eite askhshs, na sthrijoyme to eisodhma akoma kai toy anergoy, oxi mono me thn katartish, alla kai to eisodhma akoma kai toy anergoy gia tis oikogeneies aytes.

Einai ena programma, to opoio qa ftasei se ekatontades xiliades anergoys. Den milame mono gia kapoies xiliades. Gia ekatontades xiliades anergoys. Kai qa einai shmantiko. Qeloyme bebaiws na ftasoyme se ena systhma, opws stis boreies xwres, opoy den epikratei o fobos epeidh eisai anergos, giati einai aplws mia metabatikh fash, ews otoy pas na breis mia allh doyleia.

Ayto to systhma pronoias, poy den yparxei sthn Ellada, einai ayto akribws poy epishs prepei na leitoyrghsei. Na ftiajoyme ena kratos pronoias poy sthrizei ton ergazomeno, sthrizei to neo, sthrizei ton anergo poy feygei sta 40 - 45 toy, poy apolyetai, gia na mporei na brei mia allh doyleia.

Deyteron, se o,ti afora thn ``afaimajh'', poy eipate. Koitajte, epeidh polloi milane gia thn yfesh, oti ayta dhmioyrgoyn yfesh, gia skefteite, omws, dioti kapoy xanoyme to poio einai to problhma sth xwra mas, an dhladh h ``afaimajh'' ayth einai to problhma ths yfeshs. Skefteite mia epixeirhsh h opoia paragei, alla paragei proionta ta opoia den agorazontai apo kanenan. Exei ejoda, exei misqoys. Daneizetai synexws gia na paragei ayta ta proionta kai den ta poylaei kai, kapoia stigmh, erxontai oi daneistes kai lene, ``den qa ta bgaleis pera, koce''. Qa toy pei o epixeirhmatias, ``ma tote qa dhmioyrghqei yfesh sthn epixeirhsh moy''.

Kai tote qa toy poyn, ``ftiaje ena proion poy na poylietai, ftiaje ena proion poy na einai antagwnistiko''. Gi\' ayto exoyme yfesh, giati eixame mia oikonomia, poy den basizotan se ena swsto protypo anaptyjhs. Den parhgage gia ejagwges, den parhgage gewrgika proionta poiotika. Pairname epidothseis gia na ta rixnoyme stis xwmateres. Maqame s\' ayth th logikh.

Dhmioyrghsame mia yperkatanalwsh kai, ayth thn yperkatanalwsh, thn trofodotoyse to elleimma, ta terastia elleimmata toy kratoys, mexri 36 dis poy ftasame to 2009. Stekomaste se phlina podia. Ara, o stoxos einai na pame se ena allo anaptyjiako montelo, kai ayto arxizei na ginetai. Arxizei deila, alla kai dynamika. Otan milame gia 40% ayjhsh stis ejagwges, einai rekor. Aplws, den htan megalh h ejagwgikh mas biomhxania. O toyrismos exei ftasei se epipeda rekor. Sth gewrgia hdh yparxei strofh, megalh strofh stis ejagwges. Ara, deixnoyme oti mporoyme.

Alla pername apo mia fash metabashs apo mia oikonomia se mia allh. Ayth h fash einai dyskolh kai se ayth th fash yparxoyn kai symfwnies me toys daneistes mas, poy lene ``koitajte, den mporoyme na sas plhrwnoyme ta elleimmata''. Katalabainete ti mas plhrwnoyn; Den mas plhrwnoyn to xreos, to opoio den mporoyme na plhrwsoyme. Plhrwnoyn ta parapanw poy jodeyoyme apo o,ti exoyme esoda.

Kai egw kai oloi mas mporei na ejagriwnomaste me tis fraseis kai thn antilhch poy exoyn gia thn Ellada polloi, apo thn allh meria, omws, as baloyme kai ton eayto mas sth dikh toys qesh. Soy leei o allos, ``na toys bohqhsoyme, alla posa xronia qa plhrwnoyme ta parapanw toys ejoda, dhladh parapanw ejoda apo o,ti exoyn esoda;''. Kai emeis na katanalwnoyme me ta dika toys daneika. Kai gi\' ayto leme na pame grhgora se ena prwtogenes pleonasma.

Ara, nai, einai dyskola. Kanoyme ayto poy kanoyme, omws, kai pairnoyme metra - opws kai ayto to opoio sas exei analysei o Ypoyrgos - ta opoia emeis qa efarmosoyme me ton pio dikaio tropo. Dhladh, bohqwntas akribws gia na anakoyfisoyme h na mhn epibarynoyme. H na mhn epibarynoyme poly ta xamhlotera strwmata kai na epibarynoyme ta ychlotera.

Jeroyme oti sympiezetai kai h mesaia tajh. H mesaia tajh se olh thn Eyrwph kai se olo ton anaptygmeno kosmo sympiezetai. Mono omws ean ftiajoyme mia oikonomia, h opoia einai ejagwgikh kai dynamikh, qa mporesoyme na sthrijoyme th mesaia tajh. Kai mono otan ki emeis oi idioi poyme oti, ``epiteloys, plhrwnoyme toys foroys mas'', qa mporesoyme na poyme oti sthrizoyme th mesaia tajh kai oles tis tajeis, alla idiaitera th mesaia tajh kai toys xamhlomisqoys, me tis aparaithtes yphresies ths xwras.

Giati an pragmatika aisqanetai o allos oti exei kalh kai dwrean paideia, swsth kai epishs dwrean ygeia, swsth pronoia gia thn anergia, tote bebaiws einai allh h qesh ths mesaias tajhs. Sth mesaia tajh sthn Soyhdia, mporei na plhrwnei o mesos ergazomenos kai 60% kai 70% toy eisodhmatos toy, alla aisqanetai oti exei ejasfalismena ta koinwnika agaqa. Ekei prepei na pame.

Na symplhrwsei kati kai o Ypoyrgos.

EY. BENIZELOS: Hqela na epanelqw sto zhthma twn anakoinwsewn gia to metro poy epibarynei th domhmenh epifaneia, thn akinhth perioysia. Den prokeitai gia nea epibarynsh se sxesh me to synoliko mas stoxo gia to 2011.

Ejakoloyqoyme na anazhtoyme 54 dis eyrw ws ethsia dhmosia esoda. Den exoyme kataferei na piasoyme to stoxo ayto, ypoleipomaste kata ena mikro pososto kai einai zwtikh anagkh gia th xwra na ftasoyme sto stoxo mas. Den ayjanei o stoxos, einai o,ti exoyme symfwnhsei sto mesoproqesmo programma toy Ioynioy.

Omws, blepete oti oi elleiceis sth Dhmosia Dioikhsh, idiws sth forologikh dioikhsh, h forodiafygh, h dyspragia, h yfesh, exoyn ws apotelesma na ypoleipomeqa toy stoxoy mas. Ara, edw prokeitai gia ena metro ypokatastashs metrwn, poy den exoyn apodwsei ta anamenomena kai prepei na apodwsoyn ta anamenomena, mesa se 3 mhnes.

Ean qeloyme na petyxoyme thn efarmogh twn apofasewn ths 21hs Ioylioy. Ean qeloyme na qwrakisoyme th xwra, na thn asfalisoyme. Kai qwrakizontas th xwra, qwrakizoyme kai tis perioysies twn Ellhnwn, thn akinhth perioysia kai tis kataqeseis.

Leei o k. Zoylas, ``h epibarynsh toy mesaioy noikokyrioy einai para poly megalh''. Ma dystyxws, ola ta noikokyria einai to poly - poly mesaia apo forologikhs apocews. Mono 160.000 Ellhnes dhlwnoyn eisodhma anw twn 50.000 eyrw, mono 25.000 Ellhnes dhlwnoyn eisodhma anw twn 100.000 eyrw. Ayto antapokrinetai sthn pragmatikothta ths ellhnikhs koinwnias kai ths ellhnikhs oikonomias; Oxi. Ayto qa to antimetwpisoyme rizika se liges ebdomades, me to neo eqniko forologiko systhma.

Prepei na syndeetai to eisodhma kai ara h forologikh ypoxrewsh kai me thn perioysia; Ean kapoios poy exei perioysia kai dhlwnei mikro eisodhma prepei na epibarynqei, tote prepei na laboyme ypoch mas oti, sth syntriptikh ths pleionothta, h perioysia sthn Ellada einai ependedymenh se akinhta.

Me bash tis dhlwseis toy E9 poy eginan to 2009, h synolikh dhlwmenh, me bash tis antikeimenikes ajies, perioysia twn idiwtwn, poy einai ependedymenh se akinhta, jepernaei ta 400 dis eyrw. Otan to dhmosio xreos, to yperogko dhmosio xreos ths Elladas einai 360 dis eyrw kai otan to AEP ths xwras einai twra ligotero apo 220 dis eyrw to xrono.

Ara, yparxei mia pragmatikothta, thn opoia prepei na antimetwpisoyme. Kai olo ayto, me ena tropo prosektiko, analogiko, dikaio, me mia klimakwsh poy antapokrinetai stis koinwnikes kai eisodhmatikes diafores poy yparxoyn.

Kai to erwthma einai: qeloyme na kanoyme ayth thn prospaqeia, na ftasoyme sta prwtogenh pleonasmata, na stamathsei h gkrinia, h piesh, o ekbiasmos, h synexhs amfisbhthsh, h sykofanthsh ths xwras; Poso kostizei ayto; Poso kostizei h diakindyneysh ths eqnikhs mas ajioprepeias; Poso kostizei h diakindyneysh ths qeshs mas mesa sthn Eyrwph; Poso kostizei h diakindyneysh toy epipedoy zwhs kai twn metapolemikwn - oxi mono metapoliteytikwn - katakthsewn ths xwras;

As skeftoyme ti kostos einai ayto poy diakybeyetai kai ti kostos kaloymeqa na katabaloyme. Qa deite oti ayto poy kanoyme einai h swsth epilogh istorika.

X. KOYTRAS (``SKAI''): Qa to piasw apo ekei opoy to afhse o Antiproedros kai ypoqetw oti h syntriptikh pleiochfia twn Ellhnwn politwn, etsi opws to eqese o k. Benizelos, qa sas pei ``nai, qeloyme na symmetasxoyme sthn prospaqeia na meinoyn oi katakthseis ths metapolemikhs Elladas. Alla prepei na symmetasxoyme sthn prospaqeia oloi to idio''.

Opws ferate prin to paradeigma gia tis epixeirhseis, qa sas ferw allo ena paradeigma analogo: yparxei mia epixeirhsh poy paragei, plhrwnei toys misqoys ths, plhrwnei tis forologies ths, plhrwnei tis eisfores ths. Dipla, yparxei mia analogh epixeirhsh poy den kanei tipote apo ola ayta. Yparxei ena noikokyrio to opoio dhlwnei ta eisodhmata toy, exei kanei th dhlwsh toy E9 kai qa forologhqei. Kai dipla, yparxei ena allo noikokyrio poy exei mayra xrhmata, den dhlwnei tipota.

To erwthma einai: ws pote oi synepeis qa synexisoyn na plhrwnoyn; Einai poly kairio erwthma, nomizw, sthn ellhnikh koinwnia.

Kai to deytero poy qelw na sas rwthsw einai, an qewreite oti exete, eseis proswpika kai h Kybernhsh sas, to politiko kefalaio na proxwrhsete se sygkekrimenes allages, tis opoies mas perigrafete.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Prwta ap\' ola, exoyme to politiko kai eqniko xreos na proxwrhsoyme. Deyteron, to erwthma poy qesate einai apolytws swsto. Megalyterh koinwnikh adikia apo thn forodiafygh den yparxei. Na plhrwnei o enas, na einai synephs, kai o allos na mhn plhrwnei. Bebaiws, einai poly eykolo kapoioi na lene, ``efoson kapoios den plhrwnei, den plhrwnw kai egw''. Kapoia stigmh, omws, oloi prepei na paroyme thn apofash oti ayto prepei na allajei.

S? ayto, h Kybernhsh mporei na kanei mexri enos shmeioy kapoia pragmata. Qa ftiajoyme mhxanismoys, qa dhmioyrghsoyme hlektronikes yphresies, ena neo forologiko nomosxedio. Ayta bebaia pairnoyn kai kapoio xrono. Makari ola ayta na eixan ginei prin apo pente, eji, deka xronia. Den yphrxe kai toso megalh forodiafygh prin apo deka xronia.

Alla twra xreiazetai na antimetwpisoyme to problhma twn elleimmatwn poy exoyme, amesa. Kai oso to katanohsoyme ayto, toso qa eimaste kai pio apotelesmatikoi. Oso yparxei syneidhsh, oti den yparxei kamia kybernhsh h opoia qa ta lysei ola, ean para polloi polites apofasisoyn oti, ``den bariesai, egw den exw eyqynh apenanti sth xwra''.

Katanow oti etsi toys diapaidagwghsame, mporei na eimaste prwtoi ftaixtes emeis, epeidh diapaidagwghsame ena megalo meros toy kosmoy s? ayth th logikh. Ayto prepei na allajei. Oloi mas eimaste, opws eipa kai xqes, meros enos systhmatos, poy mas megalwse, mas eqrece kai dhmioyrghse syneidhseis. Kai oloi mas prepei na allajoyme.

Kai pisteyw oti, sthn prospaqeia poy kanoyme gia ena eqniko forologiko systhma, qa exoyme eyryteres synaineseis.

Eixa pei kai sthn hgesia ths Neas Dhmokratias prosfata, pro oligwn mhnwn kai otan synanthqhkame kai se epipedo Arxhgwn kommatwn, ypo thn Proedria toy k. Papoylia, na pame mazi, na syzhthsoyme me toys etairoys mas, na syzhthsoyme me thn Troika, ena forologiko systhma diaforetiko, poy qa einai akoma pio aplo, qa meiwnei kapoioys syntelestes, qa einai akoma pio epikairo, qa einai efarmosimo, qa exei mikroterh grafeiokratia, aplopoihsh k.lp.

Alla na poyme ston Ellhniko lao oloi mazi, oti kanontas ayto to neo systhma kai meiwnontas toys syntelestes, proypoqesh einai oloi na to thrhsoyme kai na to poyme oloi. Oxi na to pei to PASOK kai meta na bgei h Nea Dhmokratia kai na paei na to pyrobolhsei, gia na dwsei alloqi se kapoioys na mhn plhrwnoyn toys foroys toys, opws polles fores kanei.

Ara, loipon, mia tetoia syneidhsh qa bohqoyse para poly. Kai nomizw oti akribws ayto qelei na petyxei o Antiproedros, me to neo systhma ta opoio prowqei, oxi aplws ena kalo systhma sta xartia, alla ena systhma to opoio einai diamorfwmeno sth syneidhsh, oxi mono twn kommatwn, alla eyrytera toy Ellhnikoy laoy, oti einai ena swsto kai dikaio systhma. Kai epiteloys, ayto na to yphrethsoyme oloi. Gia na exoyme ena kratos epiteloys, gia na spasoyme ayth thn adikia, na yparxei koinwnikh synoxh kai na jefygoyme apo ta elleimmata kai ta daneika.

G. MAKRYGIANNHS (``PRWTO QEMA''): Kyrie Proedre, legetai tis teleytaies meres, eidika meta to problhma poy proekyce stis diapragmateyseis me thn Troika, to opoio problhma telos pantwn, oti oi daneistes mas den qa egkrinoyn thn katabolh ths 6hs doshs, toylaxiston oxi oloklhrh thn dosh, alla qa proxwrhsoyn se tmhmatikh katabolh.

Ayto qa shmainei, etsi opws legetai kai syzhteitai, oti nai men h xwra mas qa einai entajei stis daneiakes ths ypoxrewseis, sthn ekplhrwsh toys dhladh pros to ejwteriko, alla sto eswteriko qa exoyme sthn pragmatikothta mia stash plhrwmwn. Den qa exei dhladh to kratos th dynatothta na plhrwsei misqoys kai syntajeis, ton Oktwbrio kiolas.

Hqela na rwthsw loipon to ejhs: qa plhrwqoyn kanonika oi syntajeis kai oi misqoi ton Oktwbrio kai ti qa prajei h Kybernhsh, ean h Troika ekbiasei m? ayto ton tropo; Kai se synexeia aytoy, ean h Kybernhsh exei kapoia kokkinh grammh s? oles aytes tis pieseis ths Troikas kai an qa antistaqei h qa diapragmateyqei, en pash periptwsei, apenanti s? aytes tis apaithseis.

Na ferw ena paradeigma. O k. Benizelos eipe nwritera oti pairnei to Ypoyrgiko ta shmerina metra kai ta anakoinwnei, epeidh metajy twn allwn yparxei kai yfesh. As afhsoyme toys alloys logoys, epeidh exase h Merkel kai paei legontas. Thn yfesh, omws, thn efere to mnhmonio. Qa pate loipon sthn Troika na ths peite, oti einai kai diko sas laqos to gegonos oti den mporoyme na piasoyme 54 dis eyrw, alla na to kanoyme 53, etsi wste na mhn thn plhrwsei pali o kakomoirhs apo ta Sepolia; Eyxaristw.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Nomizw oti kanete laqos, otan lete oti ``qa to plhrwsei o kakomoirhs apo ta Sepolia''. Den einai tetoioy eidoys to metro. Deyteron, epeidh milhsate gia th stash plhrwmwn, gia skefqeite ean pragmati yphrxe h paysh daneiodothshs ths xwras mas - kai gi? ayto palecame, gia na mhn yparjei, enw emeis eixame elleimmata, opws kai exoyme - tote htan poy den qa mporoysame na plhrwsoyme syntajeis, den qa mporoysame na plhrwsoyme to systhma ygeias, den qa mporoysame na plhrwsoyme toys kaqhghtes.

Otan fqasoyme sto prwtogenes pleonasma, akoma kai na mhn exoyme na plhrwsoyme, akoma kai na mas daneiodothsoyn, toylaxiston qa mporoyme na plhrwsoyme ta ejoda mas kai toys misqoys. Gi? ayto leme oti einai kai shmantiko eqnika na fqasoyme sto prwtogenes pleonasma, asxeta me thn Troika - afhste thn Troika. Den qeloyme na fqasoyme se ena prwtogenes pleonasma; Den einai swsto, gia na mporoyme na staqoyme emeis sta podia mas, eqnika, perhfana kai me ajioprepeia; Ayto einai to problhma, h Troika; Na thn diwjoyme, na thn diwjoyme thn Troika. Ayrio, qelete;

Ayth einai h lysh; Ta problhmata ta dika mas, den ta blepoyme; Den qa ta lysoyme; Twra, ean diapragmateyomaste; Kaqe mera. Opws diapragmateyqhkame kai eixame mia istorikh symfwnia - poy sas eipa, den yparxei se allh xwra toy planhth tetoia symfwnia. Sas th ferame ayth thn symfwnia. Ferame xrhmata gia thn Ellada. Alla yparxoyn bebaiws oi desmeyseis oi dikes mas, apo thn pleyra mas.

Nomizete oti h Troika qelei na apotyxei h Ellada; Aytoi einai dhladh poy mas dhmioyrghsan thn adiafaneia, th diafqora, to systhma ygeias, tis farmakobiomhxanies, ta panepisthmia mas poy den paragoyn ta swsta ptyxia, h ftaine aytoi gia to gegonos oti exoyme mia gewrgia poy den ejagei kai eisagei, h gia tis ellhnopoihseis twn proiontwn mas; H Troika ftaiei gi? ayta;

Prepei na doyme poio einai to problhma. Deyteron. Oi Germanoi exoyn ta problhmata toys, einai mia pragmatikothta. Mporoyme na leme, ftaine oi men, ftaine oi de, exw pei toses fores oti eprepe na exoyme paei sto eyrwomologo, twra syzhteitai. Exw pei toses fores, prepei na plhrwsoyn kai oi trapezes to foro twn synallagwn. Twra syzhteitai kai proteinetai, malista.

Alla mh metaferoyme ekei tis eyqynes tis dikes mas. Dioti sas to eipa kai prin, oso exoyme elleimmata, kaqe xrono anebainei kai to xreos. Soy lene, loipon, oi alloi, ``wraia na soy plhrwsw to xreos to palio, giati breqhkes s? ayth thn katastash, poy kakws breqhkes, alla ftaime kai emeis poy den epopteysame th xwra''. Giati an eixe epopteytei h xwra, den qa mporoyse h Kybernhsh Karamanlh na ftasei sta 36 dis. Den qa mporoyse na ftasei sta 36 dis, xwris na yparxei kapoy ena freno.

Exoyn ki aytoi tis eyqynes toys, loipon. Ara, ``na analaboyme tis eyqynes gia to parelqon'', lene, ``apo edw kai pera, omws, mhn anebazete to xreos, meiwste to elleimma''. Ayto mas lene kai aytos einai o stoxos.

Ara, loipon, wraia na broyme toys ``kakoys Troikanoys'', alla o,ti kai na einai aytoi, telika, emeis exoyme thn eyqynh. Einai dikh mas patriwtikh ypoxrewsh. Epiteloys, einai h dikh mas ajioprepeia, na staqoyme stis dikes mas dynameis kai na deijoyme oti mporoyme.

Kai exoyme ena kostos. Exoyme ena kostos, opws exoyme kai ena adiko systhma. Ayto qa to allajoyme, qa ftiajoyme to systhma kai to ftiaxnoyme. Kai to kostos qa einai mia ependysh kai einai mia ependysh gia th staqerothta, gia to ayrio kai thn prooptikh mas.

D. MPOTWNHS (``NET''): Kyrie Proedre, sas akoysame kai xqes kai shmera na lete, oti prepei oloi na baloyme plath gia na bgei h xwra ap? ayto to oikonomiko toynel. ``Einai h monadikh protash, einai monodromos, einai sklhros o dromos'', opws eipate, ``alla ayton prepei na akoloyqhsoyme''.

Yparxei omws kai h allh protash. Yparxoyn ta kommata, ta opoia lene oti ayth h Kybernhsh einai kakh, prepei na fygei. Ayth h Kybernhsh exei balei th xwra se peripeteies, thn odhgei se oikonomiko xaos, jepoylaei th dhmosia perioysia. Oi dhmoskophseis sas fernoyn para poly xamhla se pososta.

Yparxoyn oi polites poy diamartyrontai, xqes sth Qessalonikh, proxqes sthn Aqhna, yparxoyn omws kai antidraseis kai mesa sthn idia thn Koinoboyleytikh Omada kai sto eswteriko toy kommatos. Mhn jexname oti eixate 160 boyleytes, exete 154 kai eixate pei palaiotera oti den mporeite na kybernhsete me 153 edres. Isxyei ayth h dhlwsh sas; Kai osoi zhtoyn ekloges, opws o k. Samaras, einai aneyqynoi politikoi; Eyxaristw.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: An htan kalh h prohgoymenh kybernhsh poy mas efere sta 36 dis elleimma, as mhn efeyge kai as mhn fygomaxoyse, eixe dyo xronia akoma. Eixe dyo xronia akoma h paratajh ths Neas Dhmokratias, qa mporoyse na kybernhsei dyo xronia akoma, qewrhtikws. Hqele omws kai fygomaxhse.

Deyteron, nomizete oti qa lyqei to problhma an fygei ayth h Kybernhsh; To problhma ths Elladas qa lyqei, an ayrio fygei ayth h Kybernhsh, an paraithqei ayth h Kybernhsh;

Triton, mas milane gia meiwseis forwn. Ma meiwmenoys foroys eixame to 2009. Eixame anaptyjh; Eixame -2%. Ara, den einai oi meiwmenoi foroi poy dhmioyrgoyn thn anaptyjh. Eixame kalh diaxeirish; Elleimma 15%.

Loipon, egw katalabainw ton pono kai oles tis dyskolies toy polith kai tis symmerizomai. Katalabainw oti qigetai o kaqenas, oti dinei o kaqenas, allos perissotero, allos ligotero, kai prospaqoyme ayto na ginetai me ton pio dikaio tropo.

Ayto poy yphretoyme, mporei na mhn einai to eidiko symferon toy kaqenos, yphretoyme omws to koino symferon olwn. Epiteloys, na yphrethsoyme to koino symferon, oxi to symferon toy tajitzh jexwrista, h toy giatroy jexwrista, h toy epixeirhmatia jexwrista.

Na yphrethsoyme to koino symferon, to kratos, thn eynomia, to swsto ekpaideytiko systhma, to swsto systhma ygeias, th diafaneia. Mia anaptyjiakh poreia, wste na steketai sta podia ths h Ellada, mia prasinh anaptyjh, mia gewrgia poy na steketai sta podia ths. Ayto einai to koino symferon, ayto qa ferei doyleies, ayto qa bohqhsei oloys.

Ara, loipon, as fygoyme apo ton mikrokosmo mas kai ton kleisto xwro twn dikwn mas mikrwn symferontwn, gia na doyme to eyrytero symferon. Kai telika, qa kerdisoyme oloi. Mporei na xasoyme ligo shmera, alla qa kerdisoyme oloi pollapla, opws polles xwres to exoyn kataferei - den einai h prwth fora. Bebaia, exei idiaiteres dyskolies h Ellada, giati exei ayth th stigmh to megalytero xreos poy eixe pote mia xwra anaptygmenh, san thn Ellada. Kai bebaiws, eimaste se mia Eyrwzwnh me kapoia problhmata qesmikhs fyshs, me mia systhmikh krish.

Ara, loipon, den einai oles oi syntages eykoles, den yparxoyn aples syntages. Omws, eimaste se ena swsto dromo kai qa ta kataferoyme.

B. SKOYRHS (``REAL NEWS''): Kyrie Proedre, na sas rwthsw to ejhs me eilikrineia kai me gegonota. Perysi, tetoia epoxh, sth DEQ, mas eipate oti qa breqoyn xrhmata apo th forodiafygh kai oti, to 2013, qa bgoyme apo to mnhmonio. En synexeia, o prwhn Ypoyrgos Oikonomikwn eipe oti, otan yparjoyn nea metra qa paraithqei, kai den yparxei tetoio endexomeno.

To kalokairi, me thn apofash ths 21hs Ioylioy, panhgyrisate kai par? oti polloi Ypoyrgoi htan edw ws fysikh paroysia, einai safes oti yphrxe sobaro problhma sth leitoyrgia ths Kybernhshs. Anagkasthkate thn perasmenh ebdomada sto Ypoyrgiko Symboylio na parete ektakta metra kai shmera epishs nea ektakta metra kai, malista to prwi, prin thn DEQ, se mia ektakth pragmatika katastash, gegonos poy kai esas sas dyskoleyei, sth dhmosia paroysia sas.

Hqela na sas rwthsw synolika - einai safes mallon oti kanate mia prospaqeia anakthshs ths empistosynhs twn daneistwn ayto to diasthma - kai hqela na sas rwthsw, meta kai apo tis xqesines diadhlwseis, oxi ta epeisodia, tis diadhlwseis sth Qessalonikh, ti qa ginei an pate sto allo akro kai xanate thn anakthsh ths empistosynhs twn politwn, to opoio einai proypoqesh, fantazomai to katalabainete apolytws, kai gia tis prowres ekloges kai gia to endexomeno sygkybernhshs kai gia opoiadhpote allh politikh ejelijh, giati ayto einai poy qa krinei kai oxi oi opoies diabebaiwseis, akoma kai toy pio fereggyoy prwqypoyrgoy.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Den katalaba to erwthma. Ws analysh, bebaia, htan endiaferoysa.

B. SKOYRHS (``REAL NEWS''): Gia thn anakthsh ths empistosynhs twn politwn rwtw kai an einai paragontas, giati nomizw oti xanetai, siga alla staqera.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Ean den yphretoysame to koino symferon, to patriwtiko symferon, qa eixe smparaliastei h xwra. To megalo problhma sth xwra mas einai akribws h empistosynh toy polith s? ayth thn Politeia. Shmera einai to problhma ayto; To 2008, eginan poly xeiroteres diadhlwseis kai oxi mono diadhlwseis, sthn Aqhna kai alloy.

Giati; Eixe xasei thn empistosynh o poliths sthn idia thn Politeia. Ayto anaktoyme kai entos kai ektos Elladas, alla einai mia maxh kai einai maxh kai me to xrono. Alla emeis qa thn dwsoyme th maxh, den qa fygomaxhsoyme. Qa th dwsoyme th maxh kai, opws sas eipa, to qema den einai h eklogikh moy qesh, h dikh moy eklogh, einai h maxh gia thn patrida, ayto bazw mprosta.

G. KAMPOYRAKHS (``ELEYQEROS TYPOS''): Kyrie Proedre, ki exqes kai shmera, exete kanei polles anafores sthn eilikrineia me thn opoia prepei na milate kai gia thn katastash ths ellhnikhs oikonomias kai genikotera. Yparxei omws kai h apoch poy leei oti, ayth h eilikrineia orioqeteitai kyriws se o,ti afora tis diapistwseis kai tis aities twn problhmatwn, kai oxi sta apotelesmata.

O Ellhnikos laos blepei edw kai peripoy 20 mhnes mia diafwnia anamesa sthn Troika kai thn Kybernhsh gia thn oikonomikh pragmatikothta kai, synhqws, thn Troika na epibebaiwnetai kai thn Kybernhsh na diaceydetai. Ayto, to teleytaio diasthma, ginetai isws kai me ryqmoys 24wrwn.

To erwthma einai, an h alhqeia k. Proedre einai para poly dyskolh telika. Dhladh, epeidh exoyme ftasei se mia katastash kai kanenas den pisteyei kanenan, den apeileitai mono h oikonomia, apeileitai kai h politikh, apeileitai kai h koinwnikh ypostash toy topoy. Kai lew, mhpws h alhqeia einai para poly dyskolh; Mhpws h alhqeia einai oti den gnwrizete oyte to baqos twn metrwn, oyte to xronodiagramma twn metrwn, alla den th lete, dioti h epiptwsh ayths ths alhqeias qa einai pollaplasia kai to baros poly megalytero;

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Mhn isopedwnoyme ta panta, giati ayto akribws kanoyme. Kai polles fores, sta Mesa Enhmerwshs, yparxei ayth h eykolh, katastrofologikh stash na isopedwnoyme ta panta, ``oti tipota den leitoyrgei, oti oloi einai aneilikrineis'' k.lp.

Ayta poy chfizoyme, ayta poy apofasizoyme kai ayta poy petyxainoyme einai poly sygkekrimena. Kai opws eipa, eimaste konta sto stoxo kai xreiazetai na ftasoyme sto stoxo. Poly apla, poly eilikrina. Kai ayto den einai qema Troikas. To qema einai na mporesoyme na ``kleidwsoyme'' mia symfwnia istorikh gia thn Ellada, gia ton Ellhniko lao, kai na thn ``kleidwsoyme'' kai sta Koinoboylia, se ola ta Koinoboylia poy qa chfisoyn, poy qa lene ``gia na doyme, kanei h Ellada h den kanei ayta poy desmeythke na kanei, petyxainei h den petyxainei;''

Kai ekei yparxoyn kai kaloqelhtes, alla yparxoyn kai polloi kakoproairetoi. Polloi qa hqelan na mhn epwmisqei h xwra toys ena baros, gia na bohqhsei thn Ellada. Ara, loipon, mhn caxnoyme gia exqroys stoys alloys, otan jeroyme oti exoyme kai emeis tis eyqynes mas gia na allajoyme th xwra. Kai ayto kanoyme. .

A. STIBAKTAKH (``AGGELIOFOROS''): Kyrie Proedre, kalhspera. Hqela na sas rwthsw, epeidh to exete pei, to exete epanalabei polles fores, to exete epishmanei kai shmera ki exqes, oti qa kanete o,ti xreiastei gia na eimaste mesa stoys stoxoys, ws xwra. Kai epeidh kai prin apo ligo eipate oti ``ola ginontai gia to patriwtiko symferon'', to erwthma moy einai, an se ayta poy eiste apofasismenos na kanete o,ti xreiastei gia na eimaste mesa stoys stoxoys, yparxoyn kokkines grammes.

Paradeigmatos xarin, qa proxwroysate sto na pwlhqei, tyxaio paradeigma anaferw, ena kommati toy limanioy ths Qessalonikhs h olo to limani p.x. se boylgarika symferonta; Oi Boylgaroi pantote hqelan na exoyn mia diejodo sto Aigaio. H na doqei kapoia diejodos pros to Ionio sthn toyrkikh pleyra;

Qa hqela an exete th dynatothta mia apanthsh s? ayto, an yparxoyn kokkines grammes stis apofaseis poy qa lhfqoyn apo edw kai pera, sto ``o,ti xreiastei''. Eyxaristw.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Mporw na sas apanthsw me mia poly sygkekrimenh prajh, dikh moy, prin apo kapoioys mhnes, otan teqhke - qa to qymaste kai to qymizw, giati kamia fora milame gia to an diapragmateyomaste h den diapragmateyomaste - oti se xwres san thn Ellada, poy mpainoyn se tetoioys mhxanismoys, na toys afaireitai to dikaiwma ths chfoy. Oxi mono gia ta oikonomika qemata, giati ayto problepetai sto Maastrixt, alla gia ola ta qemata, gia ola ta eyrwpaika qemata.

Dhladh, na mhn exoyme chfo. Na mhn exoyme chfo gia ta ejwterika mas qemata, na mhn exoyme chfo gia ta metanasteytika, na mhn exoyme chfo gia ta agrotika, na mhn exoyme chfo gia ta kondylia, gia ton proypologismo. Kai ekei eipa - den qa pw akribws th frash poy xrhsimopoihsa - ``kokkinh grammh''. Den dexomaste ayth thn protash. Kai yphrje poly entonh kai sklhrh antiparaqesh.

Ara, loipon, nai, bebaiws exoyme kokkines grammes kai aytes einai to eqniko symferon ths xwras.

G. MHTRAKHS (``KOSMOS TOY EPENDYTH''): Kyrie Proedre, kalhspera. Xqes kai shmera, milhsate gia laqh poy eginan apo thn pleyra ths Kybernhshs ayta ta dyo xronia.

Qa hqela na rwthsw, an mporeite na mas peite poia einai ta 2-3 shmantikotera apo ayta ta laqh, ti kostos eixan ayta gia thn oikonomia, afoy ayto einai to megalo problhma ths xwras, kai an plhrwse kaneis, an timwrhqhke kaneis, ennow apo to politiko proswpiko, gi? ayta ta laqh.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: To megalytero laqos mas qa htan na mhn eixame parei apofaseis, opws den phre h prohgoymenh kybernhsh. Dhladh, na eixame meinei sthn adraneia, na mhn analambaname tis eyqynes mas kai na mhn pairname poly dyskoles apofaseis.

Otan pairneis apofaseis kai, malista, otan pairneis apofaseis ypo thn piesh toy xronoy, bebaiws qa ginoyn kai laqh. Bebaiws qa dokimaseis mia nea politikh kai qa deis pws qa proxwrhsei.

Opws p.x. to qema twn apodeijewn. Kanenas den hjere oti to qema twn apodeijewn, poy htan ena qetiko kai to xeirokrothse o kosmos, qa ginotan sta xeria kapoiwn kai enas tropos gia na mporoyn na mazeyoyn lefta, gia proionta poy den agorasan oi idioi, me apotelesma ayto na dhmioyrghsei problhmata sta esoda mas.

Ara, loipon, bebaiws ayta qa yparxoyn. To qema den einai an ginontai laqh, dioti den yparxei kanenas, poyqena ston kosmo poy, otan efarmozei mia politikh, den qa dei empodia kai den qa kanei kai laqh. To qema einai an exoyme th dynamh, kai emeis thn exoyme, oxi mono na ta anagnwrizoyme, alla na ta diorqwnoyme kai na bazoyme pali to karabi sth swsth troxia, sto swsto dromo, sth swsth kateyqynsh.

Kai eyqynes qa yparjoyn, kai empodia qa yparjoyn, alla jeroyme poy pame. Gi? ayto, prepei na kanoyme kai diarqrwtikes kinhseis. Oso oloi tis sthrizoyn kai den poyn, ``einai mia Kybernhsh, as ta bgalei ayth pera'', se mia krisimh katastash, oso oloi bohqhsoyn me ton tropo toys, toso pio grhgora kai toso pio apotelesmatika qa ftasoyme sto stoxo mas kai toso pio grhgora qa fygoyme apo ayth thn peridinhsh.

Ara, loipon, ayto einai to mhnyma moy. Bebaiws, mia kybernhsh qa kanei kai ta laqh ths. Ta diorqwnei, omws, otan exei eilikrineia kai otan exei stoxo poly sygkekrimeno - kai emeis, exoyme stoxoys poly sygkekrimenoys.

EIR. SABBOPOYLOY (``STAR''): Kyrie Proedre, qa epimeinw sthn erwthsh prohgoymenoy synadelfoy kai qelw na sas rwthsw an, meta apo oles aytes tis qysies, epeidh mallon den katalaba thn apanthsh sas, an exoyme apofygei th xreokopia. An mporeite na mas to peite me bebaiothta kai me olh ayth thn eilikrineia, poy en pash periptwsei miloyme gi\' aythn tis teleytaies hmeres.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Den jerw pws syndeetai me thn prohgoymenh erwthsh, alla en pash periptwsei, emeis ayto poy apofygame ta teleytaia dyo xronia, einai akribws mia katastrofikh xreokopia. Kai den exoyme apofygei monon ayto, alla exoyme kai mia para poly qetikh, opws eipa, symfwnia, me thn opoia, malista, ayto to terastio xreos, poy einai mia qhlia, einai ena baros terastio, oxi mono gia th shmerinh, alla kai gia tis epomenes genies, exoyme kataferei na to apalynoyme poly shmantika, me diaforoys tropoys.

Enas tropos, malista, einai mia meiwsh toy baroys poy exoyme emeis apenanti ston idiwtiko tomea, stis trapezes poy xrwstame, me to legomeno ``PSI'', me thn idiwtikh symmetoxh. Ayto omws einai mia organwmenh meiwsh, mia organwmenh kai symfwnhmenh meiwsh toy xreoys, twn ypoxrewsewn mas apenanti se aytes tis trapezes, alla kai mia symfwnhmenh meiwsh aytoy toy xreoys kai me toys qesmikoys etairoys, opws einai h Eyrwpaikh Kentrikh Trapeza kai, bebaiws, kai me toys etairoys mas sthn Eyrwpaikh Enwsh, kai me thn epimhkynsh ths apoplhrwmhs, kai me tis epanagores. Ola ayta einai para poly qetika gia th meiwsh toy xreoys.

Giati to kanoyme ayto; Enas logos einai akribws, oxi mono gia na meiwqei to baros, alla gia na mporoyme na dwsoyme to klima stis dieqneis agores oti, to xreos ths Elladas einai pia diaxeirisimo, mporei na to antimetwpisei kai, ara, ajizei na ependysei kaneis sthn Ellada. Oti h Ellada exei mpei pia se ena dromo eynomias, an qelete, ajiopisths poreias, kai oti mporei na ependysei kaneis sthn Ellada.

Gi\' ayto leme oti, akoma kai gia thn anaptyjh, proypoqesh einai na diamorfwsoyme ayto to klima asfaleias. Kai ayto to klima asfaleias exei th bash toy sth symfwnia toy Ioylioy.

A. PIKOYLAS (``AJIA''): Kalhspera k. Proedre. Exete apofasisei na mhn pate se ekloges, wstoso, aytes mporei na sas prokycoyn. Dhladh, den to elegxete to politiko systhma. Kai ejhgoymai.

Exete dromologhsei para polla metra kai sto proteleytaio Ypoyrgiko Symboylio, ta opoia anakoinwse o Antiproedros ths Kybernhshs, o k. Benizelos. Wstoso, den exete rwthsei gia ola ayta thn Koinoboyleytikh sas Omada, h opoia, ontas enas paragontas toy shmerinoy politikoy systhmatos, exei kai ayth isxyres ejarthseis kai pelateiakes sxeseis me thn eklogikh ths pelateia.

Edw k. Proedre antidroyn me to anoigma toy epaggelmatos twn taji kai eseis anoigete kai alla epaggelmata. Kai yparxoyn sobares yponoies oti den qa chfisoyn to prwto nomosxedio gia ta taji, enw kai oi tosoi dhmosioi ypallhloi, poy qa teqoyn se efedreia, einai edw kai xronia eklogikh pelateia twn boyleytwn sas.

Katarxhn, pws skopeyete na jeperasete ayto to skopelo; Kai deyteron, an pisteyete oti to dhmochfisma einai ena meso gia na parakamcete ayto to saqro Koinoboylio, dhladh to politiko systhma, poy mporei oytws h allws, etsi opws einai h katastash, na sas rijei apo thn ejoysia. Eyxaristw.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Saqro den einai to Koinoboylio. Qa diafwnhsw me ayto. Mporei to politiko systhma na exei problhmata, alla mhn jexnate oti oi boyleytes einai amesa eklegmenoi apo ton Ellhniko lao. Oi boyleytes olwn twn kommatwn einai eklegmenoi apo ton Ellhniko lao. Kaqe tessera xronia, kaqe eklogikh periodo, eklegontai apo ton Ellhniko lao. Einai dhmokratika eklegmenoi.

Ekfrazoyn kai exoyn xreos na ekfrasoyn tis agwnies, ta aithmata kai ta problhmata toy Ellhnikoy laoy. Pisteyw oti ayth h Koinoboyleytikh Omada toy PASOK einai mia istorikh Koinoboyleytikh Omada, dioti katafere ayth h Koinoboyleytikh Omada, o kaqe boyleyths ayths ths Koinoboyleytikhs Omadas, na jeperasei kai ton eayto toy. Na jeperasei akribws ayto to opoio eseis eipate, tis stenes, proswrines, proskaires, an qelete chfoqhrikes h pelateiakes pieseis, kai na balei panw apo ayta to koinwniko symferon. Oxi mono to eqniko. To koinwniko symferon, to oikonomiko symferon kai to eqniko symferon ths xwras.

Epiteloys, kapoia Kybernhsh kai kapoia Koinoboyleytikh Omada eprepe na to kanei meta apo polles dekaeties, alla qa elega idiaitera ta teleytaia xronia, poy den antimetwpisame kapoia baqytera problhmata ths xwras mas.

Baqytera problhmata sto xwro ths paideias. Baqytera problhmata sto xwro ths ygeias. Baqytera problhmata sto idio to kratos. Baqytera problhmata sto anaptyjiako protypo, to opoio exoyme. Th mh xrhsh, th mh ajiopoihsh mias terastias perioysias poy exei to Dhmosio, h th lehlathsh polles fores h thn idiopoihsh ayths ths perioysias, akinhths, kinhths, energeiakhs, gewrgikhs, to anoigma twn epaggelmatwn. Bebaiws, ola ayta qigoyn epimeroys omades.

Qelw omws na tonisw jana kati para poly shmantiko. Nai, oloi mas, o kaqenas mas qa qigei apo mia pleyra, alla apo thn allh pleyra kerdizoyme, exoyme ena koino symferon. Epiteloys, an ftiajoyme edw, sth xwra mas, ena kratos swsto, oloi mas qa eimaste kalyteroi. Oloi mas qa eimaste kalyteroi.

Oloi mas, kai pio eytyxeis qa eimaste, kai megalyterh eyhmeria qa exoyme, kai megalyterh ajioprepeia, otan phgainoyme sto nosokomeio h sth dhmosia yphresia, kai ligotero xrono qa katanalwnoyme, kai megalyterh prwtoboylia qa exoyme, kai megalyterh apeleyqerwsh dynamewn, kai elpida sth xwra mas. Mporoyme ayta na ta kanoyme. Kai ayta kanoyme.

Loipon, egw eimai yperhfanos gia thn Koinoboyleytikh Omada toy PASOK, poy sthrije poly dyskoles, para poly dyskoles apofaseis, kai poy sthrizei ayth thn prospaqeia. Pisteyei se ayth thn prospaqeia kai qa synexisei na pisteyei se ayth thn prospaqeia, gia na bgei h Ellada kaqarh apo thn krish kai, bebaiws, gia na anoijei prooptikes - kai anoigontai shmera prooptikes - gia mia pragmatikh anaptyjh, basismenh sta dika mas sygkritika pleonekthmata kai stis dikes mas dynatothtes.

G. XRHSTIDHS (``MAKEDONIA''): Kyrie Proedre, h germanikh pleyra exei qesei, se synarthsh me to legomeno ``Sxedio Marsal'' gia thn anaptyjh ths Elladas, to qema ths dhmioyrgias eidikwn oikonomikwn zwnwn sth xwra. Se prosfath hmerida ths dikhs mas efhmeridas sthn Alejandroypolh, yphrje poly qetikh ypodoxh, toso apo toys topikoys foreis ths Qrakhs, oso kai apo Germanoys ependytes, oi opoioi pareyreqhsan ekei kai ejefrasan qetikes apoceis.

To erwthma moy einai, ean h Kybernhsh sas protiqetai na qesei ayto to qema sthn Eyrwpaikh Enwsh kai an qa to qesete eseis proswpika stoys biomhxanoys, poy apo o,ti katalabainw qa synanthsete sth Germania sta telh toy mhna kai an yparxei kapoia proodos ws pros ayto ton tomea. Eyxaristw.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Swsta to qesate kai gi\' ayto qelw na tonisw oti prepei, pera apo tis sygkyries, na doyme kai oles tis prooptikes poy anoigontai. Kai anoigontai prooptikes. Sas milhsa gia thn ayjhsh twn ejagwgwn, gia to rekor toy toyrismoy, sas milhsa xqes gia th gh poy qa doqei se neoys anqrwpoys, gia na pame se mia poiotikh, biologikh, oikologikh, antagwnistikh kai ejagwgikh gewrgia.

Milhsame sthn Eyrwpaikh Enwsh gia to ``Sxedio Marsal'' kai yparxei terastio endiaferon. O Ypoyrgos Oikonomikwn ths Germanias, o k. Soimple, eipe oti ``emeis qeloyme apo thn Ellada na agorasoyme hlio kai anemo'', dhladh hliakh kai aiolikh energeia.

Hdh, yparxei terastio endiaferon gia ependyseis sthn Ellada, giati opws jerete h Germania exei parei mia apofash, idiaitera meta apo to atyxhma sth Foykosima, na mhn ananewsei ta pyrhnika ths ergostasia kai na mhn epektaqei kai, ara, qa xreiastei poly megalyterh kai ananewsimh energeia.

Yphrxe ena megalo sxedio, mia megalh protash gia to legomeno ``Desertec'', poy qa ginotan sth Saxara, gia hliakh energeia, omws, logw kai ths ``Arabikhs anoijhs'' kai twn ejelijewn ekei, yparxei ena erwthma gia th staqerothta ths perioxhs. Omws, oytws h allws, mia tetoia megalh ependysh qa eprepe na perasei apo tis mesogeiakes xwres. Kai syzhthsame me toys Germanoys kai eipame, giati na mhn jekinhsoyn me thn Ellada, me tis ypodomes kai me ta diktya poy qa xreiastoyn sta nhsia mas, stis pediades mas, me ena ektetameno energeiako diktyo, panw sto opoio qa sthqoyn ta fwtoboltaika kai opoies alles ananewsimes phges energeias, poy mporei na dwsoyn mexri kai 10-15 xiliades MW sthn Germania, me terastia posa gia th xwra mas kai, bebaiws, me esoda kai doyleies gia th xwra mas;

Endiaferontai para poly, giati einai kai gi\' aytoys wfelimo. Emeis exoyme miamish fora perissoterh hliofaneia apo o,ti exei h Germania kai aytoi epidotoyn ta fwtoboltaika, ara, gi\' aytoys einai ki ena shmantiko kerdos.

Ayto deixnei aplws tis dynatothtes poy exei h xwra mas. Opws bebaiws kai sth Qrakh, sth Boreia Ellada, me to qema ths gewqermias. Ti eixame kanei tosa xronia; Twra exoyme paei se 3-4 prokhryjeis, gia na prowqhsoyme th gewqermia. Eixame aytes tis dynatothtes.

Opws milhsame kai xqes kai gia to petrelaio kai gia to fysiko aerio. Ara, h xwra mas exei dynatothtes, to tonizw ayto. Den eixe swsth diaxeirish, den eixe thn politikh boylhsh, den eixe to anaptyjiako sxedio, to opoio shmera emeis exoyme. Nai, pername apo stenwpo. Alla parallhla, bazoyme tis baseis kai proselkyoyme kai toys ependytes, gia mia diaforetikh anaptyjh.

Xreiazomaste omws th staqerh bash, panw sthn opoia qa erqei kai qa basistei o ependyths. Staqerh bash einai prwta ap\' ola na diasfalisoyme ayto to opoio eipame, tis apofaseis ths 21hs Ioylioy, th symfwnia toy Ioylioy, kai bebaiws na kanoyme polles qesmikes allages: meiwsh toy Dhmosioy, ths grafeiokratias, diafaneia, na xtyphsoyme th diafqora. Egw jerw polloys ependytes kai to exw pei ki alles fores, kai Ellhnes ths Diasporas, poy lene, ``na erqw sthn Ellada, nai, alla den qa mplejw me th grafeiokratia kai den qa mplejw me th diafqora''.

Ara, enas kalos ependyths qelei na exei ena swsto kratos. Kai malista, me thn eykairia, na pw oti qa anakoinwsoyme tis epomenes hmeres ena Symboylio gia ependyseis ths Diasporas, me shmainonta proswpa, me proswpikothtes apo olh th Diaspora, oi opoioi einai shmantikoi kai ston epixeirhmatiko kosmo, poy qa symballoyn kai aytoi se olh thn prospaqeia mas, kai sto qema twn ependysewn, kai sto qema twn apokratikopoihsewn.

Eimaste poly qetikoi gi\' aytes tis prwtoboylies kai, opws poly swsta eipate, egw qa eimai sto telos toy mhna me thn kyria Merkel sth Germania, opoy ginetai ena megalo Synedrio twn biomhxanwn. Eimai proskeklhmenos apo toys biomhxanoys, gia na syzhthsoyme akribws oles tis prooptikes sobarwn ependysewn se ayth th nea anaptyjiakh poreia ths xwras mas.

P. QEODWROPOYLOS (``RIZOSPASTHS''): Kyrie Prwqypoyrge, mas eipate oti ta metra poy exete parei kai ayta poy anakoinwsate prosfata, einai timhma ``patriwtikoy agwna''. Se ayton stelnete toys ergazomenoys, se epixeirhsiakes symbaseis twn 500 eyrw, kai apo toys dhmosioys ypallhloys apaiteite na doylecoyn me miso misqo. Kobete apo tis syntajeis twn 400 kai 500 eyrw, odhgeite 500 ergazomenoys thn hmera se anergia kai etoimazeste na apolysete kai dhmosioys ypallhloys h na toys balete sthn efedreia.

Shmera, anakoinwsate nea eispraktika metra, otan sta mikromazaga mpainei to ena loyketo meta to allo kai ta laika noikokyria stenazoyn katw apo thn piesh twn metrwn. Apo ayto ton patriwtiko polemo k. Proedre, apexoyn sto epipedo toy aimatos poy dinoyn ta laika strwmata, oi megales epixeirhseis, oi Trapezes, oi biomhxanoi kai oi efoplistes.

Kai sas rwtw: posh barbarothta qa ypostoyn akomh oi ergazomenoi, prokeimenoy na mhn plhrwsoyn thn krish oi megaloi epixeirhmatikoi kai trapezikoi Omiloi poy th dhmioyrghsan, sysswreyontas ola ta prohgoymena xronia terastia kerdh;

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Ayth th barbarothta paleyoyme. i\' ayto eimaste Sosialistes, gi\' ayto paleyoyme gia ena kratos Dikaioy, diafaneias, gia ena dikaio forologiko systhma. Alla o kosmos den einai oyte aggelika, oyte sosialistika plasmenos. Hdh, zoyme se ena dyskolo kapitalistiko systhma, omws, kai mesa s? ayto to systhma, yparxoyn periqwria sta opoia mporoyme na kinhqoyme kai na dwsoyme kai agwnes, oxi mono sthn Ellada, alla kai dieqnws.

Omws, ayth th stigmh, h Ellada kaleitai na mporesei na staqeropoihqei, gia na mporesei na balei tajh. Giati akribws aytes oi adikies, aytes oi anisothtes, ayth h adiafaneia, einai ayta ta opoia dhmioyrghsan ayto to elleimma kai ayto to xreos, poy shmera plhrwnei o Ellhnikos laos.

Dhladh, kaloymaste na ftiajoyme pragmatika ena kratos Dikaioy, mia Dikaiosynh poy qa leitoyrgei, ena systhma pronoias poy qa einai swsto. Akribws ayto to systhma einai poy, ean yphrxe, den qa eixame fqasei edw opoy eimaste shmera.

Ayto omws einai qewrhtiko, giati exoyme fqasei shmera s? ayth th maxh. Exoyme fqasei shmera s? ayta ta problhmata. Ara, loipon, prepei ayta na ta lysoyme. Me qysies; Nai. Ayta qa ta lysoyme. Alla parallhla, na kanoyme kai tis allages. Tis allages tis megales - kai aytes kanoyme - oi opoies fernoyn ena kratos Dikaioy.

Den einai dikaio, otan emeis forologoyme pia megalo-ofeiletes, otan dhmosiopoioyme toys katalogoys twn megalo-ofeiletwn, otan kanoyme katasxesh gia prwth fora 500 skafwn, otan stamatoyme symbaseis giatrwn h megalogiatrwn h kai mikrwn giatrwn - den exei shmasia - dioti den syntagografoyn swsta kai paranomoyn; Ayta den einai pros ofelos toy ergazomenoy; Ayta den einai pros ofelos toy syntajioyxoy; Ayta den einai pros ofelos toy asfalismenoy;

Kai telika, kai h epixeirhsiakh symbash; Ma to problhma shmera den einai h epixeirhsiakh symbash, einai h elleich symbashs.. Einai h elleich opoiasdhpote syllogikhs ekfrashs toy anergoy, toy ergazomenoy se mia mikrh epixeirhsh. O syndikalismos, ayta ta jerei, alla ayta prepei na dei. Na organwsoyme pragmati ton ergazomeno. As yparjei estw ayth h epixeirhsiakh symbash.

Egw qa hqela, omws, kai gia to qema ths efedreias, kai gia to qema twn epixeirhsiakwn symbasewn, alla kai gia to programma gia thn anergia, na parei to logo kai o Giwrgos Koytroymanhs kai na mas pei dyo logia kai o Dhmhtrhs Reppas.

G. KOYTROYMANHS: Eidikotera s? o,ti afora to programma gia thn anergia, meta apo thn kateyqynsh poy edwse o Prwqypoyrgos edw kai 2-3 mhnes, ola ta Ypoyrgeia syntonizomaste sto na ajiopoihsoyme toys poroys kai apo to ESPA kai apo kaqe allo eqniko poro, etsi wste aytos o xronos na einai enas xronos, poy qa mas dwsei th dynatothta na apasxolhsoyme peripoy 200.000 ergazomenoys, bebaiws akoma kai gia 5mhno kai gia 3mhno, alla kai ayto einai shmantiko stis synqhkes poy biwnoyme.

Epishs, to programma ayto problepei th diathrhsh qesewn ergasias kai thn katartish, me ena entelws diaforetiko tropo ap? ayton poy ginotan mexri shmera.

Ara, exoyme peripoy 3,5 dis eyrw, ta opoia mporoyme na ajiopoihsoyme apo twra kai mexri to telos toy 2012, etsi wste oi wfeloymenoi anergoi, oi wfeloymenoi synolika na einai mexri kai 900.000.

Bebaiws, oi misoi ap? aytoys qa einai wfeloymenoi me to programma diathrhshs qesewn ergasias. Se o,ti afora th xrhmatodothsh, einai ejasfalismenoi oi poroi kai, mesa apo thn anaqewrhsh toy ESPA, mporoyn na ejaireqoyn kai alloi poroi, gia na fqasoyme peripoy sta 3,9 h 4 dis eyrw, gia na wfelhqoyn oso to dynaton perissoteroi.

Se sxesh me tis symbaseis. Prepei na doyme, nomizw, katamata thn pragmatikothta kai ayto kanoyme, blepoyme ti symbainei shmera sthn agora ergasias. Ti symbainei synolika me toys ergazomenoys kai tis epixeirhseis.

Ayto poy symbainei, sthn pragmatikothta, einai poly xeirotero se sxesh me to nomoqetiko plaisio to opoio exei h xwra kai poy polloi pisteyoyn oti mporei na prostateysei toys ergazomenoys, eite apo ton kindyno ths apolyshs, eite apo ton kindyno ths meiwshs twn apodoxwn.

Sthn pragmatikothta, dystyxws, ayto poy symbainei einai na yparxoyn ergazomenoi, oi opoioi den plhrwnontai oyte kan tis apodoxes toys. Kanoyn atomikes symbaseis, giati ypoxrewnontai apo tis epixeirhseis kai, ara, h blepoyme ayth thn pragmatikothta, kai emeis thn blepoyme, epomenws xreiazetai mia epanaryqmish sthn agora ergasias, h agnooyme thn pragmatikothta kai nomizoyme oti mporoyme na prostateysoyme, me thn chfish kapoiwn nomwn, thn agora ergasias.

Emeis qeloyme na doyme katamata thn pragmatikothta. Qa dieykolynoyme tis Eidikes Epixeirhsiakes Symbaseis, etsi wste anti ths atomikhs symbashs, na ginetai symbash, dhladh oysiastika na mhn menei monos toy o kaqe ergazomenos me thn epixeirhsh, alla na yparxei organwmenh syzhthsh - diaboyleysh kai na katalhgoyme se mia eidikh epixeirhsiakh symbash, h bebaiws sthn kladikh symbash, sthn Eqnikh Genikh Syllogikh Symbash - den allazei to kaqestws me tis symbaseis.

Ekeino poy allazei einai oti dieyrynoyme th dynatothta, beltiwnoyme thn katastash, etsi wste na yparxei kai h eidikh epixeirhsiakh symbash kai se mikres epixeirhseis.

D. REPPAS: Kyries kai kyrioi, h ajia ths apofashs toy perasmenoy Ioylioy epibebaiwnetai kaqhmerina, oso emeis diekdikoyme thn efarmogh ths. Kai diekdikoyme thn efarmogh ths, an epideijoyme thn apaitoymenh synepeia.

Sto kratos, pragmati, exoyme kanei terastia poiotika almata, sthn kateyqynsh ths antikeimenikhs leitoyrgias twn Yphresiwn kai ths diafaneias. Prepei omws na poyme oti to ellhniko kratos, ws Dioikhsh, den exei thn poiothta poy apaitoyn oi peristaseis. Den einai to paragwgiko kratos. Paramenei se megalo baqmo asqenhs. Kai prepei na ginei to megalo mas pleonekthma. Einai ena anaptyjiako ergaleio.

Sthn kateyqynsh ayth, sto plaisio ths prwtoboylias poy exoyme analabei me to Ypoyrgeio Oikonomikwn, o neos nomos gia to misqologio - baqmologio problepei kinhtikothta twn ypallhlwn me anoixtes diadikasies, prokeimenoy to ellhniko kratos, opws qa ekane kai kapoios idiwths sth dikh toy epixeirhsh, na mporei me megalh eykolia na ajiopoiei toys kalyteroys poy exei sthn diaqesh toy gia tis katallhles qeseis.

Epishs, problepei thn ejelijh, dhladh thn proagwgh th baqmologikh twn ypallhlwn, oxi me kapoio aytomato tropo, opws ginotan mexri twra, alla me diadikasies oysiastikhs ajiologhshs, opws symbainei se alles xwres, prokeimenoy pragmati stis qeseis eyqynhs, me anoixtes - epanalambanw - diadikasies, oi kalyteroi kratikoi leitoyrgoi na einai aytoi poy qa exoyn thn armodiothta.

Bebaiws, proxwrame se ena programma anadiarqrwshs toy kratoys, poy problepei periorismo twn kratikwn domwn se pososto ews 30%, aplopoihsh twn diadikasiwn gia meiwsh toy grafeiokratikoy baroys, to opoio antapokrinetai se peripoy 7% toy ethsioy AEP, meiwsh toy baroys aytoy se pososto ews 25% kai, bebaiws, qa anefera ena paradeigma, to opoio gnwrizoyme oloi, to legomeno ``mesoproqesmo programma''.

Isws gia prwth fora sto ellhniko kratos exoyme to syndyasmo ths Dioikhshs, toy manatzment opws leme, me sygkekrimenoys oikonomikoys stoxoys, se ena sygkekrimeno xrono.

Qeloyme to kratos na leitoyrgei pleon me ena programmatismo toylaxiston trietias, poy qetei sygkekrimenoys stoxoys, entopizei poia einai ta prosdokwmena ofelh, poia einai ta dhmosionomika ofelh poy qa exei kai, bebaiws, ti stoxoys epitygxanei mesa se sygkekrimeno xrono, wste me bash ayto, toso o sygkekrimenos ypallhlos ws atomo, alla kai h organwtikh Yphresia sthn opoia anhkei, na ajiologoyntai me bash thn epiteyjh aytwn twn stoxwn.

Epeidh akribws pame s? aytes tis allages, antilambaneste oti prepei na ginei mia ajiologhsh toy synoloy toy anqrwpinoy dynamikoy sto dhmosio tomea kai ton eyrytero dhmosio tomea kai, s? ayth thn politikh, entassetai to programma ths ergasiakhs efedreias.

Opoioi kriqoyn oti anhkoyn sto legomeno ``pleonazon proswpiko'', entassontai se ayto to pedio sxesewn me to ellhniko kratos, ths ergasiakhs efedreias. Kai exoyn gia 12 mhnes th dynatothta na paramenoyn sto kaqestws ayto, to poly 12 mhnes, lambanontas apodoxes ycoys 60% twn apodoxwn toys, enw taytoxrona, me th dynatothta poy exoyn logw twn prosontwn toys, qa diekdikoyn mia qesh taktikoy proswpikoy se pososto ews 10%, mia qesh mesw symbasewn orismenoy xronoy se pososto ews 30% kai, kata proteraiothta, mia qesh se programmata merikhs apasxolhshs.

Taytoxrona, qa exoyn th dynatothta bebaiws na entassontai, an prokycei mia tetoia epilogh, se programmata syntajiodotika. H diadikasia ayth qa ginei me thn epiblech ths hgesias toy ASEP, me diadikasies anoixtes kai antikeimenikes. Kai o telikos stoxos einai, to Ellhniko Dhmosio, poy apo polloys shmera emfanizetai ws ena problhma, to opoio apotelei kai baridi, qa elege kaneis, sthn prospaqeia poy kanei h xwra gia anasygkrothsh, na anadiarqrwqei wste na apotelesei ena isxyro oplo, ton kalytero symmaxo, qa elega, toy Ellhna epixeirhmatia, toy Ellhna polith, o opoios qelei kai aytos, sthn prospaqeia thn kaqhmerinh poy kanei, na dei oti kai to Dhmosio, h Dioikhsh, alla kai o dhmosios ypallhlos einai sto pleyro toy, wste apo koinoy na dwsoyn ayto ton agwna. Eyxaristw k. Proedre.

SP. MOYRELATOS (``AQHNA 9,84''): Kyrie Proedre, kalhspera sas. Politikes dynameis, alla kai dika sas stelexh, yperqematizoyn se kat? idian syzhthseis h kai dhmosiws, oti h oikonomikh kaxejia poy xarakthrizei ayth thn periodo th xwra, epenergei kai sth diapragmateytikh ths qesh, adynatizei me liga logia tis qeseis ths xwras kai sta eqnika mas qemata.

Kai to rwtw ayto, giati qelw thn epishmh antidrash ths Aqhnas se ayto poy fainetai na eiserxomaste, se mia fash neas toyrkikhs epiqetikothtas. Prosfatws, h Agkyra apeilhse emmesws plhn safws oti qa blepoyme syxnotera tis fregates ths sthn Anatolikh Mesogeio, efoson Kypros kai Israhl energopoihsoyn th symfwnia gia ypoqalassies ereynes notiws ths Kyproy.

Qelw na gnwrizw thn antidrash ths Aqhnas panw se aytes tis dhlwseis ths Agkyras. Eyxaristw.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Eyxaristw gia thn erwthsh. Prwta ap? ola, opws eipa kai prin, exoyme kanei enan safh diaxwrismo metajy twn oikonomikwn mas dyskoliwn kai twn opoiwn problhmatwn h megalwn qematwn eqnikhs shmasias kai ejwterikhs politikhs. Kai ayto, to exoyme kai kataferei, kai diamhnysei pantoy.

Opwsdhpote, bebaiws, h epirroh ths xwras mas einai ena allo qema. H epirroh, me thn ennoia ths oikonomikhs synergasias k.lp., opws eixame kai sta Balkania, den einai h idia poy htan palaiotera, otan eixame mia pio eyrwsth oikonomia, otan eixame anaptyjh 5,5% kai otan den yphrxe kai h piesh sto trapeziko systhma, logw kai toy dhmosioy xreoys poy exoyn oi ellhnikes Trapezes.

Aytos akribws einai enas akoma logos, gia ton opoio prepei na bgoyme syntoma apo ayth thn krish, gia na epanelqei h isxys ths xwras mas kai s? ayto ton tomea.

Omws, den epitrepoyme na parejhgeitai apo kanenan ayth h adynamia, oti shmainei pws eimaste kai alloy adynamoi, h oti qa kanoyme alloy opoiesdhpote ekptwseis. Gi? ayto, tonizw kai exoyme pei oti, einai kyriarxiko dikaiwma ths Kypriakhs Dhmokratias, kyriarxiko ths dikaiwma, opws bebaiws kai toy Israhl kai kaqe allhs xwras, na kanei tis ereynes h na kanei tis symfwnies, eite einai gia AOZ, eite einai gia toys agwgoys, kai na mporei na ekmetalleyetai toys fysikoys poroys poy exei.

Ayth einai mia qesh, oxi mono ellhnikh, einai qesh kai eyrwpaikh, exoyn kanei dhlwseis kai oi Hnwmenes Politeies, kai pisteyw oti ayth einai mia jekaqarh qesh kai apenanti sthn Toyrkia. To lew ayto, epeidh emeis exoyme kaqe logo na anaptyjoyme kai na beltiwsoyme tis sxeseis mas me th geitona xwra - to kanoyme ejalloy, to exoyme apodeijei, exoyme kanei shmantikes proodoys se diaforoys tomeis - alla tonizoyme oti h bash panw sthn opoia h opoia sxesh qa oikodomhqei shmera kai ayrio kai sto mellon, einai h bash toy sebasmoy toy Dieqnoys Dikaioy.

G. MELIGGWNHS (``AYGH''): Kyrie Proedre, para polles fores exete milhsei gia ton ``patriwtiko agwna'', exete qesei ws stoxo th swthria ths patridas, ths Elladas. Twra briskomaste omws pali sto xeilos ths xreokopias, se epipedo anergias, se epipedo tashs gia metanasteysh, se epipedo anexeias. Mas exete gyrisei sth dekaetia toy ?50, mesa se 18 molis mhnes.

Kai me bash ayto, apo th stigmh poy synexizete na ayjanete th dosh enos qanathforoy farmakoy kai oxi na allazete th syntagh, qa hqela na sas rwthsw, gia logariasmoy poioy swzete th xwra; Exete dhladh yp\' ocin sas oti, ektos apo to na swsete thn Ellada, prepei na swsete kai toys Ellhnes;

Kai sas rwtaw, dioti otan xqes sas fanhke arketo na exei kaqe oikogeneia apo enan ergazomeno, einai profanes nomizw oti h swthria sthn opoia anafereste eseis, den einai swthria poy afora sthn koinwnia. Ena paradeigma: milhse o k. Benizelos to meshmeri gia to oti qa kalesete ton efoplistiko kosmo na metasxei sthn prospaqeia yperbashs ths krishs.

To perifhmo naytiliako petrelaio, to skandalwdws aforologhto naytiliako petrelaio, qa skefteite pote na to katarghsete, prin skefteite, gia paradeigma, na ejiswsete toys foroys sta petrelaia qermanshs kai kinhshs; Eyxaristw.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Exw pei polles fores oti, ean den eixame kanei tis kinhseis poy kaname kai an den eixame ejasfalisei th daneiodothsh, qa eixame kleisei olo to Eqniko Systhma Ygeias. Lew ena paradeigma. Qa eixame stis syntajeis meiwsh 70%. Qa eixame polloys dhmosioys ypallhloys sto dromo. Piqanws, qa eixan katarreysei oi Trapezes mas kai mazi kai ta apoqemata, oi kopoi para pollwn noikokyriwn.

Ayta qa eixame. Kai mhn to amfisbhteite. Giati polloi milane kai lene, ``ti egine sth Latinikh Amerikh''. Bebaiws, deite otan xreokophsan xwres, ti egine sth Latinikh Amerikh. Deite ti egine s? aytes tis xwres. Epeidh polloi lene, ``mas ferate to Dieqnes Nomismatiko Tameio'' k.lp. Deite omws ti egine otan xreokophsan aytes oi xwres. Loipon, apo ayto swsame th xwra mas. Me ena kostos.

Emeis, omws, ferame thn Ellada sth dekaetia toy ?50; Emeis eimaste ekeinoi poy dhmioyrghsame ena elleimma 36 dis eyrw to 2009; Diplasiasthke sxedon to xreos ths xwras mas se 5,5 xronia. Emeis to kaname; Ayth h Kybernhsh;

Gi' ayth thn ``kayth patata'' poy mas petajan oi prohgoymenoi, den exoyn kamia eyqynh; Kai emeis, poy meiwnoyme to elleimma, emeis poy exoyme to megalytero paketo poy yphrje pote ston planhth mas, gia na xrhmatodothsoyme ta problhmata toy parelqontos, gia na mhn katastrafoyme, gia na mhn xreokophsoyme, den exoyme kanei kati gia th xwra;

Egw mporw na katalabw to problhma toy kaqenos. Kai mporw na katalabw kai thn aganakthsh kai ton pono. Giati ftasame mexri edw; To rwtaw ki egw kaqe mera. Giati eftase h Ellada mexri edw; Alla na teleiwnoyme me thn parelqontologia. Jeroyme poios eftaije, ta exoyme analysei.

Emeis allazoyme th xwra kai pame mprosta. Kai den einai mono patriwtikos o agwnas, den einai genika enas agwnas gia thn patrida. Einai eidika kai gia ton ergazomeno, einai eidika kai gia th mikrh epixeirhsh, einai eidika kai gia ton syntajioyxo, einai eidika kai gia th neolaia. Pername apo mia stenwpo, alla ean den mpoyme se mia anaptyjh poy basizetai stis dikes mas dynameis kai oxi se daneika, h katastash den qa allajei.

Me daneika, bebaiws. Den se endiaferei an mporeis na breis ta daneika, alla synexws na briskeis daneika. O,ti kai na parageis, opoia doyleia kai na exeis, mporeis an exeis daneika na zhseis. Poios qa soy dwsei daneika, omws, an synexiseis etsi;

Ayto einai to problhma, oti den ftiajame swsth oikonomia, oti ta lefta poy yphrxan, poy phgan; Poy phgan; Den phgan se anaptyjh, den phgan se swstes ypodomes. Phgan se terasties spatales. Kai exoyme kai polles dynatothtes akoma.

Makari ayta na eixan ginei, giati den qa xreiazotan na zhthsoyme apo ton Ellhna polith toses qysies. Makari, akoma perissotero, na mporesoyme na spasoyme to kyklwma sth syntagografhsh. Qa to kanoyme. Makari na spasoyme to kyklwma stis promhqeies. Qa to kanoyme.

Mia promhqeia, poy perimename na kostisei sto Ypoyrgeio Ygeias 1.200.000 eyrw, me thn hlektronikh promhqeia, poy prwth fora kaname sth xwra mas, enw qa mporoysame na to eixame kanei prin apo 10 xronia - h Toyrkia to exei kanei edw kai xronia - katebhke to kostos stis 200.000 eyrw, dhladh sto 1/6 toy kostoys.

Ayta einai poy plhrwnei akoma shmera o Ellhnas poliths kai, pragmati, katanow oti adikeitai. Ayta den qa allajoyn me Ypoyrgikes Apofaseis kai mono, h me 20 Ypoyrgoys. Qa allajoyn, an oloi mas bohqhsoyme. Kai den ennow me to oikonomiko. Ennow sth symperifora, stis praktikes, stis antilhceis, me to na xtyphsoyme th forodiafygh.

Kai kanoyme kinhseis gia na xtyphsoyme th forodiafygh. Kai ayto to opoio polloi lene, ``ma plhrwnoyn monon oi ftwxoi'', den isxyei. Oxi, shmera plhrwnoyn kai oi exontes kai qa plhrwnoyn olo kai perissotero, ews otoy einai dikaio to systhma. Dikaiws qa plhrwnoyn, omws, me aisqhsh dikaioy, me dikaih katanomh.

A. MOSXOBAS (``KERDOS''): Kyrie Proedre, kalhspera. Kala einai ayta poy eidame tis prohgoymenes hmeres, apo ton Antiproedro, apo to Ypoyrgeio Oikonomikwn, gia tis listes twn megalo-ofeiletwn. Qa hqela na moy peite, mhpws einai kairos na doyme kai tis listes twn lhjiproqesmwn ofeilwn toy Dhmosioy pros toys idiwtes; Einai 6,5 dis. Me ayta, endexomenws, na anazwpyrwnotan h ellhnikh oikonomia, na epairne xrhmata, na kylhsei ligo reysto sthn agora.

Kai qa hqela, sas parakalw poly, kai mia dieykrinish, dioti den antilhfqhka na apanthsate safws. Einai kati to opoio nomizw kaiei toys anqrwpoys poy mas akoyne. Yparxei periptwsh na mhn plhrwqoyn misqoi kai syntajeis ton Oktwbrio; Mia jekaqarh apanthsh.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Dinoyme th maxh synexws, akribws gia na mporoyme na plhrwnoyme adialeiptws tis syntajeis kai toys misqoys twn Ellhnwn, poy plhrwnontai apo to kratos. Kai ayto qa synexistei, aytos einai o agwnas poy dinoyme. Kai ayto eggyomaste, ayth h Kybernhsh ayto eggyatai.

Omws, gia to allo qema, qa zhtoysa apo ton Ypoyrgo Oikonomikwn na pei dyo logia.

EY. BENIZELOS: Pragmati, to Dhmosio xrwstaei lefta se epixeirhseis, se epixeirhseis malista poy exoyn ekdwsei timologia. Kai oi synepeis epixeirhseis exoyn plhrwsei kai to Foro Prostiqemenhs Ajias.

To programma, opws exei apofasistei stis 21 Ioylioy, molis efarmostei plhrws, qa mas epitrecei na ejoflhsoyme kai aytes tis lhjiproqesmes kai sysswreymenes ofeiles toy Dhmosioy, kai na pesei xrhma sthn agora.

Aytos einai enas apo toys amesoys stoxoys mas kai gi? ayto eipa oti exoyn toso megalh krisimothta oi epomenoi dyo mhnes. Kai edw, entassetai kai to prwto skelos ths erwthshs sas, sto opoio apanthse nomizw para poly kaqara o Prwqypoyrgos. Prospaqeia mas einai akribws na kataballontai oi misqoi kai oi syntajeis. Na mporoyn na leitoyrgoyn ta sxoleia kai ta nosokomeia.

Ayto shmainei na exoyme tameiaka diaqesima. Ayto shmainei na kalyptontai oi daneiakes anagkes ths xwras. Gi? ayto eimaste mesa sto programma. Kai bebaiws, qeloyme na pairnoyme ta xrhmata poy problepei to programma me to xamhlotero dynato epitokio, dhladh me to mikrotero dynato kostos, giati to neo programma, to programma ths 21hs Ioylioy, exei ki ayto to poly shmantiko pleonekthma, se synexeia twn apofasewn toy Martioy, oti einai poly fqhnotero to xrhma gia mas kai, ara, makroproqesma gia ton Ellhniko lao, poy qa klhqei na apoplhrwsei kai na ejyphrethsei ayta ta daneia poy mas dinoyn oi etairoi mas.

Gi? ayto, loipon, prepei na kanoyme ta panta. Prepei na kanoyme ta panta, gia na bgoyme apo ayth th dyskolh katastash. Prepei na kanoyme ta panta, gia na exoyme prwtogenh pleonasmata. Den prepei na dwsoyme se kanenan to epixeirhma oti, dhqen emeis ftaime, giati yparxoyn kaqysterhseis h amfiqymies se sxesh me thn ektelesh kai thn efarmogh twn apofasewn ths 21hs Ioylioy.

F. GRHGORIADHS (``APE-MPE''): Kyrie Proedre, milhsate prohgoymenws gia ajiopoihsh ths Ellhnikhs Diasporas, se o,ti afora tis ependyseis. Nwritera, o k. Antiproedros ths Kybernhshs milhse gia prosklhsh se systrateysh kai toy efoplistikoy kefalaioy.

Skopeyete na plaisiwsete ayto to prosklhthrio kai me sygkekrimena metra kai poia einai ayta, poy qa proselkysoyn ton efoplistiko kosmo kai thn omogeneiakh epixeirhmatikothta;

Akomh xqes k. Proedre, kalesate toys neoys na mhn metanasteysoyn, na meinoyn edw, na palecoyn. Epeidh h neanikh anergia, kai ayto deixnoyn ta stoixeia, kai ta epishma, alla kai twn syndikatwn, einai ychloterh se sxesh me thn ypoloiph anergia, yparxei kapoio sxedio gia thn tonwsh ths neanikhs epixeirhmatikothtas;

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Gia toys neoys, bebaiws kai qa yparjoyn. Kai prwta ap? ola, ola osa kaname gia na diamorfwsoyme ena epixeirhmatiko periballon filiko, aplo kai me diafaneia, ola osa kanoyme gia na mporoyme na ajiopoihsoyme thn akinhth perioysia ths xwras mas, ola ayta einai entagmena sthn proselkysh ependysewn, wste na mporesoyn kai to efoplistiko kefalaio, alla kai o Ellhnismos ths Diasporas, na ependysoyn sth xwra mas.

Ayto einai ena plaisio shmantiko, alla bebaiws, apo ekei kai pera, qa syzhthsoyme kai me aytoys toys anqrwpoys kai idiaitera me to efoplistiko kefalaio, an mporoyn na symbaloyn kai pio oysiastika, opws eipe kai o Antiproedros.

Sthn erwthsh sas gia to qema ths neanikhs epixeirhmatikothtas, na epanalabw oti yparxei ena terastio programma, prwtofanes gia th xwra mas, gia thn antimetwpish ths anergias, dhladh gia thn katartish kai thn askhsh. Ayto einai kati to opoio hdh proxwra, alla qa organwnetai olo kai kalytera.

Milame gia peripoy 3,5 dis, poy qa pane pros ayth thn kateyqynsh, alla apo thn allh meria, yparxei kai to Ypoyrgeio Anaptyjhs, to opoio exei shmantika programmata gia th neanikh epixeirhmatikothta, opws yparxoyn programmata bebaiws kai apo to Ypoyrgeio Ergasias kai apo to Ypoyrgeio Gewrgias. Kai nomizw oti o Mixalhs Xrysoxoidhs qa mporoyse na pei dyo logia gi\' ayta, giati einai shmantiko.

Eixame prin apo ena xrono peripoy, isws kai ligotero, mia para poly kalh synanthsh me neoys epixeirhmaties, kainotomoys neoys epixeirhmaties, oi opoioi exoyn anadeijei to ti mporoyme na kanoyme edw, sthn Ellada, to ti mporoyme na ftiajoyme s\' ayth th xwra, to poses dynatothtes exoyme, ean ayto to ajiopoihsoyme, dhladh to na parei o neos prwtoboylia, na sthrijoyme tis prwtoboylies aytes kai na ajiopoihsei o neos tis terasties dynatothtes poy exei h xwra mas, me eyresitexnia, me kainotomia, me fantasia kai, bebaiws, me antagwnistiko kai ejagwgiko proion.

M. XRYSOXOIDHS: Kyries kai kyrioi, yparxei mia ereyna ths Eyrwpaikhs Epitrophs, h opoia deixnei kapoia poly dysaresta stoixeia, se o,ti afora thn prostiqemenh ajia ths ellhnikhs naytilias sto AEP ths xwras.

Enw o mesos oros ayths ths prostiqemenhs ajias ths naytilias sthn Eyrwph einai peripoy 6,5%, se emas, poy exoyme kai to megalytero stolo ths yfhlioy, h prostiqemenh ajia einai molis 3% peripoy. Ayto shmainei oti den yfistatai ena plaisio kinhtrwn gia thn proselkysh naytiliakwn ependysewn h paranaytiliakwn ependysewn, prokeimenoy na ginei elkystikh h xwra gia ta kefalaia twn efoplistwn, ta kefalaia ths ploiokthsias, ta opoia kinoyntai se olo ton planhth.

Gi\' ayto, loipon, etoimazoyme ena sxedio nomoy, ena plaisio, prokeimenoy na ginei h xwra elkystikh to epomeno xroniko diasthma kai na erqei mesa sth xwra ena meros toylaxiston apo ayta ta megala esoda, poy h naytilia kerdizei sto plaisio ths dieqnoys drasthriothtas.

Eimaste mia xwra poy exei ellhnokthto stolo para poly megalo, alla kai stolo me ellhnikh shmaia, ejairetika ogkwdh. Ara, loipon, exoyme jekinhsei mia prospaqeia, ena dialogo me toys ploiokthtes, me thn Enwsh Ellhnwn Efoplistwn, prokeimenoy na proselkysoyme ayta ta kefalaia.

Se o,ti afora th neanikh epixeirhmatikothta, giati akoysa mia erwthsh prohgoymenws gia thn anergia, alhqeia, pisteyei kaneis oti to montelo anaptyjhs poy eixe h xwra mporoyse na apasxolhsei toys ekatontades xiliades, kala morfwmenoys neoys poy exei h xwra ta teleytaia xronia;

Ena montelo rhxhs anaptyjhs, basismeno kyriws ston tomea twn yphresiwn, xwris ejeidikeysh, xwris emfash stis texnologies, xwris emfash kyriws sthn paragwgh kai th biomhxania, thn opoia xasame logw twn epidothsewn ta teleytaia xronia. Mporoyse ayto to montelo na apasxolhsei oloys aytoys toys ekatontades xiliades, sxedon ena ekatommyrio, kala morfwmenoys neoys; Kai etsi, ftasame sto shmeio na exoyme 40%-45% anergia stoys neoys, poy den einai proion ths paroyshs krisews, alla einai proion akribws toy antiparagwgikoy, eswstrefoys kai mh antagwnistikoy monteloy, to opoio kallierghqhke, idryqhke kai leitoyrghse sth xwra tis teleytaies dekaeties.

Gia to logo ayto, loipon, h prospaqeia einai na yparjei ena neo montelo anaptyjhs, poy qa strafei kyriws sthn paragwgh, poy qa strafei kyriws sthn ejwstrefeia, sthn antagwnistikothta, sth dhmioyrgia biomhxanias sth xwra.

Prepei na parajoyme jana proionta kai nees yphresies, poy qa dioxeteysoyme stis agores toy kosmoy, me prostiqemenh ajia. Kai ayth th stigmh, ginetai ena megalo qayma sthn Ellada: to gegonos, opws eipe o Prwqypoyrgos prohgoymenws, alla kai xqes sthn omilia toy, oti eixame perysi mia ayjhsh 11% stis ejagwges.

Fetos, Ioylio toy '11 me Ioylio toy '10, exoyme mia ayjhsh ths tajews toy 45%. Pleon, oi ejagwges mas ekproswpoyn to 10% toy AEP ths xwras. Kai ginetai mia megalh prospaqeia, mazi me toys ejagwgeis, na enisxysoyme olo ayto to egxeirhma. Kai pragmatika, pisteyw oti, toy xronoy, me oles tis politikes poy askoyntai, sthrijhs twn mikromesaiwn ejagwgikwn epixeirhsewn, to qayma ayto qa synexisei na yparxei.

Yparxei loipon ena megalo zhthma se sxesh me th neanikh anergia kai ws apanthsh exoyme th neanikh epixeirhmatikothta. Yparxoyn dyo programmata ayth th stigmh kai kalw toys neoys ths patridas mas kai toys goneis toys, na antapokriqoyn. Na melethsoyn ayta ta programmata kai na ypobaloyn aithmata h ependytika sxedia, prokeimenoy na symmetexoyn s\' ayth thn prospaqeia.

To ena einai to programma toy ependytikoy nomoy ``Neanikh Epixeirhmatikothta''. Einai 150 ekatommyria eyrw. Mporei o kaqe neos na parei se pente xronia epidothsh, plhrh epidothsh, mexri ena ekatommyrio gia thn ependysh poy qelei na kanei, kai yparxei kai xamhlotoko daneio apo to Eqniko Tameio Epixeirhmatikothtas kai Anaptyjhs, oso xreiazetai gia na kanei thn ependytikh toy drasthriothta ta epomena xronia.

Yparxei epishs kai apo thn pleyra toy ESPA ena epidotoymeno programma 60%, ycoys 30 ekatommyriwn, gia osoys qeloyn na ependysoyn se kainotoma proionta h kainotomes yphresies. Ayth h prospaqeia qa synexistei mexri to telos toy xronoy kai, ton epomeno xrono, qa yparjei ena neo programma Neanikhs Epixeirhmatikothtas.

Eyelpistoyme oti ayto to elkystiko programma qa apotelesei polo eljhs gia toys neoys, poy einai anhsyxoi, poy exoyn mia tolmhrh idea, poy exoyn mia idea se sxesh me thn paragwgh, eite ayth einai prwtogenhs, eite einai metapoihsh, eite einai ston tomea twn newn texnologiwn, oytws wste na thn kanoyn prajh, prajh gia th zwh toys. Kai etsi, na mporesoyn na apokthsoyn eisodhma, na dhmioyrghsoyn qeseis apasxolhshs kai na eyhmerhsoyn.

Qa hqela, epishs, k. Proedre, na moy epitrecete na pw dyo logia akoma, gia to qema twn ependysewn. Epixeiroyme mia megalh prospaqeia, prokeimenoy na proselkysoyme amesa jenes ependyseis sth xwra, giati ayto einai to zhtoymeno ayth th stigmh.

Exoyme loipon synomilies me xwres - melh ths Eyrwpaikhs Enwshs, opws h Germania, h Ollandia kai h Gallia. Endiaferontai shmantika kai sobara na ependysoyn ston tomea twn ypodomwn, ston tomea ths energeias, opws anefere prohgoymenws o Prwqypoyrgos, ston tomea ths diaxeirishs ygrwn kai sterewn apoblhtwn, sta skoypidia. Endiaferontai gia ta zhthmata poy exoyn na kanoyn me th biomhxania trofimwn. Endiaferontai gia tis megales ypodomes, tis opoies h xwra prepei na ftiajei to epomeno xroniko diasthma.

Qelw epishs na sas pw oti, sto plaisio ths epitaxynshs ths aporrofhshs toy ESPA, ayth th stigmh, ginetai mia megalh epixeirhsh, prokeimenoy ena programma kollhmeno, ena programma plhrws grafeiokratiko, ena programma to opoio den exei kamia sxesh me tis anagkes ths xwras, dioti to 65% htan programma kataskeyhs dromwn, shmera, oysiastika, anaqewreitai olo. Katargoyntai kai apentassontai erga nekra, hdh prin apo liges hmeres entaxqhkan 1.029 erga kai o ryqmos aporrofhshs ginetai poly entonos kai poly taxys, me emfash sthn epixeirhmatikothta, gia na antimetwpisoyme thn krish. Eyxaristw poly, kyrie Proedre.

M. ZAFEIRIADOY (``DHMOKRATIA''): Kalhspera k. Proedre. Tis prohgoymenes hmeres, enas Aystriakos Eyrwboyleyths, se mia erwthsh toy sto Eyrwkoinoboylio, eqese ena qema poy afora se esas.

Anaferqhke sth gnwsth ypoqesh twn CDS, me thn periptwsh xreokopias ths xwras mas, sas egkalei gia ``kerdoskopia'' kai kanei logo gia ``xrysofora epixeirhsh'' kai gia kapoia posa 22 dis eyrw, kalwntas malista thn Commission na dwsei ejhghseis gi? ayta.

Hqela to sxolio sas kai ean moy epitrepete mia dieykrinish twn prohgoymenwn erwthmatwn. Epeidh eipate polles fores oti den qa fygomaxhsete, hqela na sas rwthsw ean sto telos ayths ths maxhs, opote kai an einai, qa hghqeite eseis toy PASOK stis epomenes ekloges.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Protrexete gia tis ekloges, giati opws eipame den pame se ekloges kai qa dwsoyme th maxh. Kai emena, to problhma moy den einai h qesh moy, einai to symferon ths xwras.

Ta CDS den hjera kan ti htan, prin arxisoyn na paizoyn me to xreos ths xwras. Oyte exw dei CDS. Qa elega na mhn anaparagete aytes tis fhmologies, oi opoies kai aytes deixnoyn thn elleich dikaioy sth xwra mas. Den einai mono oti ekeinoi poy prepei na timwroyntai, den timwroyntai, alla oti kai ekeinoi poy sykofantoyntai, polles fores, den briskoyn to dikio toys.

Kai olh ayth h ypoqesh einai mia asteia ypoqesh. Kai stenoxwriemai mono, poy kapoioi boyleytes ths paratajhs ths prohgoymenhs kybernhshs, poy qa eprepe na eixan meinei sto Koinoboylio, otan emeis antimetwpizame tis ypoqeseis, kai tote epi k. Karamanlh, kai twra epi k. Samara, otan antimetwpizame qemata diafqoras, fygomaxhsan. Den eprepe na fygomaxhsoyn, alla na erqoyn na chfisoyn, giati htan mystikh h chfoforia. Omws, fobontoysan mhpws kapoioi apo toys boyleytes toys den chfisoyn symfwna me thn kommatikh grammh, poy htan na dwsoyn oysiastika amnhstia kai asylia se prohgoymenoys ypoyrgoys.

Ara, loipon, einai krima poy tetoia zhthmata anakyklwnontai, ta opoia den exoyn kamia bash. Kai einai ena apo ta qemata, sta opoia emeis qeloyme h Dikaiosynh na dwsei amesa apanthsh, akribws gia na mhn kykloforoyn aytes oi diafores istories.

Giati kai prin apo ligo, prin merikoys mhnes qymamai, gia mia omilia toy prohgoymenoy Dioikhth toy DNT, toy k. Stros Kan, eipwqhke oti htan synwmosia dikh moy me ton k. Stros Kan, to gegonos oti h Ellada mphke s? ayth thn ypoqesh. Opws htan kai mia synwmosia, dhladh egw qa mporoysa na dhmioyrghsw mia synwmosia, gia na mpei kai h Irlandia, na mpei kai h Portogalia, na apeileitai h Italia, na apeileitai h Ispania, na apeileitai h Dieqnhs Koinothta me thn yfesh! Na jefygoyme epiteloys apo ayta ta asteia pragmata kai na doyme thn pragmatikothta.

H pragmatikothta einai oti paralabame mia xwra kai mia oikonomia me terastia problhmata, se yfesh kai me terastia elleimmata. Kai kanoyme to pan, gia na swsoyme th xwra. Kai qa ta kataferoyme.

A. SPANOY (``FLASH''): Gnwrizete h pisteyete oti yparxoyn egxwries dynameis, poy qa epiqymoysan ejodo ths Elladas apo thn Eyrwzwnh, gia dikoys toys, idioteleis logoys; Kai sas rwtw, giati exete anaferqei sto parelqon se ``prwqypoyrgoys ths draxmhs''.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Yparxoyn tetoia senaria, den jerw ean yparxoyn xwres h kybernhseis, den exw akoysei pote na miloyn epishmws gia ejodo ths Elladas apo to eyrw, omws, qewrw oti, prwta ap? ola, emeis, ayta ta senaria, me tis dikes mas kinhseis - opws sas eipa - qa ta antimetwpisoyme. Kai parallhla, qewrw oti den exoyn sobarothta akoma kai gia thn Eyrwzwnh, giati to na fygei mia opoiadhpote xwra apo to eyrw, logw kapoioy oikonomikoy problhmatos, qa dhmioyrghsei ena ntomino, mia piesh se epomenes xwres kai qa meinei ws plhgh, an oxi h arxh ths dialyshs, oloy aytoy toy systhmatos.

Ayto to opoio kanoyme, loipon, einai xreos mas prwta apenanti ston Ellhniko lao, alla einai kai xreos mas kai apenanti sthn Eyrwph. Shkwnoyme ena baros kai apenanti sthn Eyrwph, poy einai bebaiws pros ofelos mas, giati qewroyme oti ayth h Nomismatikh Enwsh einai shmantikh, oxi mono gia oikonomikoys logoys, alla kai gia thn politikh symmaxia ths Eyrwphs. Qa elega, akoma kai gia thn asfaleia mas, gia to kyros mas, th dynamh mas, se ena dieqnes periballon poy allazei grhgora, poy exei myries apeiles. Kai opws eipan synadelfoi sas prin, mporei na exoyme ejelijeis sth perioxh - kai hdh exoyme ejelijeis sth perioxh, me thn ``Arabikh anoijh''. Hdh, exoyme arketes entaseis gyrw apo to Mesanatoliko zhthma, alla yparxoyn kai polles eykairies. Polles eykairies, poy mporoyme na ajiopoihsoyme.

An loipon h Eyrwph den staqei sto ycos ths, qa xasei istorika mia terastia eykairia na symbalei sthn eirhnh, sthn anaptyjh ths Dhmokratias, sthn anaptyjh ths koinwnikhs synoxhs, stis eyryteres xwres ths Mesogeioy, ths Meshs Anatolhs kai ston Arabiko kai moysoylmaniko kosmo.

A. KAROLIDOY (``NAYTEMPORIKH''): Kyrie Proedre, anaferqhkate epaneilhmmena stis adynamies ths Dhmosias Dioikhshs na antapokriqei kai eidikotera toy foroeispraktikoy mhxanismoy.

Prosfata, dhmosieyqhkan kapoia stoixeia, symfwna me ta opoia oi megalyteres Efories ths xwras den eixan na paroysiasoyn ereynes kai diastayrwseis apo th lista twn 6.000 epixeirhsewn, para polles ap? aytes exoyn kleisei h den leitoyrgoyn k.lp.

Fainetai oti qa prepei na doqei idiaiterh emfash ston tomea ayto. Qa hqela na sas rwthsw, ejetazete sobara thn ajiopoihsh twn idiwtwn forotexnikwn se o,ti afora to qema;

Kai ean moy epitrepete mia deyterh erwthsh, egine poly prosfata mia protash gia synenwsh twn HELEXPO kai DEQ, to exete dei ayto to qema sthn Kybernhsh. Eyxaristw poly.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Makari na eixame mia kalh Dhmosia Dioikhsh, giati ayth th stigmh qa htan moxlos. Kai egw kanw ekklhsh sth syneidhsh olwn twn dhmosiwn ypallhlwn, dioti h swsth Dhmosia Dioikhsh qa einai ayth poy qa profylajei kai qa beltiwsei kai tis dikes toys synqhkes, oxi mono ergasias, alla kai misqologioy, opws kai olwn twn Ellhnwn.

Ayto einai to basiko problhma poy exoyme. Sthn efarmogh, oxi mono sto qema ths forodiafyghs, alla kai se polloys alloys tomeis. Mia Dhmosia Dioikhsh, poy eixe maqei na leitoyrgei pelateiaka - to politiko systhma ferei thn prwth eyqynh - me nootropies aneyqyno-ypeyqynothtas kai polydiaspasmenes armodiothtes. Kai ayto einai poy prepei na allajoyme, ayto einai poy prepei na diorqwsoyme.

Omws ews otoy ginoyn aytes oi baqies allages, poy mporei na paroyn xrono - nai, bebaiws - prepei na ginoyn ta legomena, eite ``by pass'', eite ``outsourcing'', opws exei hdh problefqei kai ginetai me Orkwtoys Logistes gia megales epixeirhseis, gia na mhn xreiazetai na parembainei h Eforia.

Opws gnwrizw apo tis syzhthseis poy exoyme me ton Antiproedro, qa ginei kai ena eidos ``outsourcing'' gia to kynhgi twn megaloofeiletwn kai, bebaiws, mporoyme na doyme kai parapera, otan to systhma den leitoyrgei me ton katallhlo tropo. Alla isws se ayto qa mporoyse na prosqesei dyo logia kai o Baggelhs Benizelos.

EY. BENIZELOS: Eyxaristw. Opws eipe o Prwqypoyrgos, jerete oti ton teleytaio kairo exoyme analabei mia seira apo prwtoboylies, se sxesh me thn energopoihsh ths forologikhs dioikhshs kai thn ajiopoihsh toy idiwtikoy tomea.

Exoyn allajei polla dedomena. H Genikh Grammateia Plhroforiakwn Systhmatwn stelnei kaqe mera katalogoys me diastayrwseis poy prepei na ginoyn kai elegxoys poy prepei na protaxqoyn. Kai kaqe mera, h Genikh Grammateia Forologikwn kai Telwneiakwn Qematwn, me hlektronikh allhlografia, epishmainei se kaqe Dhmosia Oikonomikh Yphresia poies paraleiceis yparxoyn h poies adraneies yparxoyn.

Oi forologikes mas Yphresies den kanoyn monon aytes tis diastayrwseis, kanoyn kai tis dikes toys, elegxoyn kai toys dikoys toys fakeloys. Shmasia exei to teliko eispraktiko apotelesma. Oxi h bebaiwsh, alla h eisprajh twn forwn. H diafora metajy bebaiwshs kai eisprajhs diamorfwnei mia aisqhsh oti exoyme na paroyme polla kai, telika, ayta poy mporoyme na paroyme, einai dystyxws liga.

Ayto fanhke kai apo ton katalogo twn 6.000 epixeirhsewn, poy einai megaloi ofeiletes anw twn 150.000 eyrw, mexri pollwn ekatommyriwn eyrw. Ekei yparxoyn ptwxeymenes etaireies, palies etaireies, etaireies poy den mporoyme na entopisoyme tis dioikhseis toys. Ara, prepei na kanoyme dystyxws enan apoplhqwrismo twn poswn aytwn kai na estiasoyme thn prosoxh mas ekei opoy mporoyme na exoyme ena apotelesma.

Gia na kalycoyme fysika tis anagkes mas, toy ?11 kai toy ?12, exei para poly megalh shmasia na ajiopoihqoyn aytes oi lhjiproqesmes ofeiles twn parelqontwn etwn kai ekei kinhtopoioyme dikhgoroys kai logistes gia toys megaloys ofeiletes. Hdh, exei kinhsei h Genikh Grammateia Telwneiakwn kai Forologikwn Qematwn th diadikasia ayth. Kaqe Eforia synaptei tis dikes ths symbaseis, gia na ginei amesa h epejergasia twn fakelwn - to forologiko pistopoihtiko, poy eipe o Prwqypoyrgos.

Twra, oi Orkwtoi Elegktes h oi Logistes, aplws, einai oloi pistopoihmenoi kai ekdidoyn forologiko pistopoihtiko gia thn epixeirhsh oi idioi kai, mono deigmatolhptikoi elegxoi me algoriqmiko ypologismo qa ginontai apo to grafeio, kata protimhsh apo tis armodies forologikes Arxes.

Oi peripoy 300 Efories synenwnontai, qa meinei to 1/3 peripoy. Polla tmhmata Eforiwn katargoyntai, gia na exoyme elegktes sygkentrwmenoys stis megales Yphresies. H Genikh Dieyqynsh Elegxwn egine Genikh Dieyqynsh Elegxwn kai Eisprajewn. Dhmioyrghqhke Yphresia Megalwn Forologoymenwn, Yphresia Megalwn Epixeirhsewn se panellhnia bash, gia na mporoyme na exoyme oso ginetai shmantikotera apotelesmata.

Kai bebaia, ola ayta syndeontai kai me qesmoys enallaktikhs forologikhs dikaiosynhs. Hdh, o qesmos ths forologikhs diaithsias ginetai enas poly hpios kai eyreias xrhshs qesmos, me mia tropopoihsh poy eisagetai twra sto nomosxedio peri Trapezwn, poy chfizetai thn allh ebdomada. Kai opoios exei endiaferon na lysei th diafora toy, mporei na phgainei ekei kat\' eyqeian, wste na exei ena grhgoro kai ameso apotelesma. Ara, yparxei mia allh antilhch.

Ola ayta einai progefyrwmata pros to eqniko forologiko systhma. Sto eqniko forologiko systhma, qa doyme oxi mono qemata forologikhs politikhs, alla kai ta basika qemata ths forologikhs dioikhshs kai ths forologikhs dikaiosynhs. Giati an den allajoyme ayta ta dedomena, ta opoia poly eykola mporoyn na allaxtoyn, den prokeitai sthn pragmatikothta na petyxoyme to stoxo ths anorqwshs toy kratoys, ths koinwnias kai ths oikonomias.

B. MOYRTHS (``ISOTIMIA''): Kyrie Proedre, epeidh den milhsate poly gia thn ejwterikh politikh shmera, qa hqela na epanelqw sto qema ths synergasias Israhl - Kyproy, kaqws ginontai kai etoimasies wste na arxisoyn ereynes ekei kai h Toyrkia exei apeilhsei me xrhsh bias.

Kai qa hqela na sas rwthsw: poy apodidete, prwton, th symperifora ths Toyrkias otan, apo thn allh pleyra, einai diallaktikh sta Bakoyfia, h akoygontai kai dhlwseis peri katarghshs ths stratias toy Aigaioy. Deyteron, ean h Toyrkia xrhsimopoihsei bia, qa einai gia thn Ellada ``casus belli'', opws o eteros twn Antiproedrwn sas exei dhlwsei;

Triton. H ojynsh ths sxeshs Israhl - Aigyptoy periplekei to problhma; Kai tetarton, poia einai h qesh ths Kybernhshs sas gia tis ellhnikes AOZ sto Aigaio; Qa proxwrhsete se mia tetoia kinhsh; Qa to kaqysterhsete; Pws qa ginei akribws; Eyxaristw.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Prwta ap\' ola, qewrw oti h ``Arabikh anoijh'' einai mia megalh eykairia gia th Dhmokratia, alla einai kai mia megalh eykairia wste na yparjei prwtoboylia gia thn eirhnh, to Mesanatoliko, to Palaistiniako.

Pisteyw oti Israhl kai Palaistinh prepei istorika ayth th stigmh na proxwrhsoyn kai na diamorfwsoyn ena klima, poy qa epitrecei th dhmioyrgia enos anejarthtoy Palaistiniakoy kratoys. Mia xwra dipla apo to Israhl, poy qa aisqanetai asfalhs kai qa einai kai anagnwrismenh kai se agasth synergasia me ta Arabika krath kai ton Arabiko lao. Einai kati to opoio emeis epidiwkoyme, einai pros to symferon mas kai einai, an qelete, kai apo ayta ta zhthmata ta opoia, oso den lynontai, toso xanoyme poly shmantikes dynatothtes, kai oikonomikes, kai alles.

Sto plaisio ths synergasias kai toy Dieqnoys Dikaioy, emeis diekdikoyme ola ta dikaiwmata mas, opws me to qema ths yfalokrhpidas kai ths epektashs twn xwrikwn ydatwn. Kai h AOZ einai qema prwta ap\' ola dikaiwmatos, alla einai kai qema synergasias me tis geitonikes xwres. Ayto prospaqoyme kai prowqoyme me oles tis xwres, symperilambanomenhs kai ths Toyrkias - th symfwnia panw se mia seira tetoiwn zhthmatwn.

Qelw na tonisw oti den einai kaqoloy eyxaristh h apeilh bias kai pisteyw oti qa epikrathsei nhfaliothta, opws bebaiws pisteyw oti, sysswmh h Eyrwpaikh Enwsh kai h Dieqnhs Koinothta, den qa qelhsoyn na yparjei, oxi mono bia, alla oyte kai apeilh bias, giati einai ena qema poy einai, opws eipa, dikaiwma kratwn, kyriarxwn kratwn, opws einai h Kypriakh Dhmokratia. Einai dikaiwma toys na ajiopoihsoyn toys poroys toys.

F. MPATZOGLOY (``DER SPIEGEL''): Kyrie Prwqypoyrge, qa hqela na epistrecw sto zhthma peri piesewn, me aformh tis prosfates dhlwseis ajiwmatoyxwn kai ths Germanikhs Kybernhshs, kai twn kommatwn sth Germania. Me ayto poy eipate xqes kai to eipate kai shmera jana, oti ``anejarthta toy ti lene oi jenoi gia mas, h ti qeloyn oi jenoi apo mas, emeis qa ta kanoyme apo monoi mas'', mhpws ta pragmata einai pio apla; Oti me dedomeno to stoxo gia to elleimma gia fetos, to 2011, 7,6%, qelate stis synomilies sas me thn Troika na ton anaqewrhsete pros ta panw;

Ayto to aithma, ayth h qelhsh sas den egine dekth kai, gi? ayto to logo, proxwrhsate se ayto to metro poy anakoinwsate shmera; Giati sthn oysia, milame gia ena metro kainoyrgio kai, to symperasma poy bgainei einai oti, ypoxwrhsate se ayto poy hqele h Troika na mhn allajei, dhladh o stoxos gia to dhmosio elleimma, to 2011.

Kai me symperasma ayto, me ta gegonota ayta, ayto na to anamenoyme kai gia to 2012 kai gia to 2013 kai gia to 2014, gia th diarkeia dhladh toy mesoproqesmoy, oti den allazoyn oi stoxoi pleon, alla kaqe fora poy qa exoyme ysterhsh esodwn h kapoion allo logo, qa pairnoyme kainoyrgia metra;

Kai kati deytero kai teleytaio: me aformh thn episkech toy Ypoyrgoy Oikonomias stis arxes Oktwbrioy sthn Aqhna, an pera apo to programma ``Hlios'', me armodio Ypoyrgo ton k. Papakwnstantinoy, poy episkefqhke kai to Amboyrgo thn perasmenh ebdomada, an exete ki alla sxedia sygkekrimena, poy qa proteinete sth germanikh pleyra, stoys Germanoys epixeirhmaties, se alloys tomeis, se alloys kladoys ths oikonomias, opws einai o toyrismos, h energeia k.lp. Sas eyxaristw.

G. A. PAPANDREOY: Kat\' arxhn, opws eipa, emeis qeloyme na piasoyme toys stoxoys mas, giati qeloyme toy xronoy na ftasoyme se prwtogenes pleonasma. Kai ayto einai basiko gia th staqerothta ths xwras kai gia thn poreia ths oikonomias mas. Qa ekpemcoyme qetika mhnymata sth dieqnh oikonomia kai stis dieqneis agores.

Qelw na qymisw, omws, pws kai h Troika paradexetai kai ayth, oti merikes paradoxes, me tis opoies jekinhse, den bghkan. Eixame megalyterh yfesh. Gia polloys logoys, den exei shmasia. Eixame megalyterh yfesh. Qelete na einai oi dieqneis synqhkes; Qelete na einai oi eyrwpaikes; Qelete na einai kapoies diarqrwtikes allages, poy den petyxan toys aparaithtoys stoxoys;

Omws, h yfesh anagnwrizetai apo thn Troika, ayto einai kati to opoio den amfisbhthse. Oyte ekeinoi emas, oyte emeis aytoys. Ayto omws den allazei th dikh mas boylhsh na eimaste toy xronoy s? ena prwtogenes pleonasma. Aytos einai o stoxos.

Deyteron, bebaiws yparxoyn oi politikes mas oi diorqwtikes, oi opoies omws ejyphretoyn akribws ayto to stoxo: thn ajiopistia ths xwras mas, thn opoia emeis den qeloyme na xasoyme, giati exoyme apokthsei jana ajiopistia, me poly megalh dyskolia. Na sas qymisw oti, oysiastika, ayto to programma leitoyrgei mono ena xrono kai ligoys mhnes. Apo ton Ioylio toy 2010, mexri to Septembrio toy 2011.

Ara, loipon, exoyme kanei almata. Prwth fora sthn Eyrwzwnh. Den exei yparjei allh xwra, poy na exei katebasei to elleimma s? ena xrono kata 5%. Den qa sas aradiasw oles tis megales nomoqetikes allages poy exoyme kanei, opws einai h teleytaia sthn paideia, poy den htan entos mnhmonioy kan.

Ayto deixnei th boylhsh kai ayths ths Kybernhshs alla, qelw na pw, para tis diamartyries, para tis diadhlwseis, kai thn eyryterh, nomizw, koinwnikh symmaxia kai boylhsh na allajei h Ellada.

Ayto poy exoyme zhthsei einai sthrijh, me daneia ta opoia qa apoplhrwsoyme, qa janadwsoyme sto Germaniko lao kai stoys alloys laoys, gia na mporesoyme ayth th stenwpo na thn jeperasoyme kai na mporoyme na exoyme to xrono gia na allajoyme thn Ellada.

Dioti, prwta ap? ola, emeis den qeloyme na basizomaste se daneies dynameis. Qeloyme na staqoyme sta dika mas podia. Gi? ayto, pisteyw oti poly swsta, kai ton Ioylio, peran olwn twn allwn, syzhthsame kai eipwqhke me ton oro ``Marshal Plan'' ena programma anaptyjhs gia thn Ellada.

Dioti pragmati den prokeitai na antimetwpisoyme to xreos, ean den exoyme kai anaptyjh. Meiwnoyme ta elleimmata, alla qa xreiastei na exoyme kai anaptyjh, gia na mporoyme na plhrwsoyme to xreos. Peran toytoy, h anaptyjh einai kai eyergetikh genikotera gia ton Ellhniko lao kai toys ergazomenoys.

Qa exw sto telos Septembrioy mazi moy sthn Germania oloys toys symboyloys, toys aparaithtoys synergates kai Ypoyrgoys, ypeyqynoys twn diaforwn forewn, gia na mporesoyme na paroysiasoyme mia seira ependytikwn programmatwn. Qa einai kai o Mixalhs Xrysoxoidhs ekei, o opoios exei ypo thn epopteia toy kai to qema twn jenwn ependysewn, kaqws epishs to forea poy legetai ``Invest in Greece'', opote qa exoyme th dynatothta na paroysiasoyme stoys biomhxanoys ths Germanias mia seira ependysewn kai dynatothtwn synergasias.

Prosblepoyme sta qetika ayths ths synergasias. Nomizw oti, para tis entaseis, poy einai logikes, kai to aisqhma poy yparxei metajy mas ayth thn epoxh, se mia dyskolh periodo, kai para tis opoies arnhtikes dhmosieyseis, eite gia thn Ellada sth Germania, eite gia th Germania sthn Ellada, h Eyrwph, h ennoia ths Eyrwphs, einai na mporesoyme na synergastoyme mprosta sta problhmata. Na mporoyme na jeperasoyme prokatalhceis kai na mporoyme na apokthsoyme dynamh gia ta problhmata mas stis xwres mas, alla kai gia ta pagkosmia problhmata, akribws mesa apo ayth th synergasia.

Kai ayto mporoyme na to apodeijoyme. Exoyme polles dynatothtes synergasias, isotimhs synergasias metajy Elladas kai Germanias kai, bebaiws, kai me polles alles xwres, oxi mono ths Eyrwpaikhs Enwshs, gia ependyseis. Yparxei endiaferon gia ependysh sthn Ellada. Yparxei megalo endiaferon.

Qelw, kleinontas, na sas eyxaristhsw oloys. Eixame mia kaqysterhsh, logw twn gegonotwn kai twn apofasewn poy phrame. Einai shmantikes apofaseis, syllogikes apofaseis, omofwnes apofaseis, gia na pame prwta ap? ola se mia paragwgikh, opws eipa xqes, kai dhmioyrgikh Ellada. Strofh se mia paragwgikh - epiteloys - kai dhmioyrgikh Ellada.

Den exoyme kai den mporoyme na exoyme anaptyjh me daneika. Den mporoyme na exoyme anaptyjh, poy qa steketai se phlina podia.

Gi? ayto, h prwth mas proteraiothta einai na ajiopoihsoyme toys poroys mas, tis dynatothtes mas. Prwta ap? ola, toys energeiakoys poroys opws eipame, prasinh energeia, petrelaio, fysiko aerio, gewqermia, aiolikh energeia k.lp. Kai th gewrgia, th gh mas. Ta akinhta, epishs, na ajiopoihqoyn. Tis epixeirhseis mas, alles qa idiwtikopoihqoyn, alles qa ajiopoihqoyn, h qa yparjoyn jenes ependyseis.

Kai opwsdhpote, to anqrwpino dynamiko. Exoyme terastio anqrwpino dynamiko. Se oles tis dieqneis meletes, mporei na eimaste xamhla se alloys deiktes, alla yparxei enas deikths, poy leei oti yparxei ena anqrwpino dynamiko poy den ajiopoieitai, enw einai se ychlo epipedo.

Ara, loipon, sthrijh aytoy toy anqrwpinoy dynamikoy, epanakatartish aytoy toy anqrwpinoy dynamikoy, apeleyqerwsh aytoy toy anqrwpinoy dynamikoy. Ayto einai to systhma pronoias. Kai einai kai to trapeziko systhma, bebaiws, poy xreiazetai na staqeropoihqei kai na mporei na dwsei reystothta, gia na pame se proionta poiothtas kai antagwnismoy, oxi fqhnias.

Triton, h eynomia kai to kratos. Proypoqesh dikaiosynhs kai, malista, synexhs. Proypoqesh, na empisteyetai o Ellhnas th xwra toy, thn Politeia toy, na mhn aisqanetai jenos sth xwra toy. Kai fernw ena paradeigma, poy polles fores exw xrhsimopoihsei, alla qelw na to janapw. Hmoyn me ton Proedro ths Xilhs prin dyo mhnes ston OOSA, se ena panel, opoy syzhthsame gia th dieqnh oikonomikh krish. Milhse prwta aytos, meta egw, kai eipe oti, sth Xilh, jerete, eimaste petyxhmenh xwra, giati exoyme organwsei ena swsto kratos. Kai malista, aytoi mesa sthn krish exoyn pleonasmata kai den aisqanqhkan ton pono ths krishs. Einai ejagwgikh xwra, einai dynamikh xwra.

Exei ginei mia meleth sto Brooking Institute, poy sygkrinei Xilh kai Ellada. Kai ayth h meleth leei, ``giati h Xilh etsi kai h Ellada alliws;''. Dioti, lene, sth Xilh, ftiajane ena kratos, ena politiko systhma me diafaneia, me swsth diaxeirish kai diamorfwsane ena sxedio, opoy organwsane swsta toys poroys toys, toys ploytoparagwgikoys xwroys kai to anqrwpino dynamiko. H Ellada, to antiqeto. Ayta einai poy prepei na ftiajoyme.

H idia meleth leei oti, apo thn adiafaneia kai th forodiafygh, mporei na xanei ayth th stigmh h Ellada 8% toy AEP ethsiws. An dhladh hmastan Soyhdia, leei, qa eixame 8% parapanw, dhladh oso einai to elleimma mas oysiastika kaqe xrono. Kai an hmastan Ispania, qa eixame toylaxiston 4% parapanw.

Ara, loipon, to kratos, h eynomia einai anaptyjiako ergaleio. Einai ergaleio dikaiosynhs, alla kai anaptyjiako ergaleio - den htan mexri shmera.

Telos, ola ayta exoyn mia proypoqesh. Exoyn thn proypoqesh na ``kleidwsoyme'' ayth thn istorikh symfwnia toy Ioylioy, poy bazei tis geres baseis, panw stis opoies mporoyme na kanoyme ola ta alla.

Na ``kleidwsoyme'' thn symfwnia poy qa sthrijei to trapeziko systhma, na ``kleidwsoyme'' thn symfwnia poy qa epimhkynei kai qa elafrynei to xreos, na ``kleidwsoyme'' ayth thn symfwnia, poy qa metaferei ena baros toy xreoys stis idiwtikes trapezes, na ``kleidwsoyme'' ayth thn symfwnia, gia na mporoyme na dwsoyme aisqhma ajiopistias ston ependyth, s? ayton o opoios pragmati qelei na epistrecei sthn Ellada, oxi mono ston jeno, alla kai ston idio ton Ellhna kai, kyriws, sto neo poy, ayth th stigmh, aisqanetai oti prepei na paei sto ejwteriko.

Na dwsoyme ayth th sigoyria kai asfaleia sto ellhniko noikokyrio. Ayto einai poy qeloyme. Ayto paleyoyme kai ayth th maxh qa th dwsoyme kai qa th dwsoyme nikhfora. Qa mporesoyme na to kanoyme.

Bebaiws, opws eipa, h apofash mas, shmera, einai mia aparaithth apofash. Den einai epipleon xrhmata, einai gia na fqasoyme akribws stis eisprajeis poy exoyme ws stoxo.

Alla qa mporoyme na eimaste akoma pio apotelesmatikoi, otan oloi katanohsoyme oti, nai, ayth h Kybernhsh kanei o,ti mporei, kai egw proswpika kanw kai qa kanw o,ti mporw, xwris to aisqhma toy politikoy kostoys. An einai na ftiajoyme thn Ellada, na thn ftiajoyme mazi. Oloi mazi, o kaqenas me thn syneisfora toy.

Kai pali tonizw, h syneisfora qa prepei na einai telika ligotero oikonomikh kai perissotero mias antilhchs kai mias praktikhs, na bohqhsoyme, na allajoyme domes, praktikes kai qesmoys sth xwra mas.

Mporoyme na to kanoyme kai qa to kataferoyme.

Kai pali, sas eyxaristw.

[05] H eyrwzwnh kanei ta panta gia na apofygei th stash plhrwmwn opoiasdhpote xwras, leei o Mparnie

\"Merikoi prepei na diathroyn thn hremia kai thn cyxraimia toys\", dhlwse pros toys dhmosiografoys o gallos epitropos sto periqwrio enos synedrioy, anaferomenos sth nea ptwsh poy katagrafetai stis xrhmatagores.

Erwthqeis gia tis anhsyxies gyrw apo tis eyrwpaikes trapezes kai kyriws tis gallikes, o Mparnie diabebaiwse pws exei \"empistosynh\" sthn \"ikanothta antistashs twn xrhmatopistwtikwn idrymatwn\".

\"Proxwrhsame me sobarothta se test antoxhs (...) Enas orismenos ariqmos idrymatwn, poy den einai allwste gallika, edeijan adynamies kai qa prepei na anakefalaiopoihqoyn\", ejhghse o epitropos.

Otan toy epishmanqhke pws ta test antoxhs epikrinontai epeidh den lambanoyn ypoch thn ypoqesh mias stashs plhrwmwn apo eyqraystes xwres opws h Ellada, o Mparnie apanthse: \"Kanoyme ta panta gia na mhn yparjei ayth h katastash\".

\"Prepei na kanoyme ayto poy eipame, to syntomotero dynaton, idiaitera me tis apofaseis ths 21hs Ioylioy\", otan h eyrwzwnh anakoinwse ena neo sxedio sthrijhs ths Elladas kai thn enisxysh toy tameioy diaswshs, prosqese o Mparnie.

[06] Paranomos o syndesmos toy PAOK sto Hrakleio Krhths

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